Sponsor Of Interstate Swatting Hoax Act Gets Swatted

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This was bound to happen. I feel bad for the guy that pulled this one off, you know they are going to come down on him like a ton of bricks. :eek:

Suddenly, police lights engulfed their Melrose home. Clark was startled to find cruisers blocking both ends of her street and police officers, “some with long guns,” on her front lawn. An officer told her they had received a report of an active shooter at her house — a false report, it turns out, possibly prompted by her legislation that would go after similar pranks.
 
As long as police treat every single report as valid without verifying it first, this will continue to happen regardless of the penalties for being caught.
 
Idiots, they've just made it more likely that she'll convince them to up the penalties on swatters. But then again I think everyone who does this is an idiot. Almost all of them get caught and they don't gain anything from doing it.
 
Hypergreatthing said:
As long as police treat every single report as valid without verifying it first, this will continue to happen regardless of the penalties for being caught.
Click to expand...

That goes two ways though, in the situations they are believing to be in, there isn't time to recon the area, report the findings back to the team leader and then a decision for action is made. What will happen if this process gets bogged down with procedures and delays is when it is necessary (which doesn't hit headlines often) it will likely end in ruin as there will be too much time passed. Not sure what the fix is other than severe punishment for it, but then we end up spending money to keep these idiots in jail. sigh...
 
Hypergreatthing said:
As long as police treat every single report as valid without verifying it first, this will continue to happen regardless of the penalties for being caught.
Click to expand...

The problem is, damned if you do damned if you don't.

If the cops try to guess and guess wrong, they will get accused of not doing enough.

If this continues, swatting will keep happening.

Honestly, not sure what the solution to this is.
 
Sovereign said:
The problem is, damned if you do damned if you don't.

If the cops try to guess and guess wrong, they will get accused of not doing enough.

If this continues, swatting will keep happening.

Honestly, not sure what the solution to this is.
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Not just "not doing enough." They will get sued for negligence.
 
Sovereign said:
The problem is, damned if you do damned if you don't.

If the cops try to guess and guess wrong, they will get accused of not doing enough.

If this continues, swatting will keep happening.

Honestly, not sure what the solution to this is.
Click to expand...

get rid of swat teams
 
kirbyrj said:
Not just "not doing enough." They will get sued for negligence.
Click to expand...

not a concern, the police have no obligation to protect the public. If they fail to "protect and serve" the shit out of you, they haven't breached their duties.
 
spintroniX said:
get rid of swat teams
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Then you'll just have less trained police with guns showing up, unprepared for a situation.

It's not like every police force has police set aside to do nothing more than be a SWAT team. Most are everyday cops that are just specially trained for certain situations and a wider range of weapons stored at the station for use.

My hometown's SWAT team are normal officers who happen to take 1 day a week to train, instead of working the beat. Then they're on call 24/7, except on vacation. No extra pay or anything for it either. Aside from a couple MP5s, UMPs, and grenade launcher, the rest is standard weapons you can buy from a gun store. They don't use explosive grenades, just tear gas or flashbang style ones.
 
spintroniX said:
not a concern, the police have no obligation to protect the public. If they fail to "protect and serve" the shit out of you, they haven't breached their duties.
Click to expand...

Not while we have lawyers in the USA ... a policeman or force that didn't meet the perceived need would likely be sued for massive damages ... city governments (unlike the Federal government) are not exempted from lawsuits
 
kbrickley said:
Not while we have lawyers in the USA ... a policeman or force that didn't meet the perceived need would likely be sued for massive damages ... city governments (unlike the Federal government) are not exempted from lawsuits
Click to expand...

sorry, reading comprehension fail. Sure, lawsuits are a "problem" - but mainly for the taxpayers, since that's who pays them.
 
Hypergreatthing said:
As long as police treat every single report as valid without verifying it first, this will continue to happen regardless of the penalties for being caught.
Click to expand...

Meanwhile everyone who's not a US representative or other high ranking political figure will get a couple police cruisers at most whenever some shooter is mentioned.
 
Sovereign said:
Honestly, not sure what the solution to this is.
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Besides jail time, the idiots who do this should be fined 2x the cost of sending out the police/swat.
Then they should be banned from owning a computer or smart phone for several years.
 
kbrickley said:
Not while we have lawyers in the USA ... a policeman or force that didn't meet the perceived need would likely be sued for massive damages ... city governments (unlike the Federal government) are not exempted from lawsuits
Click to expand...

Common misconception.
In most states, the police have no legal obligation to come to your help.
They could be sitting somewhere on break, eating doughnuts, while watching you be attacked, and you have no legal recourse against them for not coming to your help.
 
We need full time video surveillance. With cameras on the street in the area that was called in, along with audio, you can view and listen to see if there is an active situation there or not. Gain audio through their cell phone if needed. Any possible shooter situation would be warrant enough to gain access to that.

Where is CreepyUncleGoogle? I miss this stuff.
 
Can we just give these people life sentences without parole already? I would say death sentence but for some idiots, that's too harsh for attempted murder and animal cruelty. If you don't understand why it's both:

Attempted murder - Police enter a home expecting an active shooter, if you're holding your cell phone wrong and it's dark, they might kill you because they think you're holding a gun.

Animal cruelty - The first thing SWAT will do upon entering your house is kill your dog. They don't know if it's hostile and don't have time time to gently shoo it away when they think there's someone with a gun killing people in the house.

Solution? Kill the people responsible for this or put them in prison for life without parole. These people aren't contributing to society, there's no reason to SWAT someone. We aren't talking about stealing bread for your hungry child. We're talking about an attempt to bring about senseless violence and wasting police resources and taxpayer money.
 
Seventyfive said:
Can we just give these people life sentences without parole already? I would say death sentence but for some idiots, that's too harsh for attempted murder and animal cruelty. If you don't understand why it's both:

Attempted murder - Police enter a home expecting an active shooter, if you're holding your cell phone wrong and it's dark, they might kill you because they think you're holding a gun.

Animal cruelty - The first thing SWAT will do upon entering your house is kill your dog. They don't know if it's hostile and don't have time time to gently shoo it away when they think there's someone with a gun killing people in the house.

Solution? Kill the people responsible for this or put them in prison for life without parole. These people aren't contributing to society, there's no reason to SWAT someone. We aren't talking about stealing bread for your hungry child. We're talking about an attempt to bring about senseless violence and wasting police resources and taxpayer money.
Click to expand...

This is one instance where I support Islamic style punishments. IE. Thiefs get their hands cut off.

So life in prison and we cut out their tongue, as they used speech to call the fake report in.
 
Jim Kim said:
Make penalties super harsh, life ruining harsh.
Click to expand...

Sounds great, won't work if history is any guide.

We have pretty harsh penalties for lots of things and the deterrent effect, as far as I know, hasn't really been sussed out.

Plus, this will just encourage encryption and obfuscation so they can't be caught (VoIP phones, etc). I'm not saying break encryption or ban VoIP, but the tech heads who like to pretend nothing bad could ever come of these things need to help figure out a solution rather than just bleating on about "freedom."

Freedom has consequences.

Let's find a way to handle them.
 
Sovereign said:
Sounds great, won't work if history is any guide.

We have pretty harsh penalties for lots of things and the deterrent effect, as far as I know, hasn't really been sussed out.

Plus, this will just encourage encryption and obfuscation so they can't be caught (VoIP phones, etc). I'm not saying break encryption or ban VoIP, but the tech heads who like to pretend nothing bad could ever come of these things need to help figure out a solution rather than just bleating on about "freedom."

Freedom has consequences.

Let's find a way to handle them.
Click to expand...

Incarceration isn't always for rehabilitation. That's a huge myth perpetuated by the left. Sometimes incarceration is to keep these fucking people away from the rest of us.
 
Sovereign said:
Sounds great, won't work if history is any guide.

We have pretty harsh penalties for lots of things and the deterrent effect, as far as I know, hasn't really been sussed out.

Plus, this will just encourage encryption and obfuscation so they can't be caught (VoIP phones, etc). I'm not saying break encryption or ban VoIP, but the tech heads who like to pretend nothing bad could ever come of these things need to help figure out a solution rather than just bleating on about "freedom."

Freedom has consequences.

Let's find a way to handle them.
Click to expand...

As far as being a deterrent:

pageitemD05.gif
 
nutzo said:
Besides jail time, the idiots who do this should be fined 2x the cost of sending out the police/swat.
Then they should be banned from owning a computer or smart phone for several years.
Click to expand...

Strip them of their human rights and make them battle a den of lions in hand to hand .. (paw??) combat . Streamed live for all to watch online for $5. Easy way for the government to make money without more taxes, helps feed hungry lions, and gets rid of idiots. Seems like a good idea to me.

Ur_Mom said:
We need full time video surveillance. With cameras on the street in the area that was called in, along with audio, you can view and listen to see if there is an active situation there or not. Gain audio through their cell phone if needed. Any possible shooter situation would be warrant enough to gain access to that.

Where is CreepyUncleGoogle? I miss this stuff.
Click to expand...

I had wondered that myself. She hasn't been here since we all had our passwords reset so I think she was one of us that didn't have a valid email on record and must not have requested to have Kyle fix that to let her back on. That or some admin banned her account around the same time that all happen. Either way she has been gone for 1 month tomorrow.
 
krotch said:
Aside from a couple MP5s, UMPs, and grenade launcher, the rest is standard weapons you can buy from a gun store. They don't use explosive grenades, just tear gas or flashbang style ones.
Click to expand...

Ya, aside from that, they are completely normal police officers.

The uniform even says "POLICE" right there on the front....just like normal.

Ferguson.jpg
 
nutzo said:
Besides jail time, the idiots who do this should be fined 2x the cost of sending out the police/swat.
Then they should be banned from owning a computer or smart phone for several years.
Click to expand...

I prefer that we draw and quarter them at the public square. I cannot stand these POS that do crap like this.
 
Seventyfive said:
Incarceration isn't always for rehabilitation. That's a huge myth perpetuated by the left. Sometimes incarceration is to keep these fucking people away from the rest of us.
Click to expand...

That's why we have some fun laws like the sexually violent predator acts. Not sure how it works in other states, but in California once you get classified as SVP, you are pretty much stuck in an institution until you are "cured". "Cured" in this since means you no longer are aroused by sexually violent images. They hook your penis up to a machine and make you look at terrible photos. If you start to get aroused even just a little bit, its back to the loony bin for you. So realistically you have 2 ways out: Castration or Legal loophole. 2 guesses as to which pretense more SVPs have been released under.

I should also mention, SVPs have usually fulfilled their prison terms... they've been locked up in prison for 10-15 years already. Once the term is up, instead of getting paroled they get shipped off to a mental institution. Some may think its cruel, they've paid their debt blah blah blah... Just read their court files. Read what these people have done, and you will have no sympathy for them at all. Unlike murderers, their victims don't die, and generally go on to lead dysfunctional lives... and then their children in turn become dysfunctional because their parent(s) where raped as children. Its a crime that keeps on giving.
 
My take is if they swat, all actions from swat shall be treated as if they were done by non LEO, the charged tallied up, and then levied against the caller.

They are looking at multiple counts of armed burglary of an occupied swelling, assault with a deadly weapon, public endangerment, (if they fire) attempted murder (first degree since they planned for swat to attack them), and so on. Make them spend the rest of their lives in the system.

Also, it'll ensure they never get to vote, which is a good thing, less idiots to go around.

The best way to stop it is to make it so costly to do such a thing that they won't. Also, if the phone line isn't a mobile or landline, no 911. mobile VOIP providers need to get their act together if they want in on the 911 bandwagon.
 
Seventyfive said:
Incarceration isn't always for rehabilitation. That's a huge myth perpetuated by the left. Sometimes incarceration is to keep these fucking people away from the rest of us.
Click to expand...

And that sounds like to me a myth perpetuated by the right. If you actually want some truth, the issue with incarceration from the left, and even many on the right these days, is that we lock up people for too long for too little costing too much and then when people get at they have too little opportunity to do anything but to go back to prison.
 
Wiffle said:
That's why we have some fun laws like the sexually violent predator acts. Not sure how it works in other states, but in California once you get classified as SVP, you are pretty much stuck in an institution until you are "cured". "Cured" in this since means you no longer are aroused by sexually violent images. They hook your penis up to a machine and make you look at terrible photos. If you start to get aroused even just a little bit, its back to the loony bin for you. So realistically you have 2 ways out: Castration or Legal loophole. 2 guesses as to which pretense more SVPs have been released under.

I should also mention, SVPs have usually fulfilled their prison terms... they've been locked up in prison for 10-15 years already. Once the term is up, instead of getting paroled they get shipped off to a mental institution. Some may think its cruel, they've paid their debt blah blah blah... Just read their court files. Read what these people have done, and you will have no sympathy for them at all. Unlike murderers, their victims don't die, and generally go on to lead dysfunctional lives... and then their children in turn become dysfunctional because their parent(s) where raped as children. Its a crime that keeps on giving.
Click to expand...

Problem with that is that you can still rape somebody in a violet and brutal way without a penis so cutting it off doesn't really change anything. I am think of a few ways off the top of my head to do really horrible things to a person with me actually inserting myself inside of them. And yes I know how that makes me sound.
 
westrock2000 said:
Ya, aside from that, they are completely normal police officers.

The uniform even says "POLICE" right there on the front....just like normal.
Click to expand...

Congratulations on not quoting my whole post and making yourself look like a douche
 
Did anyone actually ask any of these swatters why did they do it? We should find out the root cause and maybe just maybe try addressing that, to prevent or reduce further occurrences.
 
krotch said:
Then you'll just have less trained police with guns showing up, unprepared for a situation.

It's not like every police force has police set aside to do nothing more than be a SWAT team. Most are everyday cops that are just specially trained for certain situations and a wider range of weapons stored at the station for use.

My hometown's SWAT team are normal officers who happen to take 1 day a week to train, instead of working the beat. Then they're on call 24/7, except on vacation. No extra pay or anything for it either. Aside from a couple MP5s, UMPs, and grenade launcher, the rest is standard weapons you can buy from a gun store. They don't use explosive grenades, just tear gas or flashbang style ones.
Click to expand...

Going in guns drawn on a single anonymous phone call or tweet is fucking ridiculous. If the call is from the home itself or across the street, or there is more than one call from a distinct source or the person took it seriously enough to identify himself or the residence is associated with violence, these things dramatically increase the legitimacy and don't add a mountain of bureaucracy. It's not that hard, really.
 
jpm100 said:
Going in guns drawn on a single anonymous phone call or tweet is fucking ridiculous. If the call is from the home itself or across the street, or there is more than one call from a distinct source or the person took it seriously enough to identify himself or the residence is associated with violence, these things dramatically increase the legitimacy and don't add a mountain of bureaucracy. It's not that hard, really.
Click to expand...

It seems like that is what is trying to be worked on, not accepting the calls or low priority for calls that are identified as too far away. Which makes sense, yes there may be cases where someone gets screwed but like I try to tell people, best to be prepared and ready for most likely situations instead of least likely.
 
jpm100 said:
Going in guns drawn on a single anonymous phone call or tweet is fucking ridiculous. If the call is from the home itself or across the street, or there is more than one call from a distinct source or the person took it seriously enough to identify himself or the residence is associated with violence, these things dramatically increase the legitimacy and don't add a mountain of bureaucracy. It's not that hard, really.
Click to expand...

Yes, it is that hard. There are times where a family member goes crazy, grabs a gun, while the rest of the family run and lock themselves in a room and call the police. If no shots are fired, guess what? No one else aside from those within the house will know about it. Man takes family hostage isn't that rare of an occurrence either. Some have been at knife point, where no gun shots. Probably just some yelling.

Waiting for multiple reports will simply delay response. That or if they send regular officers, they may not be equipped to handle the situation. So more delays while they wait for SWAT to show up. Rather they sent SWAT and not need them, than need them and not have them. Not that every swatting incident ends up with SWAT teams showing up anyways. Just like this incident. It was just regular Melrose police that showed up. Guess it's just up to the discretion of the local police on how they react.

My thing would be to change the response. Any and all raids on a house have to be "knock" raids. The "no-knock" raids are dangerous to the home occupants and the police officers. With many ppl owning guns, they're likely to use guns when they hear someone breaking into their house. Although, at the same time if it's real, it could end up changing to a hostage situation.

There's no real right way or wrong way of doing things. Luckily no one has been killed in a swatting incident to date, but I can see that changing any time.
 
Oh, when I say "knock" raids and "no-knock" raids, I just mean for these quick calls. Raids for other things, well, guess they can do whatever. I mean, I wouldn't knock if I was raiding a known meth lab.
 
krotch said:
Oh, when I say "knock" raids and "no-knock" raids, I just mean for these quick calls. Raids for other things, well, guess they can do whatever. I mean, I wouldn't knock if I was raiding a known meth lab.
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agreed. something needs done before there is a massacre that shouldn't have happened. that whole ounce of prevention thing.
 
What happened to the days of sending a car to check something out instead of a swat team.:confused:
 
By verify i mean the following:
Check to see if the number calling you is a local number or one from another state. This is pretty much a dead give away that it's a hoax.
Call a neighbor where the disturbance is located and try and verify or not.
Record name and number of person calling about.
Ignore reports from blocked numbers or take then lightly.
 
yes because one is a day to day street cop, while the other is in full tactical/riot gear, totally the same thing!
 
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