24" Widescreen CRT (FW900) From Ebay arrived,Comments.

did you try to clean the monitor with a detergent? It damages the anti glare coating if you do..

Seriously, take the coating off.. You'll get lot better image.

You asked so much questions on gamma and black levels... IMHO ag coating ruins image output.
 
I cleaned it only with water... All the time... but i think the owner before me did clean it with something bad... I was believed that the "scratches" on the AG were from the water and say all the time "next week i will clean it propertly!" and today i wanted to do that and realized that this was not from water, it were dots and little scratches on the AG.

"IMHO ag coating ruins image output."

You mean with AG the image is more bad and without it, it is better did i understand that right?

EDIT: What did you mean with "you asked so much about gamma and black level"?

And what is about the dust which will appear without AG? And only remove AG or AG and plastic layer under it? Or exist only above the glas? I read about some plastic, dont know...
 
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Well, I had wanted one for years but the recent prices and shipping costs have kept me from pulling the trigger. I just happened to get lucky one day and found a unit that had been boxed since 2009 and for sale by a local seller who was moving in the next couple weeks, the unit was very lightly used and only issues seem to be the "G2 voltage" problems that everyone else seems to have. I have ordered a DVI to BNC and a USB convertor cable to hook into the service port so I hope I can the brightness sorted out because this thing is already razor sharp and has very good screen geometry.
 
If the coating isn't damaged or has only minor imperfections I'd personally keep it on. Once removed the screen becomes so glossy it makes the Apple Cinema Display look matte. You can literally take a shave when displaying black.
 
Who here has removed the AG then? Any experience? And theoretical i could buy a nearly same AG like this? http://www.photodon.com/mm5/merchan...tegory_Code=MXH-2029&Product_Code=MXH-3260-02 or http://www.photodon.com/mm5/merchan...tegory_Code=MXA-2029&Product_Code=MXA-3260-02 ? Or is it something other? If i would stick it also like the original AG under the brezel, then it should be identical right?

And from this persons who has removed it, what can you say to the "dust" some claim? And has you removed only AG or AG and plastic layer (if this realy exist...).

Or maybe somewho has a link for the AG as replacement part like other parts for the monitor?
 
Few pics I took, digital camera doesnt really do it justice tho:
24.jpg
8.jpg
25.jpg
26.jpg
27.jpg
 
I have removed it on 2 of my 3. The 3rd came with it removed and was the reason I removed the other two.. The picture is so much clearer/brighter with it gone. You have to use anti-static spray to keep hair and dust from sticking but once the coating is gone you can use just about anything to clean it. Anything like razor blades anything.

And after a bit of heating with a hair dryer it will peel off but you may need someone to hold the monitor while you pull. It is really glued on there.

IMG_7946.jpg


IMG_7947.jpg
 
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1036390264&postcount=6402

I think this should be the right and perfect way to remove it, right?

Firstly heating it with hair dryer and then remove it.

Wow, is nice to read that it can make the picture also better. But whats about contrast? Will it higher or lower and whats about the black point than? I will need to lower brightness more right? And higher contrast because the contrast will be lower as with AG?

And do i need the recalibrate white point or make this no difference?

EDIT: And can i get a shock by removing the AG if i open the monitor? Where i should dont touch?? There was a post in forum with a picture where a point was marked where you can get a shock if only open the case. But the image dont exist anymore... I dont wont to die because of my Sony ;)
 
My FW900 has the AG removed. Since it's half dead I'm not bothered. I wouldn't remove it on a fully working monitor tho. It comes off easily with a bit of elbow grease and a hair dryer.

On a dark scene you'll be admiring your reflection rather than the image.
Even the smallest light source washes out the screen.
Light from the gun itself (individual pixels) bleeds into surrounding pixels.
The hotspot in the center of display becomes quite visible and annoying after the monitor has heated up when viewing mostly white content.
 
Chris2000 said:
http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1036390264&postcount=6402

I think this should be the right and perfect way to remove it, right?

Firstly heating it with hair dryer and then remove it.

Wow, is nice to read that it can make the picture also better. But whats about contrast? Will it higher or lower and whats about the black point than? I will need to lower brightness more right? And higher contrast because the contrast will be lower as with AG?

And do i need the recalibrate white point or make this no difference?

EDIT: And can i get a shock by removing the AG if i open the monitor? Where i should dont touch?? There was a post in forum with a picture where a point was marked where you can get a shock if only open the case. But the image dont exist anymore... I dont wont to die because of my Sony ;)
Click to expand...

When the AG is removed you will have to lower your brightness and contrast drastically or it will be way too bright.

Reflections are now strong on it. But as long as the sunlight or other lights are not shining directly on the screen the monitor will be also useable during the day.

Others here asked about it and searched for AG coatings as replacement parts. But you will not be able to get the same model which the FW900 wears on. And you will not be able to get it on the screen perfectly, if you want you would need an complete sterile room.

The part you should not touch is the coil. Under the plastic case on back there is an aluminium case (which you must not remove). The coil is this black round part which is not under this aluminiumcase so be careful. Somewhere here on this thread there is an picture of the coil. Maybe i find it.
 
http://www.google.de/search?q=coil+...w&biw=1110&bih=659&sei=vxbPUMilG67Y4QSorYHQDA

Is the coil the black thing on image 1 here? I dont know if i should remove it. some write that it will mostly destroy the image and some say that the image will be more color rich... I am also a glossy fan on TFT, i think if i had no problem to any time with glossy tft, it will be the same with glossy fw900, or? I have poweroff it at morning today and pressed without power always the power button to release the remaining power like on a power supply which is off on pc and you press button until the led is not flashing anymore. that should be safe right?

i would do it than now... but i am unsure, but the scratches are terrible. the ag is not MUCH off, but on my desktop wallpaper i can see on the scratches a difference on this areas... it is like purple scratches... on this areas the light is not reflecting realy more... but its a little bit brighter... but only a very little bit. it looks like only the "black" on the ag is scratched but the purple is not realy damaged... also it is only on the top of the screen. i cant imagine that the reflections are so much more... if the picture would be realy washed out that would be very sad... also i can see on the whole screen "dots" of this "purple" on the screen where the "black" ag is also more and more destroying... Would be nice if someone could argue for pros and cons in the next lets say one hour... actually i think i will remove it...
 
Chris2000 said:
I cleaned it only with water... All the time... but i think the owner before me did clean it with something bad... I was believed that the "scratches" on the AG were from the water and say all the time "next week i will clean it propertly!" and today i wanted to do that and realized that this was not from water, it were dots and little scratches on the AG.

"IMHO ag coating ruins image output."

You mean with AG the image is more bad and without it, it is better did i understand that right?

EDIT: What did you mean with "you asked so much about gamma and black level"?

And what is about the dust which will appear without AG? And only remove AG or AG and plastic layer under it? Or exist only above the glas? I read about some plastic, dont know...
Click to expand...

I should have mentioned in the guide that anti glare must be removed for best pure crisp image output.. Pros are better colors, sharper text and image. But someone mentioned few posts back, that it has downsides too:

On a dark scene you'll be admiring your reflection rather than the image.
Even the smallest light source washes out the screen.
Light from the gun itself (individual pixels) bleeds into surrounding pixels.
The hotspot in the center of display becomes quite visible and annoying after the monitor has heated up when viewing mostly white content.

I wouldn't do it either on a CRT with an undamaged AR coating. But thats personal preference.

I referred to gamma and such because a damaged coating can make it hard to calibrate color gamma, gamma and brightness.. People then think the CRT is dying.

If you think your text looks fuzzy and your colors look washed out etc, the cause might be a damaged coating.. It might be better then to remove it.

Try removing it, and let us know the result. Maybe you'll convince me to remove it too, after all..

edit: here is what uncle vito had to say on the matter.

ANTIGLARE ISSUE: There are no fixes to the antiglare as it is a thick film pressured adhered to the screen at the factory. The only thing that can be done is to remove it. At the customer's request, I do that quite often as I've observed thru measurements that the antiglare film interferes with the calibration process and we've obtained different calibration data with and without the antiglare. Like I said, it is the customer's preference. Now, to remove the antiglare, you have to open the case, and then detach the bezel. Before you do that, MAKE ABSOLUTELY SURE THAT THE MONITOR IS OFF AND DISCONNECTED FROM POWER SOURCE! Then to remove the thick antiglare is very tricky and you must be patient! Carefully lift the film from any corner of the screen using a blade, and once you have enough detached film, with your fingers start pulling off the film. The pull action must be done slowly and from the top and bottom corners working inwards towards the center of the screen. If you pull too hard, you may peel off the film leaving a thick coat of glue and pieces of the film that are not easy to remove.
 
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"Light from the gun itself (individual pixels) bleeds into surrounding pixels."

why? i dont think so... i have this problem anyway with "phosphor bleedging". i though that this is because the light but people here wrote that this is because of the phosphor... but i dont think this will be more a problem without ag, or is that realy so?

"The hotspot in the center of display becomes quite visible and annoying after the monitor has heated up when viewing mostly white content. "

i dont understand what you mean here... what is the problem and why?
 
sadbuttrue said:
My FW900 has the AG removed. Since it's half dead I'm not bothered. I wouldn't remove it on a fully working monitor tho. It comes off easily with a bit of elbow grease and a hair dryer.

On a dark scene you'll be admiring your reflection rather than the image.
Even the smallest light source washes out the screen.
Light from the gun itself (individual pixels) bleeds into surrounding pixels.
The hotspot in the center of display becomes quite visible and annoying after the monitor has heated up when viewing mostly white content.
Click to expand...

its him that said it.. Maybe PM him and ask :) Maybe the listed problems are more due to faulty monitor...

Anyways, a damaged AG coating looks like this... http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1039067786&postcount=8480
 
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Yeah looks like your link... but not so much and only dots and scratches instead of big areas... i am opening it now... the gears are strong...
 
Impossible to open it! :(

I need only the 4 screws up to picture 4 to open the plastic cage right? but i cant move the plastic cage. its like the screws are in!
 
And please saerch for the picture of the coil or what is dangerous... i have a little bit fear :S

i have poweroff it this morning and dont know if there is energy anymore... i have pressed several times the powerbutton without power... dont know if this is enough that it has no energy in it anymore...
 
dont have both :S

i have opened it now! i though the bezel and front is total ruined because it is too heavy and i failed to turn it right on a pad! but it is not damaged...
 
So, have removed it and i am closing it now! But the screws are very difficult to screwing in again...
 
Sorry a bit late.

But here is an picture for the future.
[img=http://img102.imagevenue.com/loc42/th_576290223_FW900_HIGH_VOLTAGE_122_42lo.jpg]

atwix said:
browsed the thread a bit and found myramond' post showing the difference in image output
on a AG coated fw900 vs one that had it removed.

a lot of people in this thread say its worth it to remove the AG coating.. Guess I might try it out too :)

http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1037137292&postcount=6975
Click to expand...

Oh i forgot about that i made this ^^.

But i have maken an big mistake when shooting this pictures. The FW900 with AG removed is way too blueish because i think i had color temperature on 10000k or so. Dont know why i liked it this way at this time :eek:

Blacks are also not perfect on my AG removed one, because i didnt lowerd the G2 voltage at the time this photos where shooten.
 
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i want a detailed comparison chris, before and after.. Maybe i'll do it myself then.
 
It is done. But i need to test it until tomorow or few days... Its very ambivalent. Form first impression, i would say like other: If your AG is not damaged, you should not remove it. Also i need to recalibrate my monitor to make a compare... if your lamp is on, black is realy impossible because the glas is grey and this grey is the darkest black then. if you lower the brightness to 0%, this "black" also will be grey. Impssible to go darker then the glas is colored on lamp or daylight. I have now 26% brightness and 70% contrast. before 29% brightness and 90% contrast. The bad is tha black scale is not improved... You can lower black - yes, but it is like with AG in my case... All under 29% brightness (26% nearly the same) my black scale is bad. i cant see then a difference between black and realy black -> crushed blacks. Also it is reflecting VERY MUCH. I dont think the AG was only for people who work in glas house. I think was made because otherwise you cant got a right black during day. The image are more colorrich - yes, but at the moment it feels more "wrong" as good. I have to deal with contrast and other again to make a decission. Also gamma is the same. It makes sense because all what you see (the color and the color created with the brightest and darkest point on the test pictures) are more dark both if you have AG. The same gamma is right for me without AG now. Gamma is the black scale... and scale is scale... it is relativly... and if ALL is more dark (with AG), then the gamma curve will be the same as all is more bright (without AG). I have to think about it. There were no problems to remove the AG. Hair dryer did help me.

They should used dark glas and only a AG on it. Then if you remove the AG on day the reflections would not destroy much of the picture because of the dark glas. But the glas of the FW900 is so "grey" or bright itself, that black on day is not realy to reach... Also i have read that trinitrons NEED to have a more dark glas because of its mask which is otherwise too bright. I think sony did both in one step (antiglare + darkcolor) in the AG because its more easy. The anti reflections which is removed is not the problem. It is that the glas now is to grey. Its difficult to say. Also phosphor bleedging is more to see. But curiously it is more or less if you look from different directions.

EDIT: To sharpness: I would say its a little bit more sharp... but can also be placebo...
 
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I currently have the monitor set up on winserver2k8 r2 and with bnc to DVI and there does not seem to be any resolution/refresh settings past 1600x1200 and 1080i. Was just wondering if anyone else had this issue.
 
Thanks Chris2000 my favorite guinea pig, very interesting ..I`ve debated for awhile whether to take mine off for know other reason then for something to do .I love my fw900 cause of the blacks ,my desk top is like the looking into the void. now I know
 
Chris2000 said:
if you lower the brightness to 0%, this "black" also will be grey.
Click to expand...

Once the room light fades blacks are still fully black. However if you calibrate it for the nearest black levels to 0 still being visible then odds are you will never have absolute lacking light black happen in a pitch black room.
 
Nickerbocker said:
I currently have the monitor set up on winserver2k8 r2 and with bnc to DVI and there does not seem to be any resolution/refresh settings past 1600x1200 and 1080i. Was just wondering if anyone else had this issue.
Click to expand...

it can be tricky to get the best resolutions using a bnc cable..

If you got dvi to vga or dvi/vga convertor and vga to vga cable, i'd try that FIRST. Usually people use BNC to hook up PS3 or xbox alongside with a vga cable to dvi for desktop..

There is NO reason why you should be using bnc cable. Try dvi to vga cable or a dvi/vga convertor you can plug into th dvi port, with a vga to vga cable from the convertor to the fw900.

Many people reported issues with windows recognising the monitor using a bnc cable. So i think you don't have the right driver installed, or it is caused by the bnc cable.

Also, a lot of people can't get 2304x1440 or 1920x1200 to display using bnc... I think you are in same boat. 1600x1200 is a 4:3 resolution, and an fw900 uses 16:10 resolutions.

Even with a real old graphic card you must be able to get 1920x1200 at 85 hertz. If not, then it is either bad driver (you must use corrrect driver for the correct windows), or no driver installed (windows does not recognise the monitor) or or a really low quality bnc cable.
 
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funny thing is that i'm starting to doubt if the AG coating is still IN my fw900. I examined the front of monitor and it LOOKS like glass to me.

But it might be the refurbisher already removed it without me knowing... or realising.

But i doubt it. I got 2x% brightness and 9x contrast, which suggests that it is still inside.

Unless someone can accuratly prove me the difference... Then i keep my opinion that you shouldn't remove AG unless it is damaged.
 
Hello!

Can some Sony GDM-W900 CRT owner, please compare the CRT to a LightBoost2 monitor with the special zero motion blur tweak???
We need comparisions between the W900 CRT and a LightBoost2 monitor for motion blur!!

Mark Rejhon said:
Confirmed!! I've since purchased the Asus VG278H & a GTX680, and it works! Zero motion blur confirmed -- looks like CRT motion.
original post
Click to expand...

Transsive said:
Then yesterday I, for some reason, disabled the 3d and noticed there was no ghosting to be spotted at all in titan quest. It's like playing on my old CRT.
original post
Click to expand...

Inu said:
I can confirm this works on BENQ XL2420TX
EDIT: And OMG i can play scout so much better now in TF2, this is borderline cheating.
original post
Click to expand...

Terrorhead said:
Thanks for this, it really works! Just tried it on my VG278H. Its like a CRT now!
original post
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(All the above: Geforce GTX 680 or 680 SLI, or better, combined with a LightBoost2 monitor + the 2D mode tweak)
Confirmed zero motion blur monitors (when tweak is done): Asus VG278H, VG278H, Benq XL2411T, XL2420TX

My ratings:
60Hz LCD mode = 4/10 = blah
120Hz LCD mode = 6/10 = blah
120Hz+LightBoost2 strobe backlight = 9/10 = looks similar to a Sony W900

We need comparisons to a widescreen CRT like an W900.
Any W900 guinea pigs willing to buy a LightBoost2 monitor & do the 2D strobe backlight tweak/hack?
Color quality will not be as good as a W900, but the motion blur is completely gone -- looks like gaming on an W900.
I used to see a friend's W900, and it looked amazing. Now my ASUS VG278H has CRT perfect motion (even if not CRT color saturation)
Soon, it'll be impossible to get W900's in a few years, and we need a worthy heir.
Post your W900-CRT versus LightBoost2-strobe-tweaked-LCD comparision in this HardForum thread.
 
You really have quite a research project running there.... I take my hat off to you.

I think your main researcher shoud be Vega.. He has a fw900, ordered the monitor you mention and he has experience with building custom systems and actually spends more time on his setups then gaming :)

My only concern with lightboost is that you need the 3d glasses, 3d compatible monitor and what Vega already said... Correct me if i'm wrong.

My biggest gripe: all Lightboost monitors are measly 1080P and have TN panels with associated poor images quality and horrid full matte anti-glare. So my real interest is modifying my 130 Hz 1440P IPS Catleap for a scanning back-light.

I can't imagine gaming on a TN panel, let alone a monitor with full matte anti glare... Hope you find solution for IPS and newer stuff too.

i don't understand half of what is in your thread, but i wish you good luck on your project.
 
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atwix said:
it can be tricky to get the best resolutions using a bnc cable..

If you got dvi to vga or dvi/vga convertor and vga to vga cable, i'd try that FIRST. Usually people use BNC to hook up PS3 or xbox alongside with a vga cable to dvi for desktop..

There is NO reason why you should be using bnc cable. Try dvi to vga cable or a dvi/vga convertor you can plug into th dvi port, with a vga to vga cable from the convertor to the fw900.

Many people reported issues with windows recognising the monitor using a bnc cable. So i think you don't have the right driver installed, or it is caused by the bnc cable.

Also, a lot of people can't get 2304x1440 or 1920x1200 to display using bnc... I think you are in same boat. 1600x1200 is a 4:3 resolution, and an fw900 uses 16:10 resolutions.

Even with a real old graphic card you must be able to get 1920x1200 at 85 hertz. If not, then it is either bad driver (you must use corrrect driver for the correct windows), or no driver installed (windows does not recognise the monitor) or or a really low quality bnc cable.
Click to expand...


Whereever you want to use your FW900, install the drivers for it. The drivers are a must have for BNC to get all Resolutions + Refreshrates.

If you want to download them, ive posted them 2 pages ago.
 
just wondering...

winserver2k8 r2 is same driver as windows 7 to let a fw900 work with bnc? It might be different (modded) driver you need.

and: does windows 2008 server have digital driver protection, aka that it only accepts drivers that are digitally signed? I had to enable test mode on windows 7 to let my modded windows 7 fw900 drivers work, because of that protection.

Hope you get it sorted nickerboxer :)

EDIT: i found these fw900 drivers at software32 .. it also lists drivers for winserver 2008 r2. The version 5.61 might be what you look for. Try it out and let us know. Link below.

http://www.softwarepatch32.net/flgdm-fw900.htm
 
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Today: The reflectings only with sunlight are not as much as yesterday with lamp on. Also black level is better as yesterday i think. Also i think my eyes adopt day for day. I have stick the half of my display with the removed AG and i can see the difference of clearness. The colors are more "clean" - thats what i can say and that with 15% less contrast. I will test i again a day.

EDIT: Also i have set my brightness back to 29% like WITH AG because otherwise i have crushed blacks. Also i think my eyes are "learning" to ignore the reflections... Its like on a glossy laptop. Also my eyes "learn" to convert the "reflection black" to "true black like with AG". And white is more white or realy white. Thats something that is a real pro without AG. Bright pictures are more living.
 
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I have tried the various inf files for using the monitor with the pc cables.com DVI to BNC and have also even tried cutting the 2 pins of the DVI as it was mentioned earlier but it still seems to restrict anything past 1600x1200@60 and 1080i. This really is not too big of a deal but I did notice that it did look a bit sharper and nicer with the BNC even though VGA works on all listed resolutions without any problems. I guess I just need to find a really nice VGA cable and use that instead.
 
the problem then likely is that the EDID of the monitor is not transmitted trough your cable..

It is not normal that you can only select 4:3 resolutions.


That is why i always used dvi/vga cable or a dvi/vga convertor with vga to vga cable: with those the desktop pc can read the EDID of the monitor correctly.

Try it out. I bet you 5 dollar that the resolutions will show using VGA cable, provided you use the right drivers for the windows version.
 
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