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@catalystmaker Is Morphological AA going to make it to the 5xxx series? Anandtech seems to think it is possible. http://bit.ly/cYZwBE
@obiwantoby yes it will in the future
I know I'm stepping into the lions den here, but...
son, I am disappoint.
what's the fuss about? The only great thing seems to be morphAA. The 6870 is closer to the 5850 in most tests apples to apples, costs about the same, uses almost the same amount of power as the 5850, and runs at similar temperatures. I know these chips are making way for the 69 series, but right now it seems like it's a waste of time...
What I'm trying to say is, I have a GTX260 and would LOVE to upgrade my video card. I was holding out for these, but it seems like at ~200, the 5850 is still the best deal unless morphAA is only on the 6 series.
Well, the 6870 beats the 5850 in CFX (substantially in some cases), is still cheaper, 5-6% faster; has the potential to be cooler and quieter as more models appear, and it also has the potential to be a better O'C.
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6870/32.html
If you had a GTX260, you clearly shouldn't be expecting the Mainstream cards to meet your expectations for an upgrade. The 260 wasn't a mainstream card, it was enthusiast.
What AMD has done here is blur the line between mainstream and enthusiast because these cards now perform as well as previous-gen enthusiast (5850-level). For ~$200 these cards offer an amazing amount of performance, and lets face it, if thats your budget, its the best you'll be able to get.
Not sure why you think the 5850 is a better deal than the 6870, all signs point the other way. From what I've read, morphAA will only be on 6xxx.
Again, not trying to stir the pot, I really wanted one of these cards but think I'll wait a while longer to upgrade, or maybe just buy a 5850.
5850's can be had for ~195 usd after rebates. 6870's are 240. If it's all about the potential, why is everyone going gaga and buying up the cards released today? The performance so far doesn't justify the response IMO. And cards currently on the market from ATI seem to have a better price to performance ratio for non-crossfire.
"enthusiast level" doesn't mean anything to me - It's all about the price not a title. I know the 68 series pushed the price of the 58's down, but I'd be lying if I said I was impressed by the 6850's performance...
I mean, it says something about a company that, instead of just going and building a new architecture, refine and optimize their current stuff to the point that they can reduce the size of their product, add a few capabilities, and still be able to match or beat their current price-level product.
To me, these cards don't necessarily excite me. What is exciting is that, if they were able to do this with their mid-level cards, what do they have planned for their top-end stuff...
I'll be honest, I can't tell the difference between a few fps with the aa set to 2x or 4x or 8x, but I sure can tell when my office is 85 degrees vs 78 degrees F.
be careful here, toms and others put the 6870 as beating the 470, others put the 470 as winning. we need the h review for sure hereThe 470s average advantage over the 6870 @ 1920x in DX11 is 1.5%. It increases to 7% @ 2560x.
http://www.computerbase.de/artikel/...6850/23/#abschnitt_performancerating_nach_api
It's below the 6870 in DX9 and 10 @ the same res.
People interested in Crossfire really ought to look at the scaling 6870s are putting out in; BC2, FC2, Crysis, AvP and Battle Forge.
be careful here, toms and others put the 6870 as beating the 470, others put the 470 as winning. we need the h review for sure here
I think "miles ahead" is a bit of an exaggeration.
Well when a 470 has 20% OC headroom compared to 10% of a 6870 and is priced equally, the choice is pretty obvious. Plus all the Nvidia only features like CUDA/PhysX and better Tessellation.
if anything it would force nvidia to re-think their architecture.. instead of this bullcrap brute force power hungry attempt to get the same performance as AMD maybe its time to fix the problem like ATI did almost 7 years ago when the developement of the RV870 started and even before that with the HD3k series.. instead of creating a monster gpu like nvidia's been doing for years they went the other route and tried to get as much performance out of the architecture while using as little power as they could... then maybe nvidia will be able to compete with AMD in my opinion..
So a card that is basically equal in performance OC's ~10% farther, but uses ~double the power and produces significantly more heat for more money is "pretty obvious choice"? Especially for those of us who don't care about CUDA/PhysX, and with no real world advantage from the tessellation engine?
The only problem with comparing reference to reference is that they're put up on OCing sites. Who buys a card and leaves it at reference on here? OC vs OC the 470 is miles ahead of a 6870 and has much better tessellation.
So it appears that AMD has a WIN but after reading several reviews they do not have a clear win.
To explain what I mean, basically a fully overclocked GTX 460 1gb will beat a fully overclocked 6850 and a fully overclocked 470 will beat a fully overclocked 6870. They are in the same price bracket. AMD still wins for the most part due to efficiency albeit less power draw/less noise/less heat than their competitors. For some this will matter for others it will not.
Just as many dont care about Cuda'PhyX/TWIMTBP etc.. some people dont care that their card is 20c hotter and pulls 80 more watts than yours, raw end result performance is what matters to them. Id say either could be justified as a purchase over another depending on price.
So a card that is basically equal in performance OC's ~10% farther, but uses ~double the power and produces significantly more heat for more money is "pretty obvious choice"? Especially for those of us who don't care about CUDA/PhysX, and with no real world advantage from the tessellation engine?
Wow, you want to talk about exaggerating? Saying a 470 is using "double" the power?
I use CUDA for video transcoding and love it. Adobe CS4 (Photoshop, After Effects, Premiere Pro, Cyberlink PowerDVD, Vegas Video, TMPGEnc, Nero, BadaBoom etc. all use CUDA which makes life easier.
While most game don't use Tessellation very much today, the importance of it can be seen in Unigine Heaven's dx11 benchmark which dramatically improves the video quality making games feel a lot more realistic. Even a 470 smokes a 5970 in extreme Tessellation.
PhysX is something you can definitely live without, but when the cards are equally priced and one has a lot more features, I see no reason to gimp yourself other than having a preference of brand name.
Wow, you want to talk about exaggerating? Saying a 470 is using "double" the power? 6870 consumes more power than 470.
.
A fully over clocked 460 I could stand the card runs cool overall. A 470? Not on your life I like my ears and I would like to game without suffering from dehydration. The fact that the end user has to overclock in order to beat these cards is quite telling. Especially in the case of the 470. That price is suicide and won't be there for long.
I didn't know you played Heaven. though it was a tessellation benchmark. in the real world it hasn't worked like that yet. and its not double the power but close http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-6870-radeon-hd-6850-barts,2776-22.html
and if your looking for GPGPU then the 470 is probably better. otherwise not so much.
Yes you would get a big improvement.
I dont think the 6000 series are bad overclockers, I just think AMD had a 460 1gb and 470 1gb to reference and clocked their 6000 series close to the edge to compete better. It's smart and is a good thing for the consumer.
sourceCONCLUSIONS
I do not think it is very hard to draw a conclusion on the new Gigabyte Radeon HD 6870: Quality and solid construction with huge overclocking potential make him a very successful board, considering that here we saw the layout I see reference what other models from other manufacturers would do differently. For more complex analysis and conclusions complete know where to look.
Wow, you want to talk about exaggerating? Saying a 470 is using "double" the power?
I use CUDA for video transcoding and love it. Adobe CS4 (Photoshop, After Effects, Premiere Pro, Cyberlink PowerDVD, Vegas Video, TMPGEnc, Nero, BadaBoom etc. all use CUDA which makes life easier. (and you're getting this for free on one card that's equally priced)
While most game don't use Tessellation very much today, the importance of it can be seen in Unigine Heaven's dx11 benchmark which dramatically improves the video quality making games feel a lot more realistic. Even a 470 smokes a 5970 in extreme Tessellation.
PhysX is something you can definitely live without, but when the cards are equally priced and one has a lot more features, I see no reason to gimp yourself other than having a preference of brand name.
I didn't say double the power- I said approximately or nearly double.
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-6870-radeon-hd-6850-barts,2776-22.html
take a look.
1. look at the reviews. the 470 trades blows with the 6870. sorry.I don't understand what the problem is. If one card is $220 and the other is $239 while the cheaper one has more features and OCs higher giving higher fps, why would you choose the under-performing card, other than because of brand loyalty?
You may be wrong on 99% of the argument, but that 1%(unigine) is enough for you to keep arguing? Having a better Tessellation performing card now, means that games that make extensive use of it(unlike Dirt2, AVP) during the next 1-2 years that you might keep the card, will perform that much better.
You compared an OCd 470 to a reference 6870? /facepalm
470 TDP = 215W
6870 TDP = 150W
You do know that as you increase the volts and frequency of the GPU/RAM you draw more power right? Never heard of Ohm's Law?
Watts = Volts X AmperesW