3DVision is the real deal (sharing my experience)

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Matrices

Supreme [H]ardness
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A few weeks ago, I bought an XPS 17. Since adding a 3D screen was a nominal cost given all the coupons floating around, I decided to add it, not really expecting much. I played it over the weekend and was pleasantly surprised with how great it was, even with just a mid-range mobile part.

So couple days ago I bought the 27" Acer 3D monitor and paired it with a new GTX 580 to give this a proper go in a desktop environment.

The overall effect is simply amazing. Whereas most 3D movies rely on gimmicks and pop-out tricks, 3DVision renders games with depth as well as extrusion, if you're willing to tweak the settings. So while there are a few impressive moments, the best thing is the subtle, accumulative impact of having objects "look" more like they do in the real world - i.e., appearing relative to everything else.

Games I tried: L4D2, Just Cause 2, Trine, Bad Company 2, Starcraft 2, Portal 2. Portal 2 was the one game that was annoying to play on this monitor in 3D due to crosstalk (doubling of image), but everything else was very playable and pleasant to look at. You could reduce contrast and maybe frequency to further reduce crosstalk, but it was already minor to irrelevant, especially once you calibrated depth and convergence.

It's pretty difficult to put the experience into words without resorting to superlatives. Trine, which already looks great, felt magical. Just Cause 2, another looker, just blew my mind whether I opted for a depth-heavy or convergence (pop-out)-heavy setting. Bad Company 2 was more visceral and exciting. Starcraft 2 was nice with the extra depth, but it's all the nice touches with smoke and particle effect that I really appreciated.

To be clear, this tech just doesn't work for some people because some eyes are more prone to fatigue or seeing flicker; not sure what specifically about one's eyes makes that happen. I started out with a depth setting of 30 to 40% but I was fine with near 100% after a few days, and then I opted for a mix of depth and convergence. No headaches or dizziness. The glasses are light and unobtrusive, though you can't wear them *and* have studio-style headphones sitting properly on your ears, which is a little annoying.

Personally though, it's a revelation in gaming. Much more immersive than my other immersive gaming experiences: Surround/Eyefinity monitors, a 30" monitor, or a 54" TV.
 
Matrices said:
A few weeks ago, I bought an XPS 17. Since adding a 3D screen was a nominal cost given all the coupons floating around, I decided to add it, not really expecting much. I played it over the weekend and was pleasantly surprised with how great it was, even with just a mid-range mobile part.

So couple days ago I bought the 27" Acer 3D monitor and paired it with a new GTX 580 to give this a proper go in a desktop environment.

The overall effect is simply amazing. Whereas most 3D movies rely on gimmicks and pop-out tricks, 3DVision renders games with depth as well as extrusion, if you're willing to tweak the settings. So while there are a few impressive moments, the best thing is the subtle, accumulative impact of having objects "look" more like they do in the real world - i.e., appearing relative to everything else.

Games I tried: L4D2, Just Cause 2, Trine, Bad Company 2, Starcraft 2, Portal 2. Portal 2 was the one game that was annoying to play on this monitor in 3D due to crosstalk (doubling of image), but everything else was very playable and pleasant to look at. You could reduce contrast and maybe frequency to further reduce crosstalk, but it was already minor to irrelevant, especially once you calibrated depth and convergence.

It's pretty difficult to put the experience into words without resorting to superlatives. Trine, which already looks great, felt magical. Just Cause 2, another looker, just blew my mind whether I opted for a depth-heavy or convergence (pop-out)-heavy setting. Bad Company 2 was more visceral and exciting. Starcraft 2 was nice with the extra depth, but it's all the nice touches with smoke and particle effect that I really appreciated.

To be clear, this tech just doesn't work for some people because some eyes are more prone to fatigue or seeing flicker; not sure what specifically about one's eyes makes that happen. I started out with a depth setting of 30 to 40% but I was fine with near 100% after a few days, and then I opted for a mix of depth and convergence. No headaches or dizziness. The glasses are light and unobtrusive, though you can't wear them *and* have studio-style headphones sitting properly on your ears, which is a little annoying.

Personally though, it's a revelation in gaming. Much more immersive than my other immersive experience: Surround/Eyefinity monitors, a 30" monitor, or a 54" TV.
Click to expand...

http://www.hardocp.com/news/2011/05/05/mit_developing_glassesfree_3d

Should of waited
 
Glad to hear you like it, i'd be interested to see how often you use it after a say a year or even 6 months.

like any iteration of 3d gaming (i was the same as you when i first tried it with the Geforce 256) it was a novelty and seemed amazing for a while but after the novelty wears off it just loses its appeal and i found myself just putting the glasses away etc..
 
i'm looking forward to trying it myself but unfortunately i can't buy the acer hn274h in Romania yet. i'll wait for a little while and i'll order it from abroad
 
I would bite on this if the 3D package was under $100. I have everything else I need except the $$ for the kit. That is probably my next upgrade b/c I play bfbc2 so much.
 
H-street said:
Glad to hear you like it, i'd be interested to see how often you use it after a say a year or even 6 months.

like any iteration of 3d gaming (i was the same as you when i first tried it with the Geforce 256) it was a novelty and seemed amazing for a while but after the novelty wears off it just loses its appeal and i found myself just putting the glasses away etc..
Click to expand...

It's a fair point - how long does the 'wow' factor really last? (Though I don't think you can really compare earlier attempts with this in terms of the experience, because I'm someone who was never impressed with even the current iteration of 3D movies, and I still came away impressed.)

It's certainly true, though, that you'll only get the most out of it if you tweak it. Nvidia made the unfortunate decision to hide the convergence option in a submenu and has still failed to give an OSD for it. So while you can adjust depth well enough, I imagine some people won't even know about or bother with convergence unless they're an active member of the right gaming forums.

I also don't think it's suited to every game. Some games should be played both ways or played in 2D because the contrast or brightness really enhances the look of the game and you don't want to dim it with the glasses (I found this to be the case with Portal 2). And full compatibility is limited to 10 or 12 games (with another few dozen 'excellent', meaning it works well if you disable or reduce an IQ setting), so you'll definitely want to find out whether the games you most like to play are supported.

Who knows what will happen in 6 months, though. I tried and then got rid of Surround/Eyefinity twice now, because while I loved the increased FOV, it was too much of a hassle in too many games with the UI all over the place, stretching, and no support in most UE 3 games.

That's just part of the terrain of being a tech and PC enthusiast, though. I buy nice stuff and sell it off in a few months or years all the time.
 
Matrices said:
Who knows what will happen in 6 months, though. I tried and then got rid of Surround/Eyefinity twice now, because while I loved the increased FOV, it was too much of a hassle in too many games with the UI all over the place, stretching, and no support in most UE 3 games.
Click to expand...


I think that is sortof the bottom line, the "pick up and go" factor. I personally am just getting into Eyefinity, but considering i am a big Flight sim fan i am seeing where it may be a staying point (still deciding if 3 x 25" is better than my 1 x 37" for this).

I think you'll find that most criticism of the 3d is just the fact of the glasses, that when have a gaming routine (especially when it comes to online play) the hassle of the 3d glasses becomes cumbersom for day in day out gaming.


One question i would ask is the performance hit noticable? That has always been the other big drawback (same with eyefinity) is that with double the frame drawing you essentially halve your performance.
 
spaceman said:
I would bite on this if the 3D package was under $100. I have everything else I need except the $$ for the kit. That is probably my next upgrade b/c I play bfbc2 so much.
Click to expand...

Amazon is selling the kit for $135 so its getting there.

On topic: I'm a big fan of 3D Vision right now. It's pretty fun and neat. Portal 2 is kind of weird for me. It mostly worked great, but when loading 3D the crosshair doubles for a few seconds and it will go like it should. When that goes away its a really cool experience in 3D.

If you have a blu-ray drive in your PC check out some 3D blu-ray movies. Piranha 3D is awesomely cheesy (if you like cheesy horror and things being flung in your face), but Christmas Carol and Open Season (of all things) are a rather neat experience. I have Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs in 3D as well, but haven't got around to watching it yet. I really want to get Tron Legacy in 3D.
 
H-street said:
I think that is sortof the bottom line, the "pick up and go" factor. I personally am just getting into Eyefinity, but considering i am a big Flight sim fan i am seeing where it may be a staying point (still deciding if 3 x 25" is better than my 1 x 37" for this).

I think you'll find that most criticism of the 3d is just the fact of the glasses, that when have a gaming routine (especially when it comes to online play) the hassle of the 3d glasses becomes cumbersom for day in day out gaming.


One question i would ask is the performance hit noticable? That has always been the other big drawback (same with eyefinity) is that with double the frame drawing you essentially halve your performance.
Click to expand...

The glasses are pretty lightweight and comfortable. I wear regular glasses (near sighted) but I don't need those while I'm at the computer, so that's not an issue for me. I did however try to put both on at once and that also wasn't an issue for me (though admittedly I did that for minutes, not hours). The glasses also come with larger nosebridges to try out. One annoyance, as I noted, is that you can't properly fit cans on your head with the glasses on - some sound bleeds out.

As far as performance goes, it's basically a 40-50% hit. That's why 3D on consoles is so underwhelming - the graphics get gimped to keep up the framerate up. Crysis 2, curiously, works in 3D with only a 10% hit - but the 3D effect in that game is not very impressive.

I was split between getting one 580 or two 560s or two 570s. But I opted for one 580 because Nvidia has skimped on the vRAM this generation so I didn't want to get saddled with less than 1.5gb: enabling 3D increases vRAM usage by 10% to 20%, and I like to use supersampling AA and TRAA as well.

Performance is very good. Just Cause 2 runs at 40 to 45 FPS with 2xAA and most options maxed. Crysis 2 is 55-60 FPS. BC2 runs between 35-50 FPS with all options max, 8x CSAA, SSAO off (this feature I honestly have never been able to notice in-game). The framerate tanks if you zoom in while you're in a tank turret, but that's the only problem I had in any game after hours of play.

The numbers aren't as high as what 570 SLI would be, but that's $200 more, and the raw numbers don't account for the extra smoothness of a single GPU setup versus SLI. I don't have any intention of adding another GPU. Don't see the need for more power until Battlefield 3 comes out and then we have the next gen of GPUs.
 
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Matrices said:
The glasses are pretty lightweight and comfortable. I wear regular glasses (near sighted) but I don't need those while I'm at the computer, so that's not an issue for me. I did however try to put both on at once and that also wasn't an issue for me (though admittedly I did that for minutes, not hours). The glasses also come with larger nosebridges to try out. One annoyance, as I noted, is that you can't properly fit cans on your head with the glasses on - some sound bleeds out.

As far as performance goes, it's basically a 40-50% hit. That's why 3D on consoles is so underwhelming - the graphics get gimped to keep up the framerate up. Crysis 2, curiously, works in 3D with only a 10% hit - but the 3D effect in that game is not very impressive.

I was split between getting one 580 or two 560s or two 570s. But I opted for one 580 because Nvidia has skimped on the vRAM this generation so I didn't want to get saddled with less than 1.5gb: enabling 3D increases vRAM usage by 10% to 20%, and I like to use supersampling AA and TRAA as well.



Performance is very good. Just Cause 2 runs at 40 to 45 FPS with 2xAA and most options maxed. Crysis 2 is 55-60 FPS. BC2 runs between 35-50 FPS with all options max, 8x CSAA, SSAO off (this feature I honestly have never been able to notice in-game). The framerate tanks if you zoom in while you're in a tank turret, but that's the only problem I had in any game after hours of play.

The numbers aren't as high as what 570 SLI would be, but that's $200 more, and the raw numbers don't account for the extra smoothness of a single GPU setup versus SLI. I don't have any intention of adding another GPU. Don't see the need for more power until Battlefield 3 comes out and then we have the next gen of GPUs.
Click to expand...


you chose the VGA well. now you just need the second gtx 580 :)
 
o cant wait for my glasses to come in now. i just got me a 3d projector and running surround atm. to get all 4 monitors to work i have to break my surround and just use sli. hope its worth it.. if i can have 3d gaming 3d movies and all the surrround desk space i will be happy.
 
Matrices said:
Personally though, it's a revelation in gaming. Much more immersive than my other immersive gaming experiences: Surround/Eyefinity monitors, a 30" monitor, or a 54" TV.
Click to expand...

For more immersion, get two more matching 120Hz displays for 3D Vision Surround.
- i have three 24" ASUS displays using GTX 580 SLI or GTX 590 and the only disadvantage is room - they require 6 feet of desktop space. 3x27" would be even more impressive.
;)
 
DASHlT said:
http://www.hardocp.com/news/2011/05/05/mit_developing_glassesfree_3d

Should of waited
Click to expand...
I'd be surprised if it happened in our lifetime, let alone before he buys his next monitor...

Technical and financial hurdles aside, how do you even create content for something like that? It'd be a damn sight harder than stereoscopy, that's for sure. You can probably forget about real-time rendering, and I can't imagine what kind of camera you'd need to shoot a film for it.

And after all that, it's going to look pretty much the same when you're sitting still.

Is it really that hard to wear glasses?
 
apoppin said:
For more immersion, get two more matching 120Hz displays for 3D Vision Surround.
- i have three 24" ASUS displays using GTX 580 SLI or GTX 590 and the only disadvantage is room - they require 6 feet of desktop space. 3x27" would be even more impressive.
;)
Click to expand...

If I get a better-paying job in the next months, I might actually add two 23" 3D monitors to this one, since I found using 2D Surround with that configuration more appealing that using matched monitors. That said, there are too many issues with too many games in Surround, so I've gone with and dumped it twice now.

To update my thoughts after a few more days of play, I remain confident with my initial impressions. Again, the advice to lower depth and increase convergence was golden. I have all my games set to about 50% depth and higher than default convergence, so I get both depth and pop-out.

I have to say that BC2 is a mind-blowing experience after having done this adjustment. I am a writer by profession but I'm really at a loss for words here. A grenade is no longer something being tossed at the guy I'm controlled. It's being tossed at ME. My character is no longer moving through grass. I am moving through grass and ducking blades and leaves.

I also have more to say about the key question - how long does the 'wow factor' really last? I think the answer really lies with the game.

For instance, I played Section 8 Prejudice (MP GOTY so far, by the way, just amazing) in 3D, and while it looked cool for like an hour, it didn't add anything to the experience. I don't know if it's just a problem inherent with the Unreal Engine, but there are no nice particle effects or foliage or bits and pieces that pop out at you and everything is too boxy for depth rendering to make a real difference.

Playing that game in 3D versus Bad Company 2, Just Cause 2, or L4D2 (minus the areas with water), there's no comparison.
 
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