AMD to Host Livestream Event to Unveil Next Generation Ryzen Processors August 29th Monday

[LukeTbk]

Did anyone hear any of the AMD presenters mention about IGP? I didn't hear it or maybe I missed it yesterday so wondering why they didn't promote it.

I would imagine that it is a good part of their OEM presentation where it would be a bigger deal, if they did not mention it, maybe it could to create less confusion when they will announce the next generation of APU ?

I have an hard time to find solid info online and it could be for the upcoming APU, but:
The X670E chipset will be found on the best motherboards for Ryzen 7000 processors, giving you 24 PCIe 5.0 lanes, 14 USB ports including 20Gbps and Type-C, WiFi 6e, Bluetooth 5.2, in addition to up to four DisplayPort 2.0 and HDMI 2.1 ports.

if that a indication of what the integrated small iGPU can do, could be an excellent one to drive a multi monitor non 3d work setup.

 

[deepinya]

The AM5 platform is said to receive support through 2025, which is closer to three years. And that's not a maximum; it could be longer. I think that's reasonable for a consumer platform.

That way more than reasonable imo. One of the reasons I got off Intel on my last upgrade was their endless need to change sockets.

 

[Armenius]

Wondering if 13900K will match the price at $699 or higher because it has more cores.

The 13900K only has 8 P-cores out of the 24 total while all 16 cores on the 7950X are "P" cores. Given that the RCP on the 12900K was USD $589 I would expect the 13900K to be up around $700, but Intel may undercut AMD by selling it for $629-649.

 

[Brackle]

The 13900K only has 8 P-cores out of the 24 total while all 16 cores on the 7950X are "P" cores. Given that the RCP on the 12900K was USD $589 I would expect the 13900K to be up around $700, but Intel may undercut AMD by selling it for $629-649.

Something no one is talking about. It is possible the reason the 7950x was priced lower at $699 is because AMD is waiting to release say a 7980x3d or something at a higher price point to easily take the gaming crown back.

We all know we expect a 7800x3d since the 7700x is priced at $399. Of course this is all speculation.

 

[pututu]

Let the price war begins! I'm looking for a good price-performance value and computation efficiency for my distributed computing rig. Probably won't do it this year, usually I wait up to a year or more for new generation.

 

[OFaceSIG]

If they were able to hold onto an aged socket design like AM4 for as long as they did, undoubtedly a more modern design like AM5 will last quite a bit longer than 3 years. Just my thought.

 

[chameleoneel]

I am not a fan of Alder lake. I don't like the split core design and the inefficiency. I know they are on top but it seems very "eff it, win at all costs" type of situation. AMD is very good and don't have a split core design. I do believe unfortunately split cores are inevitable to keep ARM at bay but I don't like it now. Maybe because Windows 11 the only way to officially support it, and I friggin dislike 11 so much.

I think just like Ryzen 6000 is a hell of a platform for mobile. I think Ryzen 7k is a very good evolution from 5000. We'll see if it's enough to meet or beat Alder lake. Only time and real benchmarks will tell.

Well, you can buy a 12700/12700k and disable the E-cores. The P-cores on the 12700k by themselves, are barely worse than a 12-core 3900x in Cinibench R23 multicore. And deliver killer gaming performance. Some games actually perform better with the E-cores disable. IIRC, something to do with the cache frequency/latency being better, with only the P-Cores active.

Also, Zen chips with E-cores are coming. Leakers already have a lot of details. Its going to be insane.

I think AMD will wind up with E cores down the road, but for now, TSMC has helped them out with superior process nodes compared to Intel that they don't need to play that game yet. I don't like that the TDPs have gone up this round, that will make an ITX build tougher, but we're still not talking Intel Easy Bake levels so we'll have to deal I guess.

I have a 12700k in a 13.3-liter ITX. 280mm AIO. great temps, very low noise. However, if you want to do a really slim/tiny build, with a tiny air cooler, 5600/x or 5700x are the best choices.

Paul's HW mentioned all sku's will have a basic igp, but, just enough to get a display and do some web browsing if you don't have a dgpu. Nothing like the previous igp sku's that allowed some light gaming.

Its also to fill out the platform. With the IGP, AMD can guarantee direct storage acceleration for any system with a Zen 4 CPU.

Something no one is talking about. It is possible the reason the 7950x was priced lower at $699 is because AMD is waiting to release say a 7980x3d or something at a higher price point to easily take the gaming crown back.

We all know we expect a 7800x3d since the 7700x is priced at $399. Of course this is all speculation.

Zen 4 with V-cache is garunteed. Its been leaked for weeks/months, by very credible leakers. The performance boost is pretty huge, over Zen 3 V-cache.

 

[Chris_B]

and now AMD:
Hasn't increased core counts for three generations
is raising prices on most of it's parts
Has a new, expensive platform.


So this is reversed roles of Ryzen first-gen vs 7th gen Core all over again.

My, how quickly did AMD sit on their throne and pull out their dick to auction off sucking privileges.

How dare amd have a new platform after supporting am4 for 6 years! As regards to price, some am5 boards will be in the region of $125 according to the info dropped last night, not as if you have to wank away $500 on a motherboard.

 

[ChadD]

I had to check the thread date to make sure this wasn't a necro, with all ya'll talking about Rocket Lake with E cores and shit being 13th gen instead of Raptor Lake, I thought I was losing my goddamn mind!

That is what happens if you post before you got to bed. lol

 

[vegeta535]

How dare amd have a new platform after supporting am4 for 6 years! As regards to price, some am5 boards will be in the region of $125 according to the info dropped last night, not as if you have to wank away $500 on a motherboard.

No one will want those $125 board. You looking at at least $250 for a x670 board. Maybe even $300. If you building that cheap of a system you are better off going am4.

 

[Lakados]

The AM5 platform is said to receive support through 2025, which is closer to three years. And that's not a maximum; it could be longer. I think that's reasonable for a consumer platform.

Not really like 26 months on the outside if you are looking at an October 2022 availability, but compared to AM4 which has essentially existed in its current form since Feb 2017 so just a little over 5 years. Still not bad but it puts them in the Intel range of 18'ish months

 

[Lakados]

Something no one is talking about. It is possible the reason the 7950x was priced lower at $699 is because AMD is waiting to release say a 7980x3d or something at a higher price point to easily take the gaming crown back.

We all know we expect a 7800x3d since the 7700x is priced at $399. Of course this is all speculation.

TSMC still doesn't have the 3d stacking tech working reliably on the 5nm process and they still only advertise it for their 7nm, so I am thinking we are going to be waiting a fair while for their 3d cache parts on AM5. I would have expected them to have some refreshed lineup of AGP processors back still using the 7nm process and the 3d cache as a budget option but with the surplus of GPUs now on the market, those aren't nearly as desirable as they would have been over the last 2 years.

 

[Brackle]

TSMC still doesn't have the 3d stacking tech working reliably on the 5nm process and they still only advertise it for their 7nm, so I am thinking we are going to be waiting a fair while for their 3d cache parts on AM5. I would have expected them to have some refreshed lineup of AGP processors back still using the 7nm process and the 3d cache as a budget option but with the surplus of GPUs now on the market, those aren't nearly as desirable as they would have been over the last 2 years.

Do you have anything backing up those claims? AMD did tell people at the press event 3d v-cache is coming very soon. Love to see something about TSMC and v-cache issues on 5nm.

 

[1_rick]

No one will want those $125 board.

Everyone buying OEM systems will get the equivalent, though.

You looking at at least $250 for a x670 board. Maybe even $300.

Meh. Priced Z690 lately? It was nice to have cheaper stuff, absolutely, but that's where the pricing is now.

 

[vegeta535]

Everyone buying OEM systems will get the equivalent, though.

Meh. Priced Z690 lately? It was nice to have cheaper stuff, absolutely, but that's where the pricing is now.

I don't factor oem into any consideration. $250-300 will be the bottom tier boards no doubt. There are $150~ z690 boards ATM. Of course AMD is going to have a huge range of prices from the x670 like the z690. I can see the x670e being $500+.

 

[Brackle]

Everyone buying OEM systems will get the equivalent, though.

Meh. Priced Z690 lately? It was nice to have cheaper stuff, absolutely, but that's where the pricing is now.

Lets not forget how much more powerful the AM5 chipset will be with full blown 16x PCI-E Gen lanes to the GPU AND full PCI-E Gen5 M.2 support as well. Its to be expect to pay more for the top of the line tech. Just like when Z690 came out with DDR5. You pay more for the newest tech.

The question is will Raptor Lake Cost more, will Z790 cost more because of the rumored high power draw Raptor Lake will have because of more components needed. So, before everyone starts complaining about higher prices. Lets just wait to see what Intel prices Z790/13 series.

 

[Lakados]

Do you have anything backing up those claims? AMD did tell people at the press event 3d v-cache is coming very soon. Love to see something about TSMC and v-cache issues on 5nm.

I’m trying to find the TSMC papers they put out a few months back. They said it was a work in progress but they didn’t have their TSV packaging tech working correctly on 5nm which was part of the delays for 3nm.
The places I normally look are all flooded with the new stuff, I’ll have to look after work.

 

[ElementDave]

Not really like 26 months on the outside if you are looking at an October 2022 availability, but compared to AM4 which has essentially existed in its current form since Feb 2017 so just a little over 5 years. Still not bad but it puts them in the Intel range of 18'ish months

No, they said through 2025 — not up to (or until) 2025.

 

[Lakados]

No, they said through 2025 — not up to (or until) 2025.

Yeah F my brain I somehow forgot 2023 was going to be a thing and jumped right to 2024. So I don't know what that year has in store but my brain is already blanking it out

 

[pututu]

Did anyone hear any of the AMD presenters mention about IGP? I didn't hear it or maybe I missed it yesterday so wondering why they didn't promote it.

Found my own answer here about the IGP. AMD didn't mention it in yesterday presentation. Ok, with 2 graphics core (compute units) or 128 stream processors at 2.2GHz, that's roughly a sixth of the RX 6400 performance based on the number of compute units. So, nothing exciting here other than I can run this as a headless client for DC.

While absent from the presentation, the AMD website confirms that all four Ryzen 7000 SKUs will have integrated Radeon RDNA 2 graphics. Each Raphael CPU will feature 2 graphics cores, each with 64 stream processors, with a boost clock of up to 2.2GHz. Before anyone gets excited about its gaming capabilities, it’s unlikely you’ll want to snub a full desktop graphics card in favor of this built-in alternative, as the integrated GPU will only be sufficient for tasks such as basic content creation and display outputs.

 

[polonyc2]

AMD 7000 Series Details! - INTEL... You're in serious trouble!

 

[chameleoneel]

I’m trying to find the TSMC papers they put out a few months back. They said it was a work in progress but they didn’t have their TSV packaging tech working correctly on 5nm which was part of the delays for 3nm.
The places I normally look are all flooded with the new stuff, I’ll have to look after work.

Moore's Law Is Dead youtube channel has some of the most correct, well in advance leaks of anyone. He talked about samples of Zen4 with Vcache and their performance


And now he has a new video, saying Q1 release:

 

[Chris_B]

No one will want those $125 board. You looking at at least $250 for a x670 board. Maybe even $300. If you building that cheap of a system you are better off going am4.

You still dont have to go fully balls out for the new platform, thats my point. People on the moan about amd's first new socket\platform for desktop in 6 years, like wtf. How many have intel launched in that timeframe? A lot in comparison i'd wager.

 

[XenIneX]

No one will want those $125 board. You looking at at least $250 for a x670 board. Maybe even $300. If you building that cheap of a system you are better off going am4.

Why?

If someone's gonna build a cheap-n-cheerful 7700x, it's not like they're going to need ridiculously-overbuilt VRMs. PCIe4 SSDs are perfectly fine for >95% of users. And -- past performance predicting future outcomes -- PCIe4 x16 won't be a bottleneck for GPUs until AM6 comes out.

So what's left? RGB? Overengineered IO shields?

Seems to me that x50 SKUs will be perfectly reasonable for most.

 

[OutOfPhase]

Good gravy it is nice to have AMD back.

 

[Brackle]

Why?

If someone's gonna build a cheap-n-cheerful 7700x, it's not like they're going to need ridiculously-overbuilt VRMs. PCIe4 SSDs are perfectly fine for >95% of users. And -- past performance predicting future outcomes -- PCIe4 x16 won't be a bottleneck for GPUs until AM6 comes out.

So what's left? RGB? Overengineered IO shields?

Seems to me that x50 SKUs will be perfectly reasonable for most.

Exactly this. If you are already using a 5600x-5950x CPU, or Alder lake. I honestly see no reason to upgrade yet. Unless you REALLY need those extra frames.

And if you are on AM4, and you want better gaming performance. Get a 5800x3d if you REALLY need those frames. Otherwise there is no need to upgrade imo.

 

[Deleted member 268674]

I might want Zen4 for the AVX-512, if it turns out to deliver. And I won't need a top line board, just enough to run a 7950X at stock, maybe even with a power limit depending on how benchmarks shake out.

 

[bluestang]

170W TDP for 7950X... that's a 62% increase over 5950X!

 

[RanceJustice]

Moore's Law Is Dead youtube channel has some of the most correct, well in advance leaks of anyone. He talked about samples of Zen4 with Vcache and their performance


And now he has a new video, saying Q1 release:

Assuming that this is correct/likely, I'd be more understanding of the recent announcement's lack of 3D Cache info if Q1 2023 is scheduled, vs some sort of Oct/Nov or Q4 2022 release. I'm very likely going to either build a high-end build soon, be it either Zen 4 or Raptor Lake. While I know the (slimy, customer hostile) rationale, I'd be rather pissed if AMD decides to launch the current Zen 4 lineup and X670E boards, only to announce or debut a 7950X3D in Oct/Nov/ right after Raptor Lake arrives, making anyone who purchased the previous CPUs with the intention of high end performance (especially for gaming) obsolete. If the intent is to save 3D for after Raptor, it would have been nice for them to have officially included a list of models "coming soon" in yesterday's presentation just so people wouldn't have to remain speculating; those interested, could hold off knowing it wouldn't be that long while those buying with less interest in 3D cache could buy now. Conversely, it it turns out that we may not see 7950X3D or 7700X3D until Feb/March next year that would be more understandable for it not to be listed in yesterday's presentation.

On a somewhat unrelated note overall, we're seeing some leaked benchmarks that show (at least in one or two benches) that Raptor Lake 's high end is competitive and even comes out ahead of Zen4's in both single and multithread benches, but its yet to see how widely this will be and under what circumstances, not to mention things like price. Has anyone seen any updated price info for the X670E boards, particularly the Asus ROG Crosshair X670E Extreme? I saw some listing that though the "E" boards are more likely to be expensive on the lower end than perhaps previous generations, but there have been surprising articles saying that say.. Gigabyte AORUS's top board may be in the $500-ish range, cheaper than the $800 of last generation! I saw a listing that the Asus ROG Crosshair Extreme may be closer to $800 which if this is the case, would be a MASSIVE difference from the Intel Z690 Alder Lake era equivalent, where the Maximus Extreme is $1300 and the "Glacial" version with water monoblock is $2000! If it turns out that AMD"s Zen4 mobo and platform costs for X670E are significantly below Raptor Lake's Z790 equivalents, then even if the CPU performance between AMD and Intel are close, AMD may be preferable overall due to their value. Guess time will tell...

Oh and if anyone has heard or is able to play with a X670E high end mobo, any detail on settings that would allow users to disable the MS Pluton chip / credential storage (assuming it is present), and especially the PSP would be helpful.

 

[polonyc2]

And if you are on AM4, and you want better gaming performance. Get a 5800x3d if you REALLY need those frames. Otherwise there is no need to upgrade imo.

the 5800X3D is the answer for most people looking to upgrade...

 

[Brackle]

the 5800X3D is the answer for most people looking to upgrade...

We can't know that for sure until we get independent reviews. We have no idea how Zen 4 with DDR5 will benefit it over v-cache. We know in some instances that going from DDR4 to DDR5 for Alder lake increased performance, but in some instances didnt help at all.

Either way an exciting 2+ weeks until reviews

 

[Chris_B]

170W TDP for 7950X... that's a 62% increase over 5950X!

And yet, intel are still hotter.

 

[Ebernanut]

Many of the comments here about how motherboard prices are going to be high remind of the comments about x570 before it launched and the $600 dark hero board was the first announced. People were predicting that all x570 boards were going to be ridiculously expensive due to PCIe 4.0 but in the end the prices on x570 were just slightly higher than x470(especially if you compare launch prices) and the biggest change was that there were more ultra high end boards than there was for x470. I think we'll see a similar situation here with prices going up a little especially at first due to newer tech and higher spec requirements but nothing major, am4 will likely be a good budget option for many and it sounds like AMD will continue to sell that platform for a bit but it is a dead end platform at this point.

As far as the stated support through 2025 that sounds similar to the stated support of am4 through 2020 which got it last major release in late 2020 and a minor but notable refresh more recently than that. Of course it's worth mentioning that there's no guarantee that first gen am5 boards will support all am5 CPUs but I'd be willing to bet that unlike last time amd will put more effort into making sure that MB manufacturers at least leave plenty of ROM space to support new CPUs.

I'm overdue for an upgrade and if my current MB wasn't PCIe 3.0 and I wasn't due for a RAM upgrade I'd drop in a 5800x3d and call it a day but at this point I'm tempted to keep that system intact as a secondary pc and build a new one. I'll wait for reviews on the new amd and intel stuff before making a final decision, if I decide to go am5 and the 3d versions are coming Q1ish like the rumors are stating I might hold out for that which would also give some time for any kinks to be found and hopefully worked out as well as giving DDR5 a chance to get better and/or cheaper.

Of course if gpu crypto mining takes off again and I can't get one of the new graphics cards at a halfway reasonable price then I'll probably just scrap a new build or upgrade until I can like last time.

 

[vegeta535]

Many of the comments here about how motherboard prices are going to be high remind of the comments about x570 before it launched and the $600 dark hero board was the first announced. People were predicting that all x570 boards were going to be ridiculously expensive due to PCIe 4.0 but in the end the prices on x570 were just slightly higher than x470(especially if you compare launch prices) and the biggest change was that there were more ultra high end boards than there was for x470. I think we'll see a similar situation here with prices going up a little especially at first due to newer tech and higher spec requirements but nothing major, am4 will likely be a good budget option for many and it sounds like AMD will continue to sell that platform for a bit but it is a dead end platform at this point.

As far as the stated support through 2025 that sounds similar to the stated support of am4 through 2020 which got it last major release in late 2020 and a minor but notable refresh more recently than that. Of course it's worth mentioning that there's no guarantee that first gen am5 boards will support all am5 CPUs but I'd be willing to bet that unlike last time amd will put more effort into making sure that MB manufacturers at least leave plenty of ROM space to support new CPUs.

I'm overdue for an upgrade and if my current MB wasn't PCIe 3.0 and I wasn't due for a RAM upgrade I'd drop in a 5800x3d and call it a day but at this point I'm tempted to keep that system intact as a secondary pc and build a new one. I'll wait for reviews on the new amd and intel stuff before making a final decision, if I decide to go am5 and the 3d versions are coming Q1ish like the rumors are stating I might hold out for that which would also give some time for any kinks to be found and hopefully worked out as well as giving DDR5 a chance to get better and/or cheaper.

Of course if gpu crypto mining takes off again and I can't get one of the new graphics cards at a halfway reasonable price then I'll probably just scrap a new build or upgrade until I can like last time.

Dark hero was never $600. Asus and others did have $600+ MB available tho. I paid $360 for my gigabyte x570 master and while it was by far the most I spend on a MB I been happy with it and has lasted me the longest. Before that I don't think I spent more then $200 dollars on a MB. Even the MSI x299 board I had before.

 

[Ebernanut]

Dark hero was never $600. Asus and others did have $600+ MB available tho. I paid $360 for my gigabyte x570 master and while it was by far the most I spend on a MB I been happy with it and has lasted me the longest. Before that I don't think I spent more then $200 dollars on a MB. Even the MSI x299 board I had before.

I was going off memory so I'll take your word on that but it was more expensive than any of their x470 boards which seemed to fuel many of the predictions of x570 being super expensive which ended up being mostly wrong.

 

[chameleoneel]

We can't know that for sure until we get independent reviews. We have no idea how Zen 4 with DDR5 will benefit it over v-cache. We know in some instances that going from DDR4 to DDR5 for Alder lake increased performance, but in some instances didnt help at all.

Either way an exciting 2+ weeks until reviews

Moore's Law is Dead says that the Geomean of the benchmark data he has, shows that Zen4-Vcache outperforms Zen3-Vcache by 13%. That's Geomean. So, specific cases can be higher or lower than that.

He also says that Zen3 X3D is generally better at gaming, than regular Zen 4. As much as 15%, in specific games. But also as little as no difference, in others.