Fundraiser to Support ‘NSA-Proof’ Email Gets Off to a Roaring Start

CommanderFrank

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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May 9, 2000
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Close to a month ago, an encrypted mail service called ProtonMail was created by computer scientists from CERN and MIT. The email service is touted to be ‘NSA-proof’ and has signed 200K users in less than a month.

The main idea is to encrypt data before it even comes to our servers, using an encryption password that we do not have access to, so we don’t have the ability to decrypt the encrypted data on our servers.
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The FDPIC is pretty nosy, and always wants to know about data leaving their country, and goes to great lengths in documenting it all. I don't know if I trust them any more than the NSA, or to keep things from the NSA. There is definitely a need for more secure E-Mail communications -- it is impossible to get people to use PGP regularly, or even TLS for that matter in their client settings.

The cry of the naive, "If you have nothing to hide, it doesn't matter" is finally being challenged on multiple fronts and I like this a lot about today.
 
Doesn't ProtonMail have some crazy requirement that its users can never delete their cookies?
 
Isn't this kinda pointless unless you only ever email other ProtonMail users? It isn't like it is that hard for Google/Apple/MS/etc to supply all the emails other people have received from you.
 
I'm assuming it's only secure if sending from a ProtonMail (Pmail) address to a ProtonMail address?

If you're communicating with someone who isn't also doing encryption, when they reply to your email, it's likely to include your message as well which will be readable by the NSA farms. There's a lot of scenarios they have to account for with this.
 
Much as I support this, NSA will try to kill a system they could not grab information from
 
How long before the people that wrote it and host it start going to jail, losing their jobs, get their funding cut, mysteriously disappear or start dying in "freak accidents" while the press turns a blond eye?
 
I have nothing to hide, so NSA checking my emails doesn't matter to me, at least not nearly enough to use some complicated email service.
 
On one hand, the NSA should not be doing any frivolous privacy invasions and should be leaving a paper trail of their invasions.

On the other hand, there are people I want the NSA to spy on.
 
There are other vectors for interception besides compromising the servers. This system relies on software, and any system that is software driven is vulnerable because the software itself is vulnerable. The software must be written and compiled on a machine. If that machine is compromised then the software itself can be compromised coming out the gate, and if the software is compromised then the whole system is worthless. In addition, the machines at either end of a communication must not be compromised. Assuming those conditions are met - both endpoint machines are not compromised and the software itself is not compromised in any way, then there's the assumption that the NSA cannot forcibly decrypt the communication anyway.

The problem is, as an end user you will never know when something is not secure. You're assuming the software is secure, that your machine is secure, that the remote machine is secure, and that the encryption itself cannot be broken. If any of those conditions are false, you will never know it.
 
ShamisOMally said:
Much as I support this, NSA will try to kill a system they could not grab information from
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Not if their funding is slowing and systematically bled dry or cut off altogether for some of the more bullshit activities in the coming years.
 
Farkle said:
The cry of the naive, "If you have nothing to hide, it doesn't matter" is finally being challenged on multiple fronts and I like this a lot about today.
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Uh, this tool is meant for professionals and government workers who have actual *secrets* to maintain. The average Joe has nothing in his daily life that concerns national security or other matters of secrecy.

Only highly irrational people have the belief that they need encryption in their daily 'hi how's it going?' personal e-mails lol.
 
I see Germany was all upset about the NSA and now? leaks show they have been in bed with them the entire time, and have been pushing for stronger ties since the 1960's

1000 neckbeards in the streets across a 3.7 million square mile country will have little effect on the NSA, all English speaking countries (and Germany) probably others are in bed with the US government, they all share data, every country that can spy is spying...so yeah
 
vasta said:
I see Germany was all upset about the NSA and now? leaks show they have been in bed with them the entire time, and have been pushing for stronger ties since the 1960's

1000 neckbeards in the streets across a 3.7 million square mile country will have little effect on the NSA, all English speaking countries (and Germany) probably others are in bed with the US government, they all share data, every country that can spy is spying...so yeah
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and the laws to not spy on citizens of their respective countries are worthless if they just cross-spy and trade what they found out. most germans probably are against the nsa spying, but they're too lazy to get off their butts (because watching tv at home is so much more convenient) and the government doesn't give a shit about what the people want anyway.
 
If I was NSA I would hire coders to create this great NSA proof encryption model and advertise it as such. Great honeypot to tap into every possible criminal you can think of.
 
PCunicorn said:
I have nothing to hide, so NSA checking my emails doesn't matter to me, at least not nearly enough to use some complicated email service.
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The concern - one of many - is, for example, one day things get bad enough - for some people it's already there - that you can be targeted for being in or having family or friends in, say, the Tea Party or Occupy movement etc.

It kills democracy, it chills speech, it does many wonderful things. If you're not vigilant now when it's easier to do it, then you'll the metaphorical boiling frog later.
 
If it encrypts before being sent to the servers handling traffic, it seems in principle to benreally similar to PGP encryption type stuff. Definitely looking into this. proton mail seems cool, but my pgp keys are not on my hdd they are on a usb stick that no one will ever find along with my usb stick containing the bitcoin wallett!!! ahahaha someone would have a bad day getting that info. :D
 
B00nie said:
Only highly irrational people have the belief that they need encryption in their daily 'hi how's it going?' personal e-mails lol.
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It's the principle more than anything. There is nothing 'highly irrational' about the expectation of privacy in a personal or business conversation with another. It is more irrational to be okay with it. Wouldn't you be a little irritated if a neighbor was opening your mail, and putting it back in your box before you received it? Not much different.
 
octoberasian said:
NSA: "Haha, let us see you try. Remember Lavabit?"
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That was my first thought, as well.

Sad that we are having companies and services pop up that are specifically designed to circumvent our government doing shitty things...
 
Farkle said:
It's the principle more than anything. There is nothing 'highly irrational' about the expectation of privacy in a personal or business conversation with another. It is more irrational to be okay with it. Wouldn't you be a little irritated if a neighbor was opening your mail, and putting it back in your box before you received it? Not much different.
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No I find NSA scanning my mails equivalent to a police patrol doing searches in my neighborhood chasing a known serial killer. I don't mind to be stopped and checked when it can potentially save my life.
 
B00nie said:
No I find NSA scanning my mails equivalent to a police patrol doing searches in my neighborhood chasing a known serial killer. I don't mind to be stopped and checked when it can potentially save my life.
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And following every citizen constantly day and night with that premise. I hope you don't Jaywalk or pass the speed limit citizen, and don't talk bad about the mayor.
 
Wierdo said:
And following every citizen constantly day and night with that premise. I hope you don't Jaywalk or pass the speed limit citizen, and don't talk bad about the mayor.
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If you really think the NSA would give a flying f... about stuff like that you need to get a time to the shrink lol.

Although talking bad about the mayor may get you in priority monitoring list for obvious reasons but that would not show up in your daily life in any way untill you start arranging for his assassination. That's when the black car will probably park at your yard.
 
B00nie said:
Uh, this tool is meant for professionals and government workers who have actual *secrets* to maintain. The average Joe has nothing in his daily life that concerns national security or other matters of secrecy.

Only highly irrational people have the belief that they need encryption in their daily 'hi how's it going?' personal e-mails lol.
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Sorry, but this tool is not for that. You are not allowed to transmit data classified at the secret or top secret level across NIPRnet, even if it is encrypted. The government has totally segregated networks for that called SIPRnet and JWICS.
 
B00nie said:
If you really think the NSA would give a flying f... about stuff like that you need to get a time to the shrink lol.

Although talking bad about the mayor may get you in priority monitoring list for obvious reasons but that would not show up in your daily life in any way untill you start arranging for his assassination. That's when the black car will probably park at your yard.
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You have a very strange trust in authority. How do you think authoritarian regimes are formed? It starts with information control and apathetic citizens, the rest comes easy afterwards.
 
Wierdo said:
You have a very strange trust in authority. How do you think authoritarian regimes are formed? It starts with information control and apathetic citizens, the rest comes easy afterwards.
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As long as I have authority in my legs I can migrate to a better country if need be. I don't commit crimes or scheme against the government so I have zero need to worry about some security agency seeing my transmissions.

I put high suspicion on every individual who uses TOR and/or encryption in western countries, they're either paranoid or criminal. And of course they're not going to admit it.
 
B00nie said:
As long as I have authority in my legs I can migrate to a better country if need be. I don't commit crimes or scheme against the government so I have zero need to worry about some security agency seeing my transmissions.

I put high suspicion on every individual who uses TOR and/or encryption in western countries, they're either paranoid or criminal. And of course they're not going to admit it.
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They came forward with thousands of cases of NSA people using their information on girlfriends/boyfriends/exes for personal use. How many NSA agents used the information to screw a neighbor they didn't like? Or sold the information to someone looking for dirt on someone else?

BTW, we live in an over-regulated society. I guarantee you're doing something wrong and may not even realize it. You may blast through an empty school zone at 35 instead of the posted 25, your yard may not be graded correctly, you forgot to separate out park & rec fees on your municipal taxes from your property tax deduction, etc. Something that can ruin your day or worse if attention was brought to it. And there is someone with potential power over you that may have something in the "or worse" category like a boss or local cop that could be leveraged to do worse.
 
yuseaname7 said:
If it encrypts before being sent to the servers handling traffic, it seems in principle to benreally similar to PGP encryption type stuff. Definitely looking into this. proton mail seems cool, but my pgp keys are not on my hdd they are on a usb stick that no one will ever find along with my usb stick containing the bitcoin wallett!!! ahahaha someone would have a bad day getting that info. :D
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Did this guy just admit he keeps a USB stick in his anus at all times?
 
A nice use of this thread would be to hear from someone who has actually used ProtonMail. What is the deal with browser cookies?
 
B00nie said:
As long as I have authority in my legs I can migrate to a better country if need be. I don't commit crimes or scheme against the government so I have zero need to worry about some security agency seeing my transmissions.

I put high suspicion on every individual who uses TOR and/or encryption in western countries, they're either paranoid or criminal. And of course they're not going to admit it.
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Well that's great and all, you can save yourself if you can afford to, but how does this protect our democracy (or at least oligarchy) if no one cares to keep gov powers in check?

Germany was a republic as well a century ago before turning to fascism you know.
 
B00nie said:
As long as I have authority in my legs I can migrate to a better country if need be. I don't commit crimes or scheme against the government so I have zero need to worry about some security agency seeing my transmissions.

I put high suspicion on every individual who uses TOR and/or encryption in western countries, they're either paranoid or criminal. And of course they're not going to admit it.
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Well that didn't take long, things going bizarre:
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/14/07...ournal-readers-tor-and-linux-users-extremists

If you're a Linux user then maybe time to have bags packed just in case, being an "extremist" and all lol.
 
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