24" Widescreen CRT (FW900) From Ebay arrived,Comments.

LAGRUNAUER said:
When buying a GDM-FW900, please remember that "You'll get what you paid for it..."

Hope this helps...

Unkle Vito!
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gotta disagree here. Rather, it's more accurate to say that if you spend a lot of money from someone like Unkle Vito, you have a good chance of getting a good tube.

But there's no reason you might not get lucky.

I paid $30 for my first FW900 and apart from occasional popping it has worked perfectly for over a year and a half.

I paid $300 and $200 for my other two units, both of which have no apparent functional issues. The first of these likely only had a few weeks of use.
 
Ah ok, all I found recently was a SyncMaster 500s and I've used it several times. Manufactured in April of 1997 and still works, I've been getting into CRTs recently because of this.

It's a shame that monitors like these aren't still being manufactured simply because the technology is old, it is in many ways superior to LEDs.
 
random question
other than the widescreen, is anything else about the fw900 better than other good 4:3 20 inch monitors (e.g. f520)
 
with respect specifically to the f520, I'd say no. Not sure about compared to a monitor like the Diamond Pro 2070sb - I'd love to see the picture quality on one of those to see. I believe, however, that the PQ on the FW900 is superior to that of a CPD G520. Hard to pinpoint exactly how. I have an IBM P275 (which is a rebranded CPD G520 i believe). I should do some side by side comparisons some day :)
 
well my specific g520p is better than my fw900 in most areas but probably because it has gone through far less wear.

there are definitely more osd options on the fw900, and there is more stuff that is tunable via windas. but for the tubes themselves, i guess there isn't too much of a difference? or maybe the hardware in the gdm series is just better overall.

offtopic but how come whatever magical technology used here
http://www.ecinemasystems.com/products/monitor.php?product=1
hasn't been seen in more lcd's?
 
spacediver said:
gotta disagree here. Rather, it's more accurate to say that if you spend a lot of money from someone like Unkle Vito, you have a good chance of getting a good tube.

But there's no reason you might not get lucky.

I paid $30 for my first FW900 and apart from occasional popping it has worked perfectly for over a year and a half.

I paid $300 and $200 for my other two units, both of which have no apparent functional issues. The first of these likely only had a few weeks of use.
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You were lucky to get two OK units. It is not usually the case...

Almost 95% of my service clients who sent their units in for repairs claimed they bought bargain units on CL, local newspapers adds, local liquidation sales or local recyclers, among other sources even eBay and Amazon, and thought they were getting "a good deal"... Out of those units diagnosed, 90% have tube issues,and the other 10% are FBT, PSU, HOT, and other related issues.

Hope this helps...

UV!
 
spacediver said:
with respect specifically to the f520, I'd say no. Not sure about compared to a monitor like the Diamond Pro 2070sb - I'd love to see the picture quality on one of those to see. I believe, however, that the PQ on the FW900 is superior to that of a CPD G520. Hard to pinpoint exactly how. I have an IBM P275 (which is a rebranded CPD G520 i believe). I should do some side by side comparisons some day :)
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The GDM-F520 and the GDM-F500R were the two sharpest 21" (19.8" viewable area) 4:3 aspect ratio monitors Sony ever produced. Both were 0.22 aperture grille. No DiamondTron tube ever came close to the sharpness of these two monitors.

The Sony CPD-G520P, CPD-G520 and CPD-E530/540 used the same tubes and were 0.24 aperture grille, and not as sharp as the GDM-F520 and the F500R.

The Sony GDM-C520 Artisan had an special tube (unique phosphor) but still had a 0.24 aperture grille. Superior color but not as sharp as the GDM-F520 and the F500R.

The GDM-FW900 has a tube with 0.23-0.27 variable aperture grille and it was designed to be a graphics monitor, not a text monitor. It is sharp in the center but not as sharp on the edges.

Hope this helps...

UV!
 
LAGRUNAUER said:
The Sony GDM-C520 Artisan had an special tube (unique phosphor)
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do you know which phosphors were used in it? or their chromaticity coordinates?


this is interesting:
http://arcadecontrols.com/files/Miscellaneous/crtfaq.htm#crtdeg
Cathodes age due to loss of emission material, particularly for oxide cathodes. The central part of the cathode surface has carried the most current density and will wear out first. The surrounding area takes over, this will lead to an unsharp picture. Adjusting the focus voltage will not really improve it. The tube is worn out.
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this would explain why my g520p's focus is much than my fw900's focus at the center (even after adjusting)

The adjustment on the flyback sets the "static" focus voltage, which is a DC voltage applied to the focus electrode in the CRT. However, a single fixed focus voltage will not give you the best focus across the whole CRT screen, for the simple reason that the distance from the gun to the screen is different at the screen center than it is in the corners. (The beam SHAPE is basically different in the corners, too, since the beam strikes the screen at an angle there, but that's another story.) To compensate for this, most monitors include at least some form of "dynamic" focus, which varies the focus voltage as the image is scanned. The controls for the dynamic focus adjustment will be located elsewhere in the monitor, and will probably have at LEAST three adjustments which may to some degree interact with one another. Your best bet, short of having a service tech adjust it for you, would be to get the service manual for the unit in question.

It is also possible that the dynamic focus circuitry has failed, leaving only the static focus adjust.
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is it possible to mess around with these in the fw900? i think that's what i'd need to fix my blurry corner issue :p
 
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Ok, I doubt I am going to get this monitor. As I said I live in Australia, I doubt they were ever sold here or anyone in this country has ever owned one.
 
Vyr said:
Ok, I doubt I am going to get this monitor. As I said I live in Australia, I doubt they were ever sold here or anyone in this country has ever owned one.
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I don't blame you. They're good monitors but really - it's just a screen. ;)
 
I've spent my whole life around computers and games, so to me it's a little more than just a screen. I don't know if there were ever any 24" or up CRT monitors made in Australia that were flatscreen and widescreen, I'd be nice if anyone knew.
 
Vyr said:
I've spent my whole life around computers and games, so to me it's a little more than just a screen. I don't know if there were ever any 24" or up CRT monitors made in Australia that were flatscreen and widescreen, I'd be nice if anyone knew.
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As an owner of a good quality FW900 - I'll still say - it's just a screen. ;) I understand the allure of a widescreen CRT monitor, but after you get over that, it's not the best monitor in the world. It's a damn good one - but it's still a monitor.
 
jbltecnicspro said:
As an owner of a good quality FW900 - I'll still say - it's just a screen. ;) I understand the allure of a widescreen CRT monitor, but after you get over that, it's not the best monitor in the world. It's a damn good one - but it's still a monitor.
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Actually, it is.

(Admittedly, this is ultimately a subjective call. :) )
 
Yeah, it's a monitor which can produce actual blacks, higher colour depth, doesn't have ghosting and doesn't have input lag.
 
Vyr said:
Yeah, it's a monitor which can produce actual blacks, higher colour depth, doesn't have ghosting and doesn't have input lag.
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It has better blacks than most - yes. It actually DOES ghost (medium-persistence phosphor), and it doesn't have higher color depth. It's limited by whatever's driving it. Input lag? I'll give you that.

I'm not saying it's not a good monitor - it's a BEAUTIFUL monitor. BUT - it will probably not be worth what you'll have to pay to get it in Australia. My two cents. You're probably better off getting an Eizo Foris.
 
jbltecnicspro said:
es. It actually DOES ghost (medium-persistence phosphor)
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Yeah, my trinitrons ghost a little, and my Diamondtron-based Lacie ghosts even more. I tried Alien Isolation on the Lacie and the ghosting was very noticeable since the game has very high contrast environments.

My Samsung 900ITF actually had the least ghosting of my monitors, but it was the weakest in the color and sharpness department.
 
i think you'd need like <0.1ms phosphor decay half time to not notice phosphor ghosting when moving a cursor or something on a dark background
 
So it's best to stick to LEDs? Got it.

aG4Ia6Ql.jpg
 
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Vyr said:
So it's best to stick to LEDs? Got it.

aG4Ia6Ql.jpg
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Is that your personal setup? Come to think of it - if there isn't an FW900 - you can look for a W900. Personally, I would think that W900 is better because it has a round monitor. Round monitors tend to have less noticeable geometry imperfections.

There's also a 28-inch 1080p CRT monitor. I forget the name of it. But yes - the 28-incher, FW900, and W900 were the only widescreen CRT monitor's that I know of. Don't forget that there's always the BVM professional monitors, but these are more video monitors than PC monitors.
 
Vyr said:
Ok, I doubt I am going to get this monitor. As I said I live in Australia, I doubt they were ever sold here or anyone in this country has ever owned one.
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I have shipped many GDM-FW900s to Australia and New Zealand before...

UV!
 
jbltecnicspro said:
There's also a 28-inch 1080p CRT monitor. I forget the name of it. But yes - the 28-incher, FW900, and W900 were the only widescreen CRT monitor's that I know of. Don't forget that there's always the BVM professional monitors, but these are more video monitors than PC monitors.
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wasn't that the one carmack used? i think i read about that in some blog post
 
jbltecnicspro said:
Is that your personal setup? Come to think of it - if there isn't an FW900 - you can look for a W900. Personally, I would think that W900 is better because it has a round monitor. Round monitors tend to have less noticeable geometry imperfections.

There's also a 28-inch 1080p CRT monitor. I forget the name of it. But yes - the 28-incher, FW900, and W900 were the only widescreen CRT monitor's that I know of. Don't forget that there's always the BVM professional monitors, but these are more video monitors than PC monitors.
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Yes.

Thanks for the info.
LAGRUNAUER said:
I have shipped many GDM-FW900s to Australia and New Zealand before...

UV!
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Yeah, but the shipping price would be insane.
 
Vyr said:
Yes.

Thanks for the info.

Yeah, but the shipping price would be insane.
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No problem. :) Keep in mind too that if you don't go widescreen, there are still a ton of good CRT's out there that have a large size and good resolution. Sony's GDM line is a good avenue to pursue. Mitsubishi's Diamond-Pro's are also fantastic monitors. Both of these kinds of tubes have rebrands galore (except for Sony's GDM-F520. I have yet to see a rebrand tout a .22mm Aperture Grille pitch).

Viewsonic and Eizo both made some fantastic CRT's as well. What size is your current monitor? 17-inches? I had a Dell M991 that I ended up giving away to a friend. I'm now kicking myself over that because it was sharp, had great colors, and was a little smaller than my big Sony's - which is perfect for my DOS Box. It was also round and had virtually PERFECT geometry! :D
 
this is interesting:
http://lists.apple.com/archives/colorsync-users/2003/May/msg00452.html
My understanding is yes. I asked this exact question of Karl Lang the man
behind the Artisan (and previously the PressView) and was told:

> The Artisan display chassis is not the same as any shipping Sony display
> chassis. The Artisan display has better adjustment resolution (the ability to
> reach a specific target white point) and an extended dynamic range. The
> Artisan display has the highest color purity specification of any Sony
> display. The slightly finer aperture grille tube used in the f520 would not be
> able to achieve this purity spec, also the finer aperture grille tube would
> not be able to last as long at the high calibrated luminance of the Artisan.
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wow, so it looks like might have at least 10 bit voltage adjustments through the artisan software. Nice. Also very cool about the aperture grille - the increased purity might make for a sharper image too.
 
flod said:
so the gtx970's dac has this annoying thing that is hard to describe. basically it looks like every pixel is convolved with a kernel like [0 1 -0.3]

here's a slightly unfocused picture. note how to the right of each black line is a faint white shadow
http://imgur.com/0F1IEz1

edit:
laptop (intel hd 3000) does the same but not as intensely.
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swapped back to gtx 460. at first i thought it was completely free from this issue but actually it's not immune from this issue either.

if i look very carefully i see a very faint ghost 6 pixels to the right of black lines on a white background.
pixel clock is 229.5MHz so electron gun shows each pixel for 4.36ns... so the ghost is delayed by 6 pixels * 4.36ns per pixel =~24ns
light travels 26 feet in that time. signals in cables travel a little slower so it's roughly corresponds to the time for a signal to travel 4 lengths of my 6ft cable.

white lines on green have a very obvious grey shadow offset by exactly 2 pixels.
this is really weird a kind of concerning because the green value should be constant and it's only the red/blue which are changing. why would a shadow appear then?

wish i had an oscilloscope to check this crap, but basically it looks like an impedance mismatch between something and something causing signal reflections
 
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The very generous EagleOne gave me his FW900 today because his wife is forcing him to get rid of it. Initial impressions are pretty good. I'll report back after I've done some gaming on it. First I need to rearrange my desk so I can even put the monster on it :)
 
chili dog said:
The very generous EagleOne gave me his FW900 today because his wife is forcing him to get rid of it. Initial impressions are pretty good. I'll report back after I've done some gaming on it. First I need to rearrange my desk so I can even put the monster on it :)
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Sucks that he had to get rid of it. Congratulations. :)
 
jbltecnicspro said:
No problem. :) Keep in mind too that if you don't go widescreen, there are still a ton of good CRT's out there that have a large size and good resolution. Sony's GDM line is a good avenue to pursue. Mitsubishi's Diamond-Pro's are also fantastic monitors. Both of these kinds of tubes have rebrands galore (except for Sony's GDM-F520. I have yet to see a rebrand tout a .22mm Aperture Grille pitch).

Viewsonic and Eizo both made some fantastic CRT's as well. What size is your current monitor? 17-inches? I had a Dell M991 that I ended up giving away to a friend. I'm now kicking myself over that because it was sharp, had great colors, and was a little smaller than my big Sony's - which is perfect for my DOS Box. It was also round and had virtually PERFECT geometry! :D
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Yes, right now I am about to buy a 21" HP monitor (flatscreen), 4:3. It's the only thing I can get right now, but that's good enough for the moment. I found several 24" widescreen monitors that were made in Australia as well, I might have a look around to see if anyone has them.

You know, I forgot the exact inches but yeah I'd say it's around that.
 
so... remember how i mentioned that when doing the convergence procedure in windas (not dynamic convergence aka dcnv, just procedure->convergence), the convergence changes after the procedure is finished? turns out what was going on is that when you start the procedure, the system completely disables dynamic convergence and reenables it after you finish.

anyways question:

why/how do the sync polarities matter?
 
inetresting.

as for sync polarities, never could figure out why this matters. I'm a bit fuzzy on sync pulses, but polarity, from what I understand, simply refers to whether the voltage is negative or positive during synchronization pulses, and I think the monitor knows how to interpret both polarities.

Been a while since I've done any geometry adjustments in WinDAS - do the polarity instructions ever change, or it it always negative negative?
 
Hi,

I lurked this thread quite often.

I haven't bought a new monitor in a long time. I tried to get one of these widescreen CRTs, but nobody in my area ever has one.

Have new LED monitors gotten as good as CRTs yet? Or is it still going to take a while? For CRTs, it wasn't really the colors I liked, but I liked the clarity, brightness, and refresh rates more than anything.

I have a Widescreen CRT HDTV, but it isn't like those old CRT monitors. This TV only gets 60hz refresh rates, no matter what resolution through HDMI.
 
right now, from what I understand, you can get LCDs with hardly any input lag, and no motion blur, but you sacrifice colors and viewing angle (e.g. the Asus ROG Swift).

You can also get much better colors and no motion blur, but you end up with a bit more input lag (Eizo Foris), although it isn't a great amount.

Both of these examples have high refresh.

Others with more experience with LCDs may be able to add more info.
 
When I lurked this thread, I remember there was a list of similar models and brands of this 24 inch wide screen monitor, as well as standard 4:3 versions. Does anyone have this?

btw, to my understanding the CRTs like the SGI 21 inch has a 85 refresh rate at the highest resolution. But the wide screen FW900 actually has a 100 refresh rate?
 
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