What Makes Life So Hard At Foxconn?

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What makes life so hard at Foxconn? Ummm, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say "working there."

"Of course, everyone would like to make more money, but there is no way to ask for that," Ma said. "Foxconn can always get more people to work for them." These workers want enough cash to pay for food and rent and send a bit home for relatives who have even less money. It's fair to say that for most of them, the only time they'll hold a iPhone 5 is when they're putting one together.
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From an uninformed US guy here, this sounds like every other story I hear from China. They only make enough to live on (common people, anyway).
 
Foxconn employees think they are above other workers in China because they put together some Apple products. The media eats it up simply because Foxconn supplies Apple who makes tens of billions of dollars a year. They are in China, theyw ill never make the wages that a worker in the US will make and the media just needs to get over it.

How many millions of people in the US live in poverty and just enough to live on?

Foxconn should just make the media and Foxconn workers happy by shutting its doors.
 
China is nothing more than a vast slave colony bleeding its workers dry for their national intentions.
 
Why would a Foxconn assembly/manufacturing worker want or need an iPhone 5? Is owning an $800 phone some sort of human right?

China has growing pains due to the ever increasing growth of the consumer class, like every country has had.
 
arr4ws said:
I love the cnet title... foxconn IPHONE factories
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Well, it is all Apple's fault. Regardless of the MANY other companies that Foxconn makes parts for. Still, if it weren't for Apple, who would we blame? Apple has the shock factor. "OMG?! How could Apple do this to it's workers?! It's APPLE!".
 
LeninGHOLA said:
Why would a Foxconn assembly/manufacturing worker want or need an iPhone 5? Is owning an $800 phone some sort of human right?

China has growing pains due to the ever increasing growth of the consumer class, like every country has had.
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If anyone has a right to own those phones, it would be a Foxconn employee...
 
arr4ws said:
I love the cnet title... foxconn IPHONE factories
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Yeah ... because Foxconn only makes iPhones and nothing else ... Oh wait, they make electronics for most of the major OEMs ;)

There are certainly a number of problems in China ... overtime is one of the more significant ones since many companies violate the overtime limits specified in the Chinese law (a law that is typically not enforced) ... this is a problem that many of the OEMs are trying to get the contract manufacturing companies to comply with through their Electronic Industry Code of Conduct and mandatory audits associated with that

The pay for most Chinese workers is compliant to Chinese national requirements (at least for the company I work for, I can't speak for Foxconn but I suspect they comply with the law) but that is a very low bar ... in some areas there is more wage pressure to retain employees and wages have increased due to that ... many suspect that is the actual reason that Foxconn moved to Northern China since that labor market would be less constrained.

Safety has been a big problem, especially with smaller suppliers ... I have seen suppliers with locked medical cabinets (to prevent theft) and locked fire doors (for security) ... getting suppliers to change these things has been a journey involving training, auditing, and in some extreme cases changes in the supplier

Manufacturing will not come back to the developed world (it isn't just labor costs but the infrastructure China has built with cities devoted to manufacturing where all suppliers are located in close proximity to each other) ... we just need to push China to update their laws and the OEMs to continue driving their offshore suppliers to comply with reasonable standards :cool:
 
Ur_Mom said:
Still, if it weren't for Apple, who would we blame? Apple has the shock factor. "OMG?! How could Apple do this to it's workers?! It's APPLE!".
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It's fun because Apple customers usually are smug liberals.

Me, I don't care if my phone is made using dead baby dolphins.
 
pankkake said:
It's fun because Apple customers usually are smug liberals.

Me, I don't care if my phone is made using dead baby dolphins.
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Dead baby dolphins aren't actually very good for phones ... baby seal fur on the other hand makes excellent phones :p
 
Starcrossed said:
Troll elsewhere.
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Entry level assembling and manufacturing workers in the US can hardly afford an iPhone, why would it be different in a market where iPhones aren't even considered that big of a deal? These guys have plenty of knock offs and similar devices to choose from for a much lower cost.
 
LeninGHOLA said:
Entry level assembling and manufacturing workers in the US can hardly afford an iPhone, why would it be different in a market where iPhones aren't even considered that big of a deal? These guys have plenty of knock offs and similar devices to choose from for a much lower cost.
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Your keen insight into the situation is enlightening. :rolleyes:
 
Starcrossed said:
If anyone has a right to own those phones, it would be a Foxconn employee...
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If I work in a Ferrari factory, I have a right to own a Ferrari. If I work in the Federal Reserve, I have a right to own the printed money. Just saying.
 
bbqrooster said:
If I work in a Ferrari factory, I have a right to own a Ferrari. If I work in the Federal Reserve, I have a right to own the printed money. Just saying.
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You are isolating variables that look much different when put into the context of a Chinese worker who is essentially a state slave.
 
Starcrossed said:
You are isolating variables that look much different when put into the context of a Chinese worker who is essentially a state slave.
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I take it you are NOT from China ... there are many problems in China and their workers have many valid criticisms of both Western and Chinese companies manufacturing there ... however, being "Slaves" is not one of them ... the OEMs definitely take a dim view of forced labor and except for very small companies who don't supply to Western companies at all I think you would be hard pressed to find "slave" workers in China ... the wages they receive do comply with the law and many receive regular wage increases to keep them from moving to competing companies or returning home ... you can question whether the national wage requirements should be higher but they are most definitely not "slave" wages ;)
 
Starcrossed said:
....a Chinese worker who is essentially a state slave.
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Can you tell us then how these workers are slave of the state? What's the difference between these Chinese workers and the poor people in US? Are you equating these Chinese workers to the black slaves of old. I just love how people cheapen the word slave almost to the point of no meaning.
 
kbrickley said:
I take it you are NOT from China ... there are many problems in China and their workers have many valid criticisms of both Western and Chinese companies manufacturing there ... however, being "Slaves" is not one of them ... the OEMs definitely take a dim view of forced labor and except for very small companies who don't supply to Western companies at all I think you would be hard pressed to find "slave" workers in China ... the wages they receive do comply with the law and many receive regular wage increases to keep them from moving to competing companies or returning home ... you can question whether the national wage requirements should be higher but they are most definitely not "slave" wages ;)
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The reality is that LeninGHOLA enjoys his liberty but cares little for other's.
 
Starcrossed said:
If anyone has a right to own those phones, it would be a Foxconn employee...
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What gives the Foxconn employees the "right" to own these phones more than you or me? Is that a God-given right, like "all men are created equal" or is that a right given to them simply because their hands touched the HW first, ergo, it's theirs? Last I checked owning an $800 (?) iP5 isn't a right for anyone, it's a consumer decision. Where is the line for me to pick up my rightfully-mine iP5?
 
awsiemieniec said:
What gives the Foxconn employees the "right" to own these phones more than you or me? Is that a God-given right, like "all men are created equal" or is that a right given to them simply because their hands touched the HW first, ergo, it's theirs? Last I checked owning an $800 (?) iP5 isn't a right for anyone, it's a consumer decision. Where is the line for me to pick up my rightfully-mine iP5?
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Go get a job at Foxconn, and I might see it as more your right to own one than some Westerner who does give a shit about your well-being.
 
Starcrossed said:
The reality is that LeninGHOLA enjoys his liberty but cares little for other's.
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I'd actually prefer they be paid competetively and treated well. Like I said, China is having growing pains, which all countries have had or will have had when the consumer middle class grows so quickly. There is no effective way to transition an economy quickly enough to eliminate bumps along the road.
 
Starcrossed said:
The reality is that LeninGHOLA enjoys his liberty but cares little for other's.
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Well, no need to blame LeninGhola for my comment :)

Although we should certainly encourage companies that do business in China to act responsibly (through our buying preferences) ... we cannot impose "liberty" on another people (history has proven that that approach doesn't work) ... if the Chinese workers feel they are slaves then they should have the inclination to do something about it ... if they feel they are acting in their own, their family's, and in their country's interests, who are we to tell them that they are wrong :eek:
 
Lol people are so misinformed or listen to too much propaganda.... No one is being forced to work at Foxconn. There are plenty of people who want these jobs. The pay is very decent (by Chinese standards) and these workers (most of whom has at most a high school degree) make more than most college graduates. Even more if they are willing to pull more hours (which they all do). Living environment is fairly spartan but there are entertainment and I reckon the food to be pretty good (I'd pay to eat their cafeteria food in the U.S.).

Now you may ask why do they get pissed. For one they are a long way from their family and friends. It is a dead end job, the goal is to make money and go home to do something else. People don't have the safety nets around them to fall back on if something happens. Ironically one of the more recent incidents is because managers were trying to cut down on overtime work... Ever heard of slaves rioting because they are forced to work LESS?
 
pankkake said:
It's fun because Apple customers usually are smug liberals.

Me, I don't care if my phone is made using dead baby dolphins.
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Good point. But, I'd say it's about 3/4% are the smug liberals, the others are just the average person. But, I could grab a beret and grow by beard out and trade in for some thick rimmed glasses then go to Starbucks in my Prius for a vegan cream coffee and write a novel on my Macbook Air about the saint Obama and his efforts for peace and to stop war. I'd fit right in with the 75%...
 
lixuelai said:
Lol people are so misinformed or listen to too much propaganda.... No one is being forced to work at Foxconn. There are plenty of people who want these jobs. The pay is very decent (by Chinese standards) and these workers (most of whom has at most a high school degree) make more than most college graduates. Even more if they are willing to pull more hours (which they all do). Living environment is fairly spartan but there are entertainment and I reckon the food to be pretty good (I'd pay to eat their cafeteria food in the U.S.).

Now you may ask why do they get pissed. For one they are a long way from their family and friends. It is a dead end job, the goal is to make money and go home to do something else. People don't have the safety nets around them to fall back on if something happens. Ironically one of the more recent incidents is because managers were trying to cut down on overtime work... Ever heard of slaves rioting because they are forced to work LESS?
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I called them slaves because in the scheme of world economics, they essentially are.
 
Starcrossed said:
Go get a job at Foxconn, and I might see it as more your right to own one than some Westerner who does give a shit about your well-being.
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No one, at least that I noticed, said they didn't care about the Foxconn employee's well-being-ness (? word). That's another topic. I was just wondering about what right do they have? Since I work in my small business building servers for clients, is it my right to keep the server I build even though someone is paying me to do it?

My point is that it's not a right to own a phone. And I do care about the general well-being of people who have poor conditions simply because they were born into them. Once again, another topic for a different thread.
 
Pylon said:
Do you believe at all in employee discounts?
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Yes, for sure. If one works for a company that produces something (tangible or even intangible), and if the company is generous to offer it's employee's a discount, then great. Yeah, I'm for employee discounts. But don't confuse that with a "right". It's a benefit, not a right.
 
awsiemieniec said:
Yes, for sure. If one works for a company that produces something (tangible or even intangible), and if the company is generous to offer it's employee's a discount, then great. Yeah, I'm for employee discounts. But don't confuse that with a "right". It's a benefit, not a right.
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.. and it is your right to determine rights, of course ..
 
Starcrossed said:
.. and it is your right to determine rights, of course ..
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Maybe we have a different definition of "right" and "benefit". I think what you're saying is that, as a business owner, I have the right to determine rights to my employees. Yes? If that's what you're saying, then I respectfully disagree. As an employer, I have the ability to offer my employees benefits, but I cannot grant or deny rights.

To me, a right is something that you are born with - it's God-given. I have the right to be treated as a human because I am one, not because of the color of my skin or the place where I was born. I have the ability to give benefits to my employees as perks. Benefits are "icing on the cake".
 
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