Apple iPhone 7 Event Livestream

[voklskier4452]

Ultimately all they accomplished by removing the headphone port and moving the DAC to headphones/dongle. I wouldn't have such an issue with this if it didn't mean I can't charge and listen to wired headphones at the same time without someone coming out with some kind of Y adapter. If they had included wireless charging or even a stupid Y adapter I would have been more or less okay with this decision. I definitely won't be ordering this phone on release day like I did with the 6 since I really want to wait and see how this whole headphone issue plays out.

 

[rat]

Analogue audio is not, and will never be outdated tech.
"Keep it Simple Stupid".
... and a major step backwards.

What they did this time around is just an extension of what they've been doing all along: Removing features so they can sell it back to you as a dongle or have you guy an overpriced accessory. Anyone who has been using PCs long enough know that dongles and adapters are a nightmare to deal with. So I have no idea how ANYONE can justify removing a universal port as an improvement. Now Apple has _ZERO_ standardized ports on the iPhone.

 

[Deleted member 245375]

Now Apple has _ZERO_ standardized ports on the iPhone.

The Lightning port IS the standard for Apple mobile devices, has been for a few years now and the sheer number of Lightning accessories at this point - which now outweigh anything for the original connectors - basically render your opinion moot.

 

[Orddie]

Analogue audio is not, and will never be outdated tech.

Tech is relevant as long as it is still what best meets the end users needs, and for the overwhelming majority of people, an analogue headphone jack meets our needs MUCH better than any wireless solution can.

IN engineering we work by the KISS principle. "Keep it Simple Stupid". Never design a product to be any more complicated or complex than the simplest solution that will do the job.

From this perspective, wireless headsets are just plain stupidity, and a major step backwards.

does that not dffer who would be using the tech? I do not like wires, so wireless is best. Also, the headphones included with the iphone as still the same in that you plug it into a port on the phone. so i think they KISS'ed very well. Want to plug in your headphones? plug it into the port and your done! Want to connect your wireless headphones? Just open the box and hit yes on the phone.

 

[rat]

The Lightning port IS the standard for Apple mobile devices, has been for a few years now and the sheer number of Lightning accessories at this point - which now outweigh anything for the original connectors - basically render your opinion moot.

It is still proprietary and beholden to an Apple Tax.

Suppose nVidia released a new video card that had "the standard for nVidia video devices" but wasn't something anyone else used.

You wouldn't be giving them nearly as much slack.

Apple's own standard is still a proprietary port.

 

[Deleted member 245375]

And yet it's still considered to be a standard at this point in time since Apple products are a platform in and of themselves.

 

[Orddie]

It is still proprietary and beholden to an Apple Tax.

Suppose nVidia released a new video card that had "the standard for nVidia video devices" but wasn't something anyone else used.

You wouldn't be giving them nearly as much slack.

Apple's own standard is still a proprietary port.

Kinda like saying why are we going to HDMI? the picture on my CRT was fine, fuck my VCR was just fine as well. Why do i need to change / upgrade my tech? and now HDMI is very much the standard.

 

[rat]

Kinda like saying why are we going to HDMI? the picture on my CRT was fine, fuck my VCR was just fine as well. Why do i need to change / upgrade my tech? and now HDMI is very much the standard.

Everyone is free to adopt HDMI. Nobody is able to adopt Lightning. It remains Apple's own proprietary plug.

 

[Deleted whining member 223597]

Everyone is free to adopt HDMI. Nobody is able to adopt Lightning. It remains Apple's own proprietary plug.

And..who cares? It works fine in the Apple ecosystem, which is what it's designed for. Nobody ever said Apple is looking to expand their accessories outside of their own products.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

does that not dffer who would be using the tech? I do not like wires, so wireless is best. Also, the headphones included with the iphone as still the same in that you plug it into a port on the phone. so i think they KISS'ed very well. Want to plug in your headphones? plug it into the port and your done! Want to connect your wireless headphones? Just open the box and hit yes on the phone.

It's not a matter of keeping the user experience simple. It's matter of keeping the DESIGN simple. Wireless technologies are infinitely more complex than simple copper conductors.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

And..who cares? It works fine in the Apple ecosystem, which is what it's designed for. Nobody ever said Apple is looking to expand their accessories outside of their own products.

Which means you get hardware lock-in for something that should be universal, like a headset...

 

[rat]

And..who cares?

The point is that being able to adopt something is what makes it a standard over a proprietary implementation.

Apple now has ZERO standard plug interfaces.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

The point is that being able to adopt something is what makes it a standard over a proprietary implementation.

Apple now has ZERO standard plug interfaces.

Yep. Enjoy paying the $50 for a new cable

There ought to be some law requiring all consumer devices to use standards compliant plugs and interfaces where available.

 

[Deleted whining member 223597]

The point is that being able to adopt something is what makes it a standard over a proprietary implementation.

Apple now has ZERO standard plug interfaces.

Which again, has zero effect on users within the Apple ecosystem. People cried about the lightning connector for years, yet I've never had issues using them. I have a Windows PC, Macbook, iPhone and Galaxy S2 tablet, yet I have no issues. My lightning cable works with my phone and micro-usb with my tablet. Again, this might be an issue if you need very specific cables for specific products but in most cases it doesn't matter. If you don't want to get in the Apple ecosystem, then don't.

Which means you get hardware lock-in for something that should be universal, like a headset...

Again, this matters to me how? There will always be an adapter, but at the end of the day Apple just doesn't make sense for you if you worry about things like that. Don't like it, don't buy it. The Macbook is useless to me, the 1 usb-c port is stupid and I won't support it.

 

[Terpfen]

Which means you get hardware lock-in for something that should be universal, like a headset...

How does an adapter lock you in? The whole point is to avoid lock in. That's why you're adapting. The alternative is Bluetooth, which is hardly proprietary to Apple. Your complaint makes no sense.

 

[westrock2000]

Yep. Enjoy paying the $50 for a new cable

There ought to be some law requiring all consumer devices to use standards compliant plugs and interfaces where available.

There is. It's called the European Union and we (Americans) are not part of it for reasons far beyond ports on a phone.

You are calling for standards.....but you are calling for us to use your standard. We like lightning cables, I wish everything had a lightning cable because of the unidirectional port. And USB-C moved in that direction.....but again it's "use our standard".

 

[pxc]

I'm going to die laughing if broken Lightning ports become a thing from mechanical stress of using it as a headphone jack.

 

[westrock2000]

SO here is the official product. It's $9, which is not terrible for Apple. But it's something to tote around, and there are many practical issues.

However, what I want to hear discussed is how are they doing this? That is WAY to small to house a DAC and amplifier. So they have to be getting an analogoue signal out of the lightning port. That would be a cool thing to learn about. How do you get a stereo analogue signal out of a unidirectional USB plug? I'm seeing 8 pins per side on a lighting cable. So it's certainly possible they are adjusting the functionality of the port to send a analogue signal instead USB data pins.

EDIT:

Looked it up.

Pin Signal Description
1 V-
2 D+
3 D-
4 (dynamic)
5 (dynamic)
6 (dynamic)
7 (dynamic)
8 (dynamic)

So looks like they may have had this in the works from the get go. The analogue runs in tandem to the data pins.

 

[Orddie]

It's not a matter of keeping the user experience simple. It's matter of keeping the DESIGN simple. Wireless technologies are infinitely more complex than simple copper conductors.

and yet.. all you have to do is open the case close to your phone and it "Just works".

 

[Bandalo]

There is. It's called the European Union and we (Americans) are not part of it for reasons far beyond ports on a phone.

You are calling for standards.....but you are calling for us to use your standard. We like lightning cables, I wish everything had a lightning cable because of the unidirectional port. And USB-C moved in that direction.....but again it's "use our standard".

There's a difference though. USB-C is an open standard, any manufacturer can build devices to that standard on both ends. Lighting is Apple only, and Apple will take a cut of the licensing fee on both ends.

One is a standard everyone can use. The other is a standard that makes Apple money. There's no TECHNICAL reason not to use the open standard, only a monetary one.

 

[rat]

and yet.. all you have to do is open the case close to your phone and it "Just works".

We'll see about that. Apparently it's using a combination of its own bluetooth and wifi protocol over the same frequencies... 2.4Ghz... as if that wasn't crowded enough already. Gonna be interesting how busy places are for signal.

 

[Bandalo]

We'll see about that. Apparently it's using a combination of its own bluetooth and wifi protocol over the same frequencies... 2.4Ghz... as if that wasn't crowded enough already. Gonna be interesting how busy places are for signal.

It's a feature! Share your music with everyone else with Air Pods within 30ft. Additional music distribution fees will automatically be added to your account for your convenience.

 

[Zepher]

I watched the stream last night and did they stream this in 2.35:1 aspect ratio? It filled my 21:9 monitor perfectly.

 

[westrock2000]

There's a difference though. USB-C is an open standard, any manufacturer can build devices to that standard on both ends. Lighting is Apple only, and Apple will take a cut of the licensing fee on both ends.

One is a standard everyone can use. The other is a standard that makes Apple money. There's no TECHNICAL reason not to use the open standard, only a monetary one.

You make it sound like monetary reasons are trivial. I mean why even have different phones at all? Why have Android and iOS? Why have different frequency spectrums?

Because the ONLY reason anything great has ever been done in this world was for monetary reasons. Even going to the Moon.

 

[Bandalo]

You make it sound like monetary reasons are trivial. I mean why even have different phones at all? Why have Android and iOS? Why have different frequency spectrums?

Because the ONLY reason anything great has ever been done in this world was for monetary reasons. Even going to the Moon.

Apple listed a huge number of reasons to dump the headphone jack, not one of them really holds water though. The monetary reasons are not trivial TO APPLE, they're the only real reason they're making this change. This isn't about making a better device, a superior sound experience, more flexibility, higher battery life, etc. This is purely about making Apple more money in licensing fees. That's it.

 

[mope54]

Ridiculous. USB-C wasn't even finalized until a full two years after Apple had switched to lightning connectors. Now we're another two years out and lightning peripherals are ubiquitous whereas USB-C is still coming around.

So the argument is Apple should have waited 4 years to implement USB-C rather than lightening? Or that something finally gaining ground 4 years after their own implementation is somehow indicative of them not using some other standard? This really is like someone getting pissed at Sony for not implementing HDMI on all their old TVs and VCRs, as someone pointed out earlier.

Not to mention, there are significant design difference between the two plugs, one being the fact that lightning has its pins on the cable while USB-C leaves them in the device. So if one of the tabs or pins wears/breaks I have to replace the entire device instead of just the cable? Sounds great!

 

[skiddy]

Apple listed a huge number of reasons to dump the headphone jack, not one of them really holds water though.

"Courage" is a pretty valid reason silly

I was pretty under impressed with this launch. Removing the 3.5mm jack is a pretty big deal for me, I think I'll hang on to my 6+ for quite a bit more time. I'm constantly using my headphones and charging while I'm traveling, and I don't want some POS wireless solution.

 

[Bandalo]

"Courage" is a pretty valid reason silly

I was pretty under impressed with this launch. Removing the 3.5mm jack is a pretty big deal for me, I think I'll hang on to my 6+ for quite a bit more time. I'm constantly using my headphones and charging while I'm traveling, and I don't want some POS wireless solution.

POS wireless? Don't you know that Apple owns the biggest wireless headphone manufacturer? Surely you wouldn't been seen in public without your Beats!

 

[westrock2000]

The upshot is that battery cases will FINALLY have lightning connectors instead of USB.