Antec ISK-110 and AMD 7870k Build

S

Siba

Limp Gawd
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Dec 28, 2012
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I'm looking for a big air cooler to go in an Antec ISK110 and Gigabyte GA-F2A88XN-Wifi. Here are the current parts:

Case: Antec ISK110
CPU: AMD 7870k
Mobo: Gigabyte GA-F2A88XN-Wifi
RAM: 16GB EVGA SSC DDR3 2400mhz
PSU: HDPLEX 160w

Can't seem to find many options except the Noctua NH-L9a which is only rated for 65w CPUs. Does anyone know of other, larger coolers that can still fit in the ISK110 and clear the ram?
 
You may want to look into super low profile RAM to clear the bottom of low profile coolers, such as this stuff that is barely as tall as the ram slot clips.

You will also want to mod the power cable of the case, plus cut out the support bracket of the drive bays. The power cable will likely go over the CPU cooler. You have to cut the housing away from the plug attached to the back of the case. This makes it flexible enough to give more clearance. The drive bay support bracket is the part that goes from the drive bays to the back of the case.
 
Problem is that if he intends to use that APU to game, he needs the fastest ram he can get his hands on as it makes a tangible difference. 2400mhz is basically the sweet spot, though not too much of a hit if you go down to 2133.

Crucial Ballistix Sport VLP (Very Low Profile) is tiny at around 18mm height (lower than the retention clips), is also 1600mhz, but rated for 9-9-9-24 timings and @ 1.35V. Pump a bit more voltage and loosen timings and you should hit 1866 if not 2000mhz.

What is the actual cooler height limitation of the ISK 110? Antec specs and manual don't state this. Rather annoying.

The upcoming Cryorig C7 is a possibility, but I have no idea when that will be released.
 
It's a build for family members that are leaving town in the next 2 weeks so it may not be viable to wait more than a week for a cryorig c7 to finish the build out.

I'm not too worried yet about the CPU power cable, as this mobo has a majorly offset cpu socket so I should be able to route the power cable above, and I think I have an extension cable laying around somewhere for CPU 12v also.

Going w/ Intel was an option but in the end I decided against it, as I felt a stock clocked 3.9+ghz cpu would be better price/performance and also give an entry level gaming option, if they ever decide to get into that. An overclocked g3258 would probably also do the job, but is only 2 cores vs the 4 in the AMD.

Based on this image here, it looks like I might have about 40-42mm of clearance, possibly 45mm if the entirety of the cooler fits in the raised section of the side panel grill (scythe kozuti used in this build)

 
AFAIK the max CPU cooler height for ISK110 is somewhere between 48 and 50mm. I know someone who replaced the 14mm thick fan of NH-L9i with a 25mm thick fan inside ISK110 and said barely fits thanks to the protorusion over the side mesh. (The same config doesn' fit inside ISK100, whose clearance is somewhere between 45 and 47mm)
 
I think the NH-L9a will work still. There are many people using that cooler on the 7850K, which is also 95W, and their temps are great. I personally use it on my 65W APU and I can't even tell its running, great cooler.
 
It's officially 40mm according to the anandtech review but you could probably squeeze some more, the mesh grill protrudes out as noted. Someone on another website actually stuck a huge fan on the outside of the grill as well, although that sort of ruins the form factor.
 
I have an L9a coming in today, will see how the temps go. Bios/memtest seem to pull full load as the killawatt is showing 110-130w from the wall.
 
I've seen lots of mods with the isk-110, and none of them worked as expected. Airflow is just terrible on this case. You can somewhat improve it by switching to a pico-psu and removing some cable cluttering, but the way the openings are designed is just weird. Anything over 65W tends to overheat. Also, stay away from large fans, like a 140 or even a 200mm one; it makes only things worse, as most of the ventilation will require open mesh space. But ofc I can be totally wrong, and your build will be the exception... I would actually love to be wrong, as this case has always attracted me as one of the few "smart" mini-designs placing hdds beneath the mobo, and not on top of it. Yet should things get ugly, the Morex T3500 cost half the price (at least here in europe) and offers much better thermal specs. There is even a passive mod out there for this case.
 
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Ignore my previous comments about the case. For some reason I was thinking of the ISK 300/310 series when I wrote that, so my comments would not apply to the 110.

What will the system be used for? This would be somewhat important, because it may point you in a totally different direction.

IIRC the stock PSU and brick of the ISK 110 can't quite keep up with an APU's power draw. Can anyone more familiar (or with better memory) comment on this?

For normal home computer uses of internet, media, etc. even a dual core stock clocked socket 1150 rig would suffice. You didn't mention the drive used, but for these purposes I would rather use a Celeron G1820 with an SSD, rather than an AMD 7870K with a HDD if it came down to budget.

FWIW a couple LAN parties ago my graphics card died DURING the event. I switched to using my (still stock clocked) G3258 IGP with 6 EUs (basically the lowest performing desktop Intel IGP). I was still able to play games, albeit at all low settings. The current Intel HD 4600 graphics has 20EUs, which will be quite a bit faster than what I was using for actual gaming that weekend. You can get the HD 4600 starting with some $140 Core i3 chips.

The bonus is that they will run fine with the stock ISK 110 PSU, and you don't have to worry about heat even using the stock cooler.
 
I was reading up about the 7870k and it looks like if you get the right chip you can drop the voltage quite a bit and drop the power consumption quite a bit. I think stock is 1.4025v or so, with some getting 1.2v stable. I think though that on the 7870k the gpu is clocked at 866 vs the 700mhz on the 7850k. So when you start putting stress on the gpu the power consumption will eclipse the 80w the stock ISK 110 ps can handle.

Frys actually has the 1sk 110 for 50AR and the 7870k for $109 right now, but I think you are going to have to upgrade the powersupply in there and the brick. I think too that the 7870k comes with the copper heatsink from AMD which probably will not fit. I would think that even though the Noctua L9a is rated at 65w it might get the job done.

Also of not you may be able to get the TDP throttling to work if the bios supports it to 65 or even 45w, but I think this was more for the a8 7600 and the a6 chips. I bet that a a6 7400k would work great in the isk110 if you could get away with dual core and 1/2 the gpu's.
 
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I got the antec isk110 at frys for ~$50 already.

7870k was purchased at microcenter w/ $40 off on motherboard combo

Will be using a samsung 850 evo that's on sale for $90 right now.

All prices in USD. About to throw on the L9a this weekend, if it can't keep temps and noise in check during a memtest then I may have to go with a bigger case and cooler.

I definitely want to go with a quad core for more future proofing, and most likely the gpu will hardly ever be used. I know a quad core is probably overkill, but as the machine will be moving with the inlaws out of practical reach, I want to reduce the chances of it feeling slow to them as much as I can
 
Cool let me know how that goes as I had a similar idea for a build. If you do hit the power wall I did find this 250w ps that looks like it would drop in for $29 minus a power brick on ebay:
 
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rhansen5_99 said:
If you do hit the power wall I did find this 250w ps that looks like it would drop in for $29 minus a power brick on ebay:
Click to expand...

That PSU will not be able to sustain 250W continuous. If you ignore the peak output and just look at +3.3v, +5v and +12v, you're at 186.4W assuming you have a compatible power brick.
 
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I have it all assembled in a Loneindustries L3 now with the NH-L9a

Have not installed OS yet as the SSD hasn't arrived, but memtest load puts it at 61c in a 25-27c ambient temp. Killawatt has power draw @ 120w while running memtest

System is barely audible until ~2ft away under this load with the L9a low noise adapter
 
Finally got around to installing windows, and I'm running into a lot of stability issues. Doesn't seem like the L9a is able to keep up with all 4 cores under load

Dropping the cpu voltage doesn't seem to help all that much and I think it may be either the hdplex psu or the temps, or both. What temp should I be looking at in HWMonitor? Package temp hangs around 56c idle when voltage for the core is set to 1.275v in bios, and it gets some pretty heavy voltage drop under load down to 1.256v minimums. Is this normal for AMD processors? I don't have much experience here unfortunately

I also plan to check the mount quality on the L9a, as I'm not sure if the heatsink should be screwed in until the screws bottom out, or if there is some sort of arbitrary judgement call to be made, as the screws don't have any sort of tension springs or anything. Does anyone have experience with the L9a mounting?
 
I bottomed out the screws just like that, and the heatsink definitely gets very hot so it's trying to do its job but I think I'm just pushing past its design limits. Might end up having to go with an Intel i3 in this case, as much as I would have liked to support AMD
 
I'm not familiar with the AMD 7870k, but I'd be really surprised if your stability issues are a result of a 56*C temp (though that does seem like a high idle temp), or anything to do with the NH-L9a. Are you overclocking? If it were me I'd first look at the HDPLEX and/or power brick. What power adapter do you have? Do you have a ATX or other power supply you can test with? I have read of at least one other customer having issues with the HDPLEX 160W.
 
I think the 56C temps are more idle than anything - I was seeing HWMonitor 'package temp' readings at 95C+, though I'm not sure what the package includes

Perhaps it's all due to the L9a having bad cooling for components surrounding the socket area. Maybe I'll ask my friend to see if I can borrow his IR thermometer this weekend just to verify the readings
 
Ya, that's not good. You didn't happen to get it with the stock AMD cooler did you? Would be nice to test another cooler for comparison. Noctua does state that the NH-L9a is recommended for CPU up to 65W TDP. I use the NH-L9i on an i3 3225, which under load does also heat up, but within much safer levels. You could always pull off the cooler and double check the thermal paste if you haven't already.

What do the other HWMonitor temp values read?
 
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I used the noctua included paste from the L9a for each of 3 seatings to test the spread pattern. The heatsink gets very hot, the case gets very hot, the psu gets very hot - it feels like there just isn't enough airflow for a 95w cpu with no other fans in such an enclosed space, so things just end up recirculating.

It did come with the stock cooler, but that was determined to be way too loud for the sis in law, as they put a priority on having it as inaudible as possible and the stock cooler sounds about as bad as a laptop fan at full blast.
 
Oh I didn't realize your case had no fan blowing air out. I modded a silent Gentle Typhoon into the top of mine to keep everything chilly. So yea, I don't think that is the processor for a passive case. A lower wattage APU or an i3 might run cool enough to not overheat the case.

What are they using it for?
 
Siba said:
I used the noctua included paste from the L9a for each of 3 seatings to test the spread pattern. The heatsink gets very hot, the case gets very hot, the psu gets very hot - it feels like there just isn't enough airflow for a 95w cpu with no other fans in such an enclosed space, so things just end up recirculating.

It did come with the stock cooler, but that was determined to be way too loud for the sis in law, as they put a priority on having it as inaudible as possible and the stock cooler sounds about as bad as a laptop fan at full blast.
Click to expand...

Do you have an 80 mm case fan? The NH-L9a isn't large enough or close enough to the side panel, to push a significant amount of air out of the case on it's own. Works okay without a case fan on a low power i3, but I imagine you're right about the L9a just not being able to cool your CPU properly.

The stock cooler might just be useful for comparison sake. If the stock cooler improves temps, then you know the Noctua NH-L9a isn't sufficient. If it doesn't improve things, then you know to look elsewhere.

Edit: Another thought, what are the temps with the side panel off?

Just some ideas.
 
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These temps were with the sidepanel off already, I'll give it a shot with the stock cooler and see if that helps anything. Part of the problem may be that the L9a can only exhaust from one direction instead of two, as it butts right up against the RAM
 
Ya, that's probably not ideal blowing into the RAM. You can't rotate it like the NH-L9i eh?

I read that the AMD 7870k is supposed to come with a better cooler, so I'm interested to see how it compares to the L9a.

This morning I did a quick test with an Intel Xeon E3 1231 v3 (80W TDP) using a small stock Intel cooler. It idles at 30*C (I have a lower ambient than you though). After Prime95 stress testing for about 5 minutes, max package temps are 75*C. Longer and the package temps climb to 88-90*C. So it appears that even the stock cooler provided by Intel can't maintain the CPU temps below 90*C when stress testing with Prime95 (which of course isn't a realistic load). This was done with the an L1, side panel off, without any build up of hot air. Also at 90*C, the CPU heatsink was only warm to the touch. So I'm not sure how accurate those temps are.
 
I did some research and found that HWmonitor does not monitor temps correctly, and installed AMD's overdrive software to report temps. Overdrive reported that I still had ~17c of headroom (before it bluescreened again) on each core so it really shouldn't be the heat causing bluescreens. Now I'm leaning more towards the HDPlex not supplying a stable enough 12v current, or the HDPlex overheating under load.

Ended up returning the 7870k today and getting an i3 4370 in it's place, but I won't have the memory to do the build until Monday or Tuesday. I guess the title of this thread is now entirely wrong :D
 
That would make sense. The 75-90*C temps HWMonitor was reporting to me should have been hot to the touch. I don't have much experience with the HDPlex, but anytime I've maxed out a PicoPSU, my system just restarts (no blue screen). Sounds more like memory, or software to me. Oh well, the i3 4370 will be very easy to cool and make silent if required. Also allows you to drop down to a small 80W power adapter (with a PicoPSU), if you want to save the HDPlex and large brick for a more powerful build.

Look forward to seeing how this finally turns out. :)
 
Finished the build with totally different parts than I started with, but the memory is installed now. Intel extreme tuning utility passes after an hour long test, and memtest passed 6+ passes overnight so I think it's stable now. Must have been hitting the 12v limit on the hdplex or something
 
That's great, glad it worked out this time. I see you added a couple pics to imgr of your grey L3 next to your silver one. Any thoughts on which one you like better?
 
I'm sure you already know this, but you could rotate your drives so the SATA cables are pointing up, giving you a space to mount the HDPlex.

Any idea what you'll build in the grey one?
 
I like the grey more, by a fair margin. It shows some stress marks in a corner or two and a few scratches on the solid side panel (from manufacturing I assume), but it doesn't bother me too much and overall looks a lot nicer than the silver.

Agreed it might be better to flip the drives, I wasn't thinking about that previously as I was mostly concerned with system stability encountered with the APU. Will see how that turns out tonight.

How should the PSU be mounted, using adhesive tape or something?

I'm looking to build a portable midrange gaming pc in the grey one, but there aren't any satisfactory GPUs on the horizon yet. Maybe AMD/HBM will be able to turn out a mid-high range GPU in half height, but the MSI GPU and other half height issues like proper pcie faceplate have put me off on current offerings. I'll most likely wait until Skylake before revisiting options for the grey one. Hoping for some version of the R9 nano to fit in the form factor and power envelope
 
I'm glad you like the grey! Racking marks which are part of the anodizing process, are sometimes noticeable and would show bare aluminum. They're usually quite tiny though. On the side panels, racking marks would be found along the edges. If the scratches are anodized (no bare aluminum showing), then they were created during the manufacturing process. The benefits to anodizing far outweigh the downsides (e.g. racking marks, imperfections in metal showing) in my opinion. I love that the finish is so consistent, with no ugly buildup or orange peel, and can be easy refinished or re-anodized after years of use. :)

Other customers have used double sided thermal adhesive tape to mount the HDPlex.

Ya, that MSI GTX 750 Ti would be great if it didn't have the rubbing fans. I imagine not all are like this, but so far 2-3 people (including myself) have reported that issue. I'm looking forward to see what comes out next year also.
 
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