NASA Cutting Funding on Mars Projects

CommanderFrank

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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May 9, 2000
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Budget cuts will have an impact of space exploration in the near future with NASA proposing a $300m reduction in funding. The cuts will have a direct effect on the proposed joint missions to Mars with the European Space Agency in 2016 1nd 2018.

NASA spokesman David Weaver said that, just like the rest of the federal government, the space agency has to make “tough choices … and live within our means.”
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Hobman27 said:
they are going to focus on Newt's moon base project instead
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The most useless way of spending money.

*If* NASA had the money, they should focus on getting people on Mars, rather than sending rovers there. Much more exciting. (See Dr. Zubrin on YouTube... It isn't that complex of an undertaking.)
 
Brent_Justice said:
RIP American Space Exploration, it was nice while it lasted.
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Amen.

We just need one big asteroid to come on a collision course with us and we'll be screwed because of no defense setup existing... or some of the "not so good" nations to get laser targeting mounted on satellites... and we're screwed.

Oh, and we'll fall behind on technology at a quicker pace too, without these research programs going.
 
RIGHT lets cut funding the most under funded part of the Fed gov't GG Congress
just put things in perspective the Dept of Agricultural gets more funding then NASA
 
Have to agree with Brent. NASA is a shadow of it's former self, kind of like the anorexic pop star, or Angelina Jolie these days... skinny and pale, an almost ghostly figure.

I wish I had been alive when those guys were racing to the moon, amazing times.

NASA's time has unfortunatly come and gone, at least in the eyes of recent and current American government and business. The rest of us interested in such things, still keep dreaming of a world where somebody cares about something other than $$$.
 
I wonder if any of the people, politicians or otherwise, know how many innovations we use today on a daily basis as a result of the applied research done in and around the space program. Fail to invest in the future and it might pass one by.

/Off topic/
Ah well, I have no qualms about moving wherever the jobs are if this country goes the way of Rome since I am always mobile. One of the big reasons I'm doing better than a lot of my friends is because I don't believe in owning a house or anything that can't ship in a box or re-buy. It's funny how most of them changed their tune from, "you are just throwing money away on rent" to "oh noess what am I to do about my upside down house and second mortgage."
/Off topic/
 
Defense spending (kill people money) increased almost every single year the last ten years. NASA's budget has been chop, chop, chopped year after year (not sure if every year, sure feels like it though). Hmmm....

So humans are smart?

I want to be the first person in this thread to say F$$K YOU!!! to the United States Government and its shitty ass corrupt (can only get worse) politicians. I hope you drop dead you POS's.


Defense Spending 2012 = 578 billion (Don't quote me on this figure, just going off of what I think I remember hearing said on TV)
NASA budget - 2012 = 18 billion

Yeah, lets cut NASA!
 
Or maybe they're just saving money for that extralunar space station they've been talking up in recent days.

In any case, I do agree that NASA's budget shouldn't be cut anymore than it is. I like the new direction they're headed in but I disagree with the amount of money they're allocated as opposed to defense spending.
 
i don't mind. Let the other countries do the space research.

dept of agriculture gets more funding? well, shouldn't it? food related shit should be more important.
I want my beef and crops!
 
Wyodiver said:
krogen, thanks for the info about Dr. Zubrin. Depressing, as he is right about the US space agenda, yet inspirational to know that some people still care. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5haTmLDjmE0
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He is a great, great man. I think the most depressing thing is - he has been fighting for well over 20 years for us to explore the new planet. Even with so much enthusiasm and very clear, well thought out plans, NASA and the U.S. government complete ignored him all these years.

NASAs, as well as U.S. governments, excuse is always the same. We need a massive, intergalactic space exploration vehicle. That is, something that will never get done. All they want to keep doing is pushing this idea back for monetary reasons. The truth of the matter is different. We have the technology to go there. We don't need to wait for warp drives and worm holes or God knows what. We can go to Mars. Today.
 
Elios said:
RIGHT lets cut funding the most under funded part of the Fed gov't GG Congress
just put things in perspective the Dept of Agricultural gets more funding then NASA
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They get funding to prevent Farmers from growing crops. :(
 
Well we'll be the ones not going to mars while other countries go there.
 
When NASA's budget was at its peak in 66 or 67, it still amounted to just 0.5% of GDP. And we built the largest rockets ever created, landed men on the moon, and launched a space station within 5 years.

This just sucks. :(
 
dr.kevin said:
i don't mind. Let the other countries do the space research.
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You need a lot of monetary backing to go anywhere outside our orbit. That is, a big country, such as U.S., needs to be involved. You can't hope that Germany or France can accomplish this. It's us or China. China, however, is lacking the technology in space flight, so we have a big edge over that.

dept of agriculture gets more funding? well, shouldn't it? food related shit should be more important.
I want my beef and crops!
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Without the decisions that NASA and the U.S. government have made 30-40 years ago, our world would look totally different. GPS technology? Nope. Satellite television? Nope.
Go take a look at Wikipedia's page just to see how many findings and research papers were done with data that Hubble telescope found. Or Voyager space probes. Or any other space project. They all deliver new advancements in technology or science.

Even in modern agriculture, we use space technology. Modern tractors are equipped with GPS to accurately plow the land. More accurate plowing = less resources wasted = more crops = MORE BEEF FOR YOU.
 
I remember what it was like during the moon race,the excitement and pride that people felt when the Eagle finally landed. It was like mankind had finally emerged from infancy and taken it's first faltering steps. It's a shame,but I don't think I'll be around to experience that again with a Mars landing at the rate this country is going. Space is the future,this planet isn't going to last forever.
 
Why should America foot the bill for the Mars race? I am perfectly fine with letting someone else get their. Rather they cust spending at NASA, than somewhere we really need it. Like defense spending. Like it or not the rest of the world hates us, and pretty much has hated us more and more since WW2. We can no longer afford to not have a large defense budget.
 
Eh if we're broke we're broke, cut funding... but for crying out loud cut it everywhere. It sucks to high heaven to see a science based project cut but we're still spending a trillion plus more than we're taking in.

Granted I don't think we're anywhere close to exploration of Mars any more so than we've been with little rovers, and perhaps we should work on designing actual space craft beyond the "big fucking gas tank connected to a nozzle" technology, but still. Hopefully this is a project that NASA actually cut as opposed to having some politician tell them what to cut.


dr.kevin said:
dept of agriculture gets more funding? well, shouldn't it? food related shit should be more important.
I want my beef and crops!
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Eh... depends. How much of that money is paying farmers not to grow food? how much of that money is paying subsidies to farmers to "help them out". FYI, most subsidies go towards corn, cotton, rice, wheat, & soybeans are like 90% of those subsidies, you want fruits and vegetables... yanno stuff that's actually healthy for you and not just caloric content? Sorry you don't qualify. And most of those subsidies go to big mega-farms ... i.e. corporate (aka Monsanto)... i.e. the big bucks lobbying/buying politician game, and NOT mom and pop farms.

Now not sure if all that money comes from the DoA budget or is another line item on some random bill, but it does go to show "important stuff" isn't always terribly important, and your beef ain't one of those things.
 
GORANKAR said:
Why should America foot the bill for the Mars race?
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Wait, we police the world (literally and metaphorically), we give out tens to hundred of billions of dollars in foreign aid to dozens or more countries annually (That's not used to actually aid the people but to help the over there rich). Our defense spending is larger than the next top ten largest (biggest military powers) countries combined (Our Navy's bigger than the next top 13 most powerful Navy's combined). So my answer is why not? It's not like the US wouldn't claim Mars's all theirs (ours) and everyone that says otherwise is a terrorist as soon as we got there anyway!

GORANKAR said:
I am perfectly fine with letting someone else get their.
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Have fun waiting on that!

GORANKAR said:
Rather they cut spending at NASA, than somewhere we really need it. Like defense spending.
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Defense spending is being increased, not decreased (okay, possibly only for this election year but you should catch my drift).

GORANKAR said:
Like it or not the rest of the world hates us, and pretty much has hated us more and more since WW2. We can no longer afford to not have a large defense budget.
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Giving more money/power/control to our government aka the elite/corporations personal guards is only going to make this worse, not better. So I say we can no longer afford (in more ways than one) to use our defense budget (aka kill anyone that disagrees with us budget) the way we've been using it. Also, I petition a rename of it to "Global Offense Budget". Seriously though, maybe it's time to cut some of our aggressive ass imperialism/global dominance out of our budget and focus on more important matters. Oh wait, we have to cleanse the Earth before we can start phase two!



My point: the government is right, we should get our priories straight and focus on WW3 instead of setting up civilization on the closest planet to us. Yup, make perfect sense now that I truly contemplate the bigger picture!
 
AnonymousUser said:
Wait, we police the world (literally and metaphorically), we give out tens to hundred of billions of dollars in foreign aid to dozens or more countries annually (That's not used to actually aid the people but to help the over there rich). Our defense spending is larger than the next top ten largest (biggest military powers) countries combined (Our Navy's bigger than the next top 13 most powerful Navy's combined). So my answer is why not? It's not like the US wouldn't claim Mars's all theirs (ours) and everyone that says otherwise is a terrorist as soon as we got there anyway!



Have fun waiting on that!




Defense spending is being increased, not decreased (okay, possibly only for this election year but you should catch my drift).



Giving more money/power/control to our government aka the elite/corporations personal guards is only going to make this worse, not better. So I say we can no longer afford (in more ways than one) to use our defense budget (aka kill anyone that disagrees with us budget) the way we've been using it. Also, I petition a rename of it to "Global Offense Budget". Seriously though, maybe it's time to cut some of our aggressive ass imperialism/global dominance out of our budget and focus on more important matters. Oh wait, we have to cleanse the Earth before we can start phase two!



My point: the government is right, we should get our priories straight and focus on WW3 instead of setting up civilization on the closest planet to us. Yup, make perfect sense now that I truly contemplate the bigger picture!
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Too late to turn back on that now. Had we continued to mind our own business, or just went back to minding our own business after WW2, we might not need such a large defense budget now. But we are here now, no way around it. Even if we withdraw from everywhere, we would simply be despised by different people. America, despised if we do, despised if we do not.

If the rest of humanity has no interest footing the bill for Mars exploration, I guess we will just have to wait.
 
What I am saying is that, I do not see an exit strategy with a favorable outcome that would allow us to significantly reduce our defense spending and allow for spending on Mars exploration.
 
GORANKAR said:
What I am saying is that, I do not see an exit strategy with a favorable outcome that would allow us to significantly reduce our defense spending and allow for spending on Mars exploration.
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Having hundreds of bases around the world does not make defense. In fact, it is opposite of defense. You spread out too thin and any defense you have is completely gone.

Check out Ron Paul's foreign policy. Get everyone home, have much stronger defense that way and leave the Arab holy land alone. Boom, Arabs no longer hate us as much anymore, our defense has gone through the roof, and we save billions. What's not to like?

Going back to the topic, spending money on space exploration brings in benefits. GPS technology? Brought to you by U.S. military & NASA. Today the whole world uses GPS and American corporations who were behind this technology get the profits. More inventions? How about propulsion systems? How about new, stronger fabrics developed for the sole purpose of protecting spacecraft and now used in the everyday world? Tactical to practical my friend.

Spending money on space has been proven to bring in new research and technology. I think it's something that we can all agree does all of us good. And brings in a flow of cash. It's an investment opportunity.
 
We need to focus on clean energy first. Then clean up the pollution. Then we can focus on space and mining/raping mars etc. lulz
 
GORANKAR said:
What I am saying is that, I do not see an exit strategy with a favorable outcome that would allow us to significantly reduce our defense spending and allow for spending on Mars exploration.
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You were pretty clear the first time. :) I agree to an extent too but not about NASA NEEDING to be cut, no way. Example: The Navy is building 11 new carriers this year (remember our current Navy beats the next 13 top Navy's combined). If we just didn't build those (or many other things for that matter) we could double NASA's funding and potentially make way more progress! So I just want it noted (like it matters to my gov. that I know...lol) that because of this course/direction another world war is almost inevitable as there is little other choices that will remain as things progress and tensions rise (better yet when certain intentions become more clear).

I've even heard it mentioned from a few different sources that attacking places like Iran is putting us on a fast track to WW3. If I had to give an opinion I'd say the only reason we haven't completely destroyed Iran is because we the bully, I mean the US, have poked Iran with a stick repeatedly and realized it caused other big guys (countries) to watch us in discontent. So we've since backed off and are just waiting for the right excuse. The US = the bully of the world. We all know what happens to bullies sooner or later.


Point: Mars, noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!! Don't go!!! :(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(
 
Imaulle said:
We need to focus on clean energy first. Then clean up the pollution. Then we can focus on space and mining/raping mars etc. lulz
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But those first 2 things don't make rich people richer. So they are going to happen.
 
Random thought: How many people watched Avatar and thought the military/corporations were so messed up in that movie?

7 out of 10?
8 out of 10?
9 out of 10?
10 out of 10?

Point: The movie was based off/on what James Cameron and his CGI dudes knew of/seen with the oil sands in Canada. Now how's that for some doses of reality? The US is exactly (or possibly even worse) than the military/corporations that were portrayed in that movie (kill/ruin/destroy anything/anywhere for $$$$).

avatar-sands-top-image.jpg


The way humans act you'd think everyone would know/think it'd be a great idea to have an extra planet or two ready to go, but just the one? Oh, Universe, help us!!! :(
 
I keep hearing that SpaceX is the bomb and that privatization will lead us to salvation.
But then I never see any SpaceX representation at JANNAF.

Hmm.

I will admit that I only made it through a couple of minutes of that Zubrin video. He had so many things wrong in the first 480 seconds that I couldn't watch anymore.

It's very sad what's happening to NASA/our space program. As others have said, there are so many direct and ancillary benefits that it makes you wonder how it's ever even up for debate. And yet it loses every time :(
 
pfc_m_drake said:
I keep hearing that SpaceX is the bomb and that privatization will lead us to salvation.
But then I never see any SpaceX representation at JANNAF.

Hmm.

I will admit that I only made it through a couple of minutes of that Zubrin video. He had so many things wrong in the first 480 seconds that I couldn't watch anymore.

It's very sad what's happening to NASA/our space program. As others have said, there are so many direct and ancillary benefits that it makes you wonder how it's ever even up for debate. And yet it loses every time :(
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This.
 
krogen said:
Having hundreds of bases around the world does not make defense. In fact, it is opposite of defense. You spread out too thin and any defense you have is completely gone.

Check out Ron Paul's foreign policy. Get everyone home, have much stronger defense that way and leave the Arab holy land alone. Boom, Arabs no longer hate us as much anymore, our defense has gone through the roof, and we save billions. What's not to like?

Going back to the topic, spending money on space exploration brings in benefits. GPS technology? Brought to you by U.S. military & NASA. Today the whole world uses GPS and American corporations who were behind this technology get the profits. More inventions? How about propulsion systems? How about new, stronger fabrics developed for the sole purpose of protecting spacecraft and now used in the everyday world? Tactical to practical my friend.

Spending money on space has been proven to bring in new research and technology. I think it's something that we can all agree does all of us good. And brings in a flow of cash. It's an investment opportunity.
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I agree completely on the space part of your post. However, the "defense" part is just plain wrong. These people HATE us, and want us dead, period. They do not simply want us to "leave them alone". Heck, they even have outright said they'd love to "wipe Israel off the map". Fighting over there keeps them from getting to here to slaughter thousands more Americans. If we withdraw from overseas they will simply come attack us again... they already have before (WW2, 9/11/01). In Israel they attack daily. Would you want that to be happening over here? No? Then we need to keep the fight over there.

Remember, they attacked us, not the other way around. America is NOT some "evil" imperialist nation. We're defending ourselves, and people who want a free standard of living rather than oppressive nation-states that pretty much do whatever the hell they want to/with you. In most cases America is not the aggressor, and when we have been, it's been for good reason (at the time).
 
NASA spokesman David Weaver said:
just like the rest of the federal government, the space agency has to make "tough choices … and live within our means."
Click to expand...

Since when as ANY of the federal government department "lived within it's means".
I sure haven't seen any examples the last few years.


krogen said:
Check out Ron Paul's foreign policy. Get everyone home, have much stronger defense that way and leave the Arab holy land alone. Boom, Arabs no longer hate us as much anymore, our defense has gone through the roof, and we save billions. What's not to like?
Click to expand...

I have news for you. As much as I agree with the part about shutting down alot of our bases over seas, the part about Arabs no longer hating us will NEVER happen.
 
GORANKAR said:
Why should America foot the bill for the Mars race? I am perfectly fine with letting someone else get their.
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Get their what? :confused:

This is strange news coming on the heels of discovering the closest thing to a habitable planet. Or perhaps we'll redirect money toward getting to that one? I doubt it but possible.
 
AnonymousUser said:
You were pretty clear the first time. :) I agree to an extent too but not about NASA NEEDING to be cut, no way. Example: The Navy is building 11 new carriers this year (remember our current Navy beats the next 13 top Navy's combined). If we just didn't build those (or many other things for that matter) we could double NASA's funding and potentially make way more progress! So I just want it noted (like it matters to my gov. that I know...lol) that because of this course/direction another world war is almost inevitable as there is little other choices that will remain as things progress and tensions rise (better yet when certain intentions become more clear).

I've even heard it mentioned from a few different sources that attacking places like Iran is putting us on a fast track to WW3. If I had to give an opinion I'd say the only reason we haven't completely destroyed Iran is because we the bully, I mean the US, have poked Iran with a stick repeatedly and realized it caused other big guys (countries) to watch us in discontent. So we've since backed off and are just waiting for the right excuse. The US = the bully of the world. We all know what happens to bullies sooner or later.


Point: Mars, noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!! Don't go!!! :(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(:(
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Do we really need 11 carrier task forces? China only has one IIRC. Cut down the number of carrier groups, and voila more money that isn't poured into building/maintaining/dismantling ships and subs.
 
NASA is too busy constructing data to help Al Gore's global warming cause. Even they lost some of their drive for space.
 
GoldenTiger said:
I agree completely on the space part of your post. However, the "defense" part is just plain wrong. These people HATE us, and want us dead, period. They do not simply want us to "leave them alone". Heck, they even have outright said they'd love to "wipe Israel off the map". Fighting over there keeps them from getting to here to slaughter thousands more Americans. If we withdraw from overseas they will simply come attack us again... they already have before (WW2, 9/11/01). In Israel they attack daily. Would you want that to be happening over here? No? Then we need to keep the fight over there.

Remember, they attacked us, not the other way around. America is NOT some "evil" imperialist nation. We're defending ourselves, and people who want a free standard of living rather than oppressive nation-states that pretty much do whatever the hell they want to/with you. In most cases America is not the aggressor, and when we have been, it's been for good reason (at the time).
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nutzo said:
Since when as ANY of the federal government department "lived within it's means".
I sure haven't seen any examples the last few years.




I have news for you. As much as I agree with the part about shutting down alot of our bases over seas, the part about Arabs no longer hating us will NEVER happen.
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They want to eradicate the Jews. Why? Because the Jews claim that Israel is their land. It has been for a few decades, but before then it was a Muslim territory for hundreds of years. Going back further in time, it was Jews...

Who's to say that America, "the Big Brother", is to fix this s***? Who are we? Are we God? Who is right here? Who is wrong?

You can't say that Muslims are wrong in this case. If you do then you must be taking one side because of religious / biblical beliefs.

Jews lost their land long ago. It is not their anymore.

Also, listen to some of what Bin Laden had to say. Not just the U.S. propaganda war machine. The fact is, we have been in their holy land. We built bases there. After 9/11, The CIA concluded, what Bin Laden said himself. We were attacked because of our presence in the middle east.
 
GoldenTiger said:
Remember, they attacked us, not the other way around. America is NOT some "evil" imperialist nation. We're defending ourselves
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HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
(biggest face-palm ever (the bandwidth used brought down the internet so hard they had to make a totally new one))

If you believe that than wow, fucking wow!!! Where to start (or why even try)...thousands of bases in 170+ countries (right there says enough), policing the entire world, trying to and mostly succeeding in dictating all the other countries in every relevant topic throughout the entire planet, constant covert wars with dozens of nations at a time, reserve currency status( as well as being the biggest debtor nation in history holding higher credit ratings than the biggest creditor nation in history, hmmm...lol), etc. Yet you dare say that's not imperialistic....lol.

I won't even argue this with you after this one post. There's no point as I can't smack you through the screen. I guess some people just love that kool-aid they're given and drinking way too much. Smh... shit's crazy out here.

The US is the definition of imperialism (in every sense of the meaning). Now don't get me wrong, I love the land and people here too but at least I understand what's real and what you're being sold/told is real. Seriously, you get one one reply to my post and that's it. I will not debate someone that doesn't accept reality.

Meet Noam Chomsky.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAeWqBQr1GA


And Joe Rogan...lol. Not exactly the same topic but I love this video so I love it so I share it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87ogFvraGT8

Point: The US is a war machine, point, blank, period! It starts WAY MORE fights than are started against it. Most responses to the US are reactions, not actions!





Imperialism - the policy of extending the rule or authority of an empire or nation over foreign countries, or of acquiring and holding colonies and dependencies.
 
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