2950X build now or wait for mobos? First AMD since Phenom2!

Discussion in 'AMD Processors' started by shaolin95, Sep 25, 2018.

  1. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    Hello!
    So I am running the stuff on my sig, 5650 Xeon 6 cores @ 4.3Ghz on X58 and it has been a system that just keeps on giving. But of course, the upgrade bug is biting again finally after so many years with an X58 system. My previous AMD system was a Phenom 2 based system so it has been a long time.
    Finally I see the CPU that will make for a nice upgrade from what I have.
    I mostly do Photoshop with logs of plugins, Premier video editing or Vega depending on my mood lol, and about to start doing VR gaming (Oculus).
    Of course that means most of my current system will have to go aside from the Case and power supply.
    So I was thinking...maybe I should wait to get a used 2950x eventually...or buy it new then buy used Mobo and Memory.
    OR wait for possible new mobos?? Right now the Zenith and the Asrock Falaity (Seriously asrock! lol) are my main mobo being considered.
    Anyways, just looking for some feedback from current users and I guess saying hello back to my AMD friends :D
     
  2. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

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    For a 2950X I would say get one of the later generation of X399 motherboards. They are fairly easy to get now. I would personally point you at the latest MSI X399 boards. The tests here have shone them to be tanks and bristling with just about every feature you could want.
     
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  3. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky [H]ard|Gawd

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    Don't know where your gonna find a used 2950x or even more so a used X399 and RAM.
     
  4. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    ok....
     
  5. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    Thanks for the suggestion. I was looking at a local selling the Asrock Fatality x399 Pro Gaming Motherboard for $275 but I will research those MSIs as well.
     
  6. tangoseal

    tangoseal [H]ardness Supreme

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    The MSI board is nice for power delivery but really lacks in features other than power deliver if you ask me.

    If you are going to run a 2990wx you MUST get the MSI. It is proven to be able to deliver without shutting down when the 2990wx is overclocked.

    For 2950x I recommend other less costing boards. There is no need to get the latest $500 board for the 2950x its only a 180 watt chip and will NEVER pull more than 350 watts even overclocked.
     
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  7. mkrohn

    mkrohn 2[H]4U

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    I personally would wait. The TR market is still a mess. Depending on how much you can really use the TR surfing labgopher may get the work side of things squared away great. there are plenty of decent priced dual 2670 or 2690V2 type setups you can go with. dual 2690V2 would get you to 20 cores. 10G network really makes it so that doing stuff on my server is the same as it being on my desktop except I can still game while work stuff is doing some kind of heavy lifting on another machine.

    I don't like going all in on one system. With case/PSU being so cheap leave your present workstation as is and just build new with this workstation as a backup for if the TR gives you issues.
     
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  8. Dan_D

    Dan_D [H]ardOCP Motherboard Editor

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    For a 2950X, the MSI MEG X399 Creation, ASUS ROG Zenith Extreme, GIGABYTE X399 Designare, X399 Aorus Gaming 7, or the X399 Aorus Xtreme get my vote. For the 2990WX, the MSI MEG X399 Creation is the only one I know that I can trust to handle that thing well. The Zenith Extreme is seriously lacking on the cooling front where that CPU is concerned. The GIGABYTE X399 Designare has an 8-pin and a 4-pin input for CPU power which may not be good enough. The X399 Aorus Gaming 7 is the same as its virtually the same motherboard as the Designare with additional lighting and different NICs. The X399 Aorus Xtreme has dual 8-pin connectors and a nicer feature set than the MSI MEG X399 Creation, but the MSI has better VRM cooling.
     
  9. bbenz33

    bbenz33 Limp Gawd

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    I'm waiting for the TR4 heatsink review so we know what can actually cool these monsters.
     
  10. tangoseal

    tangoseal [H]ardness Supreme

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    There are already reviews of wraith ripper out. And we know the XSPC waterblock can cool these chips amazingly. I own that one. I was wanting to try wraith ripper as well but dont want to pony up the money.
     
  11. Dan_D

    Dan_D [H]ardOCP Motherboard Editor

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    The waterblocks made for the original Threadripper's were already designed and built correctly to handle the newer CPUs. Air coolers may be another matter and I don't use them so I can't speak to those.
     
  12. Aluminum

    Aluminum Gawd

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    TR shits on dual V2 xeons, ivy bridge is old especially with all the recent patches and microcode stuff. I'm already starting to retire my 22 core V4 because lanes.
     
  13. branana

    branana Limp Gawd

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    Broadwell-E IPC and PBO is what shits on Xeons. If you can get a 16 core V4 chip to Turbo 4.4ghz and not have meltdown, it would be very close to a 2950x
     
  14. mkrohn

    mkrohn 2[H]4U

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    It would be 2 gens newer than what this guy has and a ton of added cores at a low price. TR is not a refined platform YET for a guy using an 8 year old platform if he really wants TR what harm is waiting another year? If he really wants AMD a higher end Ryzen would certainly be a huge upgrade and that platform has stabilized a LOT this year. I have trouble saying anything on the TR market right now is ideal for another 8 year run for him. I have trouble saying any of the Ryzens would be an 8 year build but at a lot lower price tag a 4 year run wouldn't be that bad would it?
     
  15. bobzdar

    bobzdar [H]ard|Gawd

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    2990wx would be a 5 year cpu at least, but that's about the only one I see having that longevity due to the extreme acceleration in number of cores. Tr4 is the only chance at that kind of longevity on any current platform - zen3 (ddr5/pcie4) will be the next big jump, not zen2. We might get a little more clocks and some refinement out of zen2, but nothing worth waiting for imo. Zen was the big jump and 2990wx is the full monty - all 4 die spots filled on tr4, there's no room to add more. Unless they add more memory channels, zen2 3990wx will be 2-300mhz higher with maybe another 5% ipc in refinements on the same arch, cores and power draw. They're not going to add a ton of cores on the very first 7nm part, it'll be the successor to zen2 (zen3) that they might.
     
  16. drescherjm

    drescherjm [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I don't think Zen3 will use ddr5 or PCIe4 because of the promise of motherboard compatibility. I expect the change to happen in Zen4.
     
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  17. branana

    branana Limp Gawd

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    They only promised am4. No promise for tr4
     
  18. drescherjm

    drescherjm [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Also AMD probably won't adopt DDR5 until Intel has it in the mainstream. They don't want to be required to use more expensive ram.
     
  19. Aluminum

    Aluminum Gawd

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    V4s are all 100% locked and any big core xeons have shit turbos past the first 2 cores. The unlocked 10 core with no ECC etc intel still officially wants $1700 for (lol) and the few bits of channel that still have one to sell follow their msrp like lemmings.

    You could go used but dealing with suckers that paid that much for the 6950X is like buying used apple stuff, imaginary inflated values. My non-ES 22 core V4 for $1500 was a great deal when I got it, but then TR happened a year later.

    HW V3 and BW V4 are still dumped on pretty hard by spectre/meltdown, just not quite as bad as Sandy/Ivy. Every core pre Skylake (meaning all 4 versions of it lol) took a harder hit.

    People need to wake up to the reality that AMD set the HEDT market on fire (which also means used server-parts-as-workstation) and good on them for doing it.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2018
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  20. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

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    Indeed it is! The value is head and shoulders above anything Intel can bring to the table without making you mortgage your house. TR is the posterboy for HEDT and will only get more so.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2018
  21. branana

    branana Limp Gawd

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    6950x is a pointless SKU. 7900x ismuch better value.
     
  22. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    So nobody recommends the Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming?
    This is for the 2950x. I dont have plans for the 2990
     
  23. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

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    The Fatality X399 Professional Gaming is one of the 1st gen X399 boards. The second gen ones have a little more robust power circuitry than their 1st gen running mates so they aren't stressed out quite as much when doing heavy overclocking. The 1st gen boards should be fine for the 2950X just as they are fine with the 1950X cpus. For the 2990X though I would focus more on the 2nd gen X399 offerings out there.

    As for recommending the Fatal1ty X399 Professional Gaming, to be really honest with you the only real difference between that and the X399 TaiChi is the Aquantia 10gbe port. Which is pretty much useless if you are not running a full 10gb network. For my part I would focus more on the cheaper (by almost $100 CA) TaiChi part.
     
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  24. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    It was a local selling one thus my question. I will forget about that one then.
    Thanks!!!
     
  25. Dan_D

    Dan_D [H]ardOCP Motherboard Editor

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    Agreed. Although I wouldn't recommend the ASRock board because I haven't used it. I'm not generally a fan of any of their motherboards until I've tested them myself. ASRock cuts too many corners to hit lower price points. I have to see where the costs were cut before I'd take the plunge. Usually its in the PCB, but not always. I've seen some sketchy looking VRMs on some of their boards. They do make some good motherboards but more than any other board maker, they have to be evaluated on a model by model basis.
     
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  26. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky [H]ard|Gawd

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    On the AM4 platform the ASRocks have become a fan favorite, especially in the OC crowds. And their high end products are not cheap. Check some reviews if you can find them for the X399 boards. My guess is they would be every bit as robust and feature rich as their high-end AM4 counterparts.
     
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  27. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    Thanks. I keep going back and forth between this 2950x or a 7900x or even 8700k based on my requirements (1st Photoshop, 2nd VR gaming, 3rd Adobe Premier).
     
  28. Dan_D

    Dan_D [H]ardOCP Motherboard Editor

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    I've handled many higher end ASRock motherboards and I can tell you that it still cuts corners. All manufacturers do, but ASRock has to cut more corners to beat everyone else on price.
     
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  29. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky [H]ard|Gawd

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    I will gladly heed the words of the resident expert. For what ever reason they have seemed to have gained some respect in the AM4 circles. I am a Gigabyte man myself.
     
  30. Dan_D

    Dan_D [H]ardOCP Motherboard Editor

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    ASRock motherboards are loved because they are cheap and reasonably good for the money. They offer more bang for your buck by offering higher end features at a lesser price point. This is why ASRock has grown by leaps and bounds over the last few years. Their highest end motherboards are typically good motherboards but again, certain corners are cut to pull that off. Point out a motherboard and I can show you what corners were cut. Everyone does it, but every motherboard maker has their own way of controlling costs. ASRock typically does it in the PCB. All motherboards use phase doubling and other tricks to make things cheaper, but some go further on that front than others.

    The highest echelon ASRock boards are generally fine, you just have to be a careful installing them. That's a given with any motherboard but the thinner PCB makes it a bit more important than it does on some armored and braced fucker like GIGABYTE's X399 Designare. Nothing short of shooting at one of those would damage it.
     
  31. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky [H]ard|Gawd

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    O.T. ASRock used to be considered a dirt brand for a long time. There was a lot of hype going around for the Tai-Chi when I was getting a AM4 board about a year ago. I ended up with a Gigabyte Gaming K7. I went with what I trusted. But it is nice to see ASRock is back in the game and trying to be in the enthusiast space. The more competition the better.
    I have an old ASRock 939dual with an Opteron 185. It has dual AGP and PCI-e for those not familiar, and an optional CPU upgrade board if I recall. I consider it a classic and keep it out of nostalgia. Also it is the only ASRock board I have considered owning until the AM4 generation where they seem to have gotten their act together.
     
  32. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky [H]ard|Gawd

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    Why is the 2700X not in that mix? Great choice IMO. Put the saved cash into GFX card and fast RAM. 7900X is a lot of cash. 8700K will suck in high multi core loads compared to the rest (But still great if your work load is minimal). 2950X is pricey but offers so much more then the others all around.
    Photoshop, like Premiere seems to drop off after 5-6 cores. VR gaming will depend on your GFX card. Based on your criteria I would go 8700K (fastest at low core count) or 2700X (better at high thread, more future proof?)
    With that software suite I would not consider the TR 2950 or 7900X. Waste of money if you are not going to pursue heavy rendering.
    Get a 8700K or 2700X and splurge on GFX, storage, RAM.
    For ultimate happiness of course!
     
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  33. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    I actually got very interested in the 2700x BUT it seems that I wont have a path to the Threadrippers if I wanted to move to one of those later one since is not the same socket (unless I misread things) so that kind of stop me as I would like some way of growing in the future when CPU prices eventually drop or my needs change. So based on that, I have been removing some of the options I considered at the start of this post.
    But yeah, based on my usage, it seems 8 cores should be good for a long time and that really puts the 2700x back in the game as well as the 8700 (or 8086). The sexiness of more cores is tempting from tech point of view, but for my programs, it seems non beneficial.
    I am getting a 1080ti as well to upgrade. Waiting for next gen of cards and skipping 2080ti for now.
     
  34. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

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    If you like the upgrade path that the TR gives you but want to save a couple bucks today, might consider the 1900X. The 1900X has 8 cores like the 2700X at a similar cpu cost, but has the benefit of the high motherboard resources like up to 128GB Quad channel memory, a LOT of USB 3.0 & 3.1 ports, enough PCIe lanes to run 3 or 4-way SLI AND have 3x PCIe 3.0 M.2 SSD drives. The downside of course is that it is 1st gen threadripper and a little slower than th3 2700X due to the split between the cores being across 2 chip packages (one 4-core CCX in each package) which adds latency and causes you to switch to game mode for some games. This is the path I used to get on the Treadripper trail (still have my 1900x tho).
     
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  35. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    Well I am now leaning towards the 2700x BUT I am going to wait for the 9900k to come out before making a decision. In the end I figured for my needs based on performance I have seen, the TR family is not the best fit so either 2700x or 9900k will be my next build. Then I will get the best mobo with at least 8 sata ports that is.
    Thanks for your help!
     
  36. cyberguyz

    cyberguyz Gawd

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    The 2700X vs the i9-9900k is a tough call. There's not a lot of info on those 9900ks yet but what I hear of them is pretty good. They will certainly be a more expensive route (what can I say, It's Intel) .. so yeah, get some more info on them first before pulling the trigger for sure.
     
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  37. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    Yep I am sure is going to be around the $500 for the CPU alone but that is fine. I just want the best performance for me needs without going too crazy in spending. After holding on for so long with my x58, I want to make sure I make the best choice for sure. :)

    PS> I wonder if there will be a 2800x AMD announced at the same time ...
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2018
  38. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky [H]ard|Gawd

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    The i9-9900K will surely best the 2700K. But not by a huge amount. The main difference is that AMD is committed to the AM4 platform going forward. The i9-9900K will surely be the peak on that platform. For that reason I would take the 2700K and the saved money would go immediately to a 2080ti.
     
  39. shaolin95

    shaolin95 2[H]4U

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    I dont know about that though. For Photoshop the 8700k was already beating the 2700x so I expect the 9900 to do even better. Also for premier it would be interesting to see. I understand about AMD commitment but if the 9900k delivers the performance, then it should last me long enough so that changing platforms wont be a concern at that point. Of course, I also want to see what AMD has as a response to the 9900k and how soon. No interested in the 2080ti for me. I am getting a 1080ti at a good price and waiting for next gen instead.
    Thanks!
     
  40. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky [H]ard|Gawd

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    Photoshop has been shown to be 5-6 cores, so the 9900 will perform very close to the 8700. I recommended the AM4 platform because earlier you seemed very concerned with an upgrade path.