Adored's RTX 2080 Ti Review Roundup and Analysis

[Crystoff]

AMD's fastest card is slower than a two year old GTX 1080, for $100 more. Wow, what great fucking value AMD provides to thrifty gamers! I'm convinced that if the tables were turned, AMD would be gifting us 2080Ti performance for $499. Because they're a benevolent charity looking out for our best interest , and nVidia is the evil empire.

So out of the blue in an NVidia card review, you simply slam AMD. That adds so much to the discussion. Do you also have a "hate AMD" sign in your yard? It would make as much sense.

 

[NukeDukem]

So out of the blue in an NVidia card review, you simply slam AMD. That adds so much to the discussion. Do you also have a "hate AMD" sign in your yard? It would make as much sense.

The point is nVidia isn't the only company charging ridiculous prices for their products, and nVidia's pricing is largely thanks to the completely irrelevant joke that is the competition (in this case, AMD).

I'm not sure how that's not relevant to the thread's OP which links a video discussing this very subject. (I admit I did not listen to all of it, this man's voice is utterly maddening to listen to. Sorry.)

 

[Aireoth]

The point is nVidia isn't the only company charging ridiculous prices for their products, and nVidia's pricing is largely thanks to the completely irrelevant joke that is the competition (in this case, AMD).

I'm not sure how that's not relevant to the thread's OP which links a video discussing this very subject.

That point is your grasping to blame someone other than the culprit, nVidia.

 

[NukeDukem]

That point is your grasping to blame someone other than the culprit, nVidia.

Oh, nVidia is the big bad culprit now. Not a multi billion dollar, publicly traded corporation that is taking advantage of a market situation to maximize profits. My bad for not salivating at the mouth over economic realities that people are just going to have to deal with in lieu of actual competition in the luxury GPU sector!

Cry me a freakin' river. They should have sat on Turing for another six months and done nothing, just to satiate you babies with more 2 year old Pascal. Oh, then you'd be crying about that, and how you can't afford a 1080 Ti because they are still $800. (Not necessarily YOU, just a general statement about the perpetually angry and entitled GPU consumer mentality.)

 

[Aireoth]

Oh, nVidia is the big bad culprit now. Not a multi billion dollar, publicly traded corporation that is taking advantage of a market situation to maximize profits. My bad for not salivating at the mouth over economic realities that people are just going to have to deal with in lieu of actual competition in the luxury GPU sector!

Cry me a freakin' river. They should have sat on Turing for another six months and done nothing, just to satiate you babies with more 2 year old Pascal. Oh, then you'd be crying about that, and how you can't afford a 1080 Ti because they are still $800. (Not necessarily YOU, just a general statement about the perpetually angry and entitled GPU consumer mentality.)

You are the problem, not the solution.

You use whataboutisms, and accept being treated like shit by the corporate masters of the world. If you don't demand better, you deserve worse.

 

[Zinn]

Damn, I was too late to get in before the reeeeee.

This was a good analysis of Nvidia's launch - rushing a launch on the promise of future ray-tracing only makes sense when they're trying to get devs hooked on their proprietary API Kool Aid and further cut AMD out of the market.

I do wonder how successful this can possibly be, given that PC development is typically still hamstrung by catering to the least common gaming denominator (aka. the Xbox One / PS4). I wouldn't anticipate PC developers going balls-deep on ray tracing unless the RTX tech is available in future gaming consoles, and given how unsuccessful Nvidia has been with gaming consoles and handhelds, I wouldn't hold my breath on that.

 

[NukeDukem]

You are the problem, not the solution.

You use whataboutisms, and accept being treated like shit by the corporate masters of the world. If you don't demand better, you deserve worse.

Fair enough. I admit I'm not helping the situation by purchasing 2080Ti at this price, which I agree is (in my personal opinion) high. I am no nVidia fanboy, and I would gladly still be rocking ATI cards in an alternate universe. I think I'm just more willing to lay blame on ALL the market forces which have contributed to this mess. I am personally more upset with AMD than nVidia, and maybe that's misplaced.

I just see nVidia coming through with solid products, "overpriced" as they may be... but with AMD it's been shadow product after broken promise after excuse after whatever, IDGAF anymore. The Vega release was so much more of a slap in the face to me than RTX Turing, it's not even close! At the very least nVidia is giving us enthusiasts something tangible; namely the fastest PC gaming dGPUs in the world.

 

[Chebsy]

Fair enough. I admit I'm not helping the situation by purchasing 2080Ti at this price, which I agree is (in my personal opinion) high. I am no nVidia fanboy, and I would gladly still be rocking ATI cards in an alternate universe. I think I'm just more willing to lay blame on ALL the market forces which have contributed to this mess. I am personally more upset with AMD than nVidia, and maybe that's misplaced.

I just see nVidia coming through with solid products, "overpriced" as they may be... but with AMD it's been shadow product after broken promise after excuse after whatever, IDGAF anymore. The Vega release was so much more of a slap in the face to me than RTX Turing, it's not even close! At the very least nVidia is giving us enthusiasts something tangible; namely the fastest PC gaming dGPUs in the world.

Nuke, you have a point about AMD and their lack of high end competition, but they do compete in the mid range quite well. I also agree with others about the RTX 2080 range being over priced and slightly disappointing with the performance increase over the 10 series. The fact is AMD went off the boil with their development and Nvidia were left in a dominant market position which they are maximising to their advantage. Any good business would do the same. What I can't condone is Nvidia's underhand tactics when it comes to NDA's and controlling partners and the press. That is a step too far.

 

[TAP]

Nuke, you have a point about AMD and their lack of high end competition, but they do compete in the mid range quite well. I also agree with others about the RTX 2080 range being over priced and slightly disappointing with the performance increase over the 10 series. The fact is AMD went off the boil with their development and Nvidia were left in a dominant market position which they are maximising to their advantage. Any good business would do the same. What I can't condone is Nvidia's underhand tactics when it comes to NDA's and controlling partners and the press. That is a step too far.

Ray tracing was forever considered the unattainable holy grail of graphics and now people are complaining that Nvidia dedicated die space to it...

 

[skates15]

I will likely buy the 2080Ti since I game in 4K and that card is designed for 4K. The price is terrible though.

 

[Chebsy]

Ray tracing was forever considered the unattainable holy grail of graphics and now people are complaining that Nvidia dedicated die space to it...

Innovation and pushing new technologies is good, Ray tracing implementation is an achievement on Nvidia's part just like rapid packed maths was for AMD. Only problem for both is that there isn't much that takes advantage of them at this time, so we can only currently measure their ability/performance on FPS etc

 

[steakman1971]

I think the Nvidia prices are outrageous. Yeah, you gotta pay to play. I get it. One of my favorite movies is Snatch. The phrase "proper fucked" comes to mind.
I still have a 970 gpu. I don't want to buy first gen RTX - where are the games? They aren't hear yet. By the time they arrive, new cards will be out that are faster/better.

 

[Pieter3dnow]

On the price issue, a large factor into the cost is die size. The RTX 2080 Ti coming up 775mm Sq. vs 471mm Sq. of the 1080 Ti. Which is approximately 60% larger, I could not find the die size of the 2080 (in a very quick search, didnt try to hard) but it safe to assume it is larger as well, probably by a similar amount. Since it 13.6 billion transistors vs 7.2 of the 1080 ~53% more transistors.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13346/the-nvidia-geforce-rtx-2080-ti-and-2080-founders-edition-review
https://www.gamersnexus.net/news-pc/3356-die-size-nvidia-rtx-2080-ti-evga-xc2-ft-der8auer

The die size is a little smaller this is table with all of them https://www.pcgamesn.com/nvidia-turing-gpu-architecture-specs
The thing that baffles me is that the die size 754 mm2 for the GTX 2080 TI is also a sign that Nvidia can't go bigger.
Is Nvidia going to increase the die size is that something that will allow more performance for ray tracing?
If Nvidia will increase the die size on a lower nano meter process that these prices that people frown upon will seem cheap.

I haven't seen anyone make a case where they explain how there is a future unless Nvidia drops shader performance for ray tracing cores. Or have a breakthrough on design.

Will there be 800+ mm2 GPU next few generations, don't see that happening in the consumer space.

 

[psyclist]

Im guessing the problem was Turing was supposed to be on the 7nm node, and then got pushed to the 12nm when they realized timelines wouldnt match up, TSMC probably gave em a good deal on these wafers. So Die sizes are astronomical this gen, but will be 40% smaller for the next putting us at a similar size die of the 1080Ti.

The 20XX series is going to be short lived and feel bad for folks spending this kind of money when the next gen will be so much better...Let the market adopt Ray Tracing, see the performance hits....then decide if its worth it...I bet next gen is cheaper as well with the die shrink and cheaper GDDR6 by then...

 

[1Nocturnal101]

Honestly there are two things going on here, Nvidia knows there is a market that will buy anything they release at the high-end and they are clearly taking advantage of that with the founders edition taxes and the inflated prices on this refresh generation of GPu. The real issue is looking at the price of the 2080 versus the 1080 TI and not seeing a 30% or so increase that is standard for a refresh. This represents a very bad new environment for the consumer where buying the new architecture may not have any benefit over the old architecture. You can wax poetic about RTX and the potential it may hold down the road, but as it stands this is unquestionably a bad standards to support by purchasing these cards right now.

Yes there is a thing called "Prosumers" that will pay for the 2080 or 2080Ti, the price of which wont come down until

1)- They sell leftover 10 series stock, because people cried they couldn't buy a GPU during "minergate", Journalists and Gamers had pitchforks, it led to overproduction of 10 series and massive quantities. You didn't expect them to eat the cost?

2)- Workstation market gets sorted out, 2 GPUs were faster than an 80k workstation, the 2080Ti at less than half the price of a Titan V at $3k and outperforms it, so there is more than your limited scope at play here. You are getting away cheap considering the upheaval of the market.

3) - The die size is massive, until it matures and die harvesting has greater "ideal" dies, with lower rejects, you will pay for rejects for a while till production costs get lower, remember 1080 was $600 and was cut to $500 1080 Ti was $700 and NEVER changed, Titans were $1200msrp

4) - GDDR6 pricing, new and expensive with limited quantities.

5) - Chinese/US Import tax expectancies driving weird early costs.

Yes NVidia bungled the launch ridiculously, Yes this is a MESS, This is not a normal launch at all,
The 20 series is currently for "Prosumers" as all new tech is usually for considering the Pricing of a greater than 60htz 4k panel is way out there at "Prosumer levels" and If you are crying about the price than obviously these products aren't meant for you,

The 2080 has potential to get better, whether through the newer tech attached or drivers, the 1080 ti is at its max peak and will go no further, $100-150 extra is a bargain for that right now if you don't want to pay the early adopter tax wait and pay the same price as the 1080ti later after the price cut either way you would be a complete moron to buy already outdated tech at that price, SLI is dead so buying another one will net you nothing, you'd be better off buying the 2080ti rather than spending 7-800$ for a total of $1400-1600 for a multi GPU rig that has less than a 10% chance of being used.

With that said any game that can run TAA can take advantage of DLSS, Digital Foundry did an amazing video on breaking everything down.

Lets throw something extra in here, the 2070 starts at $500, a 2060 will retail for 300-400$, If you have the money to obviously spend even if gaming at 1080p WHY would you not spend the extra $100-200 and have access to DLSS and base Level Ray Tracing? You can say its because of budget and that is acceptable Right? Especially at that market segment,*If you have the budget you would be a moron not to buy the 2070 but if you don't its understandable

Well think of how idiotic people sound saying they wont throw an extra $100-150 at a "prosumer" level product. Its like going to a Porsche lot and saying the ceramic brakes and all to new computer safety features are to expensive and not worth it, it just makes you guys hypocritical at best, A newer one is clearly better, but you will pay for it, It may not be better in the particular way you want it to be, BUT its there.

 

[TAP]

I don't think there's enough focus on what they're bringing to the table. Ray tracing has been considered the ultimate goal for the better part of 3 decades and now Nvidia is able to provide it albeit at 1080p. I can only imagine what ray traced capabilities they will bring to the table when they start dedicating a much bigger percentage of their die space to it. And DLSS looks to be a winner when compared to previous AA methods that AMD/Nvidia has developed over the years. Developers will jump on the prospect of ray traced lighting and the market will push the prices down. This hate and whining as if there's some evil conspiracy at work is hilariously stupid.

 

[Brahmzy]

...feel bad for folks spending this kind of money when the next gen will be so much better...

Don’t feel bad, get some tissues.

I surely hope the next gen is better - that’s usually the way it works, just like this time.
If it’s it’s really cool, we’ll just buy that gen too.

 

[Stoly]

The 20XX series is going to be short lived and feel bad for folks spending this kind of money when the next gen will be so much better....

And probably much more expensive.

 

[DooKey]

And probably much more expensive.

You're probably right. The best most will be able to hope for is 1080 Ti performance at around $450-500 when 7nm hits the end of next year or early 2020.

 

[Johan Steyn]

Is that any better than the morons in the other camp paying double MSRP because AMD can't maintain stock ever artificially driving prices higher?

There is huge difference. In AMD's case there was a shortage of components (RAM) and the demand exceeded their ability to provide. The difference is that in this there is no deception involved. Why can't you get that? So for you deception is just as bad as not having the ability to provide, seriously?

This is like saying that running an old lady down with your car on purpose is the same as killing an old lady that ran in front of your car. No logic at all.

 

[Johan Steyn]

Oh, nVidia is the big bad culprit now. Not a multi billion dollar, publicly traded corporation that is taking advantage of a market situation to maximize profits. My bad for not salivating at the mouth over economic realities that people are just going to have to deal with in lieu of actual competition in the luxury GPU sector!

Cry me a freakin' river. They should have sat on Turing for another six months and done nothing, just to satiate you babies with more 2 year old Pascal. Oh, then you'd be crying about that, and how you can't afford a 1080 Ti because they are still $800. (Not necessarily YOU, just a general statement about the perpetually angry and entitled GPU consumer mentality.)

Yip, they could have have sat on the 1080's a while longer and knowing nVidia, they would have. The only reason they are doing this now, is because this gives them a broader market to milk. Even though the older cards are now cheaper, their average selling price has gone up a lot. This will bring in profite. They also have the chance of catching blind fans to buy a lot of cards on pre-order, while they were still falling for the false benchmarks and hype.

There is also a chance that they might know something we don't. What if there is actually an AMD card on the way that might upset their market share a bit? It does not need to be a monster, but with nVidia catching the market now, they can still milk the cow without before AMD's response.

 

[Johan Steyn]

Fair enough. I admit I'm not helping the situation by purchasing 2080Ti at this price, which I agree is (in my personal opinion) high. I am no nVidia fanboy, and I would gladly still be rocking ATI cards in an alternate universe. I think I'm just more willing to lay blame on ALL the market forces which have contributed to this mess. I am personally more upset with AMD than nVidia, and maybe that's misplaced.

I just see nVidia coming through with solid products, "overpriced" as they may be... but with AMD it's been shadow product after broken promise after excuse after whatever, IDGAF anymore. The Vega release was so much more of a slap in the face to me than RTX Turing, it's not even close! At the very least nVidia is giving us enthusiasts something tangible; namely the fastest PC gaming dGPUs in the world.

At least Raja is gone and most importantly the marketing guy (Chris?). The latter really hyped the Vega so much and created such high expectations.