ASUS/BENQ LightBoost owners!! Zero motion blur setting!

[BurntToast]

Strange effects. We've got to try something else, then.
Did you do some tests like window movement tests at the desktop?
E.g. dragging a window around? Did you try PixPerAn, to see how the motion looked?
Did you try the full version of the registry tweak from the other forum, and see if that worked better?

My windows login screen looked like this.

I suppose I can try the full registry setting. But I'd rather not rely on a hack. Having it be a pull down option in the Nvidia control panel is much more appealing.

So you would recommend its worth buying a lightboost 2.0 monitor for?

If you miss not having a CRT, the VG278H or VG278HE will be the closest thing you can get if you wish to relive the experience. I game in 2d and the difference between a IPS or other TN panel is very obvious. If you can get lightboost to work on top of it, then win win.

 

[Vega]

No -- A "960Hz" scanning backlight DOES NOT pulsate the same pixel 8 times. A "960Hz" (simulated Hz, not actual Hz) ideally strobes once per refresh (e.g. 1/240sec at 240Hz interpolated).

"960" equivalence (not real Hz) is simulated via 1/960sec strobe, even if it's only 60 times per second. A CRT tube of 1ms phosphor decay (1/1000sec strobe) has approximately a motion equivalence of approximately 1000 -- an equivalence to a theoretical native 1000fps@1000Hz LCD, if it existed (1000 separate frames, single refresh)
It's a motion EQUIVALENCE -- not actual Hz.

Real life scenario, however:
i.e. just X number of 1/120sec strobes at X refresh rate (X fps = X Hz), will have a motion equivalence to 120Hz (non-strobing).
Example: 1/120th second strobed backlight, strobing 60 times a second, once per refresh, at 60Hz, will have a motion equivalence of 120.
This motion-fluidity equivalence has been scientifically tested and confirmed.

Thusly:
1/120th second strobes (one strobe per refresh at any refresh rate, fps=Hz situation), motion fluidity looks like 120fps@120Hz
1/240th second strobes (one strobe per refresh at any refresh rate, fps=Hz situation), motion fluidity looks like 240fps@240Hz
1/500th second strobes (one strobe per refresh at any refresh rate, fps=Hz situation), motion fluidity looks like 500fps@500Hz

There are also real life examples:
Shorter strobes = Sharper motion.
Short persistence phoshpor CRT = shorter strobes = Sharper motion
Long persistence phosphor CRT = longer strobes = Blurrier motion (more phosphor ghosting)]
LCD display = no strobes = Blurriest motion

It's true there has been somewhat of a minor controversy about the "Hz" and "equivalence", but the science is proven.
The problem is that the claimed equivalence is sometimes exaggerated -- much like exaggerated contrast ratios versus actual measured contrast ratios.

Ah, so it is not "real" back-light Hz when those TV manufacturers say 960 Hz. It is just "perceived hz" based off of how short the LED strobes on and off? Or do you think they take into account the eight rows of LED's or whatever they have during the scanning of the back-light and not full on/off strobe back-lighting?

 

[Mark Rejhon]

Ah, so it is not "real" back-light Hz when those TV manufacturers say 960 Hz. It is just "perceived hz" based off of how short the LED strobes on and off? Or do you think they take into account the eight rows of LED's or whatever they have during the scanning of the back-light and not full on/off strobe back-lighting?

Most answers are currently covered in my Scanning Backlight FAQ, which I wrote almost three months ago.

As for the number of rows of LED's, some use many more rows -- the number of rows doesn't matter as much as factors such as backlight diffusion throughout the whole panel, length of strobe per row, diffusion between adjacent rows, and factors like this. That's why full-panel strobes (e.g. LightBoost) can be easier; there's no backlight diffusion to worry about.

 

[Vega]

Will you be going further with more research for your project or do you think these Lightboost monitors suit the purpose just fine?

Only a few things to work on if so:

Why do some people not get the enable 3D mode always selection with NVIDIA.
Way to force the 144 Hz monitors to Lightboost/strobe at 144Hz or is the strobe circuitry locked/limited to 120 Hz. (The original guy said it didn't even work at 100-110 Hz so it may not be dynamic at all and completely locked to 120 Hz).

 

[Mark Rejhon]

Ok, I did some tests on my VG278H (single monitor setup) -- I only recently got it this week, so I'm still doing tests. The movement of windows and scrolling becomes more-or-less CRT quality when I do the following:

Mark Rejhon's VG278H Instructions for Zero Motion Blur

1. I'm using driver 306.97 driver (WHQL)
2. Go to Control Panel -> Display -> Adjust Resolution
3. Verify "Enable Stereoscopic 3D settings for all displays" is enabled
4. Go to NVIDIA Control Panel (system tray -> nVidia icon)

5. Select "Set up Stereoscopic 3D" at left bar
6. Select "Enable Stereoscopic 3D" checkbox
7. Select "Asus 120Hz LCD"
8. Click Apply
9. Whole screen should suddenly dim a bit, this is normal due to strobing.
You should also have the "3D" indicator light at the top edge of your VG278H
10. To fix the dimness, use the monitor's Menu to set Contrast to 92. This makes the picture brighter while preserving all colors in this Lagom Contrast Test Pattern.
11. Smooth scroll in web browsers: If you're using Chrome and web browsing, install Chromium Smooth Scroller to gain the benefits of sharp text scrolling with the mouse wheel.

What is now different is that there's no motion blur when you drag windows, or scroll webpages, play MAME or NES emulators (perfect platformer scrolling), and launch 2D videogames (Half Life, etc), there is no motion blur.

Very Minor Side Effects: Slightly dimmer screen, some flicker feel (if you are sensitive to flicker). My desktop stayed in 2D mode, but I did avoid installing any 3D-related desktop software (e.g. 3D login screen, etc) Some video games will insist in going into 3D mode rather ; this will be annoying when you're not in the mood for 3D. You have to override this. (Game specific, probably). There's an extremely faint amount of ghosting, similiar to crosstalk in 3D glasses, but it's no more objectionable than the phosphor-ghosting of CRT. Color quality is slightly degraded during strobed backlight. Long term, someone needs to build a system tray utility to turn this feature on/off in a single click -- when you're doing photoshop editing, you'll want the slightly improved static image quality of turning off LightBoost. There is some strange temporal artifacts when dragging the browser window while displaying Inversion Walk Pixel Patterns. Other than that, motion blur is virtually completely gone in video games -- it's CRT sharp; allowing complete immersion without being distracted by motion blur. You do need a GPU (GTX 680) fast enough to frequently hit 120fps@120Hz most of the time to really notice the big improvement in motion clarity. The CRT-style motion clarity more than outweighs the other side effects.

Side note: I have not yet played many games, but I'm liking what I am seeing. Just like CRT, I can identify far-away enemies without stopping turning. Faster identification of enemies. Faster reaction times. Allowing faster reaction times that more than compensates for the input lag of LCD (From now on, competition gamers unable to get a CRT, but purchasing LCD monitors should probably factor in the motion blur advantage of LightBoost. IMHO, I'd take a LightBoost montior with 8ms input lag, over a non-LightBoost monitor with 5ms input lag. The CRT clarity of LightBoost allows me to react faster that more than compensates the 3ms difference in input lag.)

Stubborn Games that insists on going into 3D mode (if you have no 3D glasses, or don't want 3D) ...Turn off "Enable Stereoscopic 3D", keep the NVIDIA Control Panel window open, launch the game and start the game, then Alt+Tab back, and then re-enable "Enable Stereoscopic 3D". That turns on LightBoost without enabling 3D in the videogame, because I've already launched the videogame. Switch back to the game. And then play!

 

[Mark Rejhon]

Will you be going further with more research for your project or do you think these Lightboost monitors suit the purpose just fine?

I'm still going to do research, and work on zero motion blur projects.
The LightBoost monitor is a MAJOR step towards the goal, and an out-of-the-box solution, but it's not the final frontier. There's also opportunity to go down a different path, and do LightBoost hacking (modifying the strobe) to synchronize to any refresh rate, to work on AMD products (not just nVidia), and to adjust the length of the strobe for a balance between a brighter image versus motion blur elimination, etc.

I still have my >$500 worth of LED's I purchased for my home-made strobe backlight, so I'm going to still hack apart one monitor sometime later in the winter (but I will use a cheaper 24" monitor as a hacking target).

 

[mdrejhon]

Another problem: Many of my video games keep turning off 3D LightBoost when I want to keep it on even in 2D mode. Eventually, I think someone needs to write a system tray utility to keep 3D LightBoost forced-on at all times, in a more user-friendly manner. So I can agree with BurntToast; it's not entirely a glitch-free experience. Keep tuned as I continue to discover new tips and tricks (and study the other forum population)

 

[Vega]

I'm still going to do research, and work on zero motion blur projects.
The LightBoost monitor is a MAJOR step towards the goal, and an out-of-the-box solution, but it's not the final frontier. There's also opportunity to go down a different path, and do LightBoost hacking (modifying the strobe) to synchronize to any refresh rate, to work on AMD products (not just nVidia), and to adjust the length of the strobe for a balance between a brighter image versus motion blur elimination, etc.

I still have my >$500 worth of LED's I purchased for my home-made strobe backlight, so I'm going to still hack apart one monitor sometime later in the winter (but I will use a cheaper 24" monitor as a hacking target).

That is good news that you are continuing on. If anyone outside of a large company could get the project off the ground, it sounds like it would be you.

I was going to order a monitor to test but a few things you mentioned on have me a bit worried:

Feeling flicker, as I am pretty sensitive to that and why I can't use 120Hz 3D shutter glasses.
Did the screen dim down enough that it would be too dim to be usable in a daylight room?

I do like the smooth scrolling clarity that I had with my FW900, would be awesome to get that with an LCD. LCD's are pretty horrid at it.

I think I will get the 24" BenQ to test out as that has higher brightness than the Asus screens. Not to mention 27" 1080P pixels start to get really large looking.

My only reservation in getting a 120 Hz screen is if somehow someone gets 144 Hz Lightboost working, then I would be kicking myself. That brings me to the new 24" 1ms panels by both Asus VG248QE (coming out this month) and by Benq XL2411T (already out but only Europe). The second one is at overlockers.uk for $400 shipped to the US which isn't that bad.

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-070-BQ&groupid=17&catid=510&subcat=

The Asus and Benq obviously use the same panel.

Adam over at pcmonitors seems to like it quite a bit:

http://pcmonitors.info/reviews/benq-xl2411t

EDIT: going to order the Benq to see if the Lightboost will adjust to 144Hz. Seeing as it sounds like it is monitor model dependent, this will give us a larger base as more people are testing the Asus's.

 

[Mark Rejhon]

As for the reduction in brightness, I'm not sure about daylit rooms, but it works fine at night -- it's actually a comfortable brightness as all the other settings is WAY too bright for my eyes. But if you prefer a brighter picture, a brighter monitor may be preferred. However, the LightBoost strobing may not be as good zero-motion-blur. (e.g. if it strobes too long impulses). Someone needs to do comparisions.

 

[Mark Rejhon]

A new trick I have learned for stubborn games that always want to launch in 3D if LightBoost is enabled:

...Turn off "Enable Stereoscopic 3D", keep the NVIDIA Control Panel window open, launch the game and start the game, then Alt+Tab back, and then re-enable "Enable Stereoscopic 3D". That turns on LightBoost without enabling 3D in the videogame, because I've already launched the videogame. I'll be investigating if I can do this via hotkey.
- 3D is a lot of fun, but it's very hard to get the zero-motion-blur effect (due to the extra performance needed for 3D). There are times I prefer the zero-motion-blur effect over the 3D stereoscopic effect. (Maybe I'll get a second GTX680, just so I can get enough performance for the zero motion blur effect during stereoscopic 3D)

Some more comments based on more testing today. Stuff I already knew, but have just confirmed today:

1. The "zero motion blur" effects only works well if you can cap out the framerate (120fps).
So it works well in older games like Half Life 2, etc. These games cap out at 120fps very well on a GTX680, at high settings (but slightly lowered AA)

2. Games like Crysis struggles a bit at 120fps@120Hz, so the zero motion blur effect stops working when the framerate drops below 120fps. (The effect is a high-end version of a CRT 60fps@60Hz game suddenly dropping to a lower framerate -- on CRT, you start to see the edge-blurring effect of a framerate lower than refresh rate). It's still much better than without LightBoost, but the loss of the zero-motion-blur effect is noticeable.

3. I'm left wishing I can adjust the strobing down to ~85Hz so that my GPU can keep up in newer games, so I can play 85fps@85Hz. My Crysis can't run at a consistent 120fps@120Hz on a GTX 680 even at lowered Medium Detail settings in the wide-open spaces, but it will manage to do 85fps@85Hz. So a LightBoost hack could allow the strobing effect at a lower refresh rate, etc. So that my GPU can keep up, while keeping the zero motion blur effect. For single player (non-competitive), I'd rather have 85fps@85Hz with zero motion blur (strobed), than 100fps@120Hz with motion blur (non-strobed).

 

[Mark Rejhon]

I took some videos of my VG236H using my Casio 1000fps camera. Not of the motion blur (that's hard to measure without a tracking rig), but of the LightBoost strobe effect. The LightBoost strobes are approximately 2.5 milliseconds. At 1000fps, I'm capturing 2 bright strobe frames in sequence, and partials on the previous/next frames. A bit more than 2 milliseconds but less than 3 milliseconds long each. Based on these millisecond numbers, that's reducing motion blur by approximately 70% relative to non-stobed 120Hz (8.3ms samples), and approximately 85% relative to non-strobed 60 Hz (16.7ms samples). Not the 95% motion blur elimination I'd like to have, but this is the best my eyes has ever seen for any LCD, and it validates the scientific principle of a zero motion blur LCD (from the human eye perspective).

Took several video clips, non-highspeed and high-speed, with LightBoost on and off.
Later this week, I'll videoedit and creating a new YouTube video to post on my BlurBusters.com Blog.

 

[Vega]

That is pretty good news for those of us with really fast systems. You just have to buy another GTX 680.

So are you really talking CRT like motion? It's just one of those things I won't fully believe (even though all of the science is there) until I lay my own yes on it. IE: does the 70% you speak of approach CRT? As a former FW900 I kinda am skeptical.

Debating weather I should order the Benq XL2420TX 2ms 120 Hz with 3DVISION 2 kit with it for $449 shipped fully refundable:

http://www.amazon.com/BenQ-XL2420TX...&qid=1355626461&sr=8-1&keywords=benq+xl2420tx


Or order the Benq XL2411T 144Hz 1ms without 3D Vision kit for $400 (and very expensive to return, but should be easy cake to sell on Ebay as this monitor isn't sold in the US).

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-070-BQ&groupid=17&catid=510&subcat=

If I got the first and there was a way to get 144 Hz strobe to work I would be mad.

 

[Mark Rejhon]

So are you really talking CRT like motion? It's just one of those things I won't fully believe (even though all of the science is there) until I lay my own yes on it. IE: does the 70% you speak of approach CRT? As a former FW900 I kinda am skeptical.

I'd say that it's quite similar. Although TechNGamer is saying it's better than CRT, I think it's not better (yet) but it's definitely in the same neighbourhood. Far more CRT than LCD (even when comparing to normal 120Hz LCD)

Most people are using 60Hz LCD's, so based on math calculations from my strobe measurements (Casio 1000fps camera) the VG278H would have 85% less motion blur than most people's computer monitors (2.5ms of eye-tracking based blur, rather than 16.7ms of eye-tracking based blur). I'd say that throws it within a stone's throw of CRT, which I feel is 90-95% less motion blur than LCD (primarily the green ghosting effects, etc). Very hard to tell. On my VG278H, motion looks more CRT than LCD, for sure. The limiting factor is the response-time-acceleration artifacts, which trails faintly. But there's absolutely no phosphor ghosting, and edges are sharp in fast motion like CRT. It's much better than I expected, and can only get better with improved LCD's and improved strobe backlights. (If the manufacturers are willing to chase down this path.) I can now easily see a 1-pixel gap in PixPerAn chase test, something never seen before in any other LCD, although it does have visible distortions caused by response-time-acceleration. I'm able to read the "I NEED MORE SOCKS" text in the PixPerAn racecar perfectly even when it's running at 960 pixels per second. Being able to read tiny text while it's zooming across my screen at 960 pixels per second -- something I've never been able to do with any LCD, ever -- until now. I think approximately half a pixel motion blur at this speed, hard to tell. (960pps = 8 pixels step per frame, configure PixPerAn accordingly). It's a burry mess on 60Hz LCD. Once you move the car faster than roughly this speed, it's hard to track my eyes (even if it were a CRT) but it now looks like there's finally very ultra-faint amount of motion blur when you start moving objects at 1920 pixels per second (very hard to track my eyes that fast), so you just now finally barely be able to notice a possible minor shortfall relative to CRT (e.g. it psychologically feels only like a "1%" shortfall). I'll have to do more testing in pushing the limits. For all practical purposes, it's looks like zero motion blur unless I'm really trying damn hard to tire my hand out flicking my mouse so fast, that I can only barely track my eyes on the almost-too-fast-motion, and then finally I barely notice maybe 1 or 2 pixels thick of motion blur. Only I'm super aggressive at trying to move objects across my screen extremely fast. On the other hand, I've also seen worse CRT's -- long-persistence phosphor CRT's with more objectionable phosphor ghosting than what I'm seeing with the VG278H. I will say this thus far: Given a scale of traditional LCD=1 and a CRT=10, I'm giving the VG278H a "9" in sharpness of fast-motion (zero motion blur effect). To my eyes, motion on the VG278H (+zero motion blur tweak) looks 10 times better than a 60Hz LCD.

What's far more noticeable (but must be weighed against CRT phosphor ghosting artifacts) is that there's some minor trailing RTC/ghost/corona artifacts, much like you see in some reviewer photos. But surprisingly, the RTC ghost/artifacts don't show up very much in games; it only affects edges only between certain colors and certain speeds. It's hard to describe, the ghost/corona artifact is very different from what you normally see in non-strobed displays. Basically, the RTC ghosts/coronas are extremely razor-sharp double image that's chasing a few pixels behind a sharp moving image: That's the side effect of extremely slight (1%) pixel persistence leakage into the next frame for certain color contrasts. But I can't see this effect in videogames actually, and is actually less noticeable than phosphor ghosting trail artifacts (though it depends on the colors & depends on the game -- could be worse or less). It only happens when you've got big edges between big solid colors, and only between certain colors -- it's similiar to 3D shutter glasses leakage, except it's a faint razor-sharp double-edge chasing a razor-sharp edge. So I've traded CRT phosphor ghost artifacts (green ghosting in dark scenes) with faint-but-razor-sharp ghost/corona artifact.

However, the edges of everything remain razor sharp during fast movement, just like CRT. (I may replay Half Life 2 again like this. It's a new experience now, with CRT-sharp motion)

Watch your GPU if you want to do zero motion blur gaming; don't bother if you don't have a high-600-series Geforce card. Also, adjust video game settings to turn off GPU-based motion blur effects. (Although artistically desirable for some moments like being injured, I don't like it when artificial motion blur is enabled at all times in a videogame). You may have also to lower your detail level a bit, just to cap out at 120fps@120Hz. With zero motion blur gaming, you will now be able to notice frame drops even at 120Hz (where you weren't able to before, because of LCD motion blur). Much CRT at 60fps@60Hz, you quickly notice single frame drops, or CRT 120fps@120Hz, where you occasionally notice them. The zero motion blur effect makes frame drops far more noticeable; some people will hate this. Others don't mind it all that much. CRT video gamers are already familiar with this effect -- the effect is the same.

Remember, I'm talking about motion blur, not other aspects (color quality). I've had time with a friend's W900, and I also used to have a 21" CRT that could do 120Hz. For my Asus, color quality (e.g. for photoshop) is not as good as a well-calibrated FW900. It's a TN panel -- temper your expectations for color quality. Color quality will be a dissapointment for color-quality snobs. But I can say the motion blur is in "CRT territory". It totally feels like zero motion blur. Not noticeably better, not noticeably worse. Just different artifacts (very faint sharp-edge RTC artifacts instead of CRT phosphor ghosting). It may be because I'm more picky about IPS quality than TechNGaming is, so you've got to pick your poison (You want good photo viewing? IPS! You want zero motion blur on LCD? TN+LightBoost, baby!!!)

P.S. Although it looks great at just about any fps that doesn't microstutter too much --
Did I say this again: You _really_ do need to cap-out the fps at the same rate as strobes (120fps@120Hz), for the _best_ zero-motion-blur effect.
Very hard to do without a GTX680 SLI in the newest video games without an aggressive lowering of detail.

P.P.S. Regarding XL2420TX or XL2411T, I'm pretty unsure. I'd lean towards the one with the 1ms rating, but the bottom line is the length of the strobes for each monitor. Is the shutter glasses emitter built into the XL2411T like it is for the Asus VG278H? If so, then it's relatively easy to force-enable LightBoost in 2D mode -- get the XL2411T, the lower ms rating is a good sign because better response-time-acceleration (less RTC artifacts) is useful. But it's not a guarantee of it being a better strobed monitor. Or remaining bright during strobes. (Non-strobed brightness doesn't always guarantee sufficient brightness during strobed modes). We need someone well-connected to test them all, or someone near a massive elite computer store, to do some tests...

 

[mdrejhon]

More tests:
-- I've gotten LightBoost working at 100Hz and 110Hz, and it works (Win8, 306.97 drivers)! Must be done via standard Hz presets.
-- Doing it via Custom Resolutions does not work -- that kills LightBoost. However, the LightBoost is properly synchronizing (at least on my monitor) to 100Hz, 110Hz, and 120Hz.
-- At 100Hz, picture seems ever so slightly brighter. The monitor is actually dynamically lengthening the strobes at lower refresh rates, and I'm beginning to notice some really strange striped RTC artifacts in leading edges of motion test patterns (moving white square on grey background, in PixPerAn chase test). Interesting LCD quirk I've never seen before. Minor, but worse than 120Hz. My high speed camera footage is showing approximately >3ms strobes at 100Hz. Motion blur is actually starting to barely become more noticeable at 100Hz. Since strobe lengths are being lengthened against my wishes, I'm going to go back to 120Hz (eye-tracking-based motion blur is directly proportional to strobe length) -- but at least I know the 100fps@100Hz compromise is available if GPU horsepower is unable to stick to the 120fps@120Hz ceiling.

Side note:
-- I decided to test the Tile screen (I use Start8 to bypass Tile screen). There are Windows 8 redraw bugs in the Login/Tile Screen when LightBoost is enabled. It's not redrawing properly while LightBoost is enabled. (I think this is a driver bug)
-- A 1000Hz gaming mouse makes an even bigger difference when doing things like moving the mouse pointer and moving windows. If you're using a 120Hz, especially with zero motion blur (CRT or LightBoost), definitely get a gaming-quality computer mouse.

 

[jackstar7]

I'm surprised to learn Lightboost would work at non-120Hz speeds, as I had assumed that was done for the 3D effect and was meant for 60Hz for each eye and that it wouldn't be something that could even be adjusted. Glad to see there's hope for some greater potential with this.

 

[Vega]

Thanks for the in-depth testing. Unfortunately when it is IPS versus TN, it's not just good photo viewing versus zero motion blur (strobed). Resolution also takes a huge hit with a TN panel which negatively impacts everything from photo viewing to gaming. You pretty much take a hit on every single aspect of a display when going for fast motion TN.

If you have gotten those other refresh rates working with Lightboost, I wonder if 144 Hz would work? Or maybe they driver will limit that as the glasses wouldn't be able to keep up with 144 Hz. But if your testing is correct, 144 Hz would lead to a dimmer picture versus 120 Hz.

 

[Vega]

I'm surprised to learn Lightboost would work at non-120Hz speeds, as I had assumed that was done for the 3D effect and was meant for 60Hz for each eye and that it wouldn't be something that could even be adjusted. Glad to see there's hope for some greater potential with this.

In the past you can set your 3D to to run at 100 Hz and 110Hz, so I am not surprised. I am interested to know if 144Hz will work.

 

[dopple]

watch?v=nCHgmCxGEzY - mark are you capturing the backlight refresh rate or lcd refresh rate? how will it show up differently?

 

[Godmachine]

So basically , if you can't keep your frame rate at 120+ then the effect is diminished heavily and the "CRT" like smoothness drops away into obvious LCD territory?

It sounds like to run the more demanding modern games you really need serious horsepower to maintain the effect , I think in that case I may just go for a higher resolution. My GTX 480 SLI is nowhere near powerful enough to maintain the kind of fps needed for the effect to do its magic.

Perhaps when I upgrade down the line. Of course its nice to know you can do it.

 

[Mark Rejhon]

So basically , if you can't keep your frame rate at 120+ then the effect is diminished heavily and the "CRT" like smoothness drops away into obvious LCD territory?

Not LCD territory. It's more like running 60fps on a 120fps CRT.

 

[mdrejhon]

watch?v=nCHgmCxGEzY - mark are you capturing the backlight refresh rate or lcd refresh rate? how will it show up differently?

That's my older video of a DELL 2007FP, which continuously shines. So that is a pure LCD refresh capture.

There is a very clear difference between the new high speed videos with LightBoost on versus off. With it off, I see a similiar (but thinner) LCD refresh "wipe". With LightBoost on, the video is flashing. Black for several frames where I no longer see the LCD pixel persistence anymore.

 

[dopple]

That's my older video of a DELL 2007FP, which continuously shines. So that is a pure LCD refresh capture.

There is a very clear difference between the new high speed videos with LightBoost on versus off. With it off, I see a similiar (but thinner) LCD refresh "wipe". With LightBoost on, the video is flashing. Black for several frames where I no longer see the LCD pixel persistence anymore.

you mean the dell 2007fp does not have pwm flicker so it is surely lcd refresh rate/wipe rate.?

any link to the lightboost videos?

 

[Transsive]

Hello everyone, I have the VG278 for about a week now.
I bought it for excellent 2d performance at 120hz (according to digital versus).
I was very disappointed when I tried it out. Barely any better than my old Acer.
I cannot run pixperan... it's stuck at 30fps for some reason.
Still very blurry, especially noticeable in top down scrolling games like civilization or diablo.

Then yesterday I, for some reason, disabled the 3d and noticed there was no ghosting to be spotted at all in titan quest. It's like playing on my old CRT.
I almost raged when I bought my old LCD and saw the diference in blur between it and my CRT.

It's then I found out about the lightboost mode and started searching around.
I was reading this thread yesterday and though it was over a year old like most others I found... until I checked the post dates.
I guess I can join and post my experience as well.

I think there is something wrong with how light boost currently works in 2d at 120hz.
It's not that there are frame skips, the problem is I can see 1 ghost when framerate drops under 120fps. Stutter is also present.
The lower the framerate the greater the effect (more stutter and blur).
Actually I'm not even sure it is a ghost, it's like the same object is split in 2 identical images, which get more out of sync the faster the movement is.

I seem to only get good results if the game is running at exactly 120fps in 2d or 60fps in 3d.
60fps in 3d also seems to be a lot easier to maintain than 120fps in 2d.

This is how I understand these terms:
stuttering - jumpy movement, frame skips - happens when vsync is disabled
blur - smudge effect, makes everything look unclear - happens when there are ghost images, or doubles
tearing - cuts in the image (between the upper and lower part of the image) - happens when vsync is disabled

This is my current experience with 2d lightboost2 at 120Hz on the Asus VG278 (win8 64bit, 660ti, nv306.97)

braid
- looks blury in 2d with LB on (game is locked at 60 fps)
- blur is gone with 3d and glasses

shatter
- looks flawless in 2d with LB on (I can clearly see the balls moving in the menu, I even broke my old record for bonus mode the first time I tried...)

diablo 3
- ingame vsync locks the game at 60fps, objects/people are doubled when moving with LB on (120hz), creating a blur effect, no stuttering or tearing
- with disabled vsync the pictures are still separated even when running at more than 120fps
- with vsync enabled in the nv control panel the game locks to 120fps but the pictures are still separated...
- in 3d everything looks great... except it's unplayable due to all the text at 0 depth

titan quest
- looks incredible in 2d with LB on... if you are getting exactly 120fps
- when the framerate drops blur starts to be noticeable (there might be 1 ghost image), not very playable
- very easy to keep 60fps in 3d, so no tearing, stuttering or blur, unplayable due to text at 0 depth
- interestingly with vsync disabled in 3d (even when going over 60fps), there is stuttering and tearing but no blur
- seems to be the same case with 2d, very stuttery at 150fps, cannot tell if there is a ghost image

solar 2
- I can clearly see the background when moving, looks great

trine 2
- looks amazing in 3d with vsync on (60fps)
- stuttering with vsync off in 3d (67fps), no tearing, no blur
- stuttering and tearing in 2d (67fps), objects seem slightly blurred so there might be a ghost image, unplayable

torchlight
- perfect movement with 2d LB on at 120fps
- some stuttering when framerate drops under 120, did not notice a ghost image since I cannot get the game under 100fps

civilization 4
- everything is clear when scrolling in 2d with LB on at 120fps
- when the framerate drops there is stuttering and 1 very noticeable ghost image (or duplicate) while scrolling the map, unplayable
- horrible stuttering/jumpy (rubberband like) scrolling in 3d when dropping under 60fps, unplayable

I don't have a button to enable lightboost outside of games in the nvidia control panel... this highlighted option
http://www.techngaming.com/home/gui...blur-while-gaming-with-nvidia-lightboost-r485

I added the registry key EnablePersistentStereoDesktop with value 1 and this keeps lightboost activated while in the desktop. Dragging windows around is perfectly clear.
Scrolling in the browser produces the same double image effect (I'm guessing it's not rendering at 120fps)
If I scroll at the right speed I can double the rows in this thread, both look clear.

Side effect of LB always on
- display gets stuck in 3d after exiting some games (can be fixed with CTRL-T sometimes)
- sometimes stuck in 3d after login
- login screen is weird
- start menu is weird
- 3d indicator on the transmitter sometimes remains on, even when 3d is not activated
- display can only adjust contrast and LB level
- backlight wear?

Benefit (of using the registry key)
- can disable stereo in the nvidia drivers and still have lightboost on
- games no longer start in 3d
- movies are clearer

Random fact... I'm guessing the strobes are long so 3d at 60hz does not flicker as much as CRT.

Can someone confirm the double image ghosting? I want to make sure it's a general issue before I take this to nvidia forums/support.
I'm hoping it's not my unit at fault. Maybe future drivers could fix it so gaming in 2d with less than 120fps becomes feasable.
I'd also be curious how other LB2 monitors behave compared to the VG278.

 

[Vega]

So from your testing, doesn't seem to be working out too well?

 

[mdrejhon]

Then yesterday I, for some reason, disabled the 3d and noticed there was no ghosting to be spotted at all in titan quest. It's like playing on my old CRT.

Thanks for your confirmation! Between here and other forums, that makes it six or seven confirms that it's like CRT.

I think there is something wrong with how light boost currently works in 2d at 120hz.
It's not that there are frame skips, the problem is I can see 1 ghost when framerate drops under 120fps. Stutter is also present.
The lower the framerate the greater the effect (more stutter and blur).
Actually I'm not even sure it is a ghost, it's like the same object is split in 2 identical images, which get more out of sync the faster the movement is.

I get this on a CRT at 120Hz too as well, so it's not a LightBoost problem. That's the double-image effect of a repeated frame (repeat strobe on the same frame). It's far easier to see at 30fps@60Hz but the effect definitely still shows up at 60fps@120Hz (less objectionably so than 30fps@60Hz).

There were tests on that showed it will even persist at 120fps@240Hz and so on, even though the human eye gets diminishing returns, etc -- the "effect" is still visible to the eye -- One way to view it is that it is a visual harmonic effect, the beat frequency of the framerate interacting with refresh rate to create two beats (two double images). We are familiar with the frame doubling effect of 30fps@60Hz; it's the exact same thing -- but increasingly subtler at higher framerates and edges don't flicker noticeably (it ghosts instead) because at 120fps, it's beyond flicker fusion threshold.

Stutters happen because at less than 120fps, it's very easy to randomly display 1 or 2 or 3 refreshes of the same frame while it's still rendering the next frame. Rendering time is not constant, due to varying scene complexities and dynamics (spikes in action requiring more CPU and GPU, causing stutters). Capping the framerate at least refresh rate or beyond, eliminates the stutter effect from interfering with the zero motion blur effect of CRT gaming (or LCD strobed backlight gaming - LightBoost in 2D)

I seem to only get good results if the game is running at exactly 120fps in 2d or 60fps in 3d.
60fps in 3d also seems to be a lot easier to maintain than 120fps in 2d.

Same here; but there is also a performance penalty with 3D glasses that sometimes makes 120fps in 2D clearer and less stutters. But only in games that can cap out at 120fps, no 60fps limiters (ugh!)

This is how I understand these terms:
stuttering - jumpy movement, frame skips - happens when vsync is disabled
blur - smudge effect, makes everything look unclear - happens when there are ghost images, or doubles
tearing - cuts in the image (between the upper and lower part of the image) - happens when vsync is disabled

Yes, that's correct.

I added the registry key EnablePersistentStereoDesktop with value 1 and this keeps lightboost activated while in the desktop. Dragging windows around is perfectly clear.
Scrolling in the browser produces the same double image effect (I'm guessing it's not rendering at 120fps)
If I scroll at the right speed I can double the rows in this thread, both look clear.

Try Chrome which renders at 120fps, not FireFox because it renders only 60fps. Even so, there is a faint double image effect because of faint pixel persistence leakage. But it's hard to see, a faint sharp afterimage chasing a sharp image. It doesn't interfere with my ability to read text while I'm simultaneously scrolling.

If it's a strong double image (full strength as the original), that's a frame repeat (60fps@120Hz)
If it's a faint double image (like shutter glasses crosstalk), that's an artifact of pixel persistence only being ~99% perfect (LCD dependant) when the refreshed frame is finally strobed by the backlight.

Can someone confirm the double image ghosting? I want to make sure it's a general issue before I take this to nvidia forums/support.

No, the double image ghosting is normal, from what I am seeing. It's only as strong as the leakage between shutters in 3D glasses, it's a limitation. Some LCD's are better, others are worse.

I'm hoping it's not my unit at fault. Maybe future drivers could fix it so gaming in 2d with less than 120fps becomes feasable.
I'd also be curious how other LB2 monitors behave compared to the VG278.

Yep, me too. The displays with less 3D shutter glasses leakage between eyes, will be the ones that are probably superior zero-motion-blur capable displays.

 

[Vega]

I ordered the Benq XL2411T to test out to see how it compares with the Asus's. Will be interesting to see if the new 1ms panel and 144Hz will make and difference if it is select-able with Lighboost in 2D.

 

[Anisotonic]

titan quest
- very easy to keep 60fps in 3d, so no tearing, stuttering or blur, unplayable due to text at 0 depth

actually, titan quest is one of my favourite 3d experiences so far. it responds really well to the technique where you set convergence so that your cursor is level with the ground near your character with a depth of around 15 to 25%. after a while I found the controls just as accurate as 2d, and there's tons of pop-out effects everywhere, and when you can see down a cliff or something far away it gets surprisingly deep. I'd try it again.

 

[Transsive]

Thank you for the feedback.

I installed Chrome and enabled 'GPU composition on all pages' and smooth scrolling.
Middle click scrolling seems to work at 20fps, looks very bad.
But if I drag the scroll bar I can get it up to 120fps which looks very clear.

Firefox on the other hand looks like it uses 60fps all the time. (can't tell, fraps doesn't show up)

So you're saying the double frame is normal. It kind off looks just like 3d when you're not wearing the glasses.
The thing I don't understand is why there are 2 pictures at the same time on the screen.
If the screen is fast enough to only show 1 picture at 120fps, why do I see 2 at 60fps.
I would expect movement to be less smooth, not see two separate objects.
I mean, the object should simply stay in the same place for 2 frames, then move on to the next position (simulating 60hz).

I'm probably missing something... please explain if you can.

If there will be no fix to this, then using such a screen is only feasible with a very powerful PC (especially graphics card). My 660ti isn't really up to snuff.
I would be very pleased to play at 60fps with no blur.

Here's an interesting experiment I made.
I set fraps to capture video at 60fps (half size so it wouldn't reduce the framerate).
I then started Shatter, and disabled the 3d to get 2d lightboost (120fps).
Then, I activated fraps which locked the game to 60fps, down from 120. (this should be possible to recreate in any game that runs at 120fps)

The effect in game while recording?.. Double image. All to be expected till now.
The same effect can be seen in the video afterwards.

Then, the interesting part, I tried to glitch the glasses into staying active while playing the recorded video.
Started Trine with 3d active, alt-tabbed and voila, I have a 3d desktop.
Now, when viewing the video guess what, no double image, 60fps movement, no ghosting, no blur.
And the really funny part... scrolling in firefox is slightly jumpy but clear!

What this tells me, is that in 2d the frames are positioned wrong when the framerate drops during movement (with a movement of 10 pixels every frame: frame 1 at pixel 1, frame 2 at pixel 6, frame 3 at pixel 11, frame 4 at pixel 16 - an off-shot of 5 pixels between even and odd frames).
At least that's what my conclusion is for now... I might be wrong, very wrong.

I'll wait for more input.

 

[wabbitseason]

I have to admit, Mark, part of me thought that nothing, not even a strobed backlight, could salvage LCD technology. To my delight, it seems I could be wrong.

 

[Druneau]

Are they just using DDC to control backlight brightness?

For 3D the LCD's usually have more brightness then typical LCD panels, so maybe just going 100% brightness then 0 is good enough to get most of the strobe effect.

Or do they have actual hardware behind this?

I'm hoping it's only software combined with brighter then typical backlights. This could lead to some hacks which could allow this to work on multiple LCD's/GPU's. i.e. a program runs in the background, which sends DDC commands (if it's even fast enough to respond...) to change brightness levels on the fly.

 

[mdrejhon]

Thank you for the feedback.

I installed Chrome and enabled 'GPU composition on all pages' and smooth scrolling.
Middle click scrolling seems to work at 20fps, looks very bad.
But if I drag the scroll bar I can get it up to 120fps which looks very clear.

You need to try a different smoothscroll plug in extension. Google "Chromium smooth scroll" and get that from Google's extensions store. Works soooo much better!

Firefox on the other hand looks like it uses 60fps all the time. (can't tell, fraps doesn't show up)

We need to raise buzz on FireFox's bugzilla system. I will dig up Bugzilla ticket #'s and a link so we can directly get their attention to raise their framelimit for us!

So you're saying the double frame is normal. It kind off looks just like 3d when you're not wearing the glasses.
The thing I don't understand is why there are 2 pictures at the same time on the screen.

Before we proceed any further, I need to understand if what you are seeing is the same thing I am seeing. Is it two full-strength double images, or one strong image, one faint afterimage? Also, if the double image is about 5 or 10 pixels apart, during fast motion and about 2-3 pixels apart during slow motion, you are seeing what I am also seeing.
-- The full strength double image at 60fps@120Hz is completely normal and an effect of human eye tracking on 60fps@120Hz. This also happens on CRT. Why this happens, I will explain below.
-- The faint ghost image (1% strength) at 120fps@120Hz is a pixel persisrence effect, about the same weakness as image leaking between two eyes of shutter glasses. It is only barely noticeable, and only on edges between certain colors.

I'm probably missing something... please explain if you can.
If there will be no fix to this, then using such a screen is only feasible with a very powerful PC (especially graphics card). My 660ti isn't really up to snuff.
I would be very pleased to play at 60fps with no blur.

The only way to do this is to use a 60 Hz strobe backlight, flickering like a 60 Hz CRT.

The double image effect happens at. 60fps@120Hz is the same double image effect seen at 30fps@60Hz. Human eyes are continuously tracking, regardless of the frame behavior on screen. Your eyes have moved forward in the time between the two strobes. Your human eyes are in different positions when the strobes happens. Voila. Double image effect. CRT users are familiar with seeing this effect, of half framerate of refresh rate, causing a double image effect. This effect does not usually happen on normal LCD. It is normal.

The effect in game while recording?.. Double image. All to be expected till now.
The same effect can be seen in the video afterwards.

Then, the interesting part, I tried to glitch the glasses into staying active while playing the recorded video.
Started Trine with 3d active, alt-tabbed and voila, I have a 3d desktop.
Now, when viewing the video guess what, no double image, 60fps movement, no ghosting, no blur.
And the really funny part... scrolling in firefox is slightly jumpy but clear!
What this tells me, is that in 2d the frames are positioned wrong when the framerate drops during movement (with a movement of 10 pixels every frame: frame 1 at pixel 1, frame 2 at pixel 6, frame 3 at pixel 11, frame 4 at pixel 16 - an off-shot of 5 pixels between even and odd frames).
At least that's what my conclusion is for now... I might be wrong, very wrong.
I'll wait for more input.

I need to see the effect before explaining it. Did you turn on motion interpolation during video playback? That would explain it (60fps converted to 120fps). Does the screen look like it flickers more? Maybe you successfully glitched the strobe backlight into functioning at 60 Hz. If so, this is good news. Reducing strobe to 60Hz would explain the effect with FireFox too.

So; can you tell me: What does the control panel say for refresh rate when you do this "glitch"? The other theory is that, somehow, black frame insertion is now happening (every other frame is now blacked out) due to a frame buffer flipping glitch that also essentially hides every other strobe. If so, that means one strobe per actual displayed refresh and would cause the 60fps@60Hz zero motion blur effect.

I'd REALLY like to reproduce this. Can you tell me if you're now seeing increased flickering? This will be the major clue.

 

[Mark Rejhon]

Are they just using DDC to control backlight brightness?

DDC -- Probably
Backlight brightness -- It's a little more complicated than that.

Yes, many monitors use PWM (multiple strobes) to do dimming, but they don't optimize the strobing for motion blur reduction because it's multiple longish strobes per refresh.
For the zero motion blur effect: You must have only ONE strobe PER per refresh -- for each pixel. (Does not have to be all pixels simultaneously. It can be strobing the whole screen all at once like LightBoost2, or strobing one dot/pixel/scanline at a time like CRT) In addition, you want the strobes to be short for the CRT "zero motion blur" effect.

The important key ingredient for the CRT "zero motion blur" effect:
One strobe PER pixel PER refresh.

Shorter strobes (once per refresh) is less motion blur.
1/120sec strobes = 50% motion blur reduction over traditional 60 Hz LCD
1/240sec strobes = 75% motion blur reduction over traditional 60 Hz LCD
1/480sec strobes = 87.5% motion blur reduction over traditional 60 Hz LCD (VG236H is close to this)
1/960sec strobes = 93.75% motion blur reduction over traditional 60 Hz LCD

My Casio Exilim EX-FC200 high speed camera (480fps and 1000fps recordings) is showing that the Asus variant of LightBoost is outputting approximately 2.5ms strobes (1/400sec strobes). (YouTube coming by around Tuesday). So, thus, this produces roughly the same approximate "motion equivalence" of a theoretical 400fps@400Hz non-strobing LCD.

The main problem is shorter strobes will result in a dimmer picture because you are outputting less light during shorter strobes. So you need much more powerful flashes to compensate. I've calculated that in order to equal the blinding brightness of phosphor during the short flashes of phosphor illumination-and-decay on a CRT -- you need approximately 150 watts of LED illumination per square foot, in order to approximately equal CRT in the zero motion blur quality. LED's are recently finally becoming usable for stadium lighting, streetlamps, and projectors; so the technology is arriving -- I knew this was happening (panel technology already here; LED technology already here); and I recognized the zero motion blur potential before people discovered LightBoost was doing it.

It appears the LightBoost2 monitors is using really high efficiency sidelight LED's that are over-driven during short surges (over-driving LED's during short strobes is usually harmless as long as the strobes are very short, you can safely get approximately 2-3x extra brightness out of a LED when you over-drive during strobes). Even so, there's plenty of room for further technological improvement (even shorter strobes, even brighter strobes, better 1ms RTC, fewer LCD artifacts, hopefully IPS!).

As I've explained before:
The zero motion blur effect is completely independent of pixel persistence, once LCD technology is advanced enough to finish pixel persistence BEFORE the end of a refresh.
A refresh cycle is 8 millisecond long at 120Hz, and pixel persistence is now approaching 1ms-2ms nowadays. So you simply strobe (even strobe for shorter time periods than pixel persistence). By using a strobed backlight, it's possible for a 2ms LCD to 'seem like' a 0.5ms LCD simply by strobing the backlight for 0.5ms AFTER the 2ms (in the 8ms window of a 120Hz refresh). The human eye only sees the 0.5ms (from the strobe), rather than the 2.0ms pixel persistence (kept in the dark before the strobe). As you can see, and as proven by the CRT effect on the Asus VG278H -- you're bypassing pixel persistence and sample-n-hold with a strobed backlight, and successfully getting the CRT "perfect motion" effect on an LCD. This is precise strobing, and best needs custom electronics/LED's, so you can't use just any monitor.

Yes, I've done lots of studying on this topic -- Science & References

For 3D the LCD's usually have more brightness then typical LCD panels, so maybe just going 100% brightness then 0 is good enough to get most of the strobe effect.Or do they have actual hardware behind this?

It's not enough to just adjust PWM brightness to get the motion blur reductions. You need specially optimized strobes (one strobe per refresh, as bright as possible, as short as possible).

LightBoost2 is finally a MAJOR step towards successfully achieving zero motion blur on LCD. However, we've only approximately matched the motion quality of a medium-long persistence CRT. There's plenty of room for further improvement to equal a medium-phosphor-persistence (and faster) CRT's.

I'm hoping it's only software combined with brighter then typical backlights. This could lead to some hacks which could allow this to work on multiple LCD's/GPU's. i.e. a program runs in the background, which sends DDC commands (if it's even fast enough to respond...) to change brightness levels on the fly.

Yes, it MAY be possible, provided.
(1) It's commandable via DDC.
(2) The computer monitor's backlight electronics is programmable, and is possible to program one strobe per refresh.

Any DDC experts in this thread? I've got C/C++/C#/Java programming, and I have worked with generating VESA Generalized Timing Formulas, and have a good understanding of timings (at least analog), including how Horizontal/Vertical Front Porch, Back Porch, Blanking Interval, etc works. But that was several years ago. Perhaps it's time to warm up some "DDC programming skillz" again (heh heh), though it's the digital era nowadays instead of VGA (I'm not sure Windows8 security lockdown mechanisms even lets me easily program DDC anymore, alas!). However, I am a bit overloaded in work right now -- so I welcome somebody else to try a little DDC experiments before I do. Anyone?

 

[Mark Rejhon]

I have to admit, Mark, part of me thought that nothing, not even a strobed backlight, could salvage LCD technology. To my delight, it seems I could be wrong.

I used to do a lot of work in the home theater industry (info), so I've got a human vision understanding of how motion blur behaves.

It's great that us users have accidentally discovered LightBoost2 strobing was good for more than just 3D. Even though I correctly recognized zero motion blur was now already possible on today's LCD (required panel technology finally arrived, and required LED technology finally arrived), before manufacturers started actually doing it to a computer monitor (albiet for a different reason: extra brightness and reduced crosstalk during 3D) And it also proves the scientific principles behind my planned monitor hacking next year (keep an eye on my BlurBusters Blog).

 

[sadbuttrue]

I take these "CRT motion clarity" claims with a grain of salt. Compared to my FW900 I'd give the VG278HE about 6/10. Vega - considering you give it 9/10, I'm expecting at least 11/10 for the Benq you ordered

 

[Druneau]

I take these "CRT motion clarity" claims with a grain of salt. Compared to my FW900 I'd give the VG278HE about 6/10. Vega - considering you give it 9/10, I'm expecting at least 11/10 for the Benq you ordered

So you didn't like the effect it gave on your VG278HE?

It should at least reduce blur by quite a bit?

 

[Vega]

How fast of a camera do I need in order to test strobe length? I know you said the Asus is 2.5ms strobe. With my Benq inbound, curious if it is the same, faster, or slower since the strobe length can really determine the motion blur reduction capabilities.

Can you guys with the Asus monitors test custom refresh rates to see if the Lightboost dynamically follows it? Usually you can squeeze a few more Hz out of the monitors. I got 150 Hz out of my 144Hz 27" Asus that I used to have. Curious if Lightboost will only work on exactly set EDID refresh rates or will work on custom ones also?

 

[sadbuttrue]

So you didn't like the effect it gave on your VG278HE?

It should at least reduce blur by quite a bit?

I should clarify - the VG278HE was returned a while ago, so my rating is based solely on normal 144hz use.

 

[Vega]

I take these "CRT motion clarity" claims with a grain of salt. Compared to my FW900 I'd give the VG278HE about 6/10. Vega - considering you give it 9/10, I'm expecting at least 11/10 for the Benq you ordered

That was a motion smoothness rating, not a motion clarity rating. I should have, clarified.

The 144 Hz Asus has very "smooth" feeling motion, but of course the motion clarity does not compare to the FW900. Maybe a 6 or 7 out of 10.

 

[Druneau]

ah ok.

Thanks,

I was just wondering, because the theory behind strobes on LCD's adds up. And should bring CRT like motion clarity to LCD's.

 

[sadbuttrue]

My Casio Exilim EX-FC200 high speed camera (480fps and 1000fps recordings) is showing that the Asus variant of LightBoost is outputting approximately 2.5ms strobes (1/400sec strobes). (YouTube coming by around Tuesday). So, thus, this produces roughly the same approximate "motion equivalence" of a theoretical 400fps@400Hz non-strobing LCD.

The backlight runs at 360hz @ 120hz (432hz for 144hz). I'd guess the strobe frequency is fixed at that speed. It would mean that LightBoost could probably be done at 144hz.