AMD CEO Confirms 7nm Navi High-End Radeon RX Graphics Cards and 4thGen Ryzen CPUs For Notebooks

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Design1stcode2nd

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During the Q/A session, the question was raised about the high-end 7nm Navi graphics cards and 7nm mobility processors to which AMD’s CEO, Dr.Lisa Su, replied that they are indeed coming.

Hans Mosesmann

“Great, And can you give us a sense if you can on 7-nanometer high-end Navi and mobile 7-nanometer CPUs, if you can? Thanks.”

Lisa Su

“Hans, you asked the good product questions, I would say they are coming. You should expect that our execution on those are on track and we have a rich 7-nanometer portfolio beyond the products that we have currently announced in the upcoming quarters.”
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https://wccftech.com/amd-ceo-7nm-navi-high-end-graphics-cards-and-4th-gen-ryzen-cpus/

Original Source: https://seekingalpha.com/article/42...-2019-results-earnings-call-transcript?page=7
 
I'm listening.

The questions I am asking myself are "when" and "how high end".

It won't be enough to beat Nvidia's 2018 RTX 2080TI with a product that doesn't come out until 2020. If that's the case it won't be a high end product, it will be the new mid range.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I'm listening.

The questions I am asking myself are "when" and "how high end".

It won't be enough to beat Nvidia's 2018 RTX 2080TI with a product that doesn't come out until 2020. If that's the case it won't be a high end product, it will be the new mid range.
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I agree, I’d like to see big Navi by the end of the year and beat the 2080 Ti by 10% 799.99.

Wishful thinking I know but nVidia has Ampere next year with a die shrink probably. If they don’t get it out relatively soon they’ll stay at the back of the line.

They need a high end win even if it’s for a few months.
 
Interested myself, but as mentioned AMD needs these soon. Nvidia will drop new GPUs in around 6 or so months I assume. Maybe a bit longer since ~2 years seems to be the life cycle for GPU generations now. Otherwise they'll just end up competing with the RTX 3070 (or whatever they will call it) at best. Which isn't bad in its own way, because at least they'll continue to compete at the upper mid range so they'll have to keep Nvidia in check there. That should result in downward pressure for the top end GPUs as well, but obviously having something that can trade blows with a **80 card would be ideal.

At least AMD is doing semi decent on the GPU front though.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I'm listening.

The questions I am asking myself are "when" and "how high end".
Click to expand...

Zarathustra, you asked the good product questions, I would say they are coming. You should expect that their execution on those are on track and they have a rich 7-nanometer portfolio beyond the products that they have currently announced in the upcoming quarters.
 
dgz said:
Zarathustra, you asked the good product questions, I would say they are coming. You should expect that their execution on those are on track and they have a rich 7-nanometer portfolio beyond the products that they have currently announced in the upcoming quarters.
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The art of speaking without saying anything is alive and well!
 
Lisa Su said:
... I would say they are coming..
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Comes across as "I'm pretty sure they are coming, it only makes sense.. *thinking* "I should check with the product guys.."

Vague really. I interpret it to mean by say July 2020 they will have another GPU out based on their Navi/7nm.
 
rgMekanic said:
I'd like to see the humongous Navi XT beat the RTXX 3090 Ti+ Super Duper for tree fiddy next week.

Seriously why does everyone expect AMD to release uber cards and charge 50% less for them?
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Jim Kim said:
And it has to use 350% less watts.:rolleyes:
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I mean, just being competitive more than every five years or so would be cool.

Also, so would being cool.
 
rgMekanic said:
I'd like to see the humongous Navi XT beat the RTXX 3090 Ti+ Super Duper for tree fiddy next week.

Seriously why does everyone expect AMD to release uber cards and charge 50% less for them?
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Because Nvidia top end cards (2080TI and RTX Titan) are probably priced about 50-75% higher than they would be if we had real competition in the marketplace.

Remember when the top end GPU money could buy cost ~$350? yes, some things have changed since then, including the ever growing difficulty with smaller die sizes, driving up costs, but not THAT much.

If there are two (or ideally more) companies competing for the same product segment we should expect prices to come down to something more reasonable.
 
So that '4th gen for notebooks' part, which is what got my attention, would seem to refer to mobile Zen 2. Right now they're calling their APUs '3000' yet they have Zen+ (second generation Zen, but third generation Ryzen naming). It would then make sense from a marketing perspective to call Zen 2 mobile products 4th gen.

Which is fine; they need something that can compete in terms of both performance and power draw at the same time. AMD is currently dead in the water in the mobile space, while Intel is shipping 10nm mobile SoCs in volume.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
yes, some things have changed since then, including the ever growing difficulty with smaller die sizes, driving up costs, but not THAT much.
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I'll theorize that higher prices on GPUs are a bit of a feedback loop, like many luxury items. As BoM increases, a linear increase in MSRP using a lower-end SKU as a base doesn't really cover profit from that line because shipments also drop. So you'd apply an exponential curve for MSRP versus BoM.
 
rgMekanic said:
I'd like to see the humongous Navi XT beat the RTXX 3090 Ti+ Super Duper for tree fiddy next week.

Seriously why does everyone expect AMD to release uber cards and charge 50% less for them?
Click to expand...

Well for the reasons a lot of AMD fans boast about: No tensor cores, no RTX die space used and on 7nm. So they should be able to sell them for a substantially lower price right?
 
Really would love to see a big Navi myself. Of course AMD will price it against existing Nvidia products.. The price drops come in time when two businesses cut prices to increase sales that would otherwise go to the other business. AMD just needs equivalent alternatives.

Tensor cores and RTX is an interesting point though. If I were presented with a big navi that equally matched a 2080Ti for the same price but did not have RTX support (but did have freesync support to go with my freesync monitor).. which would I choose?
 
rgMekanic said:
Seriously why does everyone expect AMD to release uber cards and charge 50% less for them?
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I think what everyone is hoping for is a "revolution". That is, "a reset", but one that comes from AMD instead of Nvidia.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I'm listening.

The questions I am asking myself are "when" and "how high end".

It won't be enough to beat Nvidia's 2018 RTX 2080TI with a product that doesn't come out until 2020. If that's the case it won't be a high end product, it will be the new mid range.
Click to expand...
After the products they've announced "in the coming quarters", so a year, give or take two quarters, is my guess. Probably later for the mobile cpus, because they generally come around the same time as the next gen desktop parts, plus a few months.
 
Everyone wants amd to revolutionize the market, since thats what they did on the CPU front. Problem is, unless lightening hits twice, the chances of Nvidia unable to respond to such a change is highly unlikely, couple that with Intels so called intro into the market.

The only way to get AMD to "RYZNIZE" the GPU market is if it had some powerhouse design that isnt showcased by rDNA, that costs less, offers similar features like RTX etc, performs on par or better, at a cost to produce thats less then everyone else, while somehow magically interrupting the supply chain and design efforts of Nvidia and Intel.

Ryzen was the perfect lightening strike, rDNA at this point is not (but lets not discount the solid first effort that it is though and better then Vega and Polaris thats been holding all the GPU weight thus far).

EDIT: In regards to the higher end mobile parts, they need to make sure those parts perform in the same category in almost all metrics. Last Ryzen I picked up ran too hot, and drivers from the OEs was a mess. While Priced low, they werent milking the same amount of money that say their competition was able to per cpu.
 
5150Joker said:
Well for the reasons a lot of AMD fans boast about: No tensor cores, no RTX die space used and on 7nm. So they should be able to sell them for a substantially lower price right?
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You forgot smaller production runs and smaller margins.
 
next-Jin said:
I agree, I’d like to see big Navi by the end of the year and beat the 2080 Ti by 10% 799.99.

Wishful thinking I know but nVidia has Ampere next year with a die shrink probably. If they don’t get it out relatively soon they’ll stay at the back of the line.

They need a high end win even if it’s for a few months.
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Don’t get your hopes up. If AMD were to release a 2080ti class card they would charge 2080ti prices. Lisa Su has shown that AMD under her leadership isn’t going to be the “loss leader” anymore. They’re pricing based on their competitors prices.
 
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Design1stcode2nd said:
During the Q/A session, the question was raised about the high-end 7nm Navi graphics cards and 7nm mobility processors to which AMD’s CEO, Dr.Lisa Su, replied that they are indeed coming.



https://wccftech.com/amd-ceo-7nm-navi-high-end-graphics-cards-and-4th-gen-ryzen-cpus/

Original Source: https://seekingalpha.com/article/42...-2019-results-earnings-call-transcript?page=7
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That really doesn't tell us anything new. Obviously these parts were coming some day, we just didn't know when, and we still don't.
 
rgMekanic said:
I 100000% agree with you. But I don't think competition alone will stop it.

Stop buying $1000++ video cards... that WILL stop it.
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Exactly. And that's exactly what I did. I refuse to pay more for a video card than every other part in my computer combined. I suppose if I actually used it for work purposes or I was a competitive gamer, I could justify it. But it's just an all purpose build for my house that I occasionally game on. It went from a highly considered to a hard pass in one press conference and price reveal.
 
I hate to break it to you folks. They will release a 5800 that will beat a 2080 super by a bit.... they might perhaps release a 5900 that will slightly beat a 2080ti, however it is not going to cost half as much or even 3/4... it will cost 50-100 bucks less at most. However I would expect them to talk about added bits for Hybrid ray tracing... or more realistic talk about wave32 and how it will make hybrid ray tracing a real thing.

To further upset people... Ampere is not going to be the part folks are expecting either. As a chip designer when shrinking nodes you basically have 2 options... make it smaller, draw less power and do the same amount of work... or pack it to the gills gain a ton of performance and burn just as much if not more power. AMD choose more performance when they shrunk ryzen to 7... it seems they choose much the same with Navi. I have a feeling NV will go the opposite way. They have been making massive chips on 12nm that have not so hot yields due to their physical size. I imagine NV feels they can shrink to 7nm... optimize their architecture keep very close to the same performance on a chip in the 200-300mm range instead of 500+mm and maximize profits. Don't get me wrong if high end Ampere is basically 2080ti in a smaller package that is a huge win for consumers, Still I doubt highly we are seeing double digit performance improvements with NVs first gen 7nm stuff.
 
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kirbyrj said:
Exactly. And that's exactly what I did. I refuse to pay more for a video card than every other part in my computer combined. I suppose if I actually used it for work purposes or I was a competitive gamer, I could justify it. But it's just an all purpose build for my house that I occasionally game on. It went from a highly considered to a hard pass in one press conference and price reveal.
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I miss the days of being able to buy the hottest mid range card every year and a half or so that was as good as the top end the last time you swapped one out. Now the mid range cards cost as much as the high end used to... and get beat by 4 and 5 year old high end cards.

If you told me 20 years ago that
1) there would be a hot market for 2-3 year old used computer parts in 2019
or
2) skynet would have us all plugged into matrix battery pods... and there would be no matrix cause your life as a battery is enough for you filthy meat bag.

I would have blew all my money on hookers and coke before the AI apocalypse.
 
next-Jin said:
I agree, I’d like to see big Navi by the end of the year and beat the 2080 Ti by 10% 799.99.

Wishful thinking I know but nVidia has Ampere next year with a die shrink probably. If they don’t get it out relatively soon they’ll stay at the back of the line.

They need a high end win even if it’s for a few months.
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The problem is Nvidia has a 2080Ti killer ready to drop tomorrow if they deemed necessary.
 
rgMekanic said:
I'd like to see the humongous Navi XT beat the RTXX 3090 Ti+ Super Duper for tree fiddy next week.

Seriously why does everyone expect AMD to release uber cards and charge 50% less for them?
Click to expand...

I expect AMD to release uber cards and charge a reasonable price for them. 1200 bucks is not a fair price for a high end card, 799 is pushing the limits of normal inflation. If you are not puling for AMD to compete and cause market corrections then you may as well start making posts about how great it would be if nvidia and AMD merged and we only have one all powerful company that can charge 1200 dollars for ...oh wait.
 
odditory said:
Unfortunately Nvidia has a 2080Ti killer ready to drop tomorrow if deemed necessary.
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Accept they don't... the 2080ti is a binned TU-102 chip. The fully working versions go into the quadro 8000 (1395 clock vs 1350 2080ti) 4608 shaders in the 8000/Titan vs 4352 in the TI.

The super chips are a completely different wafer design.... which almost without a doubt has a scaled down design to improve yields and reduce costs. (if that wasn't true we would have already seen a Quadro 8500 or something.)

NV doesn't have anything until Ampere. Of course AMD has yet to release anything... if they can get big navi out before Xmas they would probably have 6 months before NV could really answer in a real way with Ampere. They just contracted Samsung to fab those recently... I wouldn't expect to see parts based on those until summer 2020 or even the fall.
 
Smoked Brisket said:
I expect AMD to release uber cards and charge a reasonable price for them. 1200 bucks is not a fair price for a high end card, 799 is pushing the limits of normal inflation. If you are not puling for AMD to compete and cause market corrections then you may as well start making posts about how great it would be if nvidia and AMD merged and we only have one all powerful company that can charge 1200 dollars for ...oh wait.
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It really doesn’t matter what you, or anyone, would like AMD to do. They have already proven that they are not interested in being the “budget” brand anymore. AMD is going to follow pricing trends with their hardware and if they have something better then their competitors they will price that item higher. Let’s not ignore that AMD is releasing a fairly expensive mainstream platform CPU soon. They are clearly not going to be the company to “correct” the market.
 
if they don't show next compute oriented card at siggraph then i doubt they'll release it by feb next year.
 
GoodBoy said:
Comes across as "I'm pretty sure they are coming, it only makes sense.. *thinking* "I should check with the product guys.."

Vague really. I interpret it to mean by say July 2020 they will have another GPU out based on their Navi/7nm.
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Well, of course she is going to be vague, that is the whole point of her doing as well as she has. She is not going to announce to the world their plans and that is fine with me.
 
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I'm looking forward to 4th gen in laptops.... That's the next laptop I'll be getting most likely.
 
My expectation is the next Navi won't be big Navi, but small Navi to compete with 1660 Ti, which has been the #1 seller on Amazon for quite a while. It looks like 1660 Ti, is the new GTX 1060, AKA the most popular card on Steam.

A competitor for that is what AMD needs next, and ASAP.

Chasing the performance crown is a big, expensive, lower volume part. It looks flashy but isn't as important as having something for the best selling segment.
 
Snowdog said:
A competitor for that is what AMD needs next, and ASAP.
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They do need something between the RX590 and 5700.

Snowdog said:
Chasing the performance crown is a big, expensive, lower volume part. It looks flashy but isn't as important as having something for the best selling segment.
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They need to be able to spin those parts into enterprise solutions- absent that, yeah, they basically can't afford to produce them. I think we all agree that AMD is more than capable of building a 2080Ti killer today, bar DXR support.
 
5500, 5600, 5800 and 5900 is what I'd expect over the course of the next 12 months. I think they need to do the 5800/5900 first as they have a shorter window to be near or on par with a 2080Ti than a 1660.

No one really expects AMD to compete head to head with Nvidia's best when Nvidia releases it as of 2019/2020. I'm hopeful we will get to that over the next 3 years or so and hope Intel becomes an option as well.
 
Design1stcode2nd said:
No one really expects AMD to compete head to head with Nvidia's best when Nvidia releases it as of 2019/2020.
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I always expect them to try- they usually just fall short. Which is frustrating, because we know that if AMD chose to compete with Nvidia, they could.
 
IdiotInCharge said:
I always expect them to try- they usually just fall short. Which is frustrating, because we know that if AMD chose to compete with Nvidia, they could.
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They could but it would burn a lot of their resources to do so. They simply cannot outspend either Intel or Nvidia and have to prioritize where their limited D&D budget goes.
 
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