28nm Patience Game

J Macker

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jan 25, 2001
Messages
10,171
I'm waiting, but not for Kepler.

I'm waiting because my 6950 will play all the games I want to play right now on high settings. After the last 4 years, I'm finally skipping a generation.
 

LEVESQUE

Gawd
Joined
Sep 4, 2008
Messages
774
Prices are high because of Nvidia. Blame Nvidia and the 580 1.5Gb, ovepriced since the first day it came out, and the still TOTALLY overpriced 580 3Gb in the market right now. The price of that card is stupid. Plain and simple.

The Nvidia 8800 GTX Ultra was 800$ when it came out. THAT was crazy. :)
 

mekkanic

Gawd
Joined
May 14, 2007
Messages
925
Life is too short to wait, could be dead tomorrow, live in the moment, I want the best stuff now.

As a consumer and based on my past experiences (perfect example....socket 1156, which had a lifespan of about 2 months [??] and was kicked to the curb by socket 1155), i find it best to wait it out and see what offers the best value for the increase in performace from my current platform(s).

I might just pass by the 7xxx/gk104 updates and wait for the next...unless theres something my rigs cannot handle at 5040 x 1080.
 

Astral Abyss

2[H]4U
Joined
Jun 15, 2004
Messages
2,899
Look at it this way...

Waiting for Kepler to arrive will give you a better chance to make a good purchase choice you'll be happy with for the rest of the year. You'll then be able to choose between 7970, 7950, and GK104 (whatever name it turns out to be). You aren't waiting for the end of the world, it's 2 months. Even better, by then, the high end custom cards will be out for the 7970. I mean, personally I think you'd be better off just waiting for the MSI Lightning 7970 anyway even if you're dead-set on a 7970, or if not that, an Eyefinity model with 6 DisplayPort connectors.

Comparing waiting for Kepler to waiting for BD is a rather poor comparison. AMD has never dominated the video card market and Nvidia is not an underdog. Nvidia has a solid reputation for releasing products that perform well. In contrast, Intel has long been dominating AMD in the CPU market and everyone knew BD was a long shot by AMD to hopefully catch up, but skepticism was high due to AMDs inability to compete in the past. Everyone was skeptical of BD for months before it released, whereas I don't see anyone questioning that Kepler is going to be AT LEAST as good as what AMD is putting out there in the 7900 series.
 

jhhack

Limp Gawd
Joined
Feb 14, 2003
Messages
178
I'm waiting till at least march when the first benchmarks on the 'officially supported 7xxx drivers' come out.

I'm hoping for maybe 2-3 of the following also happen

- Prices come down ~50 bucks or so (or catch a sale)
- 7950 custom cards come out with overclocking potential that gets them close to 7970
- 78xx series cards perform good enough for me to pick that up as good enough in the price to performance range.

Here's to hoping.
 

jrrandell

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 24, 2010
Messages
410
I see nVidia pricing there cards higher than AMD so I dont see a price war happening.
 

WorldExclusive

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 26, 2009
Messages
11,174
Life is too short to wait, could be dead tomorrow, live in the moment, I want the best stuff now.

On a more serious note, in the world of computing, if you wait, you'll end up keep waiting, there is always something new right around the corner.

That usually applies to people who are keeping up with the latest tech.
Then there are those of us who are looking at our next card as a 2-3 year investment. Waiting in this case is a benefit than a hindrance.
 

B2BigAl

2[H]4U
Joined
Mar 23, 2003
Messages
2,076
Ati's new pricing is keeping a lot of us on the sidelines. Before, you knew whatever nvidia released was going to be ridiculously overpriced, and ati would be the best bang for your buck. That's all changed now. Plus, I'm hard pressed to find any games that can really take full advantage of the power in these new cards. At least not to the point where I feel the need to run out and grab a new card.
 

Brackle

Old Timer
Joined
Jun 19, 2003
Messages
7,816
im waiting for a good 7970 that I know will easily overclock to 1200-1300 on air with low temps.

Been eyeing that gigabyte one with 3 fans on it. Problem is I havent seen any reviews on it.

I thought [H]ardocp had one to review....I want to know the overclocking potential of it.

Brent any Idea's when we can see this review?
 

That's_Corporate

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 30, 2006
Messages
1,738
im waiting for a good 7970 that I know will easily overclock to 1200-1300 on air with low temps.

Been eyeing that gigabyte one with 3 fans on it. Problem is I havent seen any reviews on it.

I thought [H]ardocp had one to review....I want to know the overclocking potential of it.

Brent any Idea's when we can see this review?

wait for the MSI model, bro
the 7950 twin frozr is already announced, 7970 should be here shortly
 

AliceCooper

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 25, 2007
Messages
1,476
Yea....I just dont trust MSI. Had too many motherboards go flaky for people I build pc's for.

Huh, I've only had MSI and Abit boards and never had problems with either. They were great all OCed very well. I don't buy their videocards though because I've read mixed reviews and I always go for the company with the best warranty (lifetime) if possible :p.
 

n3ckcutta

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
Messages
230
Ya gots ta pay if ya wants ta play....

^^^ But I am withholding and seeing what nvidia has to offer. I usually dont have a preference but like the most bang for my buck when it comes to computer parts. That and I end reading tons of reviews and such before making any kind of purchase.
 

That's_Corporate

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 30, 2006
Messages
1,738
Ati's new pricing is keeping a lot of us on the sidelines. Before, you knew whatever nvidia released was going to be ridiculously overpriced, and ati would be the best bang for your buck. That's all changed now. Plus, I'm hard pressed to find any games that can really take full advantage of the power in these new cards. At least not to the point where I feel the need to run out and grab a new card.

actually, ATI has never priced their cards any different than nVidia by any substantial margin. ATI/AMD priced their cards in relation to how they perform compared to nVidia. nVidia usually holds the single GPU performance crown, thus they were always the most expensive. now that AMD holds that crown, they are the most expensive.

you see, it's not AMD that purposefully sets their pricing low - the pricing is dictated by the fact they usually perform slightly below nVidia and thus are priced below.

now that the tables are turned, you're confusing relative pricing with something innate within AMD/ATI, you called it "value".

the 7970 is priced exactly the same as if it were made by nVidia. if you refuse to believe that for some reason, just wait until nVidia regains the crown.
 

Ripperjack

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 26, 2010
Messages
299
Flyinfinni said:
Me. But the only reason I'm being patient is because I can't afford it right now :) If I had the money to spend, I'd have a shiny new 7970 or 2 in my rig right now.
same here

Same here too. Also, I don't want to go through the hassle of trying to sell my old ATi 5870's (I got two in X-Fire) on eBay, and having to deal with some teenage punk cheapskate, trying to talk me down from the heady sale price of $50 for each. :rolleyes:
 

spaceman

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jan 7, 2005
Messages
14,817
Same here too. Also, I don't want to go through the hassle of trying to sell my old ATi 5870's (I got two in X-Fire) on eBay, and having to deal with some teenage punk cheapskate, trying to talk me down from the heady sale price of $50 for each. :rolleyes:

I hear that. I am having issues holding onto my old 480. It still works fine. I have no good reason to ditch it other than I want more eye candy in bf3. Not a good enough reason.
 
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
703
5870's still hitting over $200 or so on the bay - bitcoin has extended the life and price of these cards - suggest you get rid of them sooner than later :) They will attract a good price if they haven't been bitcoined or overclocked to high.
 

B2BigAl

2[H]4U
Joined
Mar 23, 2003
Messages
2,076
actually, ATI has never priced their cards any different than nVidia by any substantial margin. ATI/AMD priced their cards in relation to how they perform compared to nVidia. nVidia usually holds the single GPU performance crown, thus they were always the most expensive. now that AMD holds that crown, they are the most expensive.

you see, it's not AMD that purposefully sets their pricing low - the pricing is dictated by the fact they usually perform slightly below nVidia and thus are priced below.

now that the tables are turned, you're confusing relative pricing with something innate within AMD/ATI, you called it "value".

the 7970 is priced exactly the same as if it were made by nVidia. if you refuse to believe that for some reason, just wait until nVidia regains the crown.


You can try to twist the facts any way you want, but the general concensus for a while has been that amd cards are a better "value" (your word, not mine, try reading before you quote someone next time). A 6950 that could be flashed to a 6970 was a much better "value" than a gtx570. A 6970 that gave you 80% (more in many cases) of the performance of a 580 for 70% of the price, was a better "value". Maybe you don't understand the definition of the word "value", or what the colloquialism "bang for your buck" means, so I'll give you a pass this one time.
 

Cube Rhino

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
369
Even then, I'd rather spend a little extra and go with it's Sandy Bridge counterpart.

Bulldozer is akin to finding out the hand job you were getting at the glory hole was being administered by a guy -- It was good until you peeked at the performance.

Lol...so true...
 
Joined
Aug 15, 2004
Messages
650
Been waiting for a long time now. And I intend to remain patient. BF3 plays great at Ultra settings on my current machine, so I can´t justify upgrading now. However I am very curious to see what nvidia has in store for us come April.

Without the games to make these cards struggle at 1920 x 1200, I find myself getting more annoyed at game devs than impatient with nvidia though. I wish that damn next generation of consoles would come out soon, so that the devs will up the visual ante.

Frostbite 2 should be a requirement by law, at least for first person shooter devs. That engine has so much potential, BF3 is only scratching the surface.

Which games you playin? BF3 eats my 5970 for breakfast at 1080p...
 

edge929

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jan 11, 2007
Messages
1,180
My 5870 needs to retire, 7900 series are a little high for my likes, Kepler can't get here soon enough. My luck, Kepler will be even more than 7000 series equivalents, in fact, if NV stays true to history, I expect as much.
 

RamonGTP

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Nov 9, 2005
Messages
8,150
I have the money, but I'm also in no rush. Let's see what Nvidia comes up with and whether it will get prices down a bit. Not that I plan on buying a Nvidia card, but I'm still hoping that a little competition will help prices.

I'm kind of in the same boat. A more powerful card won't do me much good on my current setup but I'm waiting for IB before a complete system overhaul, so by default I'm waiting. It will be nice if nVidias next gen gets released around IB so I have all my options available around the same time.
 

That's_Corporate

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Sep 30, 2006
Messages
1,738
You can try to twist the facts any way you want, but the general concensus for a while has been that amd cards are a better "value" (your word, not mine, try reading before you quote someone next time). A 6950 that could be flashed to a 6970 was a much better "value" than a gtx570. A 6970 that gave you 80% (more in many cases) of the performance of a 580 for 70% of the price, was a better "value". Maybe you don't understand the definition of the word "value", or what the colloquialism "bang for your buck" means, so I'll give you a pass this one time.

they had the slower cards so they priced them lower. just because they lowered the price past the percentage by which they were lagging in performance you call that "value"? that's just appropriate pricing. nothing in economics says a product that under-performs by X% needs to be lowered in price by X%.
 

deadken

Limp Gawd
Joined
Oct 30, 2004
Messages
158
Am I the only guy who is waiting for the 78xx line of cards?

Could I buy a 79xx? Yes. Will I buy a 79xx? Most likely not. I bought my 8800GTS when they were $500 and I've held on to it too long. I'd much rather buy a cheaper card and replace it sooner.

So, who else out there is looking forward to the 78xx series? I want 2gb of Vram and a price of around $250. I could buy a 6950 now, hope it unlocks and possibly be content. Or, I can spend a bit more and get a 6970, be guaranteed of performance and have a higher chance of being resentful when the 78xx's come out. Frankly, I've waited over a month, I'm really hoping that waiting a few more weeks works out!

Who else here is waiting for a 78xx? Why? What are you hoping for / expecting?
 

evilsofa

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jan 1, 2007
Messages
10,078
I've got a GTX 275 896MB, and my monitor is a 20" 1680x1050 (and will be for the long term, my vision is limited). I tend to like to run games with maximum texture mods and as much AA as possible, so I would like to see more than 1.5GB VRAM.

I was tempted by the Twin Frozr versions of the 560Ti, but I am playing the patience game, hoping that the 6xx line will have something with temperature and power like the 560Ti but with performance better than a 570, maybe even a 580. Everything I hear about the new line seems to point that way.
 

Nauseous

Gawd
Joined
Jun 5, 2004
Messages
889
im trying to wait for ib and whatever is best by the time that comes out, but i really need a new rig. I have this problem buying year old tech when i can wait a few months and get brand new tech assuming i can afford it.
 

SonDa5

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 20, 2008
Messages
7,425
This morning I was reading through this thread and LOL'd. We sound like a bunch of whiney kids but I'm sure most of us our adults. :D


I don't think I'm going to get a 28nm video card till summer for the following reasons.

1. So far 28nm AMD cards are having driver problems and I wouldn't be surprised if NVIDIA has a few glitches with drivers at release date as well.

2. No solid information about NVIDIA 28nm cards coming soon.

3. Hopefully by summer there will be some good deals and a nice assortment of 28nm cards to choose from. Right now HD79XX pricing is too high.

4. Not enough water block support for 28nm video cards right now. Not a single water block available for any of the released HD7950s.



In the mean time I'm going to look for a good deal on a GTX500 series card or a AMD HD69xx series card and have fun with it for a few months then sell it when I'm ready to upgrade.

I love my water cooled GTX 470 but I want to try something a little better and cooler. Hopefully I can get a fair price for my GTX 470 and AquagraFX full water block.

I still feel like I'm being patient on waiting to make a smart choice on choosing a 28nm video card.
 
Last edited:

Yobbles

Limp Gawd
Joined
Sep 10, 2011
Messages
317
I'm not quite ready to retire 2x5870, might wait for next gen because the advantages of 7970 does not really warrant an upgrade for me. If I can play all current gen games fine now why would I need to upgrade?
 

JaguarSKX

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
1,449
I'm waiting for the Radeon HD 8000 series. My Radeon HD 5850 still provides me with enough performance for my needs. Besides with Haswell coming out in 2013, I might was well wait until then to build a totally new PC.
 

SonDa5

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 20, 2008
Messages
7,425
I'm waiting for the Radeon HD 8000 series. My Radeon HD 5850 still provides me with enough performance for my needs. Besides with Haswell coming out in 2013, I might was well wait until then to build a totally new PC.



I might end up waiting for Haswell or HD8000 series as well. I hope they are not as expensive when they release.
 
Last edited:

JaguarSKX

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
1,449
For Haswell, I expect similar prices to Ivy Bridge prices on release date, which shouldn't be much higher than current Sandy Bridge prices.

The Radeon HD 8000 series should be similarly priced as current Radeon HD 7000 series cards. Of course, there's the nVidia cards to consider as well.
 

IAMEVIL

Limp Gawd
Joined
May 8, 2011
Messages
142
Haswell will make mainstream graphic offering like 6770/ Gts450 redundant and significantly lower the entry cost to pc gaming.
 

JaguarSKX

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
1,449
Haswell will make mainstream graphic offering like 6770/ Gts450 redundant and significantly lower the entry cost to pc gaming.

Highly unlikely.

Intel stated that the graphics core in Haswell is only be a minor upgrade of the Intel HD 4000 which is the graphics core in the upcoming Ivy Bridge CPU series. The Intel HD 4000 is estimated by Anandtech to be a 60% improvement at most over the Intel HD 3000 graphics core. That basically means going from a Radeon HD 5450 to a Radeon HD 5550.

Since the graphics core in Haswell is only going to be a minor update, then I would say it will probably be around the performance of the Radeon HD 5570. That would make it more powerful than the Radeon HD 6450, but slower than the Radeon HD 6570 (I don't believe AMD has released a card in between those two cards yet).
 

KickAssCop

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 19, 2003
Messages
6,894
Played the patience game in January. Found out nV cards aren't coming out till April-May and that the flagship will be another $100 more expensive.

Went out and purchased the 7970 on 2nd February. 40% performance improvement over 6950 @ 6970 across the board was good enough. Also, now that I can do 3D with ATi, I really have no reason to wait for nVidia cards.

Overall very happy with the purchase and especially in 2D gaming my vsync-ed fps have improved a lot since I play at 120 Hz.
 

edge929

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jan 11, 2007
Messages
1,180
If $300 is the AMD/NV mandated "mid-range" from here on out, then I need to find a new hobby or deal with less eye-candy (gasp!).
 

SonDa5

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 20, 2008
Messages
7,425
Looks like all of us who have been being patient waiting on NVIDIA to show up are going to be rewarded big time! :cool:
 
Top