AMD: Zen CPU Architecture Expected To Last Four Years

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by Megalith, Jan 7, 2017.

  1. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    Par for the course, AMD’s newest architecture will mirror the longevity of previous generations and stick it out for four years. The higher-ups would also have you know that Ryzen will be available on day one—no paper launch.

    When asked how long Zen would last, compared to Intel’s two-year tick-tock cadence, Papermaster confirmed the four-year lifespan and tapped the table in front of him: “We’re not going tick-tock,” he said. “Zen is going to be tock, tock, tock.” Intel’s tick-tock cadence has typically meant that it develops a new microarchitecture every two years, with Kaby Lake the exception. Though AMD has never taken the time to formalize it, a three- to four-year lifespan for its own CPU architectures is about average.
     
  2. pxc

    pxc [H]ard as it Gets

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    I read that earlier. It's strange that AMD isn't planning on any shrinks in that time. GLF/Samsung's "14nm" process is a finfet process close to 20nm planar process geometry. IOW, it's going to be lapped by other advances multiple times by 2021. That assumes AMD keeps on schedule and delivers the promised tweaks on time up until the next uarch is released. But AMD still offers 32nm server processors that no one wants, so at least AMD has some persistence. :p
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
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  3. Formula.350

    Formula.350 [H]ard|Gawd

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    What I'M most interested in is when this "launch day" is. Have I somehow missed that concrete date in the midst of all the other CES news?
     
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  4. Twisted Kidney

    Twisted Kidney 2[H]4U

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    Please don't suck.

    Please don't suck.

    Please don't suck.
     
  5. freeloader1969

    freeloader1969 2[H]4U

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    February 21st.
     
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  6. Formula.350

    Formula.350 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Thank you :D Though :( as I dun wanna wait a month an a half :\ This A8-3850 rig has way more than paid its dues and deserves to be retired to my parts shelf!
     
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  7. Nobified[H]

    Nobified[H] [H]ard|Gawd

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    [​IMG]

    Guy on right asks the lady on left. What do you think of AMD?
     
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  8. griff30

    griff30 I Lower the Boom!

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    Being an AMD fan is like being a Cleveland Browns fan.

    [​IMG]
     
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  9. gigaxtreme1

    gigaxtreme1 2[H]4U

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    No announcement. Most sites report Jan 17-23
     
  10. Briguyatx

    Briguyatx Limp Gawd

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    I do not think that keeping the same architecture means that they cannot shrink that same architecture to a new process node in the future. Isn't that essentially what Polaris is?
     
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  11. Ducman69

    Ducman69 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I'm excited for this, and would love to go AMD if this is truly powerful, but another hesitation I have is motherboard quality... we really need a good combo at launch to change public opinion about AMD.
     
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  12. mvmiller12

    mvmiller12 Gawd

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    I don't see where this will be a problem at all. My experience with AMD is that they have a broader definition of "Architecture" then people are used to from Intel. Zen CPUs will continue to be steadily refined while still being compatible with the same AM4 motherboards, just as the AM3 platform Bulldozer and Phenom chips before them.


    Mini rant: I know you Intel guys are rocking higher IPC CPUs, and that Intel feeds you a "new" architecture every year or so, but... HOW CAN YOU STAND THE CONSTANTLY CHANGING SOCKET LAYOUT?? Seriously! I had a friend build a Skylake core I5 recently, and the Corsair H100 he bought for it was DOA. You would not believe how hard it was to find a (temporary) heatsink/fan that would fit on his board. It's like Intel constantly and arbitrarily moves the mounting holes just a bit to make you buy a new heatsink. In comparison, AMD heatsink mounting changes are very seldom - I still have socket AM2 coolers that fit perfectly fine on AM3+ mainboards, and it looks like the mountings for AM4 are going to maintain that compatibility. (Also related, why do you guys need entirely new chipsets all the time? The CPU changes between most Core i-series generations seems like relatively trivial stuff...)
     
  13. mvmiller12

    mvmiller12 Gawd

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    Motherboard quality hasn't really been much of an issue since the first Athlon mainboards arrived in unmarked white boxes (many of those were... questionable). The Asus and Gigabyte boards I have purchased for AMD processors have all been extremely solid.
     
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  14. gigaxtreme1

    gigaxtreme1 2[H]4U

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    To the rant-It's motivated by greed by intel, which is smart so they can sell more stuff. The whole proprietary thing increases revenue from the HPC community. No standardized architecture also increases innovation to sell more stuff, to have more power, bragging rights and so on.
     
  15. Nobified[H]

    Nobified[H] [H]ard|Gawd

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    Motherboards should be no problems with quality for AMD or Intel. However I will tell you that I have had more issues installing different OS's on AMD than Intel.

    I am staying with my 1366 Xeon 6 core....see no reason to upgrade.
     
  16. nilepez

    nilepez [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Interesting. I'm pretty sure my Thermalright can work on virtually any Intel or AMD platform. I know I move my HSF from box to box (unless I continue using the old one). I'm pretty sure my old XP-90 was migrated to a 2008 or 2009 Core 2 (technically a XEON chip). I wouldn't be surprised if it would fit an i7 with a new bracket (though I don't know if it's up to the task of cooling it).

    Of course I'd love to use the same MB for years on end, but that ain't gonna happen.
     
  17. EODetroit

    EODetroit [H]ard|Gawd

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    How can you stand having shit features on the same motherboard for so long? Intel makes a new socket whenever the old socket would hold back its performance. The CPU and motherboard are a team, bought together, and sold together on the used market (or given away, or demoted to HTPC, or whatever) as a team. If I didn't do this, I'd have a pile of CPUs without motherboards somewhere, how can you stand that?

    Also the mounting holes haven't changed from Sandy Bridge to Haswell, I skipped Skylake but I doubt it changed there either. Not sure what the second half of that is going on about.
     
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  18. CaptNumbNutz

    CaptNumbNutz [H]ard as it Gets

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    The same 75mm hole pattern for heatsinks that was introduced with LGA 1156 in 2009 is STILL IN USE TODAY with LGA 1151.
    That's 8 years. You can find those heatsinks EVERYWHERE.

    You guys didn't do any homework, did you?





    As far as chipsets...In the past, AMD updated their chipsets just as often as Intel. They had 20 different chipsets released from 2006 - 2008 (480x-790FX). Then they stagnated for 3 years until Bulldozer released, then stagnated again for almost 6 years now. FFS, the 990FX chipset (released in 2011) is still the best they have and stuck on PCIe 2.0. There have been a few intrepid motherboard makers that tacked on 3.0, but that was done through add on chips. Intel has had PCIe 3.0 since 2012...5 years ago.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2017
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  19. Shintai

    Shintai [H]ardness Supreme

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    Hopefully they get a better chipset out in the lifespan too. The current AM4 ones leaves a lot to be desired.

    But from the looks of it, Zen now, Zen+ shrink to 7nm in 2019 or so and that's it until 2021+. I hope Zen+ also adds more PCIe lanes, despite it requires a new socket. But SATA is dying and M.2/U.2 is the new king.
     
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  20. Gigus Fire

    Gigus Fire 2[H]4U

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    lets stop innovating for years, call it longevity.
     
  21. steakman1971

    steakman1971 2[H]4U

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    I'm very curious and trying to be optimistic for AMD. Remember when the Athlon processor kicked Intel CPU's to the curb? It made Intel innovate and come out with killer technology.
    My rig still has a Sandy Bridge processor in it. For my money, I don't see the bang for the buck to replace it (at least not for CPU performance improvements). I hope Zen launches at a good price point and is competitive with Intel. I want Intel to see them as somewhat of a threat and release a baller new platform - not a whimpy tick or even a tock. How about a bam?
     
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  22. blkt

    blkt Gawd

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    Unfortunately both sides are guilty, but at least AMD is putting full effort this round. Let's hope for the best because a monopoly would be much worse.

    AMD-Jim-Keller-6.png

    Edit: Now in 3D! Yeah, I'm bored.
    AMD-Jim-Keller-5.png
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2017
  23. nightanole

    nightanole [H]ard|Gawd

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    1/15 can confirm
     
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  24. nightanole

    nightanole [H]ard|Gawd

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    2021, still 10k cpumarks for $300, but now you save $25 a year in electricity compared to the i7-3770 that came out in 2012...
     
  25. freeloader1969

    freeloader1969 2[H]4U

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    There's enough PCI-E lanes on the AM4 platform now with the embedded southbridge. 16 PCI-E 3.0 lanes and 8 PCI-E 2.0 lanes on the CPU not including the lanes going through the southbridge.
     
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  26. ole-m

    ole-m Limp Gawd

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    I had an I5 back in those days, fast as fuck for my use (little desktop use and occasional gaming) it broke and I shipped it back ( mobo and cpu) in the meantime I put in a server mobo, cpu (self built) and amd's was the preffered chocie as core count and price was through the roof compared to intel - Yes amd had one thing going for them haha!

    anyways, I ended up not really noticing and I've ended up using 1055T, cheapest motherboard known to man, cheapest 16gb memory kit 1333mhz and i'm still running it, now with a GTX970 and it's giving me almost no issues in 1920x1200 gameplay.
    Why?, Why is it this way?
    The cpu can be beaten pretty much by an I3 nowadays in performance and so on... I was starting to notice the horrible loading times sometime last summer and thought I'd wait to see what amd have in store, but still I'm not convinced on upgrading that old piece of junk quite yet, games run fine for my use.
    GTA5 runs at high 50 fps which is what I play msot over skype with friends..

    Zen must bring really good value for people like me to actually upgrade their system >_< ...
     
  27. daglesj

    daglesj [H]ardness Supreme

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    Yeah that's why I went X99 as the system has proper mounting hardware built in. I hate the cheap and nasty Intel push pin system. The AMD clip is far better and gives reassurance its properly attached. I do remember the early Athlon/Duron clip system though, that was very difficult to use and was a real exposed core killer. At least they improved it.

    Always felt the Intel push-pin system was a step backwards.
     
  28. Armenius

    Armenius I Drive Myself to the [H]ospital

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    Me, too. None of the motherboards shown so far inspire much confidence. Another kick to the nuts is no extra PCI-E 3.0 lanes for M.2 drives? AMD chipsets have been really lacking in features the past 7 years, at least, and it seems they still haven't learned anything from it.