Relock Kickstarter - Real gun manipulation FPS.

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JoeUser

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http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/engagegaming/relock

Seems like a fully realized Receiver (made my Wolfire).

Relock is a FPS where the weapons you use are FULLY usable in that in order to reload your gun you have to load the clip with ammunition, slide the clip in, pull back on the receiver then release it, turn off the safety. Basically real time real life use of a fire arm.

This has been done before in a game called "Receiver" by Wolfire (who is also working on the marvelous Overgrowth).

Heres a clip of the gun play in action:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCThInmzjXw

So even though Relock is basically a copy of Receiver, Relock at least seems like it wants to make itself a full game instead of Receiver that was more a tech demonstration.

Think its a badass idea and Receiver can be purchased or is free if you pre-order Overgrowth (which I did). Let me tell you that this kind of control over a weapon in a game is, to put it bluntly, fucking awesome. Been playing Receiver for the past 3 hours...

Relock still needs funding though so lets try and show some love and get actual realistic FPS out there!

Disclaimer: I am in no way shape or form related to either one of these games. Just love the idea and gameplay tremendously!
 
Indeed...and once you get used to it it soooo much fun...still playing Receiver and loving every minute of it!
 
JoeUser said:
Relock is a FPS where the weapons you use are FULLY usable in that in order to reload your gun you have to load the clip with ammunition, slide the clip in, pull back on the receiver then release it, turn off the safety.
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It's a magazine. :D (it had to be done! :p)
 
Krenum said:
Just shoot a real gun?
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Stupid. This could be said about any fucking game I mean fuck really. Wanna kill terrorists? Join the army! Wanna race cars? Become a NASCAR driver. Wanna travel to alternate dimensions? Become Gordon Freeman.

Posts like yours are seriously disturbing and a waste of space on the [H]ardforum server.
 
JoeUser said:
Posts like yours are seriously disturbing and a waste of space on the [H]ardforum server.
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Boy, you gun nuts have no sense of humor. :p

I think realism has already gone way too far, so I hope an idea like this does not gain mainstream appeal. However, I'm glad this project exists for those of you who want such a thing. GL with the funding.
 
Realism only goes too far when it makes a game a chore rather than being fun. If this game is fun, then it hasn't gone too far.
 
drako said:
Boy, you gun nuts have no sense of humor. :p

I think realism has already gone way too far, so I hope an idea like this does not gain mainstream appeal. However, I'm glad this project exists for those of you who want such a thing. GL with the funding.
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I am by no means a gun nut...I don't even own a gun and have only actually shot a real one a few times in my entire life.

Also, please please PLEASE play the game before you make rash comments on ideas like this.

Also can you show me ANY games that are getting too realistic? I think an OVERWHELMING VAST MAJORITY of gamers would consider this the absolute opposite of the truth. Regenerating health is too realistic? Puh-lease!
 
JoeUser said:
I am by no means a gun nut...I don't even own a gun and have only actually shot a real one a few times in my entire life.

Also can you show me ANY games that are getting too realistic? I think an OVERWHELMING VAST MAJORITY of gamers would consider this the absolute opposite of the truth. Regenerating health is too realistic? Puh-lease!
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I apologize to gun nuts everywhere then, I guess it's just you with the lack of a sense of humor. :D

And sure I can. The trend towards the "modern war" setting; the trend in slower player movement; the trend towards shooting from the hip; the trend towards weapon # limits; the removal of old-school mainstays like rocket jumping and bunny hopping... I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting.

However, I'm really not trying to rain on anyone's parade here. Seriously! If this game gets made and gets great reviews, I'll give it an honest shot (no pun intended).
 
Alternate dimensions? If you're gonna bring in that argument, might as well have everything as an "alternate" dimension, and if that's the case, even pacman was too realistic.
 
Jack Thompson would have a heart attack if he sees this... anybody got his email?
 
They have 5% of their goal, and only 9 days left. They aren't going to make it.
 
I'm not surprised they are not going to make it.

The whole thing is very unprofessionally presented.... I mean the game looks really interesting.

But the guy who is supposed to be selling this game and encouraging people to buy it seems like he is talking about the day his mother was killed or something. Just depressing, no enthusiasm he's mumbling half the time.. Says stuff like 'Yeah there are like only 2 maps, one is just a range, other other is really small'... in this monotone voice with no emotion/enthusiasm on his face at all.

Shame.
 
Seems interesting, but I am not sure if I will pledge.

JoeUser said:
Also can you show me ANY games that are getting too realistic?
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This. Many formerly realistic shooter series have been turned into CS/CoD/BF type action games. Examples are Rainbow 6 and Ghost Recon. Other series such as SWAT/Police Quest have simply stopped being made. In general realistic shooters have been becoming less and less common. And if you think CS/BF is realistic or tactical, then I have nothing else to say.
 
JoeUser said:
Also can you show me ANY games that are getting too realistic? I think an OVERWHELMING VAST MAJORITY of gamers would consider this the absolute opposite of the truth. Regenerating health is too realistic? Puh-lease!
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That's because you don't want a really realistic shooter. Real guns are not balanced, some are better than others. They are also, by and large, one-hit kill if they are carbines, rifles, or shotguns. You also can't do much Rambo shit with them, camping is generally the name of the game. Prone is what you want for long range accuracy.

The concept of playing with all the gun parts also sounds rather silly. In real life it is fairly easy to do since, well, you have hands on the gun. Also the idea behind well made guns is that you don't need to fiddle with shit much. Same deal with jams/misfires. A well made weapon will do that almost never.

And cleaning your guns? Oh please, that is one of the least fun parts of gun ownership. We do it in real life because you have to, putting it in a game is rather silly.

Realism is fine right up until it starts to get in the way of fun, at that point you are being silly.

If I want to play with a really realistic gun, well I'll go fetch one from my safe and head out to the range. No matter how well the game is made, it won't be as realistic as a real gun.

Any game that talks up realism first, is doomed to suck. Gameplay/fun needs to come first. There's plenty about reality that can interfere with fun. Hell, that's part of the reason we play games.
 
JoeUser said:
Stupid. This could be said about any fucking game I mean fuck really. Wanna kill terrorists? Join the army! Wanna race cars? Become a NASCAR driver. Wanna travel to alternate dimensions? Become Gordon Freeman.

Posts like yours are seriously disturbing and a waste of space on the [H]ardforum server.
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No he has a serious point. Reality based games are fine but it only goes so far. There's no point in trying to precisely simulate something at the expense of fun because you'd be better off doing it for real.

I don't care how realistic the game is, it won't stack up to shooting a real gun. If nothing else you don't get the visceral feel of the recoil and the shockwave from the bullet, not to mention using your whole body to control the shots.

So, given that it can't stack up, why make a game? Well because a game can be fun. There's a lot you can do in a game you can't do in real life, and lots that can be simplified or excluded. Cleaning guns is done because it is necessary, not because it is fun. So in games, we don't.

The Onion nails it with regards to an actually realistic war game.

The whole idea of games is to have fun, do things you can't really do, and escape reality. Trying to make a game that is perfectly realistic is silly. A game should be fun.
 
Plenty of realisic games can be fun. DCS, Rainbow 6 (old ones), RO, ArmA, Infiltration. Realistic guns add a whole lot to games. Compared to a game like CoD/CS where all guns feel and act the same, a game like RO or INF is a huge step forward.

Though I agree, cleaning and field stripping would be boring. A lot of these functions are nice but are so quick and automatic in real life that it will feel artificially slow in game. But as a small mini game it would be fun.
 
To everyone saying that manually having to reload your gun rather than just hitting the "R" key should REALLY play Receiver before you make such a rash uneducated judgement.

Now that I have gotten proficient at doing so it is a BLAST!

Here is a video of me doing it real time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEhIPb2P1ZE

This is just showing the slide locked back, me reloading a magazine, firing, etc. Also note that the reloading and what not are kinda slow just to show it off. I usually have multiple magazines loaded ready to go, etc.

The guns are fully realized and I love that...from switching firing modes to turning the safety on and off...absolutely love it! Just make sure you don't pull back on the slide when you're loaded up or you'll lose a cartridge! :p

Either way, like I said, play it first, then talk trash all you want!
 
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While I do like the idea behind it and I haven't really looked deep into it; but they should make it appear more realistic if they are making it mechanically realistic. Show someone holding the gun and magazines while they load them, unload them, etc... Would add to the realism immensely.
 
Skillz said:
While I do like the idea behind it and I haven't really looked deep into it; but they should make it appear more realistic if they are making it mechanically realistic. Show someone holding the gun and magazines while they load them, unload them, etc... Would add to the realism immensely.
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Final game will have hands. In the alpha demo I the buttons all seem to be off from what the writing on the glass on the range tell me. I can rack my slide, shoot, and flip the safety on/off but that is it.

How to I reload, hit the slide release ect?
 
That's something I'd like to see video of. The realistic mechanics is cool, but it's gotta have realistic visuals as well.
 
In the video I posted on up some (it's of Receiver, not Relock) graphics are decent...not realistic per se, but the core game and engine were created in 7 days for some challenge that was going on. Not bad for 7 days if I do say so myself!

As far as Relock goes, even though I created the thread all hope is lost. Dude needs to straighten up some with his advertising and "look"...that and the demo is broken from what I can tell. I was just sponsoring it in a way because I love the core gameplay of Receiver and Relock looked like a more fleshed out realistic version.

Oh well, I say give him some time to work on it, get his act together, and repost it on Kickstarter again. He better hurry though because from what I know Wolfire is already well on their way to making Receiver a more "full" experience...so he might have some legitimately good, already working, competition!
 
So... Wolfire puts out a game they made in 7 days, featuring a lot of gun management, but set in an eerie minimalistic randomized building filled with robots and backstory tapes.
Impressive by any standard.

How is "Relock" not a shameless ripoff of concept? They copy one gameplay element and rely on that alone to make people give them money?
 
Couple personal points:
- Loading magazines is not the fun part of using a gun.
- Racking the slide of a physical gun is fun for that reason, it is a physical motion. having to push a key or worse, click a button to do the same is retarded.

Why spend hours tapping away at a keyboard when you can just do the real thing which is going to be 1000x better.
 
Meh. I could care less about this in games. I would actually probably not play a lot of modern day shooters if they involved shit like this...
 
hdawg06 said:
Meh. I could care less about this in games. I would actually probably not play a lot of modern day shooters if they involved shit like this...
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fine

go put your cursor on enemy head and left click all day

to each his own
 
jojo69 said:
fine

go put your cursor on enemy head and left click all day

to each his own
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That's all you are doing in any game: Moving the mouse around and clicking. Or using the game pad, or joystick, or whatever. That is how it works. Don't try to pretend that you are somehow superior because of the kind of clicking you do.

All that matters is what is fun.

If you want to do more than clicking with guns, well then get yourself a real gun.
 
Who said anything about being superior? I happen to enjoy realism in games. Other people happen to enjoy carrying 600 pounds of inventory and jumping 100 yards. Nothing superior about either.
 
jojo69 said:
Who said anything about being superior? I happen to enjoy realism in games. Other people happen to enjoy carrying 600 pounds of inventory and jumping 100 yards. Nothing superior about either.
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By saying "go put your cursor on enemy head and left click all day" you imply that it's a stupid monotonous task that is somehow inferior to you clicking your mouse buttons to load an imaginary gun in a certain way.
 
And the post I replied to called the features in this game "shit"

your point?
 
My point? ummmm....my point was to show you that you indeed said something about superior. I didn't see the other guy deny calling this turd "shit" though. Btw why so defensive?
 
I shoot firearms IRL. The title stood out immediately to me and piqued my curiousity. Turns out I was correct that it is one of the stances they used. It's a stance I've practiced at the range in real life as well. I like the concept of having to manipulate the firearm for reloads and such. I'm curious to see how stances play a part in actual gameplay. Center axis relock tends to be favored by elite police/military for close quarters battle, but is also applicable to the everyday shmoe in certain environs. That said, I favor modified weaver stance at the range.
 
Not taking sides but my nephew that fought for quite a bit of time in Iraq said he carried 14 full magazines with him at all times. He has no idea why someone would want to stop and manually reload a clip in the middle of a firefight unless they had to. He also said that field dressing his gun wasn't something that he enjoyed. So after listening to him I doubt this game will have much appeal.

Personally I rage every time I die while reloading in games as it is.
 
cageymaru said:
He has no idea why someone would want to stop and manually reload a clip in the middle of a firefight unless they had to.
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You don't IRL. You carry spare mags and swap after firing a few rounds when under cover. This lets you have more shots before reloading. You generally don't reload on empty, the theory being that if you need the extra shots, you'll have them since you reloaded a full magazine while under cover. It's basically cycling your ammo.

Regarding the game, I would hope that you don't actually have to load each bullet separately while in a firefight. That's not realistic. That's stupid. If they want to be realistic, they need to realize that in a real world setting, people do not walk around with boxes of ammo waiting to load a magazine bullet by bullet. rofl.

Hell, one of my firearms at one point had 10 magazines. Granted, I'd only carry a max of 2 spares, which depending on caliber would mean anywhere from 30 - 57 rounds.

Ok, I went slightly off topic. :p

I think they're premise is great, but they need to do more research like talking to people that actual shoot firearms as a hobby or former military/police. Unless you have one shitty quality gun, it's generally not gonna jam on you even after several hundred rounds down the pipe. There are people that don't clean their firearms for hundreds to over 1000 rounds.

Doesn't look like the project will get funded anyway.
 
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