Harley-Davidson Electric Motorcycle Test Drive

About the sound: I'm sure once H-D starts selling an electric bike, there will be a $500 option to give you the "Harley" sound. It's pretty much what they have done with their regular bikes anyway. Mess up the sound on stock bikes, thus making people spend $500+ in accessories to get the old sound they want.
 
I know I'm going to garner plenty of hate for this statement, but I think bikes and cars should have a specific, nation wide decibel limit with criminal consequences for exceeding that limit.

A good machine is one which is so silent, so well engineered, that you don't even know it's working.

I mean, do people at LAN parties turn up their fans and put loud speakers on their spinning HD clicks and whirs so that no one can miss it?

It's just ridiculous. Might as well wear a clown suit with neon signs pointing to your crotch and your junk hanging out. :p
 
I put playing cards in all my PC fans, that's how I know it's working.

Jokes aside, there's something about the low rumble of dino juice engines that makes me all excited, like I should be drinking whiskey and shooting guns at the same time. Super silent electric poindexter cars (and bikes) are just so... Sterile.
 
TastEPlasma said:
I know I'm going to garner plenty of hate for this statement, but I think bikes and cars should have a specific, nation wide decibel limit with criminal consequences for exceeding that limit.

A good machine is one which is so silent, so well engineered, that you don't even know it's working.

I mean, do people at LAN parties turn up their fans and put loud speakers on their spinning HD clicks and whirs so that no one can miss it?

It's just ridiculous. Might as well wear a clown suit with neon signs pointing to your crotch and your junk hanging out. :p
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In most places there ARE well defined decibel limits. The problem is that the police intentionally turn a blind eye towards loud motorcycles, even though (in Minnesota at least) motorcycles are held to the exact same noise limits as automobiles.

Laws are only as good as the police's willingness to enforce them.
 
Methos said:
I put playing cards in all my PC fans, that's how I know it's working.

Jokes aside, there's something about the low rumble of dino juice engines that makes me all excited, like I should be drinking whiskey and shooting guns at the same time. Super silent electric poindexter cars (and bikes) are just so... Sterile.
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You can have the great sounding low rumble of a dino juice engine without having the obnoxiously ridiculous horrible sound that 99.9% of Harleys get by installing straight pipes on them three seconds after the owner signs on the dotted line.

Obnoxiously loud (and shitty sounding) is bad enough, but obnoxiously loud on something that's actually relatively slow just makes baby Jesus cry.
 
TastEPlasma said:
I know I'm going to garner plenty of hate for this statement, but I think bikes and cars should have a specific, nation wide decibel limit with criminal consequences for exceeding that limit.

A good machine is one which is so silent, so well engineered, that you don't even know it's working.

I mean, do people at LAN parties turn up their fans and put loud speakers on their spinning HD clicks and whirs so that no one can miss it?

It's just ridiculous. Might as well wear a clown suit with neon signs pointing to your crotch and your junk hanging out. :p
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Frankie said:
You can have the great sounding low rumble of a dino juice engine without having the obnoxiously ridiculous horrible sound that 99.9% of Harleys get by installing straight pipes on them three seconds after the owner signs on the dotted line.

Obnoxiously loud (and shitty sounding) is bad enough, but obnoxiously loud on something that's actually relatively slow just makes baby Jesus cry.
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I agree that there should be a noise limit, however I think that limit does need to be much higher than cars.

The reason is that loud exhausts are beneficial in a different way that most people don't realize. Your average American driver regardless of what they are driving is an absolute idiot. The loud exhausts on motorcycles can be heard over most car stereos and let your average fat suburban housewife hear that a motorcycle might be in their blindspot when they have 3 kids in the backseat screaming and watching spongebob at full volume.

There is a happy medium. A motorcycle that is obnoxiously loud a quarter mile away? Too loud. A motorcycle that is obnoxiously loud at 50 feet away? Much better.
 
People specifically buy and pay a premium for Harley Davidson motorcycles because they want the feel, sound, nostalgia and lifestyle associated with Harley Davidson motorcycles, not because they want something new, well engineered or innovative. If they ever release an electric motorcycle on the market, it will fail miserably.
 
While a driver may hear an exceptionally loud back well before it reaches them, it's rare that a car driver will be able to locate the motorcycle exhaust sound until after the bike has passed them.
That renders the whole "Loud pipes save lives" argument as moot.

And these days, when SUV's with jumped up stereos seem to be the ride of choice, it's even less likely that they will hear anything other than what they're playing.


Add to that, the mistaken identity factor:
Unless they are used to seeing a lot of motorcycles, when most drivers see motorcycles in their rear-view mirror, they assume it's a larger vehicle that is much further behind them. This is especially common at night.
They misapprehend the bike's speed and distance and are startled when that squid on his crotch rocket goes flying by them.

I don't ride like a squid, but as a rider of said crotch rockets, it's rare that a day goes by where I'm not cut off, due to not being recognized.
I just see it as one of the hazards of my choice of transportation.
 
The problem is that cars have to be so incredibly insulated from the outside world to block the noise of their own engines. So then important auditory information, like the noise of other vehicles is lost. And yes, electric vehicles DO make noise, it's just all tire and road noise, with the whine or squeal of the electric motor, rather like a large drill on steroids.

In electric cars, like the Tesla, it's possible to drive comfortably, and hold a conversation without raising your voice, even with the windows down.

Speaking as a motorcyclist and driver, the problem with motorbikes is visibility. And having loud pipes DOES NOT help. Exhaust pipes (by necessity) direct all the output backwards, so the driver in the car that's cutting you off doesn't hear the sound of your engine because it's all blasted away from him. The people behind, however, and the pedestrians, cyclists and people trying to enjoy a quiet afternoon at home, all have to deal with the crapton of noise pollution you put out.

If loud pipes and noisy engines made them safer, there would be a statistical difference, for accidents and deaths involving motorcycles, between Harley owners and those that own other, quieter, brands. But there isn't, at all.
 
If I buy an electric motorcycle, it is BECAUSE of the lack of sound and not that horrible wine on that thing. Those people who want the loud motorcycle will never by electric as it will never feel or sound like a gas motorcycle. Other than the sound the only thing I don't like about it is the headlight. Looks like HD's marking department is clueless on this one.
 
gathagan said:
While a driver may hear an exceptionally loud back well before it reaches them, it's rare that a car driver will be able to locate the motorcycle exhaust sound until after the bike has passed them.
That renders the whole "Loud pipes save lives" argument as moot.
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Anaerin said:
Speaking as a motorcyclist and driver, the problem with motorbikes is visibility. And having loud pipes DOES NOT help. Exhaust pipes (by necessity) direct all the output backwards, so the driver in the car that's cutting you off doesn't hear the sound of your engine because it's all blasted away from him. The people behind, however, and the pedestrians, cyclists and people trying to enjoy a quiet afternoon at home, all have to deal with the crapton of noise pollution you put out.

If loud pipes and noisy engines made them safer, there would be a statistical difference, for accidents and deaths involving motorcycles, between Harley owners and those that own other, quieter, brands. But there isn't, at all.
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I don't know about you guys, but I definitely hear motorcycles when they are coming towards me. Sure, those pipes do direct most of the noise backwards, but they don't direct all of it backwards. There is noise reverberating off the side of their exposed mufflers, noise from the engine block itself, and of course the exhaust note that is exiting the muffler backwards but reflecting off of objects behind it.

Having a majority of the noise directed backwards isn't a bad thing either. Sure, I gave a poor example of a blind spot scenario that doesn't always happen. However, having a loud bike in front of you will make you want to back off and not ride them too closely. Keeping people from tailgating bikes due to loud noises can't be all that bad can it?

Also, keep in mind I said that there is a happy medium. I agree that some bikes are loud just for the sake of loud and probably do no one any good, especially not the rider who is going to lose situational awareness from not being able to hear a fucking thing. Happy medium guys...happy medium.
 
CaptNumbNutz said:
I don't know about you guys, but I definitely hear motorcycles when they are coming towards me. Sure, those pipes do direct most of the noise backwards, but they don't direct all of it backwards. There is noise reverberating off the side of their exposed mufflers, noise from the engine block itself, and of course the exhaust note that is exiting the muffler backwards but reflecting off of objects behind it.

Having a majority of the noise directed backwards isn't a bad thing either. Sure, I gave a poor example of a blind spot scenario that doesn't always happen. However, having a loud bike in front of you will make you want to back off and not ride them too closely. Keeping people from tailgating bikes due to loud noises can't be all that bad can it?

Also, keep in mind I said that there is a happy medium. I agree that some bikes are loud just for the sake of loud and probably do no one any good, especially not the rider who is going to lose situational awareness from not being able to hear a fucking thing. Happy medium guys...happy medium.
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This.

I've seen it myself while riding. You see a distracted cager preparing to enter traffic directly in front of you and realize that they don't see you at all, you grab the clutch and give the throttle a healthy blip, and watch as their eyes instantly focus on you like radar. I've seen it time and time again.

I've seen them swivel their heads and look directly in my direction when they hear me approach in their blind spot.

My bike isn't overbearingly loud, but it's louder than stock. It also helps warn pedestrians and animals.
 
Quite simply, I am tired of loud motorcycles, particularly cruisers, especially Harleys.
I've been riding over 50 years. Love the ride, gave up on noise long ago.
The noise exits the rear of the motorcycle, directed away from the riders ears, and competes with wind noise.
The "sound" Harley attempted to trademark just sounds like an unmufflered John Deere diesel.
ewwwee
 
I'd buy the bike for the mods. Tons of energy locked up in those batteries and electric motors can develop some serious torque at low rpms. I can see the controller and motor mods now, "Sprint" mods. You can have different torque maps, one for extended range, one for maximum performance.
 
Depending on noise to wake up an oblivious driver is an accident waiting to happen.
Alertness, anticipation, the expectation any driver around you is capable of sleep driving and dumb behavior. That works.
 
No transmission means it's rubbish.

hahah
 
Loud pipes make me want to swerve into you. Loud pipes make me want to cut you off. I'm a terrible person, but you started it with your loud pipes. ;) :D I'm joking, but I get cut off every day on the way to work. Car/motorcycle/semi-truck doesn't really matter.

You should know that I work with deaf people. They almost certainly can't hear you and they drive. There's no hearing test for a driver's license here, so you ARE better off wearing bright colors. Lose the black leather fetish.

This is the closest thing Harley has to a motorcycle that appeals to me. I like some of the other electric motorcycles more, but I've never ridden any of them. So, it's possible that I could be won over, but they would have to stop trying to make yet another fat cruiser.
 
sir-gold said:
In most places there ARE well defined decibel limits. The problem is that the police intentionally turn a blind eye towards loud motorcycles, even though (in Minnesota at least) motorcycles are held to the exact same noise limits as automobiles.

Laws are only as good as the police's willingness to enforce them.
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I can vouch for this.
 
Engineered sound my ass. If they are so stupid as to INTENTIONALLY introduce some sort of resistance in the system to get a specific sound (which sounds like something is rubbing)....piss poor engineering right there. All that would do is introduce another point of failure and reduce efficiency.
 
The voice over said "super light" ... AHAHAHAHAhaAHAHAHAHaHaahHAHAhah

Deal killers for most riders: weight, range, recharge time, nasty sound.
 
I see Harley Davidson as the last company that many people would buy an electric bike from. They really carved out a market for themselves and missed out on the crotch rocket crazy and instead went to war with it. All fine, but I give them props for getting ahead of this because who knows what the future will bring, lets be honest a Harley is not a value minded sensible bike so if they are getting into this it seems to me it is because they are very scared that something is coming down the pipe they will be unable to fight. Maybe its government mandates on fuel efficiency or something, maybe its just a renewed interest in electric crotch rockets, or maybe they think the next big wave of customers is going to be all the silicon valley over paid brats in the tech bubble trying to get a girl.
 
TastEPlasma said:
I know I'm going to garner plenty of hate for this statement, but I think bikes and cars should have a specific, nation wide decibel limit with criminal consequences for exceeding that limit.

A good machine is one which is so silent, so well engineered, that you don't even know it's working.

I mean, do people at LAN parties turn up their fans and put loud speakers on their spinning HD clicks and whirs so that no one can miss it?

It's just ridiculous. Might as well wear a clown suit with neon signs pointing to your crotch and your junk hanging out. :p
Click to expand...
Just the other day I was on a long road trip with my cousin, and there was a bike a good 200 feet up the highway from us that was so loud even at that distance that I had to raise my voice to speak to my her. I would have gladly floored it and run the guy over.
 
Steve said:
Watching this video makes me want one of these even less. If that was even possible. :( Your mileage may vary.
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I'd be thrilled if we got rid of all of the insanely loud Harleys. Even at Idle, they're generally break noise laws. My best guess is they don't ticket them, because it's a bunch of old guys driving them.
 
CaptNumbNutz said:
I agree that there should be a noise limit, however I think that limit does need to be much higher than cars.

The reason is that loud exhausts are beneficial in a different way that most people don't realize. Your average American driver regardless of what they are driving is an absolute idiot. The loud exhausts on motorcycles can be heard over most car stereos and let your average fat suburban housewife hear that a motorcycle might be in their blindspot when they have 3 kids in the backseat screaming and watching spongebob at full volume.

There is a happy medium. A motorcycle that is obnoxiously loud a quarter mile away? Too loud. A motorcycle that is obnoxiously loud at 50 feet away? Much better.
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I don't see why you need Harley noise for that. Besides, if you set your mirrors correctly, there is no blind spot.
 
nilepez said:
I don't see why you need Harley noise for that. Besides, if you set your mirrors correctly, there is no blind spot.
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You dont drive do you, because if you did you would realize that a lot of drivers dont use mirrors.
 
I like quiet cars which sing a little when opened up.

Bikes is another story, must ride like you are invisible due to the ignorant types who are selectively blind. Spent many years commuting on bikes. Loud pipes do increase awareness, especially in congestion (motorways etc) and when I hear bikes coming (if in a car) I move over a little so they can easily pass through, or pull into my lane to split/let another bike through etc.. makes for a much nicer traffic flow and everyone gets home in a good manner.

Courtesy goes a long way.

Obnoxiously loud pipes e.g. straight race pipes are quite an assholeish thing to do.
When you have to modify your high idle to avoid pissing neighbors off.. it's too loud.
Tried some for a while and wouldn't ever go back. 3ft flames and shotgun blast backfires on overrun are fun on the track though.
Only benefit is dinner is warm before you are home and you don't need to call..
Most Hardly Ablesons fall into this category for me. In this configuration they are particularly obnoxious and sound like the 1930s tractor technology they mostly are.

Somewhere between obnoxious and stock levels is much more acceptable to most people and usually not something police care about, as they too understand the safety advantage or are riders in many cases.
 
Grahamkracka said:
Why the hell would you have a transmission with an electric motor?
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That's like asking why do you need more than a 3 speed transmission in a car?

Even though an electric motor has a wider power band than an ICE, it still is not flat. This is part of the problem with electric cars, and why they have a lower top speed than an ICE. The problem is that a transmission adds a lot more complexity and weight, so it's cheaper to just use a little more powerful electric engine.
Eventually you will see electric cars with transmissions, or possible with 2 separate motors, one geared for low speed and another fro high speed.
 
CaptNumbNutz said:
I agree that there should be a noise limit, however I think that limit does need to be much higher than cars.

The reason is that loud exhausts are beneficial in a different way that most people don't realize. Your average American driver regardless of what they are driving is an absolute idiot. The loud exhausts on motorcycles can be heard over most car stereos and let your average fat suburban housewife hear that a motorcycle might be in their blindspot when they have 3 kids in the backseat screaming and watching spongebob at full volume.

There is a happy medium. A motorcycle that is obnoxiously loud a quarter mile away? Too loud. A motorcycle that is obnoxiously loud at 50 feet away? Much better.
Click to expand...

I've owned and ridden a wide variety of bikes, from sport bikes, cruisers and standards. I've had bikes with straight pipes, all those loud pipes do is piss off the neighbors and annoy pedestrians. a person in a car doesn't notice a Harley with straight pipes any faster than a stock bike. you can watch people turning left in front of you, that "where the hell did HE come from" expression as they notice you braking like hell to try and not slam into Mrs Oblivious and her van full of rugrats. no matter what sort of pipes you have.

It's like the argument against helmet laws. My wife worked in a rehab unit for 20 years, ask her what it's like taking care of people that don't wear helmets and crash. Even at low speeds, bouncing your head off the pavement is most likely fatal or a good way to spending the rest of your life drooling on yourself and crapping in your diapers. We used to have a term for bikers like that, the ones that didn't wear helmets. they were "The Perfect Organ Donor", doesn't get much better than severe brain trauma, all the rest of the organs are usually intact.

Logic doesn't enter in to it, people don't think helmets are "cool" People don't think stock exhausts are "cool" never mind the hearing loss most hard core bike riders end up with. and the
 
The safety issues with bikes have nothing to do with sound.
The problems are all the idiots in cars that feel a driver's license is a god given right and not a privilege, so they drive, radio/ cd/ mp3/ video player blaring away with no focus on the road while texting away and posting selfies on Facebook as they swerve between lanes without using their blinkers while speeding completely oblivious to their surroundings. I seriously wish more people like this got in single car accidents where they lost their lives instead of creaming some poor guy or gal on a bike, a man, woman or child on the sidewalk or even going into oncoming traffic and killing a whole family in a head on collision.
Those people don't need licenses, they need iPods and a bus pass.
And if you get pulled over texting, swerving and blaring loud music or watching video? You should lose your license on the spot and get your vehicle towed.
I lost 2 friends on bikes that were killed by distracted drivers that just got 5 year sentences then early releases after 2 and its no f#cking fair to the deceased or their families.
 
motomonkey said:
never mind the hearing loss most hard core bike riders end up with
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BECAUSE EARPLUGS ARRRRRE AWESOMMMME!

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ShamisOMally said:
92MPH top speed?

So, its basically a 30-60K scooter?

Pass
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About a 50 mile range, so yes, it's a scooter as long as your scooter will only go 50 miles.

As for the noise, the faux jet-turbine sound is obnoxious. My washing machine has a more pleasant frequency curve than that. I suppose I could fill it with batteries and drive it to work.
 
A person who doesn't use their mirror can hit another car just as easily as they can hit a motorcycle, so one has to ask why do motorcyclist think that they are special? As someone who does a lot of driving I think that motorcyclist are niave and way to often forget to admit their own responsibility on the road and often forget to respect the limitations of drivers in trucks and cars. I constantly see them driving irregularly on the road and doing so at far greater extremes then most cars do or are capable of. This is because they are capable of it, with very fast pickup and being open they see the road clearly have way fewer blind spots and can more quickly survey. As such they feel like they can cut things way closer than a car would ever do. And that often causes them to be in places that car drivers are not expecting them as well as tempting them to do ridiculous things. At 70 mph if a car suddenly breaks many motorcyclist are way to freaking close to even have a chance of avoiding the collision.

Simple example I see weekly. Motor cyclist is in the right lane and decides to pass a car that is slowed down by a vehicle in front. The car driver checks their mirror then blind spot then looks forward and starts pulling out. The motorcyclist thinks the same exact thing, except the motorcyclist having a much faster acceleration and being open does the whole sequence way faster than the car. So the car pulls in front of the motorcycle that either veers off the side or slams on the breaks then honks. Neither one of the clowns use their blinkers like half the time. So who is in the wrong? The law will place the blame on the car driver because who ever is in the lane first has the right of way, but honestly its not reasonable to blame them in that case.

Now how many of you know truck drivers? I bet some of you do and you hear them talking about the idiot car drivers. Well a motorcycle is essentially just like that to a car or truck. A smaller much more agile vehicle that can quickly cause havoc to a larger vehicle with way less visibility and maneuverability.

The problem with motorcycle drivers is they think, hey I can be a bike when I want to, I can be a pedestrian when I want to and I can be an indy car when I want to. I don't even have to obey lanes if I want to just skip ahead of traffic. Well if you aren't not moving with traffic at similar speeds its easy to see how you can get quickly end up in a place another driver had already checked or a place they don't check. Other than that its just the fact that motorcycles have zero safety that causes death rates that are way higher than people in cars who have similar numbers of accidents. Its a risk you take, but if you are out there taking that risk just remember its not really always the other guys fault drive with traffic, keep the same spacing a car would, do not ever cut the middle of lanes. And if traffic is stopped get in line with everyone else. I think you will find close calls go way down if you drive with respect.

You cant change the world so if you really want things to get better stop asking for ridiculous measures and start asking for things that could have a real change. For instance giving all cars a unified dash camera that gives them a 270 degree view of the sides and rear of their car would probably do way more than hoping some law makers are going to take away everyone's license on their first offense of any type.
 
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