4 Dead - 11 Wounded at Jacksonville FL Video Game Tournament

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NukeDukem said:
You don't get horrendous mass murders by seemingly normal people? I call BS. Yes, you do not have shootings on the same level, but you are also unarmed sheep who will do what your unelected Government in Brussels tells you to do. You have no ability to defend yourselves from either tyrannical governments or drugged up criminals.

Fact is the only way to disarm America is for the POTUS to declare Martial Law, and have government foot soldiers go on door-to-door searches of every private home to confiscate the 300+ million guns that already exist. Not going to happen, because here in America we value liberty and personal property rights.

A country is only as good as the people who live in it, and both the US and Europe have to face that fact. We are not going to LEGISLATE our way out of the problems we face.
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well the roll back on the declared mentally ill being able to buy firearms again aint helping
 
prava said:
Fact is that we don't get horrendous mass murders by seemingly normal people. We do have (unfortunately) terrorist attacks, but school shootings? We barely have any.
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I think Australia is an interesting case. Minimal gang violence, tight immigration and a very low homicide rate overall. Wealthy country to and people seem to be happy overall. Yet the rate of mass murder and the casualty counts are very high even when they don't use firearms. The few criminal gangs seem to have no problem manufacturing their own firearms there (you can Google it) and the average Australian that decides to go on a murder spree seems to have little difficultly racking up multiple deaths when they don't use firearms. Haven't checked as of late, but I recall the rate of mass murder in Australia when adjusted per capita was not too far off from California. And California is rather high when it comes to homicide rate per state.

To me this says the laws Australia have implemented have been ineffective. People can still get away with massive casualties without a firearm, and the big gangs & terrorists don't seem to have a problem manufacturing or stealing firearms. In general this seems to apply to most European countries as well.

prava said:
Very, very sad. Yes, the root cause is that teenagers are going nuts for some reason. Putting more or less guns won't change that fact. Putting more or less security into a school won't change that fact.
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I hate to be that guy, but you should do some basic research. The majority or mass shooters aren't teenagers.
 
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faugusztin said:
As a non-American, i have a question. When is not too soon to start talking about gun control ?
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What most people push as gun control mainly applies to law abiding people who are not the problem.
The bad guys that go around shooting others would still have guns.

Real gun control would mainly go after the criminal use of guns, while protecting law abiding gun owners.

How about this?

Use a gun in the commission of a crime and 10 years are added to your jail sentence. 2nd time you use a gun during a crime, we add 20 years.
Use a gun during a crime and someone dies, even if you didn't pull the trigger, it's an automatic death penalty.

Use a gun to defend yourself or someone else, and you are protected by the law.
 
SighTurtle said:
Let me first say, I don't live in Jacksonville, and I've never been so I may be wrong about what I'm about to say.
The venue was in a mall, the Jacksonville Landing, at a gaming-themed bar that apparently shared a space with a pizza parlor. This wasn't a big convention hall, or a big event, or anything like that, looking at pictures from the bar's google maps page, it looks like a nice cozy place to play games and drink. I wouldn't expect security and a place like this. Maybe the mall has security or law enforcement patrolling, but thats about it for security measures. I wouldn't expect searching of bags either at the pizza place or the entrance to the mall, which seems to be open-air.





Look, thinking about what the venue looks like, considering the info at hand, I don't think considerations about gun-free zones, and whether or not they work or if a citizen was armed in the place would have changed the outcome, cause I think this occurred at close-range, in a very crowded place, like i dunno. Obviously, I could very wrong about I've said, but time will tell.
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I work in Jacksonville. The landing is located very close to a high crime area and has experienced enough crime that most people avoid the area. My first reaction was this the work of the gang bangers. I'm not surprised that the shooter was the product of a NE school system and was a delicate snowflake unable to handle the stress of competition.
 
We have too many people unable to cope with minor loss and failure. Then there's all the people that pick on and make fun of people that lose and fail. Then we get these traumatic events but should we really be so surprised?

We as adults need to hold ourselves to a higher standard with our behavior and raise tougher children that are allowed to fail and learn how to cope with it. We also need to stop being dicks to each other then scratching our head when people snap.
 
KamelRed said:
Saw a Madden tournament video from 2017 that had the supposed shooter competing. Dude looked like a slightly higher functioning Adam Lanza...
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the Jacksonville shooter looks like Lanza's twin brother...

Kr5KKBG.jpg
 
just went to Fox News, it says 2 dead not 4 ??? but what caught my attention was the ad banner above the headline ... auto ads know no mercy (I removed the name of the company from the banner)

wow.jpg
 
Wow so terrible and senseless. How do people's minds get so far distorted towards doing something like this without friends or family noticing there's something off mentally before one of these happens? I have friends in Jacksonville. Was glad to find out they are ok. I love playing Madden with my brother. Things can get heated and frustrating at times (although always in good fun), but the thought of hurting someone over a video game is nothing short of insane.
 
nutzo said:
How about this?

Use a gun in the commission of a crime and 10 years are added to your jail sentence. 2nd time you use a gun during a crime, we add 20 years.
Use a gun during a crime and someone dies, even if you didn't pull the trigger, it's an automatic death penalty.
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I don't think that would do much to deter spree killers like this guy who shoot up everyone, then themselves.
 
This is really sad. Though an interesting time in which we live that the event was captured more or less live - you can hear the shots, the people scrambling in terror, and if I'm correct what seems to a red dot targeting laser before everything goes to hell. I would not recommend watching/listening unless you take some time to think about it beforehand. I wish all those affected the best.

As for the shooter, we'll never really know the issue given that the reports seem he took his own life at the end of the rampage. I am unsure if it would be considered impulsive or a planned attack but in any event it is regrettable. From what has been reported thus far it seems like losing a game or something related to it was the launching platform of sorts for the tragedy, powered by what is assuredly an anger or coping problem.

I'll leave aside most of the politically linked topics at Kyle's request, but I do think that one thing that (hopefully) everyone can get behind is that we should prepare for yet another major discussion about "gaming and violence", regrettably. Both from those well meaning and those exploiting clickbait orwho try to use it as a political springboard etc... once again video games are going to be foist into the frontlines. If this regrettable shooting or other act of violence would have happened over a bar bet, or even at an actual football game there would be relatively little discussion about "the violence of football as a culture is responsible". In fact, tons of violent actions come from attendees at sporting events or something related but rarely is there an indictment of the entire sport culture/governing body... yet when it comes to something like video games every unfortunate event - rare as they are - is somehow seen as linked to and perhaps in some way caused by the hobby itself. I really hope this will stop soon, but am bracing myself to see those within and outside the community alike taking all different kinds of angles discussing the event in relation to the hobby, as opposed to just a horrible series of events that could have happened anywhere else a person felt that they lost and were humiliated, taking out their frustration violently on those around them and finally themselves.

Edit: I would also ask to please not repost the name of the shooter and/or his picture. There seems to be evidence suggesting "copycat or spreading/clustered" events come from the "fame" of things like mass violence, so when someone potentially unstable sees the name and image of a shooter plastered all over the news, the Internet etc... it becomes a possible contributing factor towards violent action of their own, thinking they will "make their mark / beat the score and be famous forever".
 
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Nanan said:
Well get rid of that segment of the population and the murder rate would drop by some 80%.
How do we do this?
Step 1) Legalize all drugs and prostitution and tax them like alcohol and tobacco.
Step 2) Do away with congressional districts and implement single voting districts per population center. (remove garymandering)
Step 3) Distribute educational spending evenly, making all schools a safe place, metal detectors, security etc.
Step 4) Universal single payer healthcare that includes mental health and drug addiction treatment.
Step 5) Create a path to citizenship system for all illegal immigrants, grats your in for the next 3 years, fuck up and you are out forever. Remove all standing anchor sytems, children born etc. being born here does not make you a citizen, the USA is the only country with this rule.
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You have good intentions, you just can't stomach to reality of things. No to 4 & 5 for obvious reasons.
 
SpeedyVV said:
I actually agree with you.

This culture is what has made me always prefer America and Americans. More so than any other culture including my own.

Politics aside, meaning NOT politics! Something is seeping into your culture that I feel is cancerous. ie, it is killing your amazing Spirit.

I pray that you guys figure it out soon enough.
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We've already figured it out, its the execution of fixing it that is a challenge. The more deluded people think any political option (or incessant political complaining/opining) will lead to a solution the more unlikely its going to be solved. If you want a solution - YOU need to be the change that you want to believe in.
Want to solve the problem - have strong interactive families, teach real values, morality, never cater to the "everybody wins"/participation trophy lie, recognize that loss is a valid result and kids should be allowed to feel it and learn how to deal with it. Emphasis connection with people rather than devices (social media). Constructive dialogue and therapy can be helped with highly controlled/moderated applications of pharmaceuticals, however pharmaceuticals with highly limited dialogue and therapy will NEVER WORK and was never the original impetus for the drugs to begin with... (the drugs were ALWAYS intended from the beginning to merely support/assist real human to human therapy).
 
Video footage from last year shows the Jacksonville shooting suspect David Katz gaming it up and talking trash at a Bills-sponsored Madden tournament in Buffalo---- which he managed to win, despite being a 7th seed...

* timestamped the video to show the interview...

 
faugusztin said:
As a non-American, i have a question. When is not too soon to start talking about gun control ?
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There is "gun control".

Hey, look at Chicago... one of the most regulated places in the US. The shootings there are through the roof.

I bet if a lot of people were packing guns at that event, the shooter would have gotten maybe 1-2 shots off before being dropped.
 
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cyclone3d said:
There is "gun control".

Hey, look at Chicago... one of the most regulated places in the US. The shootings there are through the roof.

I bet if a lot of people were packing guns at that event, the shooter would have gotten maybe 1-2 shots off before being dropped.
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The only people that should be carrying guns at events like that are hired security personal. Outside of the extremely high risk of security or police mistaking an armed citizen for the killer, what happens if a bunch of people draw guns and all fire them at where they think the shooting is coming from? Also, those shots came so fast that most of them would have been done before anyone could draw a weapon, take aim, and fire, you vastly overestimate human reaction time.
 
Krenum said:
We can be assured that someones ass is going to be in the fire over this. I mean, not having security at a large event is just asking for trouble. And to me seems ridiculous. We don't live in that type of world anymore were we can just throw caution to the wind and expect everyone to play nice.

Was this an EA sponsored event?
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This was a smaller event inside of a mall. Around 100 people (watching and playing) so they probably didn't have the same level of security they would have at larger events. I believe it was sponsored as whoever won here next would be going to Vegas for the finals.
 
Krenum said:
"gun free zones" lol. This is Florida we're talking about here.
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Actually, as the article states, the vast preponderance of licensed concealed carry citizens obey the laws...ESPECIALLY laws about firearms. If a place says firearms are banned, you're not gonna find a licensed carry with his/her firearm there.

Shrug to the rest. Not gonna bog down this thread.
 
Derangel said:
The only people that should be carrying guns at events like that are hired security personal. Outside of the extremely high risk of security or police mistaking an armed citizen for the killer, what happens if a bunch of people draw guns and all fire them at where they think the shooting is coming from? Also, those shots came so fast that most of them would have been done before anyone could draw a weapon, take aim, and fire, you vastly overestimate human reaction time.
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The only people that should be carrying guns at events like that are everyone with the capacity and responsibility for firearm ownership. If this sack of shit would have thought everyone in the room would have had a gun, this wouldn't have happened. He'd have never walked back in there.
 
Knurrus said:
In Europe we have had decades of terrorist attacks committed by trained and ideological/religious persons, which we combat without giving up our freedoms.

What we do not have is an epidemic of pissed off adolescents committing mass murders, or men killing preschool children.
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There is no “epidemic”. Most American schools are as safe as they have ever been.
 
The_Capulet said:
The only people that should be carrying guns at events like that are everyone with the capacity and responsibility for firearm ownership. If this sack of shit would have thought everyone in the room would have had a gun, this wouldn't have happened. He'd have never walked back in there.
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He killed himself, so I think his objective was to inflict as much damage upon his targets, not seeking to live another day.
 
Knurrus said:
Thank you for agreeing with me. Does that mean that you even agree to restrict the availability of weapons, or you just dandy with "criminals & crazy people" having easy access to weapons?
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You cannot prevent people from having access to guns. It is not possible.
 
SighTurtle said:
He killed himself, so I think his objective was to inflict as much damage upon his targets, not seeking to live another day.
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It's not an issue of his will to keep on living. But rather the obvious thought that he's going to die as soon as he draws, and accomplish nothing.
 
harmattan said:
Huh. I'm an America who's lived in Europe (both as a civilian and otherwise) on and off for 20 years. Most Europeans have just as many, if not more, protected freedoms and rights as Americans.

They also have isolated violence and terrorist attacks like the US, the main difference being firearms are in the hands of the law only and are extremely regimented.

There were more people murdered in Illinois last year than there were in all of England. It's not splitting atoms to figure out why.
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Not if you throw out Chicago. It’s not splitting atoms to figure out why.
 
These mass shootings seem to happen in more frequency and deaths lately. When will these tragedies end? No one can live life looking over their shoulders, which the survivors will be doing for the rest of their lives. They will have to deal with the PTSD and others issues from this as well.

Not to mention the families that suffered their relatives death. It just doesn't make any sense... :(
 
The_Capulet said:
The only people that should be carrying guns at events like that are everyone with the capacity and responsibility for firearm ownership. If this sack of shit would have thought everyone in the room would have had a gun, this wouldn't have happened. He'd have never walked back in there.
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Bullshit. You are trying to subscribe rational thought to an irrational mind. A person that does stuff like that is not thinking rationally. By the way, unless someone is actually trained to handle themselves in panic situations (police, military, etc) they are just as, if not more so, likely to be a liability than a help. I know all you responsible gun owners in this thread would love to believe you're Billy Baddass in these situations, but you aren't. Some random dude pulling a gun is going to cause more panic and imagine some random dude with a gun panicking themselves. There is a reason that in most of the stories involving civilian heroes with guns taking out shooters the hero is ex-military, ex-police, or somehow highly trained and skilled beyond your average gun owner. Being a responsible gun owner does not make you a hero nor capable of taking out a lunatic in a panic situation.
 
tetris42 said:
I don't think that would do much to deter spree killers like this guy who shoot up everyone, then themselves.
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Crazy people will do crazy things, and there's not much you can do about it in a free society.
However, the number of casualties in many of these shooting would be less if there were more responsible, armed people out there who could stop them.

In some of these cases, people committing these shooting shouldn't have had access to guns due to mental health issues or complaints files against them.
Various government agencies dropped the ball or didn't forward reports that would have caused investigations likely leading to guns being removed from their possession.
 
The_Capulet said:
The only people that should be carrying guns at events like that are everyone with the capacity and responsibility for firearm ownership. If this sack of shit would have thought everyone in the room would have had a gun, this wouldn't have happened. He'd have never walked back in there.
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In my hypothetical he was suicidal, and would have gone back in.
 
nutzo said:
What most people push as gun control mainly applies to law abiding people who are not the problem.
The bad guys that go around shooting others would still have guns.

Real gun control would mainly go after the criminal use of guns, while protecting law abiding gun owners.
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Maybe not so much, I hear this argument every single time there's even talk of any sort of gun control. Sure there's the "true" criminal element that would get their guns black market etc etc. Then there's the "snap" shootings where someone just loses their shit, goes home gets their legally purchased gun(s) because prior to that point they were said law abiding gun owner, and goes crazy at a mall or something. I mean I'm not trying to pick a fight here at all, but of all the mass shootings how many of those people were "law abiding gun owners" before they turned into mass murderers? Typically "criminals" are not the ones to go on mass shootings like this, which I agree is what the talks of "gun control" tend to revolve around, some criminal shoots someone during a robbery or something all the time, no one talks gun control then because in that case it would largely be ineffective, however would the Columbine boys be the types to go driving into the inner city of Denver to try and buy some black market guns? Largely a rhetorical question, but one to think about, if the answer to that is "no, they most definitely would not have done that" then Columbine doesn't happen because of "gun control"

Also the levels of progressively more punishment for using guns, again only punish "criminals" not the ones who do stuff like this and commit suicide during.
 
That said, was this guy someone who was competing and just had the ultimate in rage quit? Or was the guy not related to the event at all?
 
Krenum said:
You have good intentions, you just can't stomach to reality of things. No to 4 & 5 for obvious reasons.
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No to #4 especially. I don't want to have 30%+ tax on my paycheck to pay other peoples health care.
 
You say that, and yet you don't know the all people you are talking about. People in my family have CWPs and i know they would be able to handle themselves. Just because you think they can't doesn't mean they can't. If someone with a CWP was really scared, then they can run with their gun. It doesn't mean they have to use it.

You know people who probably can't. There are people who can. In America, you need the FREEDOM to decide for yourself. Gun free zones take that freedom away.
 
Derangel said:
Bullshit. You are trying to subscribe rational thought to an irrational mind. A person that does stuff like that is not thinking rationally. By the way, unless someone is actually trained to handle themselves in panic situations (police, military, etc) they are just as, if not more so, likely to be a liability than a help. I know all you responsible gun owners in this thread would love to believe you're Billy Baddass in these situations, but you aren't. Some random dude pulling a gun is going to cause more panic and imagine some random dude with a gun panicking themselves. There is a reason that in most of the stories involving civilian heroes with guns taking out shooters the hero is ex-military, ex-police, or somehow highly trained and skilled beyond your average gun owner. Being a responsible gun owner does not make you a hero nor capable of taking out a lunatic in a panic situation.
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Being armed increases likelyhood you can fire back. Also, in my hypothetical only one other guy has a gun, and he was able to shoot the bad guys gun hand. Don’t tell me that wouldn’t happen. It’s my hypothetical and i can tailor it to support any political position i want.
 
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