$675k Verdict Against File Sharing Student Upheld

kbrickley

[H]ardness Supreme
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What happened to unreasonable punishment clause in the constitution.
The constitution doesn't say anything about "unreasonable" ... it says simply "Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted." ... that said, that prohibition is generally targeted at criminal proceedings and not civil ones ... this trial was a civil copyright violation (if they had charged him with a criminal violation he could have received prison time in addition to the fine)
 

dr.kevin

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what a way to fuck up a guy's credit at such a young age. Pin him with a 6 figure judgment when he clearly doesn't have that kind of money.
 

nusse

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what a way to fuck up a guy's credit at such a young age. Pin him with a 6 figure judgment when he clearly doesn't have that kind of money.
well he should be able to just claim bankruptcy and they will never see a dime or at least a very small portion .... I think anyway.

Then for about the next 10 years his credit is boned .. well kinda,I know people that have claimed chapter 13 and in a year they had loans with great interest rates.

Anyway I hope that kid can do that and the music industry sees none of the settlement.
 

teh_chem

[H]ard|Gawd
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well he should be able to just claim bankruptcy and they will never see a dime or at least a very small portion .... I think anyway.

Then for about the next 10 years his credit is boned .. well kinda,I know people that have claimed chapter 13 and in a year they had loans with great interest rates.

Anyway I hope that kid can do that and the music industry sees none of the settlement.
I think bankruptcy law was changed within the last decade or so, where even if someone declares bankruptcy they are still required to pay back a portion of their annual income minus expenses to a court-ordered settlement for a period of a few years. So while these people might never see all of their 675k, this kid is still likely not going to have it easy for a long time.
 
Joined
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I agree that the fines are excessive.

But you know what guys? If you don't like the way the law was applied and think that this was an injustice -- DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Write your congressman. Start an online petition. IIRC, it takes 100,000 signatures (can be done digitally, but it may be more now) to get the White House to respond to a petition.
 

LeninGHOLA

Vladimir Hayt
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They actually asked him for $3500 total in 2003 when this whole episode started ... it was because he declined and decided to fight this that it escalated ... as I said, he did instigate much of this himself ;)
Do not question the law, or the law will kill you.
 

damicatz

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You guys grow up a little.

When you punish a thief you have to punish them for MORE than they actually took such that they realize it was not worth it to break the law. Otherwise what reason do they have not to simply steal as much as they can then only pay back what they are caught with?

Second in most cases the person probably fought something they should have just settled for pennies on the dollar out of court. Don't fight it and drive up the lawer costs etc... If you took it then man up. You start racking up time in court and they keep increasing the costs and you can bet they are going to go after those costs.

Then lets throw in some of the other realities, he only stole 30 songs right? Oh really? I am sure someone who knows how to bit torrent and was caught, was caught on their first ever day using it, right? lol. No he has probably stolen way more than that this is just the 30 songs they could clearly prove after they threw out everything else for various reasons.

Also lay off the jury, a jury does not determine a sentence, it is not their job to decide to free someone from guilt simply because they don't agree with the sentence. Should a juror free a murderer because they don't believe in the death penalty? If you guys seriously think that its up to the jury to do that then go back to the 1900s when jurors would free a white man just because he killed a black man, because that is very much the message you are getting across if you think that a jury should be freeing people simply because of their personal belief on an issue.

Finally don't forget to preorder your PS4 everyone SONY always has you the customers best interest at hand. And unlike MS they are not a money grubbing corporation they don't even care about money ha.
Copying is not stealing. Do try to get this through your head.

Depends on the law. Awards may be pre-determined and the jury may only be allowed to find for or against the plantiff. Normally they would have a say but there's so much copyright law the award portion may have been taken away from them.
Doesn't matter what the state's law says. What matters is the non-aggression principle and the fact that imaginary property violates that principle by creating a a state-conferred benefit that violates people's real property rights. By finding him guilty, the jurors are guilty of an act of aggression against him and should be held accountable. The state's laws are no excuse for the aggression.
 

kbrickley

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Do not question the law, or the law will kill you.
You always have the right to attempt to fight a law ... sometimes it works out for you (Rosa Parks, the recent DOMA thing) ... sometimes it doesn't ... if you want to question the very concept of a copyright in a civil lawsuit you had better be ready for the full wrath of the corporate stakeholders to fall on you ;)
 

TheFlosser

Limp Gawd
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Nov 28, 2012
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This country is all kinds of fucked up, from judgements like this to the imbeciles that condone them. Not surprised to see a few of them posting here at HardOCP.
 

Azhar

Fixing stupid since 1972
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When are you Americans going to take back your country from the ruthless greedy corporations that have hijacked it? Home of the free my ass.:mad:
As soon as people start realizing that the skydaddy's a myth. Corporation hides behind religion promoting their politicians.
 

Qinsp

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As soon as people start realizing that the skydaddy's a myth. Corporation hides behind religion promoting their politicians.
What religion is Sony?

Church of the Latter Day Electronics?
 

Azhar

Fixing stupid since 1972
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Messages
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What religion is Sony?

Church of the Latter Day Electronics?
Whatever the politician's religion is. It's the politicians who sell religion to their voters while corporations line their pockets. If you think they care about babies in a woman's belly I've a bridge to sell you.
 

Qinsp

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Whatever the politician's religion is. It's the politicians who sell religion to their voters while corporations line their pockets. If you think they care about babies in a woman's belly I've a bridge to sell you.
Yeah, we're a real Saudi Arabia here. :rolleyes:

While I agree politicians are scumbags, not sure about the whole religion aspect.

None of the Uber-Religious have had much success in elections.
 

Qinsp

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About babies in women's bellies, this is going to come as a HUGE shock to Liberals, but it's not just Bible thumpers who question whether it's homicide.

Most states consider it homicide when not performed by a doctor, but consider it legal when a doctor does it.

Make up your minds. Is it murder or not?
 

Ducman69

[H]ardForum Junkie
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About babies in women's bellies, this is going to come as a HUGE shock to Liberals, but it's not just Bible thumpers who question whether it's homicide.
I've never heard of an Atheist that has an issue the way the bible-beaters do... ever. Atheists don't generally consider a zygote to be a sentient being, the way religious people ... wait a second, what does this have to do with file sharing again? LOL!
 

pxc

[H]ard as it Gets
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I lol'd. He really stood up for his non-existent rights!
 

Ducman69

[H]ardForum Junkie
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And that's the difference when a cop pulls me over for speeding I say sorry and suck it up
Felatio isn't on the bargaining table to make EVERY problem go away though; not that I'm questioning your success fighting traffic violations.
 

Qinsp

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I've never heard of an Atheist that has an issue the way the bible-beaters do... ever. Atheists don't generally consider a zygote to be a sentient being, the way religious people ... wait a second, what does this have to do with file sharing again? LOL!
You are making generalizations, you can't back up. I suggest you read up on Russian history in the 20th and 21st century.

Would you say that the USSR is was a Bible Thumping gov't?

Abortion laws do have some ties to religion, but it's not exclusive.

You have been mislead for decades. Basically because the Liberal Elite do not think the common American is very smart.
 

LeninGHOLA

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You are making generalizations, you can't back up. I suggest you read up on Russian history in the 20th and 21st century.

Would you say that the USSR is was a Bible Thumping gov't?

Abortion laws do have some ties to religion, but it's not exclusive.

You have been mislead for decades. Basically because the Liberal Elite do not think the common American is very smart.
The Russians have always been Eastern Orthodox, very much so. Even during communism. Just like the majority of Chinese people are Buddhist, even during Mao. The Russian people at no point in their history have had an athiest majority. Not even close.
 

chockomonkey

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If I were him, I'd be looking at moving to India or somewhere in Asia as soon as I graduated. He could pretty easily disappear and live well on what would be a modest income in the US.
Yea if i had something this heavy sitting over my head, i'd definitely get some credit cards, max them out, sell shit for cash and stow it. Then declare bankruptcy and go to one of the many awesome countries around the world where the us dollar can be stretched.

I'd be in Cambodia.
 

kbrickley

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The Russians have always been Eastern Orthodox, very much so. Even during communism. Just like the majority of Chinese people are Buddhist, even during Mao. The Russian people at no point in their history have had an athiest majority. Not even close.
Actually I think the majority of Chinese are more Taoist and Confucianist ... but I digress :)
 

chockomonkey

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Never. As painful as it is to type this the America everyone once knew is dead.
Our last Presidential election confirmed we are a nation of retards. Seriously doubt we could take back a hot dog stand.
I'm curious about the future. There are so many retards in 'murica now, that i imagine even when the gov starts really stepping on us, they'll still not mind. I'm curious if the intelligent will be forced to flee because there are so few of them, or if they will actually have numbers enough to form a rebellion.

I'm guessing the former.

I agree that the fines are excessive.

But you know what guys? If you don't like the way the law was applied and think that this was an injustice -- DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Write your congressman. Start an online petition. IIRC, it takes 100,000 signatures (can be done digitally, but it may be more now) to get the White House to respond to a petition.
There are just too many people who are swayed by mass media and false promises. Not enough people will think. Writing a congressperson will likely fall on deaf ears because they know there are enough retards watching the propaganda on TV that they'll keep their seat anyway.

File sharing is abortion. You heard it at the [H] first.
Sweet Grandmother's Spatula!!
 

buttons

[H]ard|Gawd
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with services like spotify and pandora i see no need to buy music, even so $1 a song is a lot better then $15 for a cd with 14 crappy songs and one good song we use to pay when i was in school. I highly doubt he caused $675,000 in damages. Most people that download music have no intention of buying it even if they couldnt download it.

I think the penalty he was sentenced is absurd unless he is insanely rich. After all it should be punishment but not to the point where would would rather skip the country or commit suicide.
 

sir-gold

Gawd
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Jan 19, 2006
Messages
931
If I was facing that kind of charge, I would turn every Sony office in the US into the end-scene from fight club.

$675k buys a lot of C4...
 

vasta

Gawd
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Sep 14, 2004
Messages
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the fact you can go out -- get drunk -- and plow into a family van filled with kids, killing a few of them, and get LESS of a harsh sentence, says a lot about how messed up this country is.

I could rob a bank, shoot someone in the legs, take 50,000 dollars in cash, and have less of an overall life impact than this judgement.
I know a guy who got hammered, drove drunk and killed a cop and dragged him for a block and got 10 years, probably gonna get out in 7

On an unrelated note

What's more amazing then the fine is the fact that this guy managed to find 30 songs to download these days, unless the music he downloaded wasn't from the last 15? years
 

rudy

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I know a guy who got hammered, drove drunk and killed a cop and dragged him for a block and got 10 years, probably gonna get out in 7

On an unrelated note

What's more amazing then the fine is the fact that this guy managed to find 30 songs to download these days, unless the music he downloaded wasn't from the last 15? years
So you would rather go to jail for 10 years then pay a fine? I don't get how you guys are comparing strait up jail time to fines. I guess you have absolutely no value for your life. A huge fine simply means you will have your paychecks garnished for the rest of your life, you probably wont ever actually pay it off. But going to jail, you cant ever get that time back.
 
Joined
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I've never heard of an Atheist that has an issue the way the bible-beaters do... ever. Atheists don't generally consider a zygote to be a sentient being, the way religious people ... wait a second, what does this have to do with file sharing again? LOL!

As a hardcore agnostic, I would disagree. Most athiests/agnostics agree with me on this one.

I don't think abortion is the right choice, in almost any situation, and it's not a choice I would ever make. (Thank god I'm a guy, right)

But guess what?

I DON'T HAVE THE RIGHT TO TELL EVERYONE ELSE THAT.

That's the core of Pro-choice. I don't have the right to tell someone else how to live there lives.

Bible-thumpers and pro-lifers, feel they do. They are allowed to be wrong. They do not have the right to tell anyone else how to live their lives either. They just keep trying to change the laws until they have.

Just because they might have the power to change the laws, does not mean they have the right to do so.
 

Qinsp

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The Russians have always been Eastern Orthodox, very much so. Even during communism. Just like the majority of Chinese people are Buddhist, even during Mao. The Russian people at no point in their history have had an athiest majority. Not even close.
Russia banned abortions due to low birthrate. Not the Church. China encouraged abortion due to high birthrate, Not the Atheists.
 
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