2016 Vizio P Series

hannibl

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I wanted to start conversation here on the recently announced Vizio P series. It has caused quite a stir in the home theater community due to the features offered, price point, using casting instead of TV apps, and lack of a built in tuner.

Brief specs and pricing:
4k, HDR, DolbyVision, FALD
50" - $999 VA, 60hz
55" - $1299 IPS, 120hz
65" - $1999 VA, 120hz
75" - $3799 VA, 120hz

HDMI 1-4 support the following:
2160@60 4:4:4, up to 8bit per color
2160@60 4:2:2, up to 12bit per color
2160@60 4:2:0, up to 12 bit per color

HDMI 5 is a low latency (gaming) port that supports:
2160@60, 4:2:0, up to 10bit per color
1080p@120, 4:4:4, up to 10bit per color
~15ms latency in game mode

Vizio Product Page

RTINGS Review of the 65"


AVS Owners Thread

I'm considering purchasing one for monitor use, deciding between a 50" VA 60hz and a 55" IPS 120hz. No word on PWM to my knowledge.

Those of you who have used a 50"-55" display as a monitor, how far away do you sit to see it all without moving your neck?

Those of you who are good at math, how far away would I have to sit from a 50" VA panel with a 17 degree viewing angle to avoid gamma shift due to sitting too close?

Does FALD help contrast on IPS?
 

Vega

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Unfortunately gaming mode 4K is 4:2:0, which looks horrid.
 

Aluminum

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Waiting for someone to bite the bullet and test input lag on the non "gaming" ports. (+1 on the fuck 4:2:0 camp here)

Granted you still can't really correctly test 4k with any of the current testing gear, but I'd still take first hand owner accounts over the home theatre "review" sites.

I have brown spots (dead backlight array leds) on my samsung JS which qualifies for a full replacement/credit under the extended store warranty, but I'm intentionally waiting a bit to see whether I'd want any of the this years screens first. The KS models are actually a downgrade at the same model #s, kinda sad how it reminds me of the nvidia/ati rebranding crap.
 

bandit390

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Unfortunately gaming mode 4K is 4:2:0, which looks horrid.

Rtins says you can do 4K and 4:4:4 60hz

But it does say "4:4:4 is blurrier than on other TVs that support it." Whatever that means...
 

bandit390

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Waiting for someone to bite the bullet and test input lag on the non "gaming" ports. (+1 on the fuck 4:2:0 camp here)

Granted you still can't really correctly test 4k with any of the current testing gear, but I'd still take first hand owner accounts over the home theatre "review" sites.

I have brown spots (dead backlight array leds) on my samsung JS which qualifies for a full replacement/credit under the extended store warranty, but I'm intentionally waiting a bit to see whether I'd want any of the this years screens first. The KS models are actually a downgrade at the same model #s, kinda sad how it reminds me of the nvidia/ati rebranding crap.


Rtings put it at 37ms on non-gaming ports.
 

delita

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What about this as a PURELY TV watching set? Worth the $?
 

Aluminum

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Rtins says you can do 4K and 4:4:4 60hz

But it does say "4:4:4 is blurrier than on other TVs that support it." Whatever that means...

Hmm, that kind of worries me, other than the panel quality/type variations there should be no difference in what you see, 1:1 with subpixels is 1:1 with subpixels. This implies they might be cheating or fudging it somehow :(
Fuck, now I really really really want to see someone take a picture of the usual 4:4:4 test pictures from PC output. Worst buy near me needs to get some on the floor I can play with.

Rtings put it at 37ms on non-gaming ports.

Yeah at 1080p, they can't test 4k input lag yet. Some tvs have way worse delay at 4k than 1080p because they don't really turn off all their stupid image processing effects. If they do proper PC/native 1:1 modes that turn off processing it should have equal or possibly even lower latency since no scaling is needed.
 

Aluminum

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What about this as a PURELY TV watching set? Worth the $?

The usual AV / home theatre discussion places have 100+ page posts about these as a TV, what I've read overall seems positive so far.

HF is one of the few places that has the rare double-combo of enough people that 1) care about PC input and 2) actually understand the shit that matters behind PC uses. The samsung threads are a good example of this.

There are a handful of smart users on AVS and other places but they get drowned out by the 5000 "this shows the red highlights in RandomBlurayMovie#6172 better than OtherBrand blah blah blah".
 

delita

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The usual AV / home theatre discussion places have 100+ page posts about these as a TV, what I've read overall seems positive so far.

HF is one of the few places that has the rare double-combo of enough people that 1) care about PC input and 2) actually understand the shit that matters behind PC uses. The samsung threads are a good example of this.

There are a handful of smart users on AVS and other places but they get drowned out by the 5000 "this shows the red highlights in RandomBlurayMovie#6172 better than OtherBrand blah blah blah".
LOL, yeah.

I just needed a new 65" for my living room. I game on Gsync but a lot of people on HF only talk about displays from a PC use perspective and I was just curious on how this guy performed as a regular ole TV :)
 

kabobi

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According to rtings the P series use PWM, but they don't elaborate on the frequency.
 

illram

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Purely on the TV aspect of it: no tuner (not a big deal for most people) and it uses Google Cast for "smart TV" content. This is an interesting feature as this means you are using Google's cast TV apps not "native" TV apps. The set comes with a tablet with Vizio's branded "SmartCast" app for the TV, so this is basically a TV with a built in chromecast. The way I understand it, this means your 4K viewing options are limited to whatever 4K is supported by Google Cast. (E.g., no Amazon 4K streaming.) I cannot definitively figure out if Netflix 4K is supported but comments here and there seem to think it is. Does anyone know if Chromecast now works with 4K Netflix? I think it would be crazy for Vizio to go this route if they could not deliver streaming 4K Netflix.

The other thing I cannot figure out, if the TV runs on Google cast, can you use wired ethernet rather than stream wirelessly? It has a wired ethernet port, but if it has no apps on the TV and depends on a wireless connection to the tablet and the SmartCast app, I'm a little confused how it would all work. I can't find an answer to this on AVS forum or other forums with 100+ page threads. My current set up just runs all my streaming content from my PC to my TV, but having used smart TV's and Roku's recently at other people's houses, these devices have come a long way and the convenience of a dedicated streaming TV app or peripheral, rather than using my PC, is actually something I'd like to move over to.

For the non TV part of it, the low input lag is intriguing even with the 4:2:0, since for me my "fast-twitch" games are on console, and my casual games are on PC, so I could use one of the 4:4:4 chroma ports for my PC and probably live with 4:2:0 from my console in the "game" port.
 

Snowknight26

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The other thing I cannot figure out, if the TV runs on Google cast, can you use wired ethernet rather than stream wirelessly? It has a wired ethernet port, but if it has no apps on the TV and depends on a wireless connection to the tablet and the SmartCast app, I'm a little confused how it would all work.


I have the P65-C1 and can hook it up to ethernet, but I think then I'm limited to casting via the Chrome extension? Is that something you'd want tested?
 

bandit390

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I just picked up the 50". Everything is good so far, but I can't get 4:4:4 to show under nvidia control panel. Any suggestions?
 

Snowknight26

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Ocellaris

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I just got moderately interested in the 55 inch model only to read they don't have built in tuners :( OTA and streaming are all I use for media.
 

kabobi

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I just got moderately interested in the 55 inch model only to read they don't have built in tuners :( OTA and streaming are all I use for media.

But they basically come with Chromecast-equivalent so you can use Plex or Kodi to stream everything. Take a look at the massive AVSforum thread for more info.
 

Ocellaris

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But they basically come with Chromecast-equivalent so you can use Plex or Kodi to stream everything. Take a look at the massive AVSforum thread for more info.

"Everything" doesn't include OTA sports though. And I've yet to see a TV's built in apps be as flexible as something like a FireTV, so what software they build in to the TV (and won't update after a few months) doesn't matter much to me. The software on two Smart TVs I've had has been dreadful.
 

illram

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I have the P65-C1 and can hook it up to ethernet, but I think then I'm limited to casting via the Chrome extension? Is that something you'd want tested?

Awesome. Yeah I guess I'd just like to find out if the TV can stream via the wired connection, and you just use the smartcast app to control the TV, or does it actually force you to stream from the wireless tablet (or equivalent).


"Everything" doesn't include OTA sports though. And I've yet to see a TV's built in apps be as flexible as something like a FireTV, so what software they build in to the TV (and won't update after a few months) doesn't matter much to me. The software on two Smart TVs I've had has been dreadful.

On topic with the above...the TV is basically just piggybacking on Google Cast, and ditching its (defunct) TV app partnership (I believe with Yahoo). So as long as Google Cast remains updated, the Vizio will also see the same updates. It's an interesting idea and it basically makes Vizio's smart TV solution on par with the big players like Amazon and Samsung and LG as far as reliability with updates.
 

Snowknight26

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Awesome. Yeah I guess I'd just like to find out if the TV can stream via the wired connection, and you just use the smartcast app to control the TV, or does it actually force you to stream from the wireless tablet (or equivalent).

Just cast from my desktop's Chrome to the TV using Ethernet (network panel on the tablet said Ethernet) without any hicups.
 

bandit390

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Any chance you'd be able to take a picture of that test showing the pixels for the last two rows? :angelic:

I will when I get home. Are there any other tests out there?

Here is my 50"


20160418_071952.jpg
 
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Snowknight26

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I will when I get home. Are there any other tests out there?

Here is my 50"

That test in the thread you linked is perfect.

Nice setup, though I personally wouldn't do it as Windows is still terrible with DPI scaling. 100% or bust.
 

Snowknight26

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Certainly looks better than what I've got going.



Wonder which part of my setup is causing it.

Are you going straight from HDMI -> HDMI on your GTX 980?
 

illram

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Do you guys have different sizes? If so, could it be different panels maybe?
 

bandit390

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Certainly looks better than what I've got going.

Wonder which part of my setup is causing it.

Are you going straight from HDMI -> HDMI on your GTX 980?

Here is another picture. I don't see how it's "fuzzy" as Rtings.com has mentioned.

20160419_192026.jpg
 

kabobi

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Unrelated question, but how does casting work for the new P series?

I have my entire movie collection on a desktop PC. How can I "cast" those to the P series without physically connecting my PC? Do I have the option of just putting a movie on a USB and plugging it into the TV?

And for sports/TV, I usually just use the official online streams for each channel (I have cable subscription, but no box) on my desktop. Can I cast that too?

I'm trying to decide whether to spend $470 for the new 43" E series (has 4k@60Hz w/ 4:4:4, but no HDR/DV, and only 10 LED zones) or to spend $1k for the 50" P.

P.S. Bandit, how is the 60Hz panel at that size? Do you notice any judder or motion artifacts when viewing hockey/soccer/games?
 
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bandit390

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Unrelated question, but how does casting work for the new P series?

I have my entire movie collection on a desktop PC. How can I "cast" those to the P series without physically connecting my PC? Do I have the option of just putting a movie on a USB and plugging it into the TV?

And for sports/TV, I usually just use the official online streams for each channel (I have cable subscription, but no box) on my desktop. Can I cast that too?

I'm trying to decide whether to spend $470 for the new 43" E series (has 4k@60Hz w/ 4:4:4, but no HDR/DV, and only 10 LED zones) or to spend $1k for the 50" P.

P.S. Bandit, how is the 60Hz panel at that size? Do you notice any judder or motion artifacts when viewing hockey/soccer/games?


I do three things with this screen.

1. PC monitor/gaming
2. Netflix
3. Console gaming


Question....
If my computer is set to 4K@60hz 4:4:4 then all video played by my pc would play at 60hz, instead of 120hz(assuming my screen was capable of 120hz), right? That's why I plan to stick with my 50" instead of the 55"
 

Snowknight26

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Question....
If my computer is set to 4K@60hz 4:4:4 then all video played by my pc would play at 60hz, instead of 120hz(assuming my screen was capable of 120hz), right? That's why I plan to stick with my 50" instead of the 55"

The videos would play at whatever frame rate they are, but the panel still refreshes at 60Hz, so you'll get some judder. If you use MPC-HC, for example, you can have the TV's refresh rate change to the video's frame rate to eliminate that judder.

With a 120Hz panel, if your PC also output at 120Hz, you would be able to play 60, 30, and 24 fps content without issues because 120Hz is divisible by those frame rates evenly.

It's not like you can do 3840x2160 @ 120Hz anyway..
 

bandit390

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The videos would play at whatever frame rate they are, but the panel still refreshes at 60Hz, so you'll get some judder. If you use MPC-HC, for example, you can have the TV's refresh rate change to the video's frame rate to eliminate that judder.

With a 120Hz panel, if your PC also output at 120Hz, you would be able to play 60, 30, and 24 fps content without issues because 120Hz is divisible by those frame rates evenly.

It's not like you can do 3840x2160 @ 120Hz anyway..

Thanks

I also just ordered a 55" to try out.
 

illram

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I do three things with this screen.

1. PC monitor/gaming
2. Netflix
3. Console gaming


Question....
If my computer is set to 4K@60hz 4:4:4 then all video played by my pc would play at 60hz, instead of 120hz(assuming my screen was capable of 120hz), right? That's why I plan to stick with my 50" instead of the 55"

Rtings.com says the 50" is a different panel and does not do 120hz.
 

kabobi

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What's worse: IPS and 120hz or VA and 60hz?

Depends on what you value most/least. For me, I cannot stand the light bleed / glow of IPS panels, and I am only mildly sensitive to judder so VA/60 is better for me. Viewing angles are also a factor, but I will be sitting in front of my screen.
 
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