AMD: Fidelity FX Super Resolution, June 22nd

DPI

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How do you figure? It does a very similar task and sounds as though it is easier to integrate into any particular game or piece of software than DLSS 2.0 (which in turn was more compatible and required less specifics and mess than DLSS 1.0). It certainly seems like a DLSS alternative technology, given that it provides a "upscale" (term used loosely) to give greater performance than native resolution, but with graphically indistinguishable (or close to it depending on the preset level, much like DLSS - different settings to choose the degree of performance boost vs possible visual limitation ) quality. The exact methodology used and technology may differ, but from at least the description given the use case and results seem similar.
This isn’t using machine learning. It's just upscaling/reconstruction. My guess is the real DLSS-like tech may come with RDNA3 which should have ML hardware on board.
 

griff30

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Looks like Intel is wanting to push into open source DLSS with AMD, well according to the twitter post between Kyle and Intel's GPU god
 

FrgMstr

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Looks like Intel is wanting to push into open source DLSS with AMD, well according to the twitter post between Kyle and Intel's GPU god
Knowing Raja fairly well and his background with open standards, it seemed like a good question. Did not expect it to get as much attention as it did, but honestly, I am glad it did. I would love to see Intel come into line with AMD on this FSR standard as it has HUGE implications for gamers across the board, not just the folks that can afford an RTX GPU and have been lucky enough to snag one.

1622653248618.png
 

DPI

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Knowing Raja fairly well and his background with open standards, it seemed like a good question. Did not expect it to get as much attention as it did, but honestly, I am glad it did. I would love to see Intel come into line with AMD on this FSR standard as it has HUGE implications for gamers across the board, not just the folks that can afford an RTX GPU and have been lucky enough to snag one.

View attachment 362092
That twitter back and forth showed up on my newsfeed last night- "I know that guy!"

The cynic in me wonders if the unspoken second half of Raja's "we'll try to align with open approaches..." isn't "but management already has its heart set on XeSS, so my hands are tied"

78644_05_intel-xess-is-team-blues-answer-to-greens-magic-dlss-technology.png
 
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cybereality

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Fact of the matter, FreeSync won. Of course Nvidia calls it "G-Sync Compatible" because they will never admit defeat. But the free and open standard won out.

I would not be surprised if FSR finds a similar fate. By making it open and easy to use, and not tied down to specific expensive GPUs from one vendor, developers will likely be more willing to implement.

With AMD on next-gen consoles, this becomes even more likely. No developer is going to leave performance on the table, and we already see many games use the older FidelityFX features.

This could be huge.
 
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With AMD on next-gen consoles...

I get your point, but to be fair, AMD has been on consoles for how long now?
Nvidia's got some serious resources to stay relevant even when out of the console game for a long time (does the switch even count?)
 

trandoanhung1991

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I don't understand the optimism when we haven't even seen a demo o_O

I for one don't hold out much hope for FSR being better than DLSS 1.0 upon release. Anything "less clunky" than that would really impress me.
 

GoodBoy

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Fact of the matter, FreeSync won. Of course Nvidia calls it "G-Sync Compatible" because they will never admit defeat. But the free and open standard won out.

Just because something "wins" (by your example, I take that to mean 'more widespread availability') doesn't mean it's necessarily better though. G-Sync is far from dead, so it isn't playing out like a format war.

The quality and performance of this tech remains to be seen. DLSS 2.0 is pretty amazing, the bar is set. If it follows in freesync's footsteps, it's going to be many years before it has competitive performance. I like the idea that it can run on anything, but it doesn't seem realistic that doing so will perform even reasonably well on most hardware out there. DLSS 2.0 requires significant compute power, currently achieved using dedicated hardware. Enabling those features on a 1080Ti, gonna be a slideshow. Granted, raytracing on a 1080Ti is already a slideshow... but still. Going from 12 fps to say 16 fps, 25% performance boost! But the slideshow would still be a slideshow on 95% of the hardware out there. Might be useful on 6800XT and 6900XT, which is really what it is being written for. They have to try to catch up to nVidia. To really do that, they need to aim for an 8x performance jump in their 7800XT's (as compared to the 6800XT)... being forever 2 years behind sucks, because if you are a hardware enthusiast, 2 years behind doesn't cut it.
 

FrgMstr

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I don't understand the optimism when we haven't even seen a demo o_O

I for one don't hold out much hope for FSR being better than DLSS 1.0 upon release. Anything "less clunky" than that would really impress me.
How many games supported DLSS on day one? How many GPUs supported DLSS on day one? That is right, none. Not a high bar and you don't need a $1200 video card for nothing supported.

I am sorry that NV has destroyed your thoughts on what you should get with supported features.
 

Lakados

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Just because something "wins" (by your example, I take that to mean 'more widespread availability') doesn't mean it's necessarily better though. G-Sync is far from dead, so it isn't playing out like a format war.

The quality and performance of this tech remains to be seen. DLSS 2.0 is pretty amazing, the bar is set. If it follows in freesync's footsteps, it's going to be many years before it has competitive performance. I like the idea that it can run on anything, but it doesn't seem realistic that doing so will perform even reasonably well on most hardware out there. DLSS 2.0 requires significant compute power, currently achieved using dedicated hardware. Enabling those features on a 1080Ti, gonna be a slideshow. Granted, raytracing on a 1080Ti is already a slideshow... but still. Going from 12 fps to say 16 fps, 25% performance boost! But the slideshow would still be a slideshow on 95% of the hardware out there. Might be useful on 6800XT and 6900XT, which is really what it is being written for. They have to try to catch up to nVidia. To really do that, they need to aim for an 8x performance jump in their 7800XT's (as compared to the 6800XT)... being forever 2 years behind sucks, because if you are a hardware enthusiast, 2 years behind doesn't cut it.
It's going to work just fine, it is using an amalgamation of two already existing supersampling methods that are very common and already abundant at a hardware level in everything from TV's to Cellphones. What AMD and Microsoft have managed to do here is create a new algorithm that utilizes the best of both methods while supposedly ignoring or compensating for both of their drawbacks, given that the linear and non-linear upscaling processes have been baked into all generations of hardware for a long time and are very well known I am sure they will do something that is beyond adequate. I don't believe it will achieve DLSS levels of quality or clarity, but I can completely see it being 90% of the quality while using significantly fewer GPU resources in the process. It looks like it will be more complex to implement as AMD does not do anywhere near the degree of hand-holding support that NVidia does for their feature sets. But given that it will be supported on PS5, XBox, and the last 3 generations of PC GPU's I can easily see it gaining large adoption as for the consoles it will very much mean the difference between hitting 60fps and not, especially at "4K" resolutions.
 

trandoanhung1991

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How many games supported DLSS on day one? How many GPUs supported DLSS on day one? That is right, none. Not a high bar and you don't need a $1200 video card for nothing supported.

I am sorry that NV has destroyed your thoughts on what you should get with supported features.
I'm not being pro-NV by any means, but have we gotten any concrete information on FSR? So far I've only seen PR materials and some AMD performance figures. If there already are concrete information I'd love to dive in deeper.

Reason I said DLSS 1.0 is because while 1.0 was great performance-wise, it had major issues with limited game support, difficult integration and inferior image quality, and required major real-world tuning and tweaking, and I don't think AMD can skip this step. Growing pains, if you will. If AMD FSR can reach DLSS 1.0 level of everything to me is already a win, since it's open source and GPU-independent. I don't believe FSR can reach 2.0 levels of performance AND better than native image quality with its first release but if AMD prove me wrong I'd only be happier.
 
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According to digital trends. FidelityFX will support variable rate shading, contrast adaptive sharpening, denoising, and parallel sort to improve image quality. FidelityFX will be supported in 35 games at launch. Granted this is an Xbox series X article so we'll have to wait and see how this translates to PC games. Link to article.
 

FrgMstr

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According to digital trends. FidelityFX will support variable rate shading, contrast adaptive sharpening, denoising, and parallel sort to improve image quality. FidelityFX will be supported in 35 games at launch. Granted this is an Xbox series X article so we'll have to wait and see how this translates to PC games. Link to article.
FidelityFX is already launched and is AMD's software collection of tools that devs can implement in-game. FSR is just another component of that tool set. FSR stands for FidelityFX Super Resolution.
 
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OK sorry it's early here and I just woke up. Still eagerly waiting to try this out on several machines with RX 500 series gpus though and of course my 6900 on cp2077. Hoping it'll make 4K with solid 60 fps and RT there.
 

ChadD

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Anyone that thinks the industry is not going to be fully behind this one is not really thinking this through.

Imagine if your say CDprojectRed and its October last year and AMD got this open standard final and out the door before you launch your Cyberpunk game. Instead of having to be forced to refund millions of dollars of purchases of last gen console sales.... you simply release your FSR patch and last gen consoles become playable... no not 120fps but playable.

This is a game changer for developers who have been trying really hard to release games on brand new consoles that look like next gen games while still trying to release on consoles with 9 year old GPUs. That this AMD standard will work even on that hardware is the game changer. All FSS has to do is make newer games hit 30fps on the PS4 gen and AMD wins every console developer instantly, and that means pretty much every AAA developer.

We'll see on the 22nd. My expectation is to see a ton of developers pledge support. Yes like Freesync the end of Nvidias proprietary sillynesss is not far away. The funny thing is Nvidia could be the one writing standards if they would just grow up. DLSS should have been a suite of open source tools that ran on everything... but had added quality mode(s) if the right hardware was detected. They learned nothing at all from Gsync.
 

GoodBoy

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It's going to work just fine, it is using an amalgamation of two already existing supersampling methods that are very common and already abundant at a hardware level in everything from TV's to Cellphones. What AMD and Microsoft have managed to do here is create a new algorithm that utilizes the best of both methods while supposedly ignoring or compensating for both of their drawbacks, given that the linear and non-linear upscaling processes have been baked into all generations of hardware for a long time and are very well known I am sure they will do something that is beyond adequate. I don't believe it will achieve DLSS levels of quality or clarity, but I can completely see it being 90% of the quality while using significantly fewer GPU resources in the process. It looks like it will be more complex to implement as AMD does not do anywhere near the degree of hand-holding support that NVidia does for their feature sets. But given that it will be supported on PS5, XBox, and the last 3 generations of PC GPU's I can easily see it gaining large adoption as for the consoles it will very much mean the difference between hitting 60fps and not, especially at "4K" resolutions.
I love your optimism.

We should know in a few weeks.
 

cybereality

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Imagine if your say CDprojectRed and its October last year and AMD got this open standard final and out the door before you launch your Cyberpunk game. Instead of having to be forced to refund millions of dollars of purchases of last gen console sales.... you simply release your FSR patch and last gen consoles become playable... no not 120fps but playable.
Cyberpunk 2077 supported the original FidelityFX, and it was the only way to get close to 60 fps on my GTX 1060 test rig.

So yeah, they were working with AMD would obviously have added this new FSR if available. Not sure if they used it on consoles, but there was some render scaling.
 

ChadD

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Cyberpunk 2077 supported the original FidelityFX, and it was the only way to get close to 60 fps on my GTX 1060 test rig.

So yeah, they were working with AMD would obviously have added this new FSR if available. Not sure if they used it on consoles, but there was some render scaling.
I have a feeling they expected AMD to have this ready to go at launch. I know it sounds like they got pushed to get it out the door. Still I believe they expected this feature to make everything ok on last gen consoles. Something like ya we are only seeing 20 FPS... but AMD is going to have FSR ready for their next gen cards and consoles and get us to 30 FPS on PS4/Xbone it will be fine.

Very heavy speculation... perhaps Microsoft not pulling it from their old gen consoles as quickly may have had something to do with MS being involved implementing FSR. Not to absolve CDPR for their mess... but perhaps there was some blame to go around if they did expect to get a magic 30-40% uplift from MS/AMD.
 

Balkroth

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I have a feeling they expected AMD to have this ready to go at launch. I know it sounds like they got pushed to get it out the door. Still I believe they expected this feature to make everything ok on last gen consoles. Something like ya we are only seeing 20 FPS... but AMD is going to have FSR ready for their next gen cards and consoles and get us to 30 FPS on PS4/Xbone it will be fine.

Very heavy speculation... perhaps Microsoft not pulling it from their old gen consoles as quickly may have had something to do with MS being involved implementing FSR. Not to absolve CDPR for their mess... but perhaps there was some blame to go around if they did expect to get a magic 30-40% uplift from MS/AMD.

Interesting for you to say that, I actually had this typed up for a day or so and never submitted it :


It would be hilarious if CDPR is waiting for this to come out for the new consoles to release their enhanced versions
 
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