A Farewell from [H] Consumer

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I think the naming of it may have had some negative impact, considering the audience.
I mean, "Consumer" and "Console" just don't appeal to me personally.
However, I do believe combining "Consumer: and "Console" into [H]Gamer would have probably worked out much better. I tend to check out things "Gaming" related, and I don't even game all that much anymore.

Just a thought...

Anyway, take care guys and thanks for the reviews and effort. Best of luck to you all.

-Dwayne Sessom
 
I too will miss your reviews. It's a shame that you couldn't get the support you needed from the integrators. It just goes to show that not enough businesses are interested in producing a quality product and would rather pay to get a positive review than actually have to work and do things right to produce something decent. Good luck!
 
Just a quick thanks. I enjoyed the reviews and used them to get friends and family of my back to build them gaming boxes.
I appreciated all of the good work put in to evaluate the experience.
 
Best of luck. Unfortunately great writing and great coverage doesn't always make a great business model, but you guys had your hearts in the right places. Best of luck.
 
Quite surprised by the absence of the Consumer link on [H] today. Personally, my interest only lie in what the front page showed; there's simply alot of information already. I only noticed the missing link since I wanted to get a comprehensive review of notebooks using the Intel or AMD processor, and I knew [H] wouldn't hold back. I think for me, information overload is the problem, thus I rarely venture/d beyond what I am looking for, or just casual browsing. I believe [H] was really becoming the "Wikipedia" of hardware reviews. Until today. Sigh.

Keep up the forums though. Best there is.
 
DSessom said:
I think the naming of it may have had some negative impact, considering the audience.
I mean, "Consumer" and "Console" just don't appeal to me personally.
However, I do believe combining "Consumer: and "Console" into [H]Gamer would have probably worked out much better. I tend to check out things "Gaming" related, and I don't even game all that much anymore.
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dwayne- back when kyle announced the seperation of console and consumer reviews, this exact point was brought up in another thread. the idea of seperating these out really was a good move. console moved more into the specs of the products and what can be done on the hradware more than just game reviews would have. and the consumer really moved more into what processor or video card really would have been the best value for your mom's computer compared to your little brothers.


ScourggeFX said:
Quite surprised by the absence of the Consumer link on [H] today. Personally, my interest only lie in what the front page showed; there's simply alot of information already. I only noticed the missing link since I wanted to get a comprehensive review of notebooks using the Intel or AMD processor, and I knew [H] wouldn't hold back. I think for me, information overload is the problem, thus I rarely venture/d beyond what I am looking for, or just casual browsing. I believe [H] was really becoming the "Wikipedia" of hardware reviews. Until today. Sigh.

Keep up the forums though. Best there is.
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Scourgge- agreed, agreed, agreed, and agreed. maybe we'll see a [H]ard redesign?
 
Man, too sad.

I have an idea, though. What about opening up about the review process on the forum that you guys typically did, and through the forum we do our own evals? If it is well written and deemed to be informative, then it would make the main page and help by increasing content and driving more users to the [H].

Just saying, maybe making it a community effort will help keep the dream alive.
 
It's sad to hear things didn't work out as planned, unfortunately I'm not totally surprised.

I have been reading [H]ard|OCP several times a day for nearly 10 years now and I never visited [H]Console, nor [H]Consumer unless a review had some funny comment on the frontpage. And then I still only read about the tech support misery and possibly the conclusion as pre built systems aren't of any interest for me, nor anyone I know.

[H]ard|OCP has always been aimed to the dedicated "extreme" enthusiasts so reviews of prebuilt systems really didn't fit that demography regardless how well written they were.

Good luck with future endeavors for all involved.



PS. Kyle, please continue doing what you do best and I will still be a daily visitor in 10 years time. DS.
 
I have to say, i recently came across your site and ill tell you what, the best site i have been to in a long long time. i loved the reviews, very very well done, and i hate to see it leave, but for money reasons, you have the right one to go out on. its a shame that companies would not love to sponsor you . well i just wanted to throw in my 2 cents, and wanted to say thank you for what you guys have done, and was a hell of a good run!
 
mugenese said:
The entire [H] page has been on a steady decline for the last 3 years and your egos have grown far beyond your reality.

Honestly, lets be rational. You were trying to dish reviews of pre-built pc's to your audience who is what...people that build their own systems. What could of possibly gotten into your head to make you think this would work?
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We thought producing quality journalism in an informative and entertaining style would result in people wanting to read it.
Trying to reach a new audience?
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Yes.
Trying to inform consumers who are already well aware of what to expect?
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Most [H]ers build their systems. Some, though, need to recommend computers for a family or friend. [H]Consumer provided them with in-depth knowledge into what to expect from a computer company. The knowledge of which companies have the best support or which software builds slow a computer would help people who usually get roped into supporting family computers figure out which computers would need the least support. That's just one application of why informing consumers - even well informed consumers - is important.
Seriously, just go to any support forum and you could of gotten the same info as your reviews.
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I don't think you would have gotten detailed gaming quality results on a wide variety of games, nor do I think you would have gotten quite so much information about the technical support of these companies. Average article I wrote for HardOCP was around 8,000 words. "Guess-timated" average forum post: 500.
I rarely visit the site now and I'm quite happy to see that this part of it blew up in your face.
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Really. I'm glad our pain has brought you joy.
This site has become nothing more than reviews of hardware that most people will not own until they have a good job,
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Despite six years of Bush administration policies, there are still people out there that do indeed have a good job.
they beg mommy and daddy for it,
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High school students often smarter than the adults they work for find themselves unable to command wages commensurate to their real value. Should they be deprived of an educational and communications tool, mastery of which is required for the best paying jobs?
or it's been a year since the review and the price has fallen considerably
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The New York Times has not fallen into disrepute for having published information on the Iran-Contra scandal, despite the fact that that information is no longer timely. It does, however, provide a record of events.
or news that can be gotten at pretty much any other site involving a pc.
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Those people are called competitors and any company has them. I wonder why you're upset at us for publishing the same news that can be found from other news organizations. I don't think we did - I think we were unique - but I don't get the criticism.
This site used to be about getting the most out of your hardware.
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It still is. But getting the most out of your hardware also deals with the idea of user experience, not just raw numbers. Yes, the Enthusiast side still evaluates motherboards for overclockability - we kept the Consumer stuff seperate. Do you read every section of your newspaper, or are there some sections you skip? Don't blame the Sport section because you get no value from the Home and Garden section.
Now it's about getting most expensive on the market if it passes what you now call your standardized testing.
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Price usually correlates to quality, but not always and I think we've done an excellent job of pointing out when you pay a premium for standard components. Case in point: Alienware computers typically came with good hardware and support that we nevertheless felt was overpriced, and recommended lower priced boutiques.
You've become a schill for the high-end market and never even realized it.
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My first computer evaluation here was for the PC Club Enpower Fuzion. Not exactly a high-end computer.
You'll notice I didn't even bother to mention the console part of the site until now. It was so ridiculously unneeded that I felt this sentence alone would cover it. You are a website about high-end pc parts.
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No. We are a Web site about whatever the owner of the website wants the website to be about. Are you the owner of the Web site?
You've lost why you made the page in the first place. You're so lost in the idea that you have made a difference in the world of how a pc is benchmarked that you forgot those same benchmarks, the reviews of what overclocks the best, and the best cooler to help you get that overclock are what made your page in the first place.
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Has there been any diminishing of those types of evaluations on the Enthusiast page in anything other than a ratio situation? Yes, we branched out, it didn't work. But [H]Consumer didn't take resources or space away from [H]Enthusiast. Anything [H]Consumer brought to the table was something that we added to the site, whether or not you wanted it was irrelevant. No one tells you that you must find all articles on a Web site relevant to your interests. You pick and choose. That's the beauty of freedom.
Flame on [H] fan boys. This is my first post in over a year and I'm sure it will be that long before I bother to post again.
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I'm not given to getting into these sorts of arguments and rarely lose my temper like I am now, but I must say that I wouldn't be disappointed in the least if it is a while before you come back.

Whether or not you found value in [H]Consumer, others did. The program did not diminish you in any way, nor did it subject you to anything against your will. Your enmity of it shows a skewed perspective at best, and your ineffectual commands and meaningless reprimands carry with it the stink of a man who thinks he has far more power over the actions of other people than he actually does.

So here is the question: If you are really this upset over the subsection of a consumer Web site, why? I'm upset because I lost the opportunity to do some amazing work and I'm sad because I was proud of what [H]Consumer did, but what justifies this level of animosity? Why, in vulgar parlance, do you give a toss?

-- Brian Boyko
 
Brian Boyko said:
Whether or not you found value in [H]Consumer, others did.
-- Brian Boyko
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Brian, I found value in the work you guys did and I enjoyed reading each page. I even used your reviews for guiding people who were looking for systems that I did not have the time to provide myself. Thanks for the work and I am sorry to see it didn't work out in the end.
 
Wow...so sorry to hear this. I really loved the reviews and if it wasn't for the reviews, I would still be struggling to find the desktop that fits me. Hope [H]Consumer can be re-opened someday. We are really grateful for what you guys have done for us. Best of luck guys.
 
I, too, am saddened to hear the passing of [H] Consumer. Though I was never in the market for a pre-built system, the articles were always incredibly enjoyable to read and I always looked forward to new ones. There's not much better than coming into work, sitting down with a mug of coffee and reading a new [H] Consumer article (or any other [H] article for that matter). [H] has been my first stop for enthusiast needs for years now but since the coming of [H] Consumer, I find myself rarely straying outside [H] for my tech needs/reading enjoyment.

GG [H] Consumer...you will be missed. It's too bad that you're shut down due to companies pulling out...despite your unique, quality articles whose equal cannot be found anywhere on the 'net.
 
As someone who now has twin sons, I doubt I'll the time to hand build a system for a good long while. I enjoyed reading the reviews as they gave me insights as to where my next system may very well be coming from. Additionally, the laptop reviews were doubly important, because as a scientist I find myself needing portability and graphical power for any number of graphics intense programs. I am very very sad to see it go and hope that [H] occasionally will do one of these reviews.
 
You guys need to talk to consumer reports... maybe sell them some of your review skills.

The computer reviews you have done were the best I have read, with the review of the whole experience of the buy, not just some "I t works, 5 out of 5 whoopie cushion stars!" arbitrary rating.

Good luck in your business ventures, I hope you all learned well from the experience and can take those lessons and ramp up to teh next level.

-Bryan
 
Ahh it sucks to see [H] Consumer go. Without it, I don't think I would have ever heard about quality system builders like Maingear, etc.
 
Any chance you could open the forums or part of the site for people to do their own reviews? [H] could make a template to follow for people to use as guidelines when they make a purchase and testing. [H] then could review the completeness of the documentation and judge the bias level before it is posted. I don’t know if this makes any sense, but if the people are speaking out, Just maybe OEMs and builders will take notice and the advertisers wouldn’t be so gun shy and leave because it’s the people talking and not the [H].?
Just thought anyway
 
Bummer. The articles were little more than entertainment value to me, but back in 2001 when I first found this place, I was at the level of looking for prebuilt systems, then slowly moved into the realm of DIY. (I was most interested in your "System for $500/1000/1500" articles.)

I think you shook things up a bit with your evaluation of overall experience; I recall seeing some e-penis envy from other sites when you switched to that model. (And IMO that's why Mr. Asshat posted that gleeful taunt a couple pages back.) IMO it's a good method of evaluating systems and you guys were nice and strict about it.

I always thought your business model was to get new subscribers with little knowledge via the Consumer/Console section, then build them into DIY'ers... But what do I know.

Gonna miss those articles, sorry it didn't work out. Sucks that doing things 'the right way'--or nearly so--cost you in the long run.
 
I'm really sorry things didn't work out, the [H] Consumer reviews were the only computer reviews that ever seemed worthwhile to me, in the whole industry.
 
Now that you have all this experience in doing the "Consumer Reviews", maybe it could be put towards a consulting venture doing what you were before - reviewing "the experience" of a dealing with a company.

I'm sure that there would be companies that would pay to find out just how they rank - especially if they know that if there was a bad experience, it would be for their eyes only.
 
Wow I wasn't aware of the extent of the problems here, and find it unfortunate that it has to come to this. If anyone deserves success it's all of you guys behind [H], wish you the best and luck with the business. I'm just glad [H] is not going away alltogether, now that would suck!
 
Paul_Johnson said:
Brian, I found value in the work you guys did and I enjoyed reading each page. I even used your reviews for guiding people who were looking for systems that I did not have the time to provide myself. Thanks for the work and I am sorry to see it didn't work out in the end.
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I second (or whatever number we're on) this sentiment. While I knew that personally I would not buy a system off the shelf in the forseeable future, I enjoyed the in depth reads and used them for making recommendations to family and friends as this was the closet to "real world" evaluations I could get without going thousands of dollars into debt myself. And tech support stories are always entertaining when they're someone else's...

Thanks to all for the noble attempt and sticking to your philosophy. Hopefully the spirit will live on at least a bit in some of the more mainstream reviews.
 
I am not sure that I am using the right word, but it is very ``disappointing'' to see you guys go.
 

I am really happy to hear that [H] Consumer and [H]Console are going away. I always thought you guys were selling out by catering to people that werent [H]ard enough. Although I thought you guys did a great job as always, I'm glad that [H]ard OCP is not catering to this demographic anymore.
 
You know after reading this a second time and actually seeing some of the other posts. I finally get it. It looks like it's a downward spiral for review sites, unless they become a shill for the company. Web search engines are the ones taking all the profits from your hard work. Why would a company spend any money on advertising with you when they can spend it with a search provider who directs you to the same articles or for that matter ones the company dictates (the good ones). The only reason a company would do that is if they actually cared, but the fact of the matter is they have to compete, so every dollar in advertising has to be spent as wisely as the guys who don’t care. It makes me not want to use a search engine, but how would I find anything? :confused:

It's almost like you should be getting a cut of the profits if your page is clicked on from a search engine, but it's the other way around.
 
Replicant1911 said:
I am really happy to hear that [H] Consumer and [H]Console are going away. I always thought you guys were selling out by catering to people that werent [H]ard enough. Although I thought you guys did a great job as always, I'm glad that [H]ard OCP is not catering to this demographic anymore.
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That is a bold statement.(no pun intended) I suppose you just woke up one day and became able to put together an unbelievable uber computer,huh?

About three years ago, I was looking for some advice for upgrading my son's computer. Doom 3 was about to be released and I knew his box was weak. I was directed the the [H] and an excellent article comparing video card performance for D3. Well, I went from knowing nothing, to now building every computer in my house,an HTPC, and three folding boxes.
I've been helped along the way by a great bunch of people willing to help me and carry the load.
If the [H] hadnt "catered" to my "demographic" I'd still be trying to figure a lot of stuff out.
Information is powerful. No matter who you are or your level of "expertice".
 
Actually, just for [H] to make public how attentive tech support is with any company, and how it's working incognito was worth it's weight in gold for many a prospective OEM client. As far as a few people here thinking it wasn't hard enough here in general -- well that's total BS IMO as those sections of the forums were and are still there and it hasn't changed. [H]ardocp never was the very most hardcore site anyway there are more than a few very hardcore OC only sites that break down things that [H] usually doesn't, but what [H] brings is the perfect balance of common advanced tech forums and it's blended in ways that your lay or advanced enthusiast can read and understand and enjoy reading for long periods of time.
 
It's sad that you guys couldn't get funding. I thoroughly enjoyed several articles that [H]Consumer had put out and I thought that they were very well written and indepth.

:(
 
Brian Boyko said:
es.Most [H]ers build their systems. Some, though, need to recommend computers for a family or friend. [H]Consumer provided them with in-depth knowledge into what to expect from a computer company. The knowledge of which companies have the best support or which software builds slow a computer would help people who usually get roped into supporting family computers figure out which computers would need the least support.
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This is the key right there. We are a very large minority as nerds ( sorry ) and the main focus of myself reading these evaluations is to recommend systems to the 80% of my family and friends that is not interested in ever opening up the case. They want something that works, and when it doesn't, stellar customer support. This is what will sorely be missed by me, as I have yet to find any site that reviews the customer service side of things as well as [H] Consumer did.

Farewell!
 
Wow.... I was just reading this thread and now I can't believe it.

What's going to happen to all the guys that work there? Will they get new jobs with the [H] or will they need to find new jobs?

When I first came to the [H] two years ago, the first article I read was the Puget Dual Core review. In these two years, I have gone from a guy who thought that Dell was the best and that AGP and PCI-E were the same to a guy who builds PCs and is the school tech guy.

Thanks to [H] Consumer, I bought a Velocity Micro system and have saved thousands of dollars on it than if I had gone with Dell.

When looking back at the systems, I don't want to point fingers, but I feel that the companies that got one review and then ran are partly responsible. I mean, you look at the guys with the most reviews, and they're on these forums posting. You see these one review companies get reviewed, and then the never bother to reply on the forums or provide any feedback. Even the large fucking companies who could afford thousands! Cough* Tier One* Cough*

Course you guys know more than I, but I feel that this sucks. I even found your articles inspiration for my PC review.

http://www.freewebtown.com/dozydagger/text/velocity_micro.html

Sorry to the guys at [H] Consumer for ripping off your review format, keep up the good work!
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I credited you guys and hoped that the reviews continued. Sadly, they haven't.

You guys have done great work. My friends are now more knowledgeable, and they're doing better everyday. They held off on Vista because of the 30 Days thing. One started using Nix because of your 30 Days with Linux.

Good Luck and Thank You. Your work will be missed.
 
Replicant1911 said:
I am really happy to hear that [H] Consumer and [H]Console are going away. I always thought you guys were selling out by catering to people that werent [H]ard enough. Although I thought you guys did a great job as always, I'm glad that [H]ard OCP is not catering to this demographic anymore.
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You're entitled to your opinion, but you're pissing me off. People need to buy computers because if could be simpler, or maybe they just don't have the time because of commitments?
 
Internal Power said:
Any chance you could open the forums or part of the site for people to do their own reviews? [H] could make a template to follow for people to use as guidelines when they make a purchase and testing. [H] then could review the completeness of the documentation and judge the bias level before it is posted. I don’t know if this makes any sense, but if the people are speaking out, Just maybe OEMs and builders will take notice and the advertisers wouldn’t be so gun shy and leave because it’s the people talking and not the [H].?
Just thought anyway
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I believe some of us, including myself, have done reviews in the fashion, but the quality varies and is lacking a lot of the time. (My review was about less than a thousand words, the average [H] review is eight thousand.
 
Sorry to hear, I really only looked at the wiring jobs and tech support sections. I do agree that you guys shook up the review process enough that Anandtech and others have adopted your style. Kudos for that.

To the a-hole telling them to hit the door you're a moron. I can build computers all day, I actually enjoy it. But when a relative asks if I'll build them a computer I tell them a defiant NO. I don't enjoy being tech support. They buy a Dell/HP/etc... and they can call "Bob" from India all day long. The only people I will build for are friends, who I can tell to take a hike if I need to and my immediate family.
 
Love the reviews, loved the writing the thoroughness.... so sorry the businesses you were helping didn't want to help support you.

You almost convinced me to buy a machine from one of these vendors... this from the guy who has built every computer he has owned for about a decade. Certainly got me to recommend these places to friends and family.

Loved the reviews... I read nearly every one of them.

I use firefox adblock extensively, but explicitly whitelist [H] (one of the only sites I whitelist) so my page views will support them.

Sounds like page views weren't the problem here... and I'm sorry that a super high quality business couldn't stay afloat. It's like if you were making ferraris for $1000 each, and no one wanted to buy them....

Good luck to the whole Consumer staff. I hope you find the transition to new positions easy and rewarding.

-Nate
 
not that it hasn't already been said, but thanks for your hard work to trying to make this process work. i'm one of those guys that reads the [H] pretty much everyday and loved reading the system reviews. i'm the type that could fix a system and replace/upgrade something here or there, but i would never build it from ground up. i don't have the time or knowledge for every little detail. so your articles had a big impact on me and my future section for a new badass system (time to upgrade). i've heard about companies i wouldn't otherwise have known, for the good or the bad...i now know of them.

honestly, to me, the companies are all basically making the same thing, but its the differences that [H] finds that made the difference. to be honest, i really counted on the tech help sections the most. knowing a company will be there to help you when something fails or can give you the best advice can make one stand out over another when you're talking about systems that only differ in a couple hundred bucks.

also, i think your reviews have had quite the impact on the companies and general business. i don't know if the reduction in startup bloatware can be credited back to you guys, if not, it should. i'm sure there are other small things too.

i do have one request. any chance you can give one last overall review of all the systems to put all reviews in ONE place? i know it would be hard to compare them all - so i'm not just asking for that, since you're dealing with 2 years worth of hardware, etc. anyway, just a thought.

thanks! ;)
 
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