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Thanks for reporting contrast measurements with and without LightBoost! This sounds about right;
We've since discovered that it only works if you've ever initialized the monitor into 3D Vision once before in its lifetime (and haven't unplugged the monitor since)
This is an excellent question, and it goes to the heart of the matter. The VG248QE at 120hz is much better than 60hz. There is clearly an added benefit with LB over 120hz, but not as dramatic as the jump from 60hz to 120hz (in my opinion). Whether LB justifies the tradeoffs will be a choice for the user. I'm glad to have the option, I also wonder if there is room for a bigger improvement in what LB is doing now. If so, it could become even more compelling.
All it has is display driver, HD audio, control panel, etc...I've been trying to use the search function but not finding this readily. I seem to remember someone, probably Mark R, listing a bunch of display types and the % blur reduction of each, and maybe even shown as "__ times clearer" , I forget. He included 60hz, plasma,perhaps 120hz - 133hz korean ips, 120hz tn, 144hztn, Lightboost2 enabled in 2D at 100hz&100fps+ and 120hz&120fps+, crt. I'm not sure if it was even this thread or one of the other individual threads that had lightboost questions posed in them.
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I know 60hz is very blurry and that 120hz tn is about "50%". I'm not sure what the plasma and some of the other quotes were. There was also this quote of blur trail lengths:
PixPerAn chase test, 960 pixels per second:
60Hz -- blur trail length of about 16 pixels
120Hz non-strobed -- blur trail length of about 8 pixels
120Hz LightBoost strobe backlight -- blur trail length of ~1 pixels (CRT sharp)
Here's some bad news -- there is forced LightBoost gamma on all LightBoost monitors, in LightBoost mode. There's different gamma settings. I've never seen a low-gamma LightBoost mode. The only way to adjust that out is via either nVidia Control Panel or via the video game (but fortunately, you can usually do either).
Falkentyne and chuckinbeast, welcome aboard with Radeon LightBoost. At least you don't have to do it again, provided you don't unplug your monitor. Powering off your monitor should be OK (although I've heard the older BENQ XL2420T "forgets" the LightBoost setting; while the newer VG248QE does not).
Interesting note that the motion blur benefit benefits high-detail more than low-detail.
Motion blur of fps = Hz is almost exactly equivalent on all refresh rates, due to CRT phosphor being the same.elvn said:
I made a mistake a few months ago; it is Lightboost not Lightboost2. My confusion was that 3D Vision doesn't have LightBoost, but 3D Vision 2 has LightBoost. I confused the sequel (of 3D Vision) with LightBoost which is simply a feature added, not a sequel to a feature. So it's "LightBoost" not "LightBoost2". My apologies.
92%, not 96%.
Actually. It's just one strobe per refresh. One 1.4ms strobe, occuring 120 times per second. Larger black periods between refreshes means less motion blur.
I've posted some info about this at 2500 Hz FFD page at Blur Busters. Plasma discussion is rather complicated, but a good explanation .... One needs an understanding of how plasma does temporal dithering (or at least DLP temporal dithering; which is somewhat different but very similar). That's high-speed pulse-width-modulation at the per-pixel level. What FFD is to focus all of it into a smaller time period, with larger black periods between refreshes.
Theoretically, LightBoost 60fps@60Hz can be just as clear as 120fps@120Hz when tracking moving objects (even if not as stroboscopically smooth if you're not intentionally tracking moving objects). The problem is LightBoost strobes only function during the 100Hz to 120Hz range. And you also need fps matching Hz, so that's why we've got the enforced high-GPU requirements of LightBoost today.
Actually, it has more to do with the LENGTH of a visible refresh. Scientifically, the "Hz" is meaningless for the purposes of motion blur. (though as a side effect, more Hz means shorter visible refreshes on traditional sample-and-hold displays). LightBoost doesn't operate at 60 Hz. (Though we've successfully tricked LightBoost to have exactly the same zero motion blur effect at 60 Hz in MAME arcade emulator, via software-based black frame insertion trick -- see www.blurbusters.com/mame -- simply by blacking out every other 120 Hz refresh, so that every 60fps frame has exactly one strobe per frame, which is necessary for the zero motion blur effect)
The best plasma are great but it is hamstrung by a 5 millisecond red/green phosphor decay, so it's got an effective strobe length of approximately 5 milliseconds, which dictates its absolute limit in motion blur elimination.
One of my favourite links from the Science & References page at Blur Busters is a VERY good oldie Microsoft Research article from 2001, which I will quote:pcmonitors.info said:
For the first graph, the middle image (CRT) is the same thing LightBoost does -- it essentially point-samples the refreshes for your eyes tracking trajectory, by using very short strobe lengths. (Remember your eyes are continuously moving tracking a moving object. Your eyes are in a different position at the beginning of a refresh than at the end of a refresh) For the optimized LightBoost strobe backlight (OSD=10%) ... 1.4 millisecond strobe lengths is 92% shorter than 1/60sec (traditional 60Hz LCD) and is a bit over 80% shorter than 1/120sec (traditional 120Hz LCD). Even at maximized LightBoost (OSD=100%), the 2.4 millisecond strobe lengths are still 85% shorter than 1/60sec. That's where my oft-repeated 85% and 92% numbers come from -- also confirmed by oscilloscope and via PixPerAn motion tests, as well as the upcoming new Blur Busters motion tests. (three separate measured confirmations) pcmonitors.info vouches for the veracity of these "85% less motion blur" and "92% less motion blur" numbers too, in the pcmonitors.info forum mentioning their upcoming article that covers LightBoost more in-depth.Microsoft Research said:Flat-panel displays have a sample-and-hold characteristic
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All of the newer display technologies such as LCD, plasma, DLP, and so on, have essentially a sample-and-hold characteristic. When a pixel is addressed, it is loaded with a value and stays at that light output value until it is next addressed. From an image portrayal point of view, this is the wrong thing to do. The sample of the original scene is only valid for an instant in time. After that instant, the objects in the scene will have moved to different places. It is not valid to try to hold the images of the objects at a fixed position until the next sample comes along that portrays the object as having instantly jumped to a completely different place.
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Your eye tracking will be trying to smoothly follow the movement of the object of interest and the display will be holding it in a fixed position for the whole frame. The result will inevitably be a blurred image of the moving object.
Sample and hold pixel characteristic causes blur.
So my numbers are accurate, and reviewers are gradually starting to confirm this.pcmonitors.info said:
Just make sure you always cite me and BlurBusters.com when you quote any of my publicly posted posts. Also, I'm collecting snippets for future posting at the Blur Busters website.
[dont-copy-and-paste]Both. It's black between refreshes then the subfield comes on (essentially a kind of PWM modulation at pixel level). , then it goes black again. Rinse and repeat for each of the 600 Hz subfields. Most of the subfields are tantamount to frame repeats, so on better plasmas you compress as much of the information into the brighter subfields into one compressed subfield per refreshs. From a vision science perspective, plasma is horrendously more difficult to explain than LCD's are.[/dont-copy-and-paste]
.... There are better experts at plasma displays than me. I highly advise people who wish a better understanding of plasma to go to www.avsforum.com and other places on the Net.They are all over the map, the worst and the best plasmas can have a big difference. Even the ones with the less blur can have very noisy-looking dark colors. And there is whether or not the subfield refreshes are motion-interpolated or not (Panasonic 2500 Hz FFD's use interpolation to avoid the repeated frame effect in contributing to motion blur of the repeated subfield refreshes).
That's true; that's the stroboscopic effect I'm talking about in my previous post.
I am flattered, but let me credit esreality forums (whose people discovered before I did) and TechNGaming's HOWTO (before I created my LightBoost HOWTO from scratch) for helping popularize this too. And we have to remember, not everyone benefits as not everyone is as sensitive to LCD motion blur as we are; they think I'm just a fanboy!
Yep, excellent point.
(I know the above is the 27H)
Even LightBoost at 100% still beats all other mere mortals of LCD's hands-down, and all of yesterday's 120 Hz LCD. So you're not missing much. But, some people still think LightBoost 100% is still TOO BRIGHT for a dark room. (Vega, for one).