2015 Samsung 4k TV as a Monitor Set Up Guide

FerrarisIV

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I think most of us are using these on Nvidia GPU's. This to me sounds like it might be an Intel driver issue.

It's possible that it could be a cable issue, as those tend to have rather unpredictable symptoms, but my money is that it is an Intel GPU driver issue.

Do you have another computer you can test it on?

Thanks for your reply. I have an old HP Pavillon laptop, I have never had problem with it. But I set it in Extended screen mode so is a different situation. With the PC I only have one monitor, that is the Samsung TV.

I also tried video driver of MSI (from the website of the Motherboard) but no had improvements...

Unfortunately is not good time to buy an external video card (for their price) and I would not know what choose because I am not so expert (I am not a gamer, simply use this PC to enjoy video with good quality, also in 4K)
 

Nebell

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Has it already been 3 years? Wow, I remember when this thread was created. I spent almost the whole summer at work just reading on [H] about new Samsung TVs XD
It's also what got me to join.
 

serowoon

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What settings do you guys have for Color Tone & 2 Point White Balance?

Using it as a monitor where white backgrounds are most common, I wasn't happy with any of the default color tone options (Cool, Standard, Warm1, Warm2), and I'm now going back and forth between Cool with 35 R-Gain (for 2 Point White Balance) and Warm2 with 35 B-Gain trying to see any differences between them, if any.

I'm trying to achieve the best color accuracy, which is said to be found on Warm2, while keeping white backgrounds free of any yellow tint.
 

Nenu

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Has anyone looked at the new 2018 Q9FNA series TVs? They appear to be spectacular!
(Not to be confused with the older Q9F series)

Up to 2000 Nits for HDR, very wide gamut, superb motion handling, HDR10 & HDR10+ & HLG (for broadcast HDR), great contrast, FALD with 480 zones, prism treated display coating to reduce side angle view colour issues and cope with room light glare, single 5m or 15m cable to connect power and signal.
Extremely low latency only just over 20mS even when using 120Hz interpolation!
It accepts 1080p 120Hz (and 1440p but the colour is washed out. Maybe that can be tweaked)
** update: 1440p 120Hz input works fine with RGB, its only a problem with ycbcr. Also they dont support 1440p 60Hz, only 120Hz. Odd but no problem :)
Very good upscaling from SD and HD.
Freesync VRR.

Downsides appear to be a slight loss of detail in very dark HDR scenes due to the aggressive dimming.
Hopefully this will improve with a firmware update. edit: indeed it did, there is no loss of detail I can detect.
And VA viewing angles if viewed from a side angle. (although +/- 40 degrees is reported to be good)
Those aside its a potentially worthy alternative to OLED without the major issues for PC use.

More info
https://www.trustedreviews.com/reviews/samsung-q9fn-qled
https://www.hughes.co.uk/blog/samsungs-qled-back-avengeance/
https://www.hughes.co.uk/blog/review-samsung-qe55q9fna-4k-ultra-hd-hdr-smart-qled-tv/
Review
https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/q9fn-q9f-q9-2018

edit, https://www.whathifi.com/samsung/qe65q9fn/review

I'm getting one for my PC.
It will do double duty as a TV/movie display nearer the sofa until much better projectors arrive.
 
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revenant

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Has it already been 3 years? Wow, I remember when this thread was created. I spent almost the whole summer at work just reading on [H] about new Samsung TVs XD
It's also what got me to join.

Yeah it was Black Friday 2015 when I got my 40" ju6700 for like $550... I had amazon match a Tiger Direct sale price. Anyways.. it's been a solid unit for the last three years. This thread was really helpful in getting things dialed in.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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Has it already been 3 years? Wow, I remember when this thread was created. I spent almost the whole summer at work just reading on [H] about new Samsung TVs XD
It's also what got me to join.

Jeez. Time flies. I felt like I just wrote this.

All of this information was available in that other massive 4k Samsung thread. I just put it together to a neat guide took some pictures, and put a bow on it in part because Kyle asked, and in part because I kept having a difficult time finding the information in those 150+ pages every time I needed it.

It was good to have everything in one place.
 
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Nebell

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Yeah it was Black Friday 2015 when I got my 40" ju6700 for like $550... I had amazon match a Tiger Direct sale price. Anyways.. it's been a solid unit for the last three years. This thread was really helpful in getting things dialed in.
Jeez. Time flies. I felt like I just wrote this.

All of this information was available in that other massive 4k Samsung thread. I just put it together to a neat guide took some pictures, and put a bow on it in part because Kyle asked, and in part because I kept having a difficult time finding the information in those 150+ pages every time I needed it.

It was good to have everything in one place.

And guess what... I'm still using my JS9000 daily a computer monitor :)
 

Zarathustra[H]

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And guess what... I'm still using my JS9000 daily a computer monitor :)

Ditto. It's a damned good screen, and I'll keep using it either until it dies, or until I can get a 43" 4k screen with G-Sync at an affordable price.
 

DarkStar02

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And guess what... I'm still using my JS9000 daily a computer monitor :)

Still using my JU7500 48" as my daily monitor. It's been getting 6-8 hours of use every day since I bought it. The power button on the back doesn't work anymore and the screen goes black/tv restarts randomly a couple times per day but it's been great.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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Still using my JU7500 48" as my daily monitor. It's been getting 6-8 hours of use every day since I bought it. The power button on the back doesn't work anymore and the screen goes black/tv restarts randomly a couple times per day but it's been great.

That's a little disconcerting. People used to own and use the same TV for decades. To have one start breaking after only 3 years doesn't exactly speak highly of Samsung's quality.

I never used the power button on the screen itself on mine. I always just use the remote, and its still working fine. The only issue I have had is that a slight lighting uniformity problem has developed over time, where the far corners are slightly brighter than the rest of the screen. I figured this was just an artifact of ot being one of the first generation of curved screens, and not having that technology quite right yet.

It's still perfectly usable though, and is not enough of an issue to have be thinking of getting rid of it.
 

Nebell

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That's a little disconcerting. People used to own and use the same TV for decades. To have one start breaking after only 3 years doesn't exactly speak highly of Samsung's quality.

I never used the power button on the screen itself on mine. I always just use the remote, and its still working fine. The only issue I have had is that a slight lighting uniformity problem has developed over time, where the far corners are slightly brighter than the rest of the screen. I figured this was just an artifact of ot being one of the first generation of curved screens, and not having that technology quite right yet.

It's still perfectly usable though, and is not enough of an issue to have be thinking of getting rid of it.

Now that you mention it, I see quite noticeable light bleed on both left and right side of my screen. It's very hard to see unless on bright or dark backgrounds, but it doesn't really bother me unless I try to look at it.
But I'm waiting on 4k/120hz tech on something 40" or larger. Preferably OLED. My 1080Ti is still serving me well at 4k and I'm not impressed by 2080Ti. I'll wait on the next gen and hopefully there will be a screen I'm looking for in a couple of years.
 

FrgMstr

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New Samsung QLED panels have what is called Game Motion Plus. I would highly suggest checking this out, unless of course you have FreeSync available.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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Exactly what I intend to use.
My plan is to put off upgrading my 1080ti for another 2 to 4 years!
Its like free SLI with 100% efficiency if it is as good as hoped.
This will offset the cost of the TV quite nicely.


I mentioned the 120Hz interpolation in post 608 but wasnt going further until I had tried it.

The Q6N, Q7N, Q8N and Q9N TVs all support it.
Except 49" panels because they are not 120Hz.

I'd imagine that any frame rate interpolation would come with a hefty input lag penalty, no?

Even if it doesn't, what's the benefit?

At least to me, 60fps and 120fps LOOK mostly the same. The difference - if any - is in the added responsive mouse feel, which you would't get if faking it via interpolation.
 
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Nenu

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I'd imagine that any frame rate interpolation would come with a hefty input lag penalty, no?

Even if it doesn't, what's the benefit?
Check post 608, its covered there.
Rtings reported it to be 21ms.

At least to me, 60fps and 120fps LOOK mostly the same. The difference - if any - is in the added responsive mouse feel, which you would think get if faking it via interpolation.
That will be the only issue, but I'm fine with 60Hz so it wont matter for me.
A major point behind interpolation is that you can achieve above 60Hz @4K for years longer with the same gfx card.
And achieve it with a 1080ti in any game.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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Now that you mention it, I see quite noticeable light bleed on both left and right side of my screen. It's very hard to see unless on bright or dark backgrounds, but it doesn't really bother me unless I try to look at it.
But I'm waiting on 4k/120hz tech on something 40" or larger. Preferably OLED. My 1080Ti is still serving me well at 4k and I'm not impressed by 2080Ti. I'll wait on the next gen and hopefully there will be a screen I'm looking for in a couple of years.

Mine really isn't bad, unless I do something silly like fill the screen with a grey background.

IMG_20180925_202727.jpg


IMG_20180925_202733.jpg
 

Nenu

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I'd imagine that any frame rate interpolation would come with a hefty input lag penalty, no?

Even if it doesn't, what's the benefit?

At least to me, 60fps and 120fps LOOK mostly the same. The difference - if any - is in the added responsive mouse feel, which you would't get if faking it via interpolation.

The 55" QLED Q9FN TV came today and first impression was wtf, it was awful!
Turns out you need to select movie mode to get rid of the garish overbright image and tweak it from there, it made a huge difference.
Since then it has become a revelation, fantastic colour and image quality at 4K res.
Its not quite so hot at 1080p but still very good.
However 1440p or 1600p are great for gaming. I havent got a working 18Gbps cable atm so havent been able to test 1440p 120Hz, but this res looks fantastic for games.

Onto Game Motion Plus interpolation.
I cant detect an increase in lag when enabled, super.
Its no replacement for framerate though, if there is judder it cant do anything about it.
Framerate of 30hz max gets slightly improved. Its nowhere near the smoothness of 60Hz though.
The benefit in 60Hz is when very fast action occurs or when panning round fast, its super smooth.
I tested this in Kingdom Come at 2560x1600 60Hz with a 1080ti.
Without it on, panning round very fast I can see some refresh rate update frames.
With it on they are gone, its amazing.

I had a quick try with HDR and wow yeah, this TV can push some Nits.
It looks fantastic!

This is quite some TV.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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The 55" QLED Q9FN TV came today and first impression was wtf, it was awful!
Turns out you need to select movie mode to get rid of the garish overbright image and tweak it from there, it made a huge difference.
Since then it has become a revelation, fantastic colour and image quality at 4K res.
Its not quite so hot at 1080p but still very good.
However 1440p or 1600p are great for gaming. I havent got a working 18Gbps cable atm so havent been able to test 1440p 120Hz, but this res looks fantastic for games.

Onto Game Motion Plus interpolation.
I cant detect an increase in lag when enabled, super.
Its no replacement for framerate though, if there is judder it cant do anything about it.
Framerate of 30hz max gets slightly improved. Its nowhere near the smoothness of 60Hz though.
The benefit in 60Hz is when very fast action occurs or when panning round fast, its super smooth.
I tested this in Kingdom Come at 2560x1600 60Hz with a 1080ti.
Without it on, panning round very fast I can see some refresh rate update frames.
With it on they are gone, its amazing.

I had a quick try with HDR and wow yeah, this TV can push some Nits.
It looks fantastic!

This is quite some TV.


I just looked these up on Samsungs webpage. Turns out 65" is the smallest size for a Q9 series TV. Heck, the smallest 4K QLED they make (a Q6 model) is 49".

This pretty much kills any chance of me buying one. I already have a 48" screen, which I wish were a few inches smaller. 43" would be perfect. 65" would be WAY too big for my application.

It's a shame that the large manufacturers seem to have abandoned high end 40-45" TV's. It's either 65+" high end TV's or mediocre ~40" TV's.
 

Nenu

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I just looked these up on Samsungs webpage. Turns out 65" is the smallest size for a Q9 series TV. Heck, the smallest 4K QLED they make (a Q6 model) is 49".

This pretty much kills any chance of me buying one. I already have a 48" screen, which I wish were a few inches smaller. 43" would be perfect. 65" would be WAY too big for my application.

It's a shame that the large manufacturers seem to have abandoned high end 40-45" TV's. It's either 65+" high end TV's or mediocre ~40" TV's.
Yeah you do need a bit of distance, I am approx 1.5m away.
I also read somewhere that the smallest Q9FN is 65" but it isnt true. There are reviews of the 55" and I have one here...
for now that is.

It has a serious issue that I spent a long time diagnosing and I think I understand why it happens.
60fps gaming is great.
But 24/25 fps video has motion artefacts.

* edit: This problem was later fixed when firmware 1153.3 was installed
The TVs flicker reduced a bit with use which is why I kept it at first. Then the firmware update sorted out nearly all the problems with using interpolation. I now use it all the time.
It used to be a severe distraction, now there is only an occasional glitch and they are not severe.
I am very picky when I say this, other people dont notice the glitches and I barely do when not looking for them.

***old issue***
Watching TV/video with the interpolation off is flickery unfortunately.
I have a 6 year old TV hooked up with the same signal and that looks fine but this new Samsung is flickery.
Other people might not be bothered but I struggle to watch tv or video without interpolation on this TV.
So the deblur/dejudder tools are necessary to turn on the TVs interpolation.
The deblur tool doesnt cause any problems but the Judder tool, as soon as it is enabled on setting 1 onward (up to 10), I see artefacts on TV/video.
Small areas of the screen where there is movement, like a person talking, moving their arms, or even a newsreaders lips moving, periodically will judder and/or look lower res.
The rest of the screen is smooth but a small area (can be anywhere) judders and often looks 1/2 res as well. Almost like deinterlacing gone wrong except it is only fed a progressive signal.
It sometimes does the same thing on much larger objects. These are both very distracting.
But it can also make the whole screen judder for up to 1 second. Not often, but enough to be very annoying.
It does this with video played on PC (1080p or UHD) or my satellite receiver (1080p 50). I tried direct connections to the TV (ie not through my AVR) but the issues persist.

I called Samsung who connected online to the TV and performed a full reset.
The problems mostly vanished. I could see small traces of the problems occasionally (now that I am sensitive to them) but could have lived with it.
Sadly, as soon as I disable overscan they return.

It looks as if the video processor isnt fast enough to cope with processing the whole image at once.
When overscan is on there is less data on screen giving it a lower CPU load and looks ok with some slight issues still.
But for £2100 I want to be able to disable overscan. I wouldnt accept this on a £200 TV.
I asked to speak to a Samsung engineer to try and establish what he knows/can detect but they dont let that happen.
Its probable the firmware simply needs optimisation and it will be perfectly fine once they get a grip on it.
But I only have a small return window to resolve this and dare not keep it unless there are sureties.
***/old issue***

Other than those problems, this TV is simply fantastic.
Video picture quality in HD is very good, better than I hoped.
Picture quality in UHD is as good as you can hope for.
The colours are fantastic!
And HDR is amazing, simply amazing.
The HLG BBC iPlayer demo in the beta section of its settings is incredible. (it doesnt appear when using a none HLG HDR TV)
If UHD HDR broadcasts will look this good, life is going to be special.
Sadly not for me with this TV though.
Hmph.
 
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Zarathustra[H]

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Yeah you do need a bit of distance, I am approx 1.5m away.
I also read somewhere that the smallest Q9FN is 65" but it isnt true. There are reviews of the 55" and I have one here...
for now that is.

It has a serious issue that I spent a long time diagnosing and I think I understand why it happens.
60fps gaming is great.
But 24/25 fps video has motion artefacts.

Watching TV/video with the interpolation off is flickery unfortunately.
I have a 6 year old TV hooked up with the same signal and that looks fine but this new Samsung is flickery.
Other people might not be bothered but I struggle to watch tv or video without interpolation on this TV.
So the deblur/dejudder tools are necessary to turn on the TVs interpolation.
The deblur tool doesnt cause any problems but the Judder tool, as soon as it is enabled on setting 1 onward (up to 10), I see artefacts on TV/video.
Small areas of the screen where there is movement, like a person talking, moving their arms, or even a newsreaders lips moving, periodically will judder and/or look lower res.
The rest of the screen is smooth but a small area (can be anywhere) judders and often looks 1/2 res as well. Almost like deinterlacing gone wrong except it is only fed a progressive signal.
It sometimes does the same thing on much larger objects. These are both very distracting.
But it can also make the whole screen judder for up to 1 second. Not often, but enough to be very annoying.
It does this with video played on PC (1080p or UHD) or my satellite receiver (1080p 50). I tried direct connections to the TV (ie not through my AVR) but the issues persist.

I called Samsung who connected online to the TV and performed a full reset.
The problems mostly vanished. I could see small traces of the problems occasionally (now that I am sensitive to them) but could have lived with it.
Sadly, as soon as I disable overscan they return.

It looks as if the video processor isnt fast enough to cope with processing the whole image at once.
When overscan is on there is less data on screen giving it a lower CPU load and looks ok with some slight issues still.
But for £2100 I want to be able to disable overscan. I wouldnt accept this on a £200 TV.
I asked to speak to a Samsung engineer to try and establish what he knows/can detect but they dont let that happen.
Its probable the firmware simply needs optimisation and it will be perfectly fine once they get a grip on it.
But I only have a small return window to resolve this and dare not keep it unless there are sureties.

Other than those problems, this TV is simply fantastic.
Video picture quality in HD is very good, better than I hoped.
Picture quality in UHD is as good as you can hope for.
The colours are fantastic!
And HDR is amazing, simply amazing.
The HLG BBC iPlayer demo in the beta section of its settings is incredible. (it doesnt appear when using a none HLG HDR TV)
If UHD HDR broadcasts will look this good, life is going to be special.
Sadly not for me with this TV though.
Hmph.


Hmm. Usually TV's handle low refresh 24hz content by refreshing the same frame multiple times, so, for instance, if your TV has a 120hz panel, when viewing 24hz movies, each frame is refreshed 5 times.

This tends to take care of the flicker issue without molesting the frames, like that interpolation stuff does. Tons of directors and other film professionals have been railing against interpolation for some time, calling it the "soap opera effect". The latest, just a few days ago, were Christopher Nolan and Paul Thomas Anderson. For TV or movie watching I'd keep any interpolation off, but I'd expect multiple frame refresh to be on in order to eliminate flicker.
 

Nenu

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Hmm. Usually TV's handle low refresh 24hz content by refreshing the same frame multiple times, so, for instance, if your TV has a 120hz panel, when viewing 24hz movies, each frame is refreshed 5 times.

This tends to take care of the flicker issue without molesting the frames, like that interpolation stuff does. Tons of directors and other film professionals have been railing against interpolation for some time, calling it the "soap opera effect". The latest, just a few days ago, were Christopher Nolan and Paul Thomas Anderson. For TV or movie watching I'd keep any interpolation off, but I'd expect multiple frame refresh to be on in order to eliminate flicker.
If I could handle how the TV looks without interpolation I would be happy.
But it flickers/judders almost like a CRT at 60Hz to me. Its not quite the same but I can see it clearly.
When there is fast movement or a fast pan its like I see every frame.
I can see even small movements have sudden small changes in position.
Like the TV has removed all motion blur when interpolation is not in use.

edit:
The lower the definition/less bright or slower the motion, the harder it is to detect.
HD bright scenes are not pleasant to watch.
I wonder if they are halving the framerate or something close.

For example, with interpolation off I just watched a TV report where they focused on a page of text and panned right slowly.
It was like sample and hold, the text was jumping to new positions as the camera panned.
Then a woman reporter spoke and again it was like sample and hold happening very fast watching her mouth move.
Its like this with everything when interpolation is turned off.

As posted above, I placed an older LG TV next to it and that looks fine. I also have an old 22" PC monitor that has been used as a small TV display and that looks fine too. Same with my projector. At the same time the Samsung TV looks flickery.
Its not possible for me to use it without the Judder control, but thats broken with motion artefacts.
fyi, the Judder and Blur settings are inside a menu called 'Auto Motion Plus settings'.

I "do not" want to return this TV, it is one of my pet hates to return things.
But unless some kind of magic happens to make normal framerate TV look better or remove the artefacts from the Judder control, I cant avoid it.
I'll keep it until Monday in the hope a new firmware comes out in time.
 
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Nenu

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Hmm. Usually TV's handle low refresh 24hz content by refreshing the same frame multiple times, so, for instance, if your TV has a 120hz panel, when viewing 24hz movies, each frame is refreshed 5 times.

This tends to take care of the flicker issue without molesting the frames, like that interpolation stuff does.

I came across this article which covers the exact problems I explained in the post above.
https://www.flatpanelshd.com/review.php?subaction=showfull&id=1525936564
I'm glad he has put a name to both problems, stutter and judder.

On the 24fps video stutter
Motion performance is a mixed bag. While watching very bright scenes, Q9FN exhibits the same stroboscope effect that we have observed on OLED. Unfortunately, it cannot be resolved by activating the Auto Motion Plus system without introducing visual motion artefacts. The effect relates to the low frame rate that movies are shot in (24Hz), specifically that 24Hz video tends to stutter even more (not to be confused with judder) when reproduced at higher brightness levels. While one would usually strive to make response time as low as possible on a display technology, low response time has this side effect that it actually reproduces more of the flaws inherent in the video content. In the past, and when watching a movie on a projector system (that has inherent motion judder), the transition from one frame to another is blurred out to some degree. As we move to high frame rate video, this issue should disappear.


Confirmation of the judder introduced by the Motion plus system
On a few occasions, we observed that Auto Motion Plus actually added judder rather than reduce judder.
He found better quality video exhibits it less but I find the opposite.
SD TV mostly looks fine. Any effects are mild and I can live with them.
Some HD TV can look very bad but its not always like that, I hardly see it for long sections of time and then the next program its back.
Certain 1080p BD videos are really bad.
ie Humans Series 3. When the start of episode 2 covers the previous episode, many people talk and 4 of them have judder over their faces/mouths and there are other larger events of judder.

The best quality smoothness of video is when LED Clear Motion is enabled (inside the Motion Plus menu).
Unfortunately this is achieved by inserting black frames between each frame but it really works.
However when a bright scene is on its way too flickery. Only then is it as bad as the stutter when Motion plus is disabled (ie interpolation is turned off).
(ps I only use brightness of 15 out of 50 in the darker movie mode)
So I cant use LED Clear Motion either.

I adore this TV in many other respects though and am trying to find a way I can keep it and be happy.
 
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Zarathustra[H]

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I came across this article which covers the exact problems I explained in the post above.
https://www.flatpanelshd.com/review.php?subaction=showfull&id=1525936564
I'm glad he has put a name to both problems, stutter and judder.

On the 24fps video stutter



Confirmation of the judder introduced by the Motion plus system

He found better quality video exhibits it less but I find the opposite.
SD TV mostly looks fine. Any effects are mild and I can live with them.
Some HD TV can look very bad but its not always like that, I hardly see it for long sections of time and then the next program its back.
Certain 1080p BD videos are really bad.
ie Humans Series 3. When the start of episode 2 covers the previous episode, many people talk and 4 of them have judder over their faces/mouths and there are other larger events of judder.

The best quality smoothness of video is when LED Clear Motion is enabled (inside the Motion Plus menu).
Unfortunately this is achieved by inserting black frames between each frame but it really works.
However when a bright scene is on its way too flickery. Only then is it as bad as the stutter when Motion plus is disabled (ie interpolation is turned off).
(ps I only use brightness of 15 out of 50 in the darker movie mode)
So I cant use LED Clear Motion either.

I adore this TV in many other respects though and am trying to find a way I can keep it and be happy.


Seems kind of shitty of them to blame the source content when there are plenty of TV's on the market that don't have this problem.

And interpolation effects like "Auto-Motion-Plus" or higher refresh rate video are the last thing you want, as they prodice the "soap opera effect" where everything looks like Dr Oz and other daytime television garbage, instead of a movie.

Samsung should have considered this and used a multi exposure algorithm as other TV makers do.

It is the very fact that films are shot in 24hz that give them that movie mystique. This is often co ololetely lost at higher refresh rates
 

Nenu

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Seems kind of shitty of them to blame the source content when there are plenty of TV's on the market that don't have this problem.

And interpolation effects like "Auto-Motion-Plus" or higher refresh rate video are the last thing you want, as they prodice the "soap opera effect" where everything looks like Dr Oz and other daytime television garbage, instead of a movie.

Samsung should have considered this and used a multi exposure algorithm as other TV makers do.

It is the very fact that films are shot in 24hz that give them that movie mystique. This is often co ololetely lost at higher refresh rates
Its sad.
This TV is otherwise a masterpiece that is very close to OLED colour quality, gives double+ the brightness of OLED in HDR (which is great), is resilient enough for PC use and has incredibly low lag.
I just tried the pretend HDR with normal TV and it can work really well. Although I turned the brightness down a ton it still gives really good highlights. Glass and metal reflections look real.
Its turned off now cos I dont want to break my eyesight lol. After watching HDR, normal colour looks a bit flat and takes time to get used to again.
 

Nenu

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I've decided to try and live with it.
Motion Plus is off for TV viewing, I have to ignore the stutters and it does get easier over time.
But with Blu Ray playback they are so much more pronounced I have to turn motion control on to level 5 or 6 (out of 10) to make it look as it should - without the soap opera effect.
It artefacts but less now possibly because...

Until today I havent had 18Gbps HDMI cables, they just arrived.
Previously the NVidia driver let me use UHD mode in ycbcr 4:2:0.
Now I can select RGB full at last.
Whether its the increase in cable bandwidth or using RGB I'm not sure yet but it has halved the number of judders with Blu Ray playback when auto motion plus is enabled.
This is making it easier to accept.

And something that might be a bonus.
I read comments that playing HDR content from PC needs to use ycbcr 4:2:2 or 4:2:0 because there isnt enough HDMI bandwidth to do it over RGB (full or limited).
As I was using ycbcr 4:2:0 until now I wasnt able to verify.
Using 18Gbps cables with UHD 60Hz RGB full, HDR movie playback works perfectly. No need to change display mode.
Is this normal?
 

Nenu

[H]ardened
Joined
Apr 28, 2007
Messages
19,438
Haha, sussed it.
Get a few mates round, have stack of beers and all the frames blur into each other (using interpolation off!).
Perfect TV when getting pissed :D
 

Nebell

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 20, 2015
Messages
1,930
Yikes, that it is.

I wonder if that's because I keep mine at a lower backlight setting. Generally 6 or 7. Above that and it gets too bright for me. It hurts my eyes

Yeah, I have backlight at 20 and contrast at 100 and also the picture mode to entertain instead of standard.
It's opposite for me. I keep my room well light when gaming because my eyes hurt when the only light source is the screen. And if the whole room is lit up, then reading on the screen becomes really tedious if it's not bright enough.
 

Zarathustra[H]

Fully [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
31,220
Yeah, I have backlight at 20 and contrast at 100 and also the picture mode to entertain instead of standard.
It's opposite for me. I keep my room well light when gaming because my eyes hurt when the only light source is the screen. And if the whole room is lit up, then reading on the screen becomes really tedious if it's not bright enough.

Wow, yeah we really do have very different preferences.

I took one look at "entertain" mode when I set up the screen originally said NOPE
 

Nenu

[H]ardened
Joined
Apr 28, 2007
Messages
19,438
Seems kind of shitty of them to blame the source content when there are plenty of TV's on the market that don't have this problem.

And interpolation effects like "Auto-Motion-Plus" or higher refresh rate video are the last thing you want, as they prodice the "soap opera effect" where everything looks like Dr Oz and other daytime television garbage, instead of a movie.

Samsung should have considered this and used a multi exposure algorithm as other TV makers do.

It is the very fact that films are shot in 24hz that give them that movie mystique. This is often co ololetely lost at higher refresh rates

Update: (about my Samsung QE55Q9FN QLED TV for those that missed what I'm talking about :))

I'm keeping this TV.
The really bad flickering with interpolation off was caused by it being new and not run in because it has improved with use.
On TV I barely notice it now.
On 24fps movies its a bit more prominent until my attention is drawn to the movie.
There must be an element of getting used to it but whatever it takes is fine by me, I dont want to lose it.
Its the dogs danglies as a PC gaming monitor and for HDR movies.

I'll update if they fix the interpolation judder problems.
Right now I'm in glee :D
 

Nenu

[H]ardened
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Messages
19,438
Update 2:

Installed the latest firmware today, version 1153.3, after reading it helps with video glitching.
Its not available using the update menu, downloaded from Samsungs web site and installed via USB.

The jerking problems that occurred when using Auto Motion Plus are completely gone.
Tested with all my previous worst case videos and they play straight through the problem areas as though there never was a problem.
Wonderful. Perfect.

The only thing making this not the perfect TV is it not being 110" diagonal so I can replace my projector :)
Its all I could ask for from a TV + PC monitor, and then some.
Highly recommended!

edit
Well damn!
2560x1440 120Hz res looks better than 1080p, its almost as though its the TVs native res.
I'm baffled how it can look so good, I'm sure it wasnt this good before the firmware update.
Gaming at this res/Hz with a 1080ti is superb.
 
Last edited:

jincuteguy

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 25, 2008
Messages
407
So it's 2018 and almost 2019 now, between Sony, Samsung QLED, and LG Super UHD, which brand is better to use as a gaming monitor for PC? I'm not talking about their Flagship TVs, just the midrange ones ....
Any info would be appreciated.
 

Ziming

n00b
Joined
Nov 9, 2006
Messages
50
So it's 2018 and almost 2019 now, between Sony, Samsung QLED, and LG Super UHD, which brand is better to use as a gaming monitor for PC? I'm not talking about their Flagship TVs, just the midrange ones ....
Any info would be appreciated.

Samsung LED – 55″ UN55NU8500 – Input Lag: 16ms
https://displaylag.com/good-for-gaming-samsung-tvs-tested-for-input-lag/

Here's a well written Amazon review from someone who uses the set for PC gaming.

I was originally going to wait until I've owned the TV for a few months before writing this, but given that nobody else has written an in-depth review on it for Amazon yet, I figure it couldn't hurt to do one after only a couple of weeks, especially given that I already know my way around the TV quite well (and can always edit this review later). Now keep in mind that I bought this TV to be solely used as a monitor for PC games, so not everything I'll be covering here may apply to you.

With that out of the way, let's talk about the one thing most people care about: Picture quality. Contrast is great for a non-OLED TV; it's not anything mind-blowing, but if you're upgrading from an older TV or monitor, the blacks will blow you away. This TV also has fairly accurate colors right out of the box, which is good, since it disables most of the picture settings when it's running in PC mode (like 20 Point White Balance, which for some stupid reason cannot be adjusted when the TV detects a PC). I'll post the settings you need to change at the end of the review.

Next I'd like to talk about the reason why I chose this TV over the competition: Input Lag. If you don't know what that is, I'll explain it simply: every TV and monitor introduces a small delay because of the time it takes to receive the signal, process it, and then display it for your eyes to feast on. This small delay means that what you're seeing in a game actually arrives at your eyes slightly later than when it actually occurred in-game, making it harder to react if input lag is high. Every TV/monitor has input lag, and the more processing it has to do (and the slower it does it), the higher input lag it'll have. Thankfully this TV has the lowest overall input lag of any TV in existence at the moment, thanks to the fast quad-core processor that powers everything it does. Depending on your settings, it can go as low as 9.3ms (which is roughly the same amount of time it takes for a CRT monitor to draw an image, which if you didn't already know, is RIDICULOUSLY fast), or as high as 27ms with Game Motion Plus turned on (which you won't even notice unless you game competitively; more on that later).

Now because the TV is has native 120Hz panel, that means that you can run games at a silky-smooth 120FPS (if your PC can handle it), which if you haven't seen in person before, makes 60 FPS look like 30 FPS. If you play a lot of shooters or any game that requires fast reflexes, you will fall in love with this TV. Unfortunately there's a catch: 120Hz can only work @ 1440p or 1080p. You are limited to 60Hz @ 4K. This is not because of any fault of the TV itself, but rather a limitation of the HDMI 2.0 standard. No TV can accept a 4K120 signal at the moment, not at least until TVs complying with the new HDMI 2.1 standard start popping up within a year or two. It doesn't really matter anyway since there isn't a single PC or console in existence that can handle 4K120 gaming yet, plus there's a workaround to get a 120Hz-like image @ 4K which I'll touch upon next. Not to mention that this TV does an absolute stellar job at upscaling; so much so that you can run games @ 1440p all day and won't even notice that your TV isn't running at its native 4K resolution unless you're sitting two feet away from the screen.

So speaking of which, the next thing I want to touch upon is called Game Motion Plus, which is this magical little feature that converts games to 120Hz while introducing such little input lag, that only the most competitive gamers will notice it (27ms as I mentioned earlier). You may already know this as the "Soap Opera Effect", and while most people would probably agree that it makes TV shows and movies look worse, it's an absolute godsend for gaming. I'll tell you why: through some sophisticated processing magic, this TV is able to analyze the image on the screen, and insert its own frames in between whatever your PC/console is able to render, making the game appear to be running at a higher FPS than it actually is. This means that your 30 FPS games will look like they're running at 60, and your 60 FPS games will look like they're running at 120. Most TVs nowadays can do this, but this particular SAMSUNG is the ONLY TV in existence right now that can do so while still keeping input lag low. This also means that 4K games will run @ 120Hz when playing in 4K, even though you can't actually send a 120Hz signal @ 4K through an HDMI cable just yet. For single player games and multiplayer titles that don't require fast reflexes, you'll want to have this feature turned ON.

[That's it for now, I will update this review later to touch upon the cons of this TV, as well as discuss things like HDR, the smart features, menu navigation, and the remote.]

And as promised, my recommended settings for PC gaming use (any settings I don't mention here, you can safely assume that they can be left on default):

DEVICE TYPE: PC
PICTURE MODE: Standard or Game (or Movie if your TV isn't hooked up to a PC)
BACKLIGHT: your personal preference
BRIGHTNESS: 0
CONTRAST: 50
SHARPNESS: 10 (which means no added sharpness nor blurriness to a PC signal)
LOCAL DIMMING: High
COLOR TONE: Warm2
GAMMA: 0
HDMI UHD COLOR: Enabled for all inputs
HDMI BLACK LEVEL: Auto
GAME MODE: On
FREESYNC: Ultimate (if you have a compatible AMD graphics card or console, otherwise Off)
GAME MOTION PLUS: On for Games (except competitive twitch shooters), On for movies/videos/TV (unless you hate the soap opera effect), off when viewing the desktop (unless you want the soap opera effect for streaming sites like YouTube)
BLUR REDUCTION: 10 (only applies when Game Motion Plus is On)
JUDDER REDUCTION: 10 (ditto)
AMBIENT LIGHT DETECTION: Personal preference. Adjusts the backlight depending on how bright your room is. This setting also dims the backlight when dark scenes are being shown on the TV. Some people may like this, others might be irritated by it.
 

cybereality

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
6,455
I have a Samsung Q7F, it's very nice for gaming. It does have FreeSync, but if you have a good Nvidia card it's still nice without the FreeSync feature.

Mainly because it has this thing called Game Motion Plus, with will smooth out a low fps to a high refresh rate. I'd say it looks similar to real 90fps but with added lag (enough to be noticeable but still playable).

Since 4K high refresh is not an option for TVs at this point, this is the next best thing.
 

Zarathustra[H]

Fully [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
31,220
I have a Samsung Q7F, it's very nice for gaming. It does have FreeSync, but if you have a good Nvidia card it's still nice without the FreeSync feature.

Mainly because it has this thing called Game Motion Plus, with will smooth out a low fps to a high refresh rate. I'd say it looks similar to real 90fps but with added lag (enough to be noticeable but still playable).

Since 4K high refresh is not an option for TVs at this point, this is the next best thing.


How does that different from Auto Motion Plus?

Some people on here used to like it, but I found it added a shit ton of input lag making games almost unplayable.
 

cybereality

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
6,455
Yeah, it's like Motion Plus on the older TVs but with reduced lag so it can be used with gaming.

I had the older version on my last TV and it was useless for gaming: lag, artifacts, etc. The new version is not perfect, but it works.
 

Zarathustra[H]

Fully [H]
Joined
Oct 29, 2000
Messages
31,220
So,

Something really sketchy happened with my JS9000 today.

After all the stories out there of peoples smart TV's spying on them, I have kept my ethernet cable unplugged from my JS9000. I have also never connected it to my WiFi, so it does not have my WiFi password stored.

A connection test confirms it cannot reach the internet.

Yet somehow when I powered on my TV today, it forced a firmware update on me. Made me wait wile installing it, and then restarted.

WTF? Where did this firmware update come from?
 
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