40 inch RGB panel, with NO PWM and little input lag #4K

iBurgerr

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I'm throwing it out there in the crowd.

Question: Is there any 40 inch panel (Korean / or not) which is 40 inch RGB, with no PWM issues and no serious input lag?

I'm looking for a 4K monitor which I can use for a long time. I will be spending long hours behind the screen, mostly for work. So it needs to be really easy on the eyes. I'm also looking for RGB since that is the only type that OSX can handle properly.

Monitors which didn't make the cut:

1. Mango Wasabi UHD400 (RGB Yes, but Jann from teksyndicate reports 50 ms input lag)
2. AMH A409 (RGB, but bad input lag according gmoney from teksyndicate)
3. Wasabi Zen U400 (BGR)
4. Phillips Garbage (PWM issues and BGR, best of both worlds.. ahem).
5. ...

I have spent much time on this topic but I am open to all suggestions. Much appreciated.
 
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Nothing available right now. Maybe in 2017? You and many others are looking for the same thing. Good luck.
 
Why does it have to have an RGB pixel layout? So long as the pixels aren't staggered RGB or BGR shouldn't matter...
 
I believe it is because he is using OSX and not Windows. Windows will handle alternate pixel arrangements while OSX does not seem to.
 
Lender: that's correct. Apple cannot handle anti-aliasing text on BGR screens. It really expects RGB.

This summer is bad, last summer was great ! I have AMH 399 and 409 and they are fantastic; unfortunately, this years crop is not that amazing ~!
This is really too bad, these screens are productivity assets and super gaming, when you get a good one, or the productions are made with left overs from previous runs..........(IMO)
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^ I agree with this. It seems to be a really bad time to be buying a 40 inch panel.
 
You're not alone. After weeks of reading I finally upgraded, and yes, I say upgraded, to a UHD400 from a U3415W. No complaints at the price they ask. Flicker doesn't bother me, basically non-existent with the brightness set at my preferred level. Input lag is on par with the Dell. I have no scientific measurements, but I can't notice a difference in that regard, so I'm happy. Think I'm content until OLED arrives in force.. or we get a decent 38-42" 4K IPS w/ GSync.
 
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I believe it is because he is using OSX and not Windows. Windows will handle alternate pixel arrangements while OSX does not seem to.

Amazing that OSX doesn't have a facility to adjust sub pixel font rendering for alternate pixel arrangements. But in my research there are options.

The easiest is just to completely disable sub pixel font rendering (OSX refers to it as font smoothing) which makes very little difference on 4k displays anyway. Believe it or not we all got along just fine without it before it was enabled by default in Windows Vista. (It was available in XP but turned off by default)

And another rather silly solution if you absolutely wanted font smoothing in OSX on a BGR pixel arrangement would be to physically flip the display upside down and then flip the output in the control panel in OSX 180 degrees. Yes, it really does work lol.

But I guess I'm just rambling LOL, the OP wants what he wants! :)
 
NoxTek:
Thanks for the reply: flipping the monitor is indeed an option :). This perhaps makes a monitor like the Wasabi Mango UHD 430 (flipped) a serious contender. I have to read a little bit more about the implications of this. It just seems wrong to me, at first thought. Why would a manufacturer not flip the panel themselves? What was the consideration for them to go BGR in the first place; if it's just a simple FLIP and you have RGB. (?)

The monitors we are looking at have a dpi of about 100-110 (40"-43"). Although you could indeed turn off font smoothing, I think it'd become annoying rather quickly, after having spent years with it turned on. Also, you'd feel like a sad panda, if come August there'd be a proper panel on the market and you missed your chance.
 
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If not gaming the 40"+ 4ks are wicked productivity panels.

Issue is two main ones have burn in (FFS) and the rest have lag or no free sync or whatever.

Total shithouse of a market.

3415 is a good panel indeed!
 
Though Windows has the capability to use clear type to fine tune to make up for the BGR layout, not all software will respect it and still run RGB inside of Windows. I was just considering one of these large panels, but like people are saying, it's a horrible time to buy them for actual desktop use. Watching movies and tv should be okay.
 
I use the crossover 404k and I have no issues, but then again I have a higly specific use-case. Input lag could be better...
 
@everybody:

I just turned the Dell u2713hm screen 90 degrees and entered productivity heaven. I'm very surprised by this because I thought I really needed a larger screen. I have to say; your mileage may vary. I spend a lot of time in Google Chrome and reading stuff.

NoxTek, thanks for pointing me towards the flipping thing. Font smoothing indeed seems rather useless. I assume OSX turns it off when you rotate the screen 90 degrees.
 
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I had to add one more thing; if you are on OSX, running a 40" inch screen will allow you to divvy up the screen in half with the new split screen option. (yes, inspired by windows). It must be really good. So I'm still considering the 40 inch after all. Apple: please give us 3-way split, with 3 windows. (left-mid-right). That'd be truly awesome.

KazeoHin : interesting. Did you ever experience PWM? And is it RGB or BGR? (Lagom test) Thanks!!
 
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Honestly, I'll be happy with any 40"-43" that is RGB, 4:4:4, and PWM Free. Input lag is not really a "big" concern in my boat since I won't use it for serious gaming. Gaming on smaller screens is much more comfortable for me. I just want something more for productivity and my workstation setup. I'm having trouble finding panels that are RGB "and" PWM free. A lot of the times these companies will advertise flicker free, but that can mean a number of things. They could use hybrid dimming, or high cycle of PWM frequency, or DC dimming which is the only one I'm after.
 
NoxTek, thanks for pointing me towards the flipping thing. Font smoothing indeed seems rather useless. I assume OSX turns it off when you rotate the screen 90 degrees.

Honestly being an 'old fart' I can remember when ClearType (sub pixel font rendering) was brand new and a lot of us old guys thought things looked better with it turned off. On a 4K display ClearType is not nearly as noticeable an effect as it is on a 1080p display. The whole point of SPFR is to smooth out the edges of fonts on a display with large and visible pixels - the higher the resolution display the less effect it has.

And again this is something that has absolutely no other effect on anything else - just text in the user interface (be it Windows or OSX or whatever)...
 
Just got my WM UHD430 set up.

Huge, no PWM, and contrary to someone's assertion that they have input lag I notice zero.

Awesome monitor, at first I thought I should have gotten the UHD490 and then I put the 43" on my desk. It's gigantic.
 
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CCLMD.

That is great news. I'm very happy for you. It is very nice screen -- i have seen the pictures and reviews. Unforutantely it is a BGR screen, and I'm hesistant about it. I could perhaps rotate it 180 degrees, but then I need a monitor arm. (BGR flipped becomes RGB).

The bigger the screen, the lower the dpi. The UHD430 has about ~100 dpi. So font smoothing starts to matter again.

Difficult choices. But good stuff anyway. The UHD430 is a good screen for many people i think.
 
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Sorry for my imprecise language. I'm not sure if they are the same. I haven't looked into anymore because they are BGR. If I had to buy a screen right now, it'd be your UHD430.
 
Buying BGR monitor knowingly to flip it is like... WTF?
It is ok-ish solution when realizing it is BGR after it was already bought and we cannot easily return it but deliberately getting such engineering turd is at least improper. Imho.

BTW. OSX and Windows always used completely different font rendering engines and it is not only some minor differences like how M$ tweaked and improved Cleartype over the years but massive difference in philosophy of font rendering so it is really like comparing apples with oranges.

BTW. From technical standpoint changing RGB to BGR and BGR to RGB in monitors electronics means adding one frame of input lag because of frame is sent basically from top to bottom and displayed from bottom to top meaning it need to be stored in memory first. At least if panel itself doesn't have option to just work in reverse in which case it would not add input lag. In any case it is BGR so it is bad monitor and no one should buy it.
 
I've been looking at new laptops these past few days, it's insane that we have 3200x1800 displays at 13", even 4k at 5" (Sony Xperia Z5 Premium) and we can't get a decent resolution RGB, pwm free panel at 37-40".
 
I've been looking at new laptops these past few days, it's insane that we have 3200x1800 displays at 13", even 4k at 5" (Sony Xperia Z5 Premium) and we can't get a decent resolution RGB, pwm free panel at 37-40".

That's because whether you're making a tiny phone screen or TV, the process is the same. The larger the surface the greater the risk of bad spots rendering the whole panel non-viable. So for one defective unsellable 40" panel, that could be 30/40 usable mobile phone screens.

But yeah, I hear you; halfway through 2016 and we're all still waiting for a screen that ticks these fucking basic boxes. All the while we continue to see pathetically pointless 24" 4K screens coming out left right and centre...
 
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