AMD at CES 2023: 7950X3D, 7900X3D, 7800X3D - VCache Party In Here

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Aren’t the non 3D parts a 170w TDP?

What are they doing that has made them run at higher clocks with the extra cache while shaving 50w off them.
 
Is only one CCX getting the V-Cache on the 7950X3D? If the the single CCX 5800X3D and the upcoming also single CCX 7800X3D have 64MB of added V-Cache, then shouldn't the two CCX 7950X3D have 128MB of added cache?

Single-core boost speed is the same. AMD may have been saving some of the better chiplets for 3D, this might be a new stepping, and/or AMD just undervolting/offsetting the chips after seeing how the existing ones have performed.

Base frequency on the 7950X3D is down 300MHz.

FURTHER EDIT to note my statements are based on the slides that videocardz and techpowerup are already showing.
 
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16 core laptop CPUs with 80mb of cache

*Laptops get a 7600 GPU product before desktop lolololol
 
Teenyman45 said:
Is only one CCX getting the V-Cache on the 7950X3D? If the the single CCX 5800X3D and the upcoming also single CCX 7800X3D have 64MB of added V-Cache, then shouldn't the two CCX 7950X3D have 128MB of added cache?

Single-core boost speed is the same. AMD may have been saving some of the better chiplets for 3D, this might be a new stepping, and/or AMD just undervolting/offsetting the chips after seeing how the existing ones have performed.

Base frequency on the 7950X3D is down 300MHz.

FURTHER EDIT to note my statements are based on the slides that videocardz and techpowerup are already showing.
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One CCX has V-cache, one does not. That way, you get the benefit of the cache, but you also get the same boost clocks on one CCX. Whereas the single CCX 7800X3D has lower boost clocks, like the 5800X3D did.
 
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chameleoneel said:
One CCX has V-cache, on does not. That way, you get the benefit of the cache, but you also get the same boost clocks on one CCX. Whereas the single CCX 7800X3D has lower boost clocks, like the 5800X3D did.
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So some thread priority tricks? How we going to keep the game running on the one CCX or do you think the drivers will manage that?
 
I am interested in the 7800X3D, depends on what price it is though. Still waiting for motherboard/RAM prices to come down so I would probably get any upgrade later in the year. By then they should have plenty of BIOS fixes for this platform and come pre-loaded with latest BIOS already installed.
 
Flogger23m said:
I am interested in the 7800X3D, depends on what price it is though. Still waiting for motherboard/RAM prices to come down so I would probably get any upgrade later in the year. By then they should have plenty of BIOS fixes for this platform and come pre-loaded with latest BIOS already installed.
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She did mention cheaper boards. Glad to hear her acknowledge that is an issue.
 
Man, I'd definitely buy one of these, if I could only use a 16x slot AND an 8x slot at the same time (both electrically)

The 8x Slot doesn't even have to be gen5. I'd accept Gen4 or even Gen3.

The wimpy expansion options on modern PC's is really annoying.
 
The presentation was light on details. I'm hoping to get a 7800X3D, but I need to learn about pricing, productivity performance compared to Intel, and gaming benchmarks compared to Intel. I hope it beats the 13700K in everything.
 
DAMN that MI300 3D stacked beauty with everything on it was pure hard on even though I have 0 interest in it lmao.
 
I find it interesting that pricing wasn't mentioned. I find that a little worrysome.
 
Teenyman45 said:
Is only one CCX getting the V-Cache on the 7950X3D? If the the single CCX 5800X3D and the upcoming also single CCX 7800X3D have 64MB of added V-Cache, then shouldn't the two CCX 7950X3D have 128MB of added cache?

Single-core boost speed is the same. AMD may have been saving some of the better chiplets for 3D, this might be a new stepping, and/or AMD just undervolting/offsetting the chips after seeing how the existing ones have performed.

Base frequency on the 7950X3D is down 300MHz.

FURTHER EDIT to note my statements are based on the slides that videocardz and techpowerup are already showing.
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I think these are just more tweaked. I am suspecting around 5ghz all core that is what tweaked 7950x get if you dropped it to 120w or so runs cooler, loses a little performance while using much less power.
 
Domingo said:
I find it interesting that pricing wasn't mentioned. I find that a little worrysome.
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it might have to do with not slowing the sales of other processors either if they were to be set lower. I think it might be a good thing. Because if they intend to drop them at 699.99 for top sku and just keep the 7950x at discounted pricing people might hold off on those for now and spend the extra 150 next month. I suspect 799.99 max for the x3d 7950x
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Man, I'd definitely buy one of these, if I could only use a 16x slot AND an 8x slot at the same time (both electrically)

The 8x Slot doesn't even have to be gen5. I'd accept Gen4 or even Gen3.

The wimpy expansion options on modern PC's is really annoying.
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The MSI X670E Ace has three 16 lane slots that are wired for 16x, 8x, and 4x respectively and all gen 5. Of course, you still have the same limited total lanes from the 7950.

NKD said:
it might have to do with not slowing the sales of other processors either if they were to be set lower. I think it might be a good thing. Because if they intend to drop them at 699.99 for top sku and just keep the 7950x at discounted pricing people might hold off on those for now and spend the extra 150 next month. I suspect 799.99 max for the x3d 7950x
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I can see the argument because the one 7XXX series selling well is the 7950, but AMD does have the big ask of pushing people who are already in for 7950 after generally getting premium RAM and a 670E board to now buy a new CPU at full retail. This is following a bad launch of the 7XXX series AND now on top of that the double let downs in the basic performance of the 7900XTX as well as the cooling issues.
 
7950x3d is going to be a beast. Having Vcache on one chip... and a chip free to boost to 5.7ghz on the other is exactly what the tech needed. Its not just for gaming at that point... best of both worlds on one chip, tons of cache and high boosts.
 
ChadD said:
7950x3d is going to be a beast. Having Vcache on one chip... and a chip free to boost to 5.7ghz on the other is exactly what the tech needed. Its not just for gaming at that point... best of both worlds on one chip, tons of cache and high boosts.
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Indeed. If we had more dense DDR5 I’d be a bit tempted, but I need more ram than they can do right now. Not going back to 64G to get decent performance. Curious what this could mean for the future of the workstation Epyc/Threadripper. A CCD or two with cache on one of those ….
 
Teenyman45 said:
The MSI X670E Ace has three 16 lane slots that are wired for 16x, 8x, and 4x respectively and all gen 5. Of course, you still have the same limited total lanes from the 7950.



I can see the argument because the one 7XXX series selling well is the 7950, but AMD does have the big ask of pushing people who are already in for 7950 after generally getting premium RAM and a 670E board to now buy a new CPU at full retail. This is following a bad launch of the 7XXX series AND now on top of that the double let downs in the basic performance of the 7900XTX as well as the cooling issues.
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what does graphics have to do with it? nothing. Plus anyone who bought 7950x should have know these were coming, it was already rumored to death. i mean I did when I bought the 7700x. I'll take a little loss on it as rental use lmao and then buy the x3d. People who bought 7950x probably wont care. Since lot of people waited getting chips that were worth it this might be it to drive the AM5 platform. Lisa did talk about lot of budget options coming for AM5. May be they are going to push the board prices down as well q1.
 
7950X3D looks like my kinda processor.

Maybe in the future or if I come across an outrageous amount of money.
 
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lopoetve said:
Magic. Voodoo magic. (Aka: Buggy windows 11 code that will take 6-9 months to get fiddled out).
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It occurs to me that Intel and their E-Cores may have already gotten the code in place for this… >.<

You can call it what you will but AMD now has asymmetric processors. Not the same as E and P cores but logically similar.
 
Lakados said:
It occurs to me that Intel and their E-Cores may have already gotten the code in place for this… >.<

You can call it what you will but AMD now has asymmetric processors. Not the same as E and P cores but logically similar.
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Toms Hardware said:
AMD is working with Microsoft on Windows optimizations that will work in tandem with a new AMD chipset driver to identify games that prefer the increased L3 cache capacity and pin them into the CCD with the stacked cache. Other games that prefer higher frequencies more than increased L3 cache will be pinned into the bare CCD. AMD says that the bare chiplet can access the stacked L3 cache in the adjacent chiplet, but this isn't optimal and will be rare. Yes, the chip with the extra L3 cache will run games at a slower speed, but most games don't operate at peak clock rates, so you should still get a huge performance benefit.
 
Lakados said:
It occurs to me that Intel and their E-Cores may have already gotten the code in place for this… >.<

You can call it what you will but AMD now has asymmetric processors. Not the same as E and P cores but logically similar.
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Different optimizations I’d suspect. Identifying what can benefit from extra cache vs different core capabilities and types… there’s a foundation, but it’s a different type of house. Still gonna be some bugs. I’d almost love to be a fly on the wall in those early discussions about how to handle that. Fun!! It’ll be easier than the first time around though.
 
chameleoneel said:
Toms Hardware said:
AMD is working with Microsoft on Windows optimizations that will work in tandem with a new AMD chipset driver to identify games that prefer the increased L3 cache capacity and pin them into the CCD with the stacked cache. Other games that prefer higher frequencies more than increased L3 cache will be pinned into the bare CCD. AMD says that the bare chiplet can access the stacked L3 cache in the adjacent chiplet, but this isn't optimal and will be rare. Yes, the chip with the extra L3 cache will run games at a slower speed, but most games don't operate at peak clock rates, so you should still get a huge performance benefit.
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Hah. Posted before I saw this! I was right!
 
Teenyman45 said:
The MSI X670E Ace has three 16 lane slots that are wired for 16x, 8x, and 4x respectively and all gen 5. Of course, you still have the same limited total lanes from the 7950.
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Unfortunately not

From the MSI X670E Ace Specifications:
Code: 
3x PCI-E x16 slot
Supports x16/x0/x4, x8/x8/x4
PCI_E1 PCIe 5.0 supports up to x16 (From CPU) 
PCI_E2 PCIe 5.0 supports up to x8 (From CPU) 
PCI_E3 PCIe 5.0 supports up to x4 (From CPU)

So no 16x and 8x at the same time.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Unfortunately not

From the MSI X670E Ace Specifications:
Code: 
3x PCI-E x16 slot
Supports x16/x0/x4, x8/x8/x4
PCI_E1 PCIe 5.0 supports up to x16 (From CPU)
PCI_E2 PCIe 5.0 supports up to x8 (From CPU)
PCI_E3 PCIe 5.0 supports up to x4 (From CPU)

So no 16x and 8x at the same time.
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Well that's due to the lack of lanes from the chip. Sure the CPU has 28, but 4 are reserved for m.2 and 4 more for miscellaneous io. Can't run 24 lanes if only 20 are available.
 
I'm prepared to take my holiday acquired 7950X back now that a 7950X3D has been confirmed AND its showing up in February. - actual Q1 release? Not "the last day of March", not "pushed until the last day of Q2" or "midsummer"... but ACTUALLY Q1?! I'm liking this return to form, first both Nvidia and AMD release their high end GPUs BEFORE all the rest, now the X3D chips arrive in Feb... the only thing that would make it a true enthusiast glory days is if Zen5 (and whatever Intel's next thing is) are released with a HEDT Threadripper platform BEFORE the mainstream Ryzen!

Anyway, the only thing that concerns be a bit is that the AMD 7950X3D doesn't have all the extra cache on both CCXs. Does this mean one of them will be hobbled in terms of clockspeed and OC potential (ie like the 5800X3D was?) Also I wonder what this will mean for the 7900X3D having most of the cache but lacking part of the cores. The 7950X3D has been my target proc since the beginning but I was hoping it would be cache on both CCX . I'm a bit concerned about "will need magical optimizations, kinda like the whole P and E core scheduler stuff. Better luck next time if you're not on Windows 11!" potential; I can only HOPE that AMD will remember their steller relationship with Linux users in terms of GPU drivers and be sure that whatever scheduler magic will be open sourced and incorporated into the Linux kernel ASAP; I do NOT want to see this require some proprietary binary or whatever to get fully used properly until some workaround eventually comes down the pipe. On the 120w, that also concerns me a bit - if its improvements in process then so much the better but if not I don't want it to be more restricted in its boost clocks/OC potential or anything. Hopefully there will be some sort of thing to allow those with sufficient cooling to allow the wattage ceiling to uncap and otherwise get the most out of the proc - It will still be impressive either way I'm sure but I'd hate if they couldn't find whatever high temp/frequency capable material or whatnot so there's a hard limit similar to the 5800X3D to make up for it.

Those worries aside I'm glad to see the X3D Zen4s coming in stores so soon!
 
Teenyman45 said:
Well that's due to the lack of lanes from the chip. Sure the CPU has 28, but 4 are reserved for m.2 and 4 more for miscellaneous io. Can't run 24 lanes if only 20 are available.
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Note that I said I did not need the 8x slots to be Gen 5.

You could easily run 8x "less than Gen5" lanes off the chipset to an 8x PCIe slot.

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Zarathustra[H] said:
Note that I said I did not need the 8x slots to be Gen 5.

You could easily run 8x "less than Gen5" lanes off the chipset to an 8x PCIe slot.
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Not sure if its exactly what you're seeking, but this seems to differ by motherboard. The Asus ROG Crosshair X670E Extreme says this about the PCI-E slots (and M.2 for that matter. Besides regular M.2 slots, the Extreme also comes with a custom slot andGEN-Z2 mount resembling a RAM stick, as well as a PCI-E slot mounted M.2 converter/cooling module).
--
AMD Ryzen™ 7000 Series Desktop Processors
2 x PCIe 5.0 x16 slots (supports x16 or x8/x8 modes)*
AMD X670 Chipset
1 x PCIe 4.0 x4 slot
*When the PCIe 5.0 M.2 card is installed on the PCIEX16(G5)_2, PCIEX16(G5)_1 will run x8 only.
*When M.2_2 is enabled, PCIEX16(G5)_1 will run x8 and PCIEX16(G5)_2 will run x4.

Total supports 5 x M.2 slots and 6 x SATA 6Gb/s ports*
AMD Ryzen™ 7000 Series Desktop Processors
M.2_1 slot (Key M), type 2242/2260/2280 (supports PCIe 5.0 x4 mode)
M.2_2 slot (Key M), type 2242/2260/2280 (supports PCIe 5.0 x4 mode)**
GEN-Z.2_1 slot (Key M) via ROG GEN-Z.2, type 2242/2260/2280/22110 (supports PCIe 5.0 x4 mode)***
PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot (Key M) via PCIe 5.0 M.2 card, type 2242/2260/2280/22110 (supports PCIe 5.0 x4 mode)***
AMD X670 Chipset
GEN-Z.2_2 slot (Key M) via ROG GEN-Z.2, type 2242/2260/2280/22110 (supports PCIe 4.0 x4 mode)
6 x SATA 6Gb/s ports
*AMD RAIDXpert2 Technology supports both NVMe RAID 0/1/10 and SATA RAID 0/1/10.
** When M.2_2 is enabled, PCIEX16(G5)_1 will run x8 and PCIEX16(G5)_2 will run x4.
*** Performance may very depending on the SSD’s firmware version, the system hardware and system configuration, for more information refer to www.asus.com for device support list.
--

It seems kind of odd for a a board not to include x8/x8, as even going back to the old days of SLI and CrossfireX the whole "x16 for a single slot, or x8/x8 if both are populated" thing was a commonality. Though I do get what you mean about there sometimes being limited lanes - while just about everything else from the HEDT (
I can recall how despite the platform having overall more lanes vs mainstream, even more could be unlocked depending on your CPU model. ) era has been sort of handled by modern Ryzen (and I assume Intel i9 + Zxxx chipsets similarly), there's still only so many PCI-E lanes to go around. It would kind of be nice if they made some variation so that some boards and certain procs could handle up to a higher maximum amount of lanes, but someone without those needs could by cheaper ones without the full compliment.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Note that I said I did not need the 8x slots to be Gen 5.

You could easily run 8x "less than Gen5" lanes off the chipset to an 8x PCIe slot.

View attachment 539597
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I agree completely. We used to be able to get boards with like 4, 5, 6 PCI-E slots on them. Now if you get even 3 that's a blessing. I wouldn't be surprised if this is intentional to force a difference between desktop and HEDT. For example all Threadripper boards I've seen at least have 4.
 
kac77 said:
I agree completely. We used to be able to get boards with like 4, 5, 6 PCI-E slots on them. Now if you get even 3 that's a blessing. I wouldn't be surprised if this is intentional to force a difference between desktop and HEDT. For example all Threadripper boards I've seen at least have 4.
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We used to get montherboards without on board sound,lan,raid
What would a normal user need to add beside GPU?
at most more advanced users will add a raid controller or 10gbit lan maybe for specific uses.
audiophiles would prefer usb DAC anyways , and SLI is dead .
one extra slot is max i might need.
 
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