Apple Defends Decision To Remove 3.5mm Headphone Jack, Cites “Courage”

nysmo said:
Ok fine then, how about when optical disc drives stopped being included in certain laptops. A lot of people threw an uproar over their inability to access those precious cd-roms because ya never know when you might have to burn something or whatever the fuck. I rolled my eyes and cringed just as hard back then. Or when laptops stopped including 5+ usb ports with 3+ video out ports. "omg der taking away our optionz!". It reminded me of the fat guys at work who would bring a backpack every day like a schoolkid filled with all these backup essentials "just in case". They'd have a full change of clothes, bottle of water, external HD, a few USB drives, their laptop from home that they never use at work, etc etc etc. I'd call them out on it and they'd say "dude you never know when you might get caught in a storm at work and need a change of dry clothes, or spill coffee all over your crotch or need 8TB to migrate some data off another guys laptop". Yeah, they never touched that shit once in 5 years, but they put themselves through the inconvenience of having all that extra shit "just in case".

The problem with MS removing the start menu is nearly 100% of their user base depended upon it, so much so that nobody had time to relearn a new system. And it didnt exactly make anything better, it just made it different. It'd be like if car manufactures all suddenly decided to change from round steering wheels to joysticks in the car. It's just too dramatic and there has been no gradual shift into that design yet to prepare people. You cant just have one thing that everyone uses and then the next day take it all away. But the headphone jack is different. We've had a solution to this problem for years and people have been using it. We're finally to a point where it's just flat out not necessary any more except for people too cheap to buy quality headphones.
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A lot of laptops still have optical disc drives. The laptops that don't have them are typically a different class of laptops from the ones that do have them. Again, your analogy fails. For it to be valid, Apple should have an iPhone 7 with a headphone jack (and whatever supposed compromise that brings) and one without a headphone jack. As it stands, Apple does not have that.

Terpfen said:
So you have a browser extension that automatically filters out page 1 of every forum thread? Good to know.
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I see that you have an extension that filters out every post that contradicts what you posted before you even post it. Good to know as well.
 
Trimlock said:
This keeps getting brought up but most don't remember the "skin" that Samsung used, which looked and worked exactly like iOS at the time. The only way Apple could get them to fix it was to utilize multiple patents.

Plus Steve Jobs had a massive fucking agenda against Android and he couldn't do anything about it, that part I loved :D
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You loved that the CEO of one of the most valuable tech companies wanted to obliterate the competition?

Interesting.
 
Tsumi said:
No one has yet given a valid, functional reason why it should have been eliminated. Answers have varied from aesthetics to waterproofing (debunked) and stereo speakers (also debunked). Meanwhile, there are functional reasons why it should be kept.



Did you even bother to read the thread? No? Okay.
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They don't need functional reasons. What don't you understand about that? They are designing the product they want and that doesn't include a headphone jack. Buy another phone if it bothers you. Don't buy anything if you don't want. If the headphone jack is so important, the phone will be a flop.
 
Tsumi said:
A lot of laptops still have optical disc drives. The laptops that don't have them are typically a different class of laptops from the ones that do have them. Again, your analogy fails. For it to be valid, Apple should have an iPhone 7 with a headphone jack (and whatever supposed compromise that brings) and one without a headphone jack. As it stands, Apple does not have that.
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Apple does have that, it's called the iphone 6. The only laptops that still have optical drives are for people who still demand headphones jacks in their phones. There are less and less of them, they are no longer featured prominently in stores, and it should be obvious how undesirable they are since who the hell uses optical media for anything these days. This is the perfect analogy.
 
I was hoping to have an all in one device with a phone. Music player for whatever, phone, etc.. Music player will have to be a different device. I'll stick with the 6S for as long as I can, though.
 
Ultima99 said:
Ancient port? Great argument.

By the way, we've been using those stupid ancient wheels forever too. We should get rid of them!
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My Apple car with square wheels works great! The built in back massager is excellent after a hard day of bending over


(I swear I tried to resist the temptation)
 
Trimlock said:
This keeps getting brought up but most don't remember the "skin" that Samsung used, which looked and worked exactly like iOS at the time. The only way Apple could get them to fix it was to utilize multiple patents.

Plus Steve Jobs had a massive fucking agenda against Android and he couldn't do anything about it, that part I loved :D
Click to expand...

Didn't apple steal that skin from a tyco toy phone?
 
Its not courage, its following a trend. Samsung has the same earbuds also.
 
nysmo said:
Ok fine then, how about when optical disc drives stopped being included in certain laptops. A lot of people threw an uproar over their inability to access those precious cd-roms because ya never know when you might have to burn something or whatever the fuck. I rolled my eyes and cringed just as hard back then. Or when laptops stopped including 5+ usb ports with 3+ video out ports. "omg der taking away our optionz!". It reminded me of the fat guys at work who would bring a backpack every day like a schoolkid filled with all these backup essentials "just in case". They'd have a full change of clothes, bottle of water, external HD, a few USB drives, their laptop from home that they never use at work, etc etc etc. I'd call them out on it and they'd say "dude you never know when you might get caught in a storm at work and need a change of dry clothes, or spill coffee all over your crotch or need 8TB to migrate some data off another guys laptop". Yeah, they never touched that shit once in 5 years, but they put themselves through the inconvenience of having all that extra shit "just in case".

The problem with MS removing the start menu is nearly 100% of their user base depended upon it, so much so that nobody had time to relearn a new system. And it didnt exactly make anything better, it just made it different. It'd be like if car manufactures all suddenly decided to change from round steering wheels to joysticks in the car. It's just too dramatic and there has been no gradual shift into that design yet to prepare people. You cant just have one thing that everyone uses and then the next day take it all away. But the headphone jack is different. We've had a solution to this problem for years and people have been using it. We're finally to a point where it's just flat out not necessary any more except for people too cheap to buy quality headphones.
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Don't give me that "too cheap to buy quality headphones" bullshit. Most of the quality headphones are still corded. I have yet to find a pair of bluetooth headphones that are worth half a damn. I always end up going back to my $400 Sennheiser's.
 
Trimlock said:
This keeps getting brought up but most don't remember the "skin" that Samsung used, which looked and worked exactly like iOS at the time. The only way Apple could get them to fix it was to utilize multiple patents.

Plus Steve Jobs had a massive fucking agenda against Android and he couldn't do anything about it, that part I loved :D
Click to expand...

Ok genius. What did I fail to read?

Or have you failed?

Edit. I'm serious. Spell it out for me, I'm limited with intelligence.
 
Hellstoaster said:
Don't give me that "too cheap to buy quality headphones" bullshit. Most of the quality headphones are still corded. I have yet to find a pair of bluetooth headphones that are worth half a damn. I always end up going back to my $400 Sennheiser's.
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You may like the non neutral Senn sound, just your preference and completely valid. I find the newer v moda headphones to be decent. Not perfect, then again nothing is.
 
In 2 years you'll all be jerking off to your new fucking Samsungs and shouting about how Apple never started the nixing of the 3.5mm jack in cell phones. Who gives a fuck? Don't like it? Don't buy it. But feel free to keep on bashing a company for releasing the products they want to release. It seems pretty fucking hilarious to me that in this highly conservative forum, almost everyone feels entitled to having the option to buy an iPhone 7 with a 3.5mm jack even though they simultaneously abhor the company that makes it.
 
mope54 said:
So to get your argument straight, you're pissed off about not being able to direct connect your AKGs to your phone?

Sorry, that seems like retarded logic. When I sit down with my AKGs I am connected to a DAC and tube amp. If I wanted to connect them to my phone, this simply makes it easier or at least no worse connecting them through the lightning to 3.5mm socket. If nothing else, I'll be able to bypass whatever crappy DAC is implemented in current phones.

Back when iPhones were using 30pin connectors, those of us over on head-fi had one of the members fab up 30pin to 3.5mm connectors so we could bypass the internal DAC. The only one worth anything was the Wolfsen DAC already mentioned. This is a non-issue for an audiophile but nice try attempting to sound like you know what you're talking about.
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I'm not pissed off at all, hard to be pissed off about a product who's entire existence is completely irrelevant to you ;) Also, I never said anything about "audiophile" it's more or less a proven fact that 95% of what that crowd says is utter fucking non sense anyways. tone neutral is tone neutral, when 99% of people will never tell the difference it becomes more likely a situation of confirmation bias. Every single person who has listened to my headphones hears the difference immediately. The difference between -MY- phone (Not a iJunk) and my dedicated DAC however? not so much. Keep your audiophile non sense over on head fi where people actually buy into that shit. And yes I've personally owned and listened to gear worth more than my car, it's non sense.
 
Terpfen said:
The iPhone is the leading smartphone. The only relatively reasonable competitor is Samsung, which slavishly copies the iPhone as proven in a court of law. So, yes, you're basically implicitly admitting here that problems aren't really problems until they're sufficiently mass market, defined as "sold at Apple.com."
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Leading in what, profits? Sure, I'll grant you that: massive gigantic profits that every company on Earth wishes they could get even in the ballpark of and that just continues. Were you instead implying it's the best smartphone, 'cause if you were then you'd be wrong because no such thing is possible. There can be a best smartphone for me, a best smartphone for you, and others too on an individual basis but it's impossible to have or even truly make a statement like "The iPhone (whatever) is the best smartphone." because best is relative and subjective at the same time.

But the iPhone 7/7 Plus is far from "leading" in terms of actual real-world technology that people want in their smartphones, Apple typically lags behind other devices (because Android is an OS, not a hardware platform, and Windows Phone, well who the fuck cares really - I still don't know one single person that owns a Windows Phone) by several years but as always, when they do catch up the tech industry freaks out because of simple refinements to tech that someone else created. That's the nature of the industry I suppose, of any industry to be honest.

Apple is a band of thieves peddling off devices literally as "the second coming" of whatever it happens to be, period, and if Steve Jobs were alive today he would laugh and nod his head in absolute total agreement. They're just always late to the party but that's their entire point: they're not first to arrive (not even with the original iPhone), but they sure do give devices a nice polish and shine for that second time around. :D
 
delita said:
Anyone using a PHONE as their SOURCE for "audiophile" grade equipment is ignorant.

Anyway, not saying you are WRONG for saying Apple is shitty for removing it, I'm just saying that I could personally give 2 shits because I jumped ship from wired headphones on my phone a while back.

I'll be giving away my AirPods to a homeless guy on the street, they look fucking stupid, probably sound horrible, and were built to be lost and never found so that people have to re-purchase them endlessly.
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As i said in my other post. I have AKG K612Pro's almost no one can tell the difference between my phone (LG g4) and my dedicated DAc other than it's louder (More power output). But everyone instantly tells the difference between my headphones and anything else they've heard. So nothing entirely wrong with a phone's DAC per say, depends on the phone, the DAC in it, and how much power you require both in mW and Ohms. As for your statement of wireless, I've yet to have a single bluetooth headphone worth a shit ever, I will not listen to anything lesser than ATH-Ad900's ever again, so maybe I just have too high of expectations.
 
Fifth Horseman said:
Audiophiles have a legit bitch about the quality of the Bluetooth stream though. Yes the fidelity of Bluetooth can suck royally depending on your equipment and the bit rate being used between the devices. Let's be realistic here though. IT"S ANEFFING PHONE THAT'S PLAYING BACK COMPRESSED AUDIO! All the same, my Jaybird Freedom ear buds sound amazing, and when it comes to listening to music in my truck, even through Bluetooth audio I have to really strain to hear the difference between it and the audio stream VIA Android Auto and micro USB..
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Just because yours does, doesn't mean it has to, or is by any stretch required to. A phone, atleast on android, can play FLAC on a phone with a decent DAC tone flat just fine and dandy. Head units for your cars are not much more sophisticated than what is in phones these days and they have been doing tone flat for over a decade or two now. So i'd this statement is fairly false tbh.
 
Vercinaigh said:
As i said in my other post. I have AKG K612Pro's almost no one can tell the difference between my phone (LG g4) and my dedicated DAc other than it's louder (More power output). But everyone instantly tells the difference between my headphones and anything else they've heard. So nothing entirely wrong with a phone's DAC per say, depends on the phone, the DAC in it, and how much power you require both in mW and Ohms. As for your statement of wireless, I've yet to have a single bluetooth headphone worth a shit ever, I will not listen to anything lesser than ATH-Ad900's ever again, so maybe I just have too high of expectations.
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This should offer a push to get bluetooth headphone quality up. Perhaps skip a generation and let the market mature a bit on this one?
 
Frobozz said:
This should offer a push to get bluetooth headphone quality up. Perhaps skip a generation and let the market mature a bit on this one?
Click to expand...

I'm all for quality not super jacked up priced wireless equipment that isn't a fair bit heavier. That's the dream. It's also completely doable. but will it happen? I seriously doubt it.
 
Liver said:
You may like the non neutral Senn sound, just your preference and completely valid. I find the newer v moda headphones to be decent. Not perfect, then again nothing is.
Click to expand...

i run AKG K612 Pro's, the entire point of them is neutral studio recording quality. I second the guy's statement about not finding a single wireless headphone that isn't much heavier, much more expensive and less quality all at once.
 
Vercinaigh said:
i run AKG K612 Pro's, the entire point of them is neutral studio recording quality. I second the guy's statement about not finding a single wireless headphone that isn't much heavier, much more expensive and less quality all at once.
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Plug it in via the adapter. You don't make any sense. You complain that there's no way to plug in your AKGs and then when I pointed out that you can plug it in via an adapter, and that anyone really that worried about audio quality is already used to a bevy of adapters, you then come back and complain that there's no difference in quality between different wired headphones. And since you have said repeatedly you have no intention of buying an iPhone regardless of whether it has a 3.5mm socket, you are apparently that guy who stands around digging in his eye complaining to everyone around him that your eye hurts. Take your finger out of your eye, you're doing it to yourself!
 
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mope54 said:
Plug it in via the adapter. You don't make any sense. You complain that there's no way to plug in your AKGs and then when I pointed out that you can plug it in via an adapter, and that anyone really that worried about audio quality is already used to a bevy of adapters, you then come back and complain that there's no difference in quality between different wired headphones. And since you have said repeatedly you have no intention of buying an iPhone regardless of whether it has a 3.5mm socket, you are apparently that guy who stands around digging in his eye complaining to everyone around him that your eye hurts. Take your finger out of your eye, you're doing it to yourself!
Click to expand...

Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit I see. What i said was fairly clear and concise. And just because I won't buy one doesn't remove my right to my opinion of it's stupidity, either. The rest of your response is just babble.
 
Removing 3.5mm, ok fine. Using a Apple only Lightning port instead of USB-C. Now that's the problem.

Its just a way to make sure people buy more crap.

Hopefully regulations fix this soon, just as the power charger BS that got fixed.

Its funny considering the iPhone 7 got an USB charger, yet doesn't use USB headset.
 
Shintai said:
Removing 3.5mm, ok fine. Using a Apple only Lightning port instead of USB-C. Now that's the problem.

Its just a way to make sure people buy more crap.

Hopefully regulations fix this soon, just as the power charger BS that got fixed.

Its funny considering the iPhone 7 got an USB charger, yet doesn't use USB headset.
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As long as you realize it you have a choice to buy something else that fits your needs and wants.

If apple is so shitty for removing the port then speak with your wallet and don't support them. If your not an iPhone user why care? If you're thinking of switching and the headphone jack is a deal breaker.... Well I think you might have some different issues
 
It's a phone, why do so many care that others do not much like the decision to remove the jack? Rabidly so even. The jack has been removed b4 by other phone makers. Customers did not like it, the phone makers brought the jack back.
And those ibuds are not new either. Samsung has had their Icons wireless buds out on the market for a while now. It is a lot of money for sound of similar quality to the the standard corded earbuds that ship with most phones. Will the ibuds be any different?
 
Vercinaigh said:
As i said in my other post. I have AKG K612Pro's almost no one can tell the difference between my phone (LG g4) and my dedicated DAc other than it's louder (More power output). But everyone instantly tells the difference between my headphones and anything else they've heard. So nothing entirely wrong with a phone's DAC per say, depends on the phone, the DAC in it, and how much power you require both in mW and Ohms. As for your statement of wireless, I've yet to have a single bluetooth headphone worth a shit ever, I will not listen to anything lesser than ATH-Ad900's ever again, so maybe I just have too high of expectations.
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Yeah your expectations are probably too high. Vmoda claims their wireless headphone is indiscernible from the wired, but I haven't heard it. I specifically use my bluetooth headphones for the gym, so the quality is less important to me personally than the ability to be free of cords. I have a good home setup for higher quality audio, with much better sources/amplification. I have seen better quality portable DAC/media players out there than an iPhone or any phone for that matter, if I was on the go more listening to music I'd probably get one of those.
 
I use the v moda blue tooth exclusively now. For my iPad. I use cheap blue tooth with my iPhone for the gym.

They are great. They work fantastically. If you are plugging in high end phone directly to a mainstream phone then it most likely will not make a difference. Look at sounds out (hertz) to sound detected. That's the objective test.

Now if you think it sounds better, that's cool too. Audio is so subjective. I think the v moda blue tooth headphones are perfect for me. Based on sound quality, comfort and life style.

I can not think of a practical way to blind test headphones. That's why it's so subjective.

They may not work for you. If a better model comes out, I'll try it.

Edit. The V Moda recommendation is not relevant to this thread. I'll bow out (but trial them ....)
 
Last edited:
I spoke to our office manager; only 3 out of 80 people are taking the "upgrade" to the iPhone 7 in our office. Almost every person that said "no" did so because there is no headphone port.

It may be a small sample, but our company has been getting the latest/greatest Apple phone for the past 4 years, so we're all running iPhone 6 and iPhone 6s here.

tl;dr: At my company the lack of a headphone jack is a deal breaker for nearly 77 / 80 people.
 
I'm not upgrading because I have a 6 plus. The 6 plus is still a great phone.

Has nothing to do with the lack of a headphone jack.

Both of these metrics mean about nothing. I am curious what the sale numbers will be, as compared to previous generations.

Before some one says that means nothing because of "Apple sheeple," it does.
 
vl2xxer82ukx.jpg
 
Watching the apple fans defend this scumbag company is entertaining.

When my HTC one (m7) died three months ago my work offered to get me a new phone and move me to their company plan. Catch was they use iPhones. I said sure, as it would save me many hundreds.

3 months with the 6s and I hate it more every day. I have never had a device lockup or crash as much as this. Not to mention basic features that I had on Android....even blackberry, don't exist on the iPhone. Simple things like how impossible it is to have a keyboard with the numbers above...or deleting or merging duplicates in contacts. How was about not crashing when opening Google now.....if I have my Bluetooth headset on and get into my vehicle with Bluetooth, my iPhone nukes itself.
Install SwiftKey....iphone reverts to default as soon as I have to enter a password. Not to mention the shit screen and the inability to use any public wifi that requires a login page( Starbucks, mcdonalds etc). Not to mention that having your own ringtones and notifications is more complicated than a match of MXC.
 
BB Gun said:
vl2xxer82ukx.jpg
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Amen to that, had same thoughts about the jack. I use Square on iPhone and many businesses do too but typically with iPads. I personally wouldn't want a phone w/t 3.5mm jack but most people don't have good headphones so it really doesn't matter. iPhone and most phones don't have decent DACs and can't drive good cans. To some folks above who say they can't hear difference, BT headphones have really poor audio quality and that's coming from a non audiophile person. I can easily hear difference on good cans and proper player. Even Apple's own earbuds that came with my iPhone 6 sound better on my DAP (yes, I have one because music sounds like ass on phone, same deal when connected to car aux). My Galaxy S5 doesn't sound any better either, but at least it is easy to get a player to play all formats.
 
Droc said:
3 months with the 6s and I hate it more every day. I have never had a device lockup or crash as much as this. Not to mention basic features that I had on Android....even blackberry, don't exist on the iPhone. Simple things like how impossible it is to have a keyboard with the numbers above...or deleting or merging duplicates in contacts. How was about not crashing when opening Google now.....if I have my Bluetooth headset on and get into my vehicle with Bluetooth, my iPhone nukes itself.
Install SwiftKey....iphone reverts to default as soon as I have to enter a password. Not to mention the shit screen and the inability to use any public wifi that requires a login page( Starbucks, mcdonalds etc). Not to mention that having your own ringtones and notifications is more complicated than a match of MXC.
Click to expand...
Half of that sounds like you have a defective device and the other half sounds like PEBKAC.
 
For hose who dont want a dongle to liaten and charge, can't they just use a wireless charging pad?
 
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