A64 and RAM

D

DaMaDo

Gawd
Joined
May 31, 2001
Messages
681
Ok, I've just gotten the sysetm listed in my sig and I've been having one really annoying problem...it locks up every now and then after about 1-6 hours. The temp doesn't go above 65 and it usually only locks up when its at idle anyway.

I coudln't figure out what was wrong, but a friend at work was telling me he was having the same prob and the only way he figured it out was to change his RAM to one on the "supported list" I didn't even know there was one...I thought most ram was just universal. I REALLY like the ram I have b/c I love the lights (hey, they're pretty ok?).

I'm reluctant to change it....especially since gameve.com seems to have poor rma ratings on reselleratings.com and I dont' even want to get into that if I don't have to.

Is this a known problem with AMD chips? I know I can't get a new mobo to fix it b/c the mem controller is in the chip itself....right?


Edit:
Looking at some reviews, I found this:
The modules that we have on the test bench are labeled CMX512-3200XL. These modules are rated at 2-2-2-5 timings at 2.75 Volts. While we have not had the modules for too long we have been able to use them on the following chipsets: VIA KT600, nForce2 Ultra 400, Intel 865P/875P, Via K8T800 Pro, and the nForce3-250 all with 100% success at 2-2-2-5 timings! We even used it on the upcoming 939-pin CPU's from AMD on ASUS's A8V (VIA K8T800 Pro) motherboard in dual channel operation with perfect operation. These modules seem to work on both AMD and Intel platforms at the tightest timings possible!
Click to expand...
 
i know the lights are pretty, but if i were you, i'd of gotten some pc3500 or 3700 for the extra price of those little leds.

anyway, where is this "supported list?" i would love to check it out so i can make sure i get the right ram.
 
Using 1GB sticks will cause increased stress on the memory controller...2x1GB is probably very stressing. I bet if you switched to 2x512MB the problem would go away.

Is SPD reading correctly? Hehe...OCZ EB is the king for oc'ing with tight timings :cool:
 
Hmm, I have 4x512

Yeha I thought 65 might be a little hot, I'm getting a waterchill system in this week. That should fix things.

I'm using artic silver 5 for the first time...might have put too much on. I'll try a little less.

Also....these are twinx matched ram sticks...I tried swapping a couple to see if maybe I put the matched pairs in diff slots by accident.


This isn't overclocked at all....

Oh, and 65 degrees was when the mobo was auto overclocking....its normally 55-57 at max load.

The supported list is in the mobo manual (it says "DDR qualified vendor list"...and it says for an updated version go to www.asus.com but I can't find it for the A8V...only for some of the older ones....

I've heard of the A64 being very picky with its memory so prolly wise to look into that list....if they have it online that is....I only found out by reading the manual...kinda too late then.


So far after switching the ram sticks around it hasn't locked up in 4 hours (under heavy load)...we'll see if it can make it through the night.
 
You might try to back off the memory timings a tad with four dimms. The other option is to turn on the 2T turnaround if it is in the BIOS (or go with just two dimms...remember blue first...dual channel).
 
Have you tried running a memory tester such as in memtest86? My CPU ,an AMD 64 crashes whenever it gets much above 50°C. It however is overclocked from 2 to 2.4GHz.

Try running with just one memory stick. Double sided memory puts more stress on your system. You can also try running the memory at 2-3-2-6. Mushkin has an article on their site about the extra requirements of the AMD 64 systems.
 
Thanks guys, I had some old Corsair XMSPC3500C2 which is specifically on the approved list and same problem. Only locks up after a long time in idle.

So its good in the way that I don't feel like I wasted $800 on my 2 gigs.

I'll see how it goes once my waterchill system gets here this week. I guess it could be the temps....maybe, I'll try undercloking the ram like you mentioned.
 
Well, I would suspect your motherboard.

Alternatively, if you're convinced that it sitting idle is the root of the problem, try running a background application that places it under load during idle time. (Distributed Computing)
 
bored-sarcasm said:
i know the lights are pretty, but if i were you, i'd of gotten some pc3500 or 3700 for the extra price of those little leds.

anyway, where is this "supported list?" i would love to check it out so i can make sure i get the right ram.
Click to expand...
Commit suicide. You've been left out of the loop way too long, there's no way you would ever catch up now.
DaveX said:
Using 1GB sticks will cause increased stress on the memory controller...2x1GB is probably very stressing. I bet if you switched to 2x512MB the problem would go away.

Is SPD reading correctly? Hehe...OCZ EB is the king for oc'ing with tight timings :cool:
Click to expand...
You too plz.
 
M4d-K10wN said:
Commit suicide. You've been left out of the loop way too long, there's no way you would ever catch up now.

You too plz.
Click to expand...

I suggest you stop spamming or take it somewhere else.
 
DaveX said:
Using 1GB sticks will cause increased stress on the memory controller...2x1GB is probably very stressing. I bet if you switched to 2x512MB the problem would go away.

Is SPD reading correctly? Hehe...OCZ EB is the king for oc'ing with tight timings :cool:
Click to expand...

And what have I stated that is wrong? Are you saying running 2x1GB is less stressful on the integrated memory controller than 2x512MB?

Are you saying OCZ EB is not the king of mem oc'ing? Even though it can reach 260 FSB 1:1 while keeping tRCD @ 2 constantly? Even though Sham reached 300 HTT 1:1 @ 3-2-2-5 ~2.9V?

I'm glad you don't past at other forums because every post I read from you seems to be useless spam.
 
I can do better than that with BH-6, and slightly more voltage. Or better yet, BH-5, or then again Samsung Revision 5. It does 250 at 2.5-3-3-8 on 2.7 why shouldn't it do it at 2-2-2-5 at 3.0-3.1? And beyond 250 FSB, it would be useless on an A64 anyway; they don't scale up past 25% clock gain anyway. Some even less, actually.
 
BH-5/BH-6 averages 245MHz @ 2-2-2- ~3.2V
Samsung TCCD is rated 2-2-2- @ 200MHz (by OCZ and Corsair in their platinum rev2 and XL respectively) and by Samsung for 3-4-4-8 @ 250Mhz

Many people have bought Corsair XMS-PC3200XLPro already and it only does 2-2-2- timings up to 220Mhz. Those Xtreme dudes, knowing what voltage does for BH-5/BH-6, tried to scale up the voltage but it didn't do that squat. Best was around 2.5-3-3-7 @ 250Mhz, what Corsair said it could do. Basically this is a non-contender for 1:1 @ high speeds and low latencies.

OCZ EB has Micron 5ns (probably hand-selected for quality because that Micron PC3200 has been around forever). Now tell me what you would want...245Mhz @ 2-2-2- 1:1? Nope. OCZ EB can do 260MHz @ 2.5-2-2- ~2.9V and 280MHz @ 3-2-2- ~3.1V. Some like Shamino's can do 300MHz @ 3-2-2- 1:1. Running sync always beats out running async. And benchmarks have shown time and time again that tRCD @ 2 is always more important than CAS @ 2. 2.5-2-2- will beat 2-3-3- everytime, with 2.5-2-2- beating 2-3-2- also.

Now considering BH-5/BH-6 is not in production anymore and sold off at exorbant prices (even though its value is falling), how is it better than OCZ EB? It clocks lower on average, OCZ EB runs the same tight timings (both do tRCD @ 2), and has issues with some A64 mobos? I would choose the OCZ...their sales rep has always been active in tech forums and gained most of the community's trust back a long time ago.

Why would going beyond 250 HTT be useless? I see people lowering their multiplier and running 300 HTT all the time. 300x8 and 300x8.5 is very common and achievable.

EDIT: This is not even mentioning many cases of BH-5/BH-6 that clock like crap...OCZ and Mushkin PCB's are the best IMHO. Too many cases of BH-5/BH-6 compatibility issues and double-sided and 2x512MB issues.
 
Hmm. My BH-6 takes me to 250MHz at 2-2-2-6 at 3.3vdimm. Sucks that XL doesn't care for move voltage, though. The BH-6 is Mushkin, btw.
 
I forgot to add, Corsair XMS-PC3200XLPro can do 2-3-3- timings up to 230-240MHz. Not bad but certainly no BH-5/BH-6 or OCZ EB killer.
 
DaveX said:
I forgot to add, Corsair XMS-PC3200XLPro can do 2-3-3- timings up to 230-240MHz. Not bad but certainly no BH-5/BH-6 or OCZ EB killer.
Click to expand...
You know, that somehow makes me happier that I bought BH-6 two weeks before XL came out. Because if I didn't, I would have jumped on XL, and it's not as good, and more expensive :(.
 
M4d-K10wN said:
You know, that somehow makes me happier that I bought BH-6 two weeks before XL came out. Because if I didn't, I would have jumped on XL, and it's not as good, and more expensive :(.
Click to expand...

I don't think you would have...XL costs way to much...$360 for 2x512MB sub-BH-5/BH-6 performance is just outrageous. I bet 2x512MB Samsung TCCD only costs like $250. Must be the activity LEDs jacking up the price ;)

I'm just glad I got my 2x512MB KHX BH-5 when their PC3000 was still good and cheap at $220 :eek:
 
I've got a silentmaxx 550 PSU on order also. I needed a new one since mine is an antec 350 and the new vid cards will need the power. I've had memory problems before and it was the PSU so we'll see.

I'll continue to play with the 100000000000000000000 motherboard settings the A8V has.

Hopefully they come out with a new bios soon too.
 
I would really think about laxing the timings to maybe 3-3-3-7 and if that works tighten the timings from there.
 
tried 3-3-3-7 still locks....new PSU still locks...I got the graphics error again today....something about the GPU.

I think the mobo just doesn't like the vid card.

Asus released an updated bios to "improve stability" with certain AGP cards, but no joy....still locks.
 
maybe it's just a video card issue. is the heatsink on that 9800 hot to the touch after being on for a long time?
 
yeah it gets too hot to keep my finger on it, but I got a big fan blowing on the whole case now and the temps are like 10 degrees cooler and I can touch everything easily....still locks...I think its the vid card driver or something I need to wait for 4.7 cats I guess.
 
Great posts DaveX.
The highest my Corsair PC3200XLPro will clock to is 231mz. This is holding my FX53 back to 231x12 = 2772. I really wanted to hit 2.8. But one of my modules is failing Prime95 at 2225 timings so I'll probably send them in to be replaced. Your post would explain why many can't get over 2.8 if they're using Corsair PC3200XLPro. And yes, I bought it because of those 2225 timings, but for now I have to run the system at 2336 to be stable in Prime95. But even at 2336 timings, I still can't get over 231mz on the FSB.
 
way to dig up an old thread, and why don't you just increase the multiplier? you do have an fx chip after all.. even though it means you'll have to run the ram slower, it doesn't seem that a64's improve peformance all that much with some extra memory bandwidth. 216x13 (2808mhz) ought to do the trick, plus you can lower the timings back down to 2-2-2-5 and get better latency scores :D
 
whee, check this forum once a month and look what I find ;)

OCZ EB isn't produced anymore so the choice for A64 memory is between Samsung TCCD Rev.F based memory like PQI Turbo PC3200 and OCZ PC3200 Plat. rev2 and Micron mT -5B G based memory, Crucial Ballistix PC3200 and PC4000.

Like eclipse said, running "1:1" (although there really is no such thing as 1:1 on A64 because the memory speed is based off the cpu clockspeed using a divider) doesn't give that much of a performance boost. Running the highest cpu clockspeed you can and 1T with tight timings on the memory really give the best performance.

Lucky you have a S939 because the S754 single-channel memory controller cpu's really dislike oc'ing with 2 sticks in. NoGodForMe, try loosening the timings to 2.5-3-3-10 1T and try to go as far as possible. If you can get beyond 260Mhz that way, it will be better than 2-3-3-6 1T @ 230MHz. Been seeing TCCD ram going to 280MHz @ 2.5-3-3- timings very regularly lately :D
 
with 4 sticks,you might need to use 2T command rate.

Also, just out of curiosity, run sisoft sandra hard drive test. My board was hard locking for some random reason with my hard drive plugged into one of the SATA slots. I changed it to a different slot and it was fine. Would hard lock every time when sisoft probed the drive (yet I got windows installed on it etc.)
 
bored-sarcasm said:
anyway, where is this "supported list?" i would love to check it out so i can make sure i get the right ram.
Click to expand...
You can usually find the supported list of RAM on the manufacturer's website and in the manual that came with your device.

I know there is a chart in my manual for my Asus A8V Deluxe.




I'm probably a little late replying to this but I'm bored tonight and am just roaming the boards reading various posts.
 
I hear everyone talk about the Samsung TCCD memory and all the different companies that make modules that use it. What about Micron? the Ballistix memory they make now, is it any good? I have read a few recent reviews lately and it seems to compete really well. Also when you overclock memory this much doesn't it give memory errors? even if Windows doesn't give them to you doesn't memory testing software show errors from the stress?
 
I have the corsair 3200XLPro and if you look at the tech sheets at their website it states that the tested voltages are 2.75 and for my mobo Abit AV8 the default DDR voltage is 2.65. So try upping the voltage and I would imagine your memory error problem will get alot better
 
I have 4 sticks of Corsair Pro ram and it runs fine with 2xT off!!! It runs dual channel at 200Hz on stock clocks with the v's 2.8. If I put Tx2 on it will not boot! If I just boot up 4 sticks at stock V's and 2xT on it runs at 166Hz. I know this is not the best set-up for OC'g the ram (ie 4 512mb sticks) and if I go back to two sticks there are no problems at all.

At first I played around with the timings and went to 2.5-3-3-6 and the four sticks would run 200hz, but now I am back to 2-2-2-5 with no problems at 200Hz?
 
I'm runnin 2 x 512M Generic no name ram in my A64 2800+ @ 2.3GHz
ALL default voltages
runs 25 degrees idle (Cool 'n Quiet R0x0rz)

MSI K8N Neo Platinum
256x9
3X HT : 166Mem dividor

I think you should try maybe runnin 2 sticks instead of 4 for a bit and see if it helps.. Populating all 4 Slots will make your A64 mem controller very unhappy.

I've had too many issues with Asus motherboards and Video cards to really recommend them anymore. ABit, DFI, MSI (the newer boards at least)

Edit: 3-3-3-10 Ram Timings
I've read that AMD64's like a 10 RAS Precharge
http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.html?i=2036&p=6
 
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