Trinity in the Flesh...or Silicon

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Below you will see the new upcoming Trinity APUs. Desktop, Notebook, and Low Power. We should be seeing these launched in early Q2'12, and as noted earlier in our Rory Read post, Trinity will launch with many design wins under its belt. While AMD has not informed HardOCP about a new desktop socket, all our sources in the industry tell us to expect an "FM2" socket format.
 
Now this is an AMD product I can actually be excited about. Sucks that FM1 is a one-and-done platform, but let's hope they've ironed out any Bulldozer core Issues with Trinity's Piledriver cores.

From a product standpoint, AMD is really focusing on its mainstream and entry level APUs. Rory didn't come out and say it here but no where in AMD's future direction is a focus on the high-end x86 CPU space.

Also note that AMD isn't going to be as focused on delivering high performance products on the absolute latest process node. It views Brazos as one of its biggest successes to date and that architecture was built on a 40nm process with an easily synthesizable architecture. It's likely that the future of AMD is built around more of these easy to manufacture SoCs rather than highly custom, bleeding edge CPUs.
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http://www.anandtech.com/show/5492/amds-rory-read-outlines-amds-future-strategy

Looks like Anand is actually there or getting a feed, but I've been trying to keep track because of stock prices, haha. Either way, I don't think this is a shock to anyone.

That said, if you're pinning your hopes on Piledriver, I'd keep my eyes out during late Q1 early Q2 for leaked benchmarks as that's when most OEMs should have received their chips.

It's AMD's financial analyst day, btw. AKA Project WIN
 
Considering Bulldozer's high prices I would be amazed if they could make it worthwhile based on price/performance.
 
does it apply to A series only or does it include E series also?
 
The E-series wouldn't fit in FM2. It's die size is far smaller (75mm squared), 40nm as opposed to Trinity's 32nm, and it's meant for embedded markets and mobile.
 
pelo said:
Now this is an AMD product I can actually be excited about. Sucks that FM1 is a one-and-done platform, but let's hope they've ironed out any Bulldozer core Issues with Trinity's Piledriver cores.
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Sucks to be me, cause I just built a system with a FM1 socket. Was hoping it to be future proof. Though the machine wasn't meant to replace my main computer, just another HTPC.
 
new products are always cool, time will tell on this line.

am i the only one that noticed the weird finger on the bottom die?
 
There's three different chip "formats" in the picture. With heatspreader, without, and something else. They apparently all use FM2. What the advantage of having those different formats?

EDIT: I think I know. The bottom chip is not FM2, it is the "embedded" format - soldered directly to the board.
 
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venm11 said:
There's three different chip "formats" in the picture. With heatspreader, without, and something else. They apparently all use FM2. What the advantage of having those different formats?
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I wouldn't go so far as to say they all use FM2.

The top is definitely desktop. The middle is probably for mainstream/regular laptops. The bottom is most likely for ultrabooks, very thin laptops.
 
This is pretty exciting. I likely have to build another HTPC Q4 of this year for family and this looks like a great candidate.
 
Bontakun said:
This suppose to compete against Intel's ultrabooks?
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I'm going to focus on client mobility, thin and light," Read said.

Read said AMD would focus on opportunities in cloud computing and growing demand from developing countries like China for entry level PCs and other devices.

AMD this year will concentrate on improving its execution rather than pushing the envelope with new technology, he said.

AMD's new chip designs are increasingly energy efficient and the company will go after the tablet market "with a vengeance," said recently hired Lisa Su, senior vice president and general manager of global business units.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/02/02/us-amd-idUSTRE8111ZP20120202
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That's what Rory Read seems to be saying. Then he goes on to talk about cheap entry level devices in China. That makes me think Piledriver is not meant to compete against Intel Ultrabooks. At any rate it will be a miracle if they can manage to fab a massive 28nm Bulldozer/Piledriver at a low price, especially considering they are at 32nm now. With Nvidia's new Kepler GPUs going into Ultrabooks using Optimus I wonder even more about the future of Piledriver.
 
I'm more curious about the piledriver and how that stacks up considering a 4 core llano can rock a 4 core bulldozer thing.
 
venm11 said:
There's three different chip "formats" in the picture. With heatspreader, without, and something else. They apparently all use FM2. What the advantage of having those different formats?

EDIT: I think I know. The bottom chip is not FM2, it is the "embedded" format - soldered directly to the board.
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Tsumi said:
I wouldn't go so far as to say they all use FM2.

The top is definitely desktop. The middle is probably for mainstream/regular laptops. The bottom is most likely for ultrabooks, very thin laptops.
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Top is FM2 (desktop), middle is FS1r2 (mobile 25W+) and the last is probably similar to FT1 or FT2 for the <=17W parts.
 
niconx said:
That's what Rory Read seems to be saying. Then he goes on to talk about cheap entry level devices in China. That makes me think Piledriver is not meant to compete against Intel Ultrabooks. At any rate it will be a miracle if they can manage to fab a massive 28nm Bulldozer/Piledriver at a low price, especially considering they are at 32nm now. With Nvidia's new Kepler GPUs going into Ultrabooks using Optimus I wonder even more about the future of Piledriver.
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Ultrabooks like this are going to be almost double the price of Trinity systems (expect $1000+). Intel is requiring a high material quality, etc that drives up the price. Add in a dedicated Kepler GPU and you got a $1200 laptop easily. I suspect Trinity to do quite well for itself (same price-range as Llano - $500-$700).
 
For what it's worth, if I were to get another laptop right now that has one, good battery life, and two, very good graphics performance for under $700, I'd go with an AMD APU honestly.

I'd choose that over a $700 Intel Core i3 or Core i5 system that is paired with a lesser performing Nvidia GPU with Optimus enabled.

The only thing that is holding me back right now is that many of the A-series-based mobile Llano CPUs are clocked no higher than 2 GHz, many are in the 1.6 to 1.9 GHz range. (I'll have to double check that.) Compare that to a Core i3 or i5 system and they're above 2 GHz in speed, but usually paired with a low end Nvidia card or have a crappy Intel-only on-die GPU.

I'm hoping Piledriver-based Trinity APUs are clocked above 2 GHz.
 
Steve said:
Trinity will launch with many design wins under its belt. While AMD has not informed HardOCP about a new desktop socket, all our sources in the industry tell us to expect an "FM2" socket format.
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if this is true, and i've seen nothing to say it is, then this is hopefully a good thing as i believe the high-end is supposed to migrate from AM3+ to FM2 next year, so we can buy a trinity now and a 28nm steamroller 8 core next year............?
 
I'm more interested in the comments about AMD in effect dropping out of the high end desktop market and wondering where that leaves PC gaming?

I mean high end pc users are already quite niche, if Intel uses the lack of competition in that sector to up prices then we will see that high end area becoming an even smaller niche.

So how will that impact on game developers? Will they bother making PC games? Or will they just make console ports more directed at mid range pc's without added bells and whistles that would require a high end pc to make use of?

Or conversely will the increase of mid range pc's with quite good integrated graphics open up the pc gaming market and stimulate a revival on the pc front albeit at a lower level?
 
Game development doesn't depend on CPU, it depends on GPU and AMD have zero intention of vacating that market. Their intentions are to continue to lead that market and are stressing it is one their primary objectives.
 
octoberasian said:
For what it's worth, if I were to get another laptop right now that has one, good battery life, and two, very good graphics performance for under $700, I'd go with an AMD APU honestly.

I'd choose that over a $700 Intel Core i3 or Core i5 system that is paired with a lesser performing Nvidia GPU with Optimus enabled.

The only thing that is holding me back right now is that many of the A-series-based mobile Llano CPUs are clocked no higher than 2 GHz, many are in the 1.6 to 1.9 GHz range. (I'll have to double check that.) Compare that to a Core i3 or i5 system and they're above 2 GHz in speed, but usually paired with a low end Nvidia card or have a crappy Intel-only on-die GPU.

I'm hoping Piledriver-based Trinity APUs are clocked above 2 GHz.
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This is easily fixed with K10stat utility. Many members on notebook forums are reporting 2.4ghz all 4 cores stable 100% load without additional cooling. some 2.8-3.0ghz suicide runs but they say much over 2.4ghz is to hot for your lap.
 
I bought an Acer e350 laptop through Wallmart for just under $400 CAD after tax. Full size keyboard, sizable screen, and very good performance considering the price. I can't play all games on it, but I can play Starcraft 2 pretty well on the lowest settings. I'm very happy with my laptop.

That being said, I am very excited about next gen AMD APUs, I am salivating at the performance of the A10's. Do want.
 
Of course, and I just bought an A8 laptop. Mobile CPU upgrade please?
 
Ashbringer said:
Sucks to be me, cause I just built a system with a FM1 socket. Was hoping it to be future proof. Though the machine wasn't meant to replace my main computer, just another HTPC.
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if its just an HTPC its future proof in its self. absolutely no reason to upgrade it if thats its sole use. its not like trinity will browse the web or play a movie any better then llano, lol. only difference would be power usage but that should be quite minimal in the HTPC market.
 
flippin_waffles said:
Game development doesn't depend on CPU, it depends on GPU and AMD have zero intention of vacating that market. Their intentions are to continue to lead that market and are stressing it is one their primary objectives.
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Exactly. Developers have far more power at their disposal than is needed.

Its all down to how well you optimise your code. The constant increase in CPU power has just allowed shitty inefficient code to get by. If coders today used the same efforts that folks used back in the 8bit days then you could probably have Crysis running on a 500Mhz PIII.:D
 
This is easily fixed with K10stat utility. Many members on notebook forums are reporting 2.4ghz all 4 cores stable 100% load without additional cooling. some 2.8-3.0ghz suicide runs but they say much over 2.4ghz is to hot for your lap.
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I can clock up to 3.2ghz on my a4-3300m, its only a dual core though. I have a bunch of different p-states setup. High performance and then battery life states. Easy 12 hours of battery life. 3-4 hours gaming life.

I have high hopes for the trinity Apu. The demos have been impressive so far.
 
I have a E-350 APU on my DM1Z. The CPU is perfect for internet and MS Office use like I intended it to, but now I am finding myself wanting more power. I think the trinity may fit the bill if it is priced right considering it has a good GPU on it. Looking forward to seeing it reviewed when it comes out in the next few months.
 
Quote from techreport:

http://techreport.com/articles.x/22452/4

"Also, notice that HSA won't be extended to support discrete GPUs until 2014. Initially, this effort is very much about taking advantage of APUs and the ease of programming made possible by shared memory in APUs and other SoCs."

Other slides from the analysts day seemed to suggest that 2012 was the year for AMD to introduce GPU access to system memory, and 2013 for a unified address apce between gpu and cpu.

Given the above quote it would seem to suggest this is coming to trinity first, although the graphic doesn't actually show the 2012 goal.

Will we get it or not?
 
R3MF said:
Quote from techreport:

http://techreport.com/articles.x/22452/4

"Also, notice that HSA won't be extended to support discrete GPUs until 2014. Initially, this effort is very much about taking advantage of APUs and the ease of programming made possible by shared memory in APUs and other SoCs."

Other slides from the analysts day seemed to suggest that 2012 was the year for AMD to introduce GPU access to system memory, and 2013 for a unified address apce between gpu and cpu.

Given the above quote it would seem to suggest this is coming to trinity first, although the graphic doesn't actually show the 2012 goal.

Will we get it or not?
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I'm not totally sure, but what I think he meant that the full assortment of HSA features will not be included in discrete GPUs until 2014, with the initial features launching with Sea Islands near the end of this year (according to AMD's roadmap). Think of it as the procession of SSE in CPUs.

What I do know is that when HSA is fully extended to discrete GPUs, FM2 and similar platforms will receive a greater benefit than platforms like AM3+.
 
buttons said:
This is easily fixed with K10stat utility. Many members on notebook forums are reporting 2.4ghz all 4 cores stable 100% load without additional cooling. some 2.8-3.0ghz suicide runs but they say much over 2.4ghz is to hot for your lap.
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Allow me to add, im able to run 2.4GHz stable at 1.0875 vs the stock voltage of 1.3125 (for same 2.4 speed) on A8-3500M. i hope Trinity is another joy to undervolt.
 
pelo said:
Looks good, at least if these spces are true. I would have preferred more radeon cores, but it's got a healthy 800mhz clock and there's unlocked versions.

http://vr-zone.com/articles/report-amd-trinity-specifications/14852.html
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What do you make of the huge difference in TDP between the 5800K and the 5700 with the only modest difference in clock speed?

Interesting that they dont give specs for the dual core parts... if they run as fast (or faster) than the quad core skus then theyll be amazing budget rig chips.
 
pelo said:
Looks good, at least if these specs are true. I would have preferred more radeon cores, but it's got a healthy 800mhz clock and there's unlocked versions.

http://vr-zone.com/articles/report-amd-trinity-specifications/14852.html
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I wonder if the 32nm process has improved some, because that A10-5800K is really tempting.

I hope the evolution from 'Bulldozer' to 'Piledriver' brings Trinity to at most 10-15% better than Llano per clock.

If the GPU inside of Trinity has similar throughput improvements as Cayman has over Cypress, then the fewer SPs may give a 10% minimum performance improvement. If GF had 28nm SOI up and running by the end of last year, then Trinity most likely would have packed a larger GPU.
 
PaperclipGod said:
What do you make of the huge difference in TDP between the 5800K and the 5700 with the only modest difference in clock speed?

Interesting that they dont give specs for the dual core parts... if they run as fast (or faster) than the quad core skus then theyll be amazing budget rig chips.
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Well it's both GPU and CPU clock so that probably factors in quite a bit. Also figure they're binning the chips differently because the TDP wouldn't matter as much to somebody who's buying a K-based chip with the intention of adding aftermarket cooling and there's heat and power increases associated with a healthy overclock anyway.

From this TR article:

One of Bulldozer's big weaknesses right now is its performance in individual threads. The CPU does relatively well on some broadly multithreaded workloads, but its IPC (and thus performance) in each thread is often relatively poor. David Kanter attempted to tease out the new CTO's thoughts on single-threaded performance by asking what sort of gap with Intel is acceptable. 15%? 30%? More? Papermaster wasn't willing to give us a number, but to our relief, he didn't attempt to argue that single-threaded performance is unimportant, like some of AMD's marketing folks have been doing. Instead, he said he refused to give a number because he "didn't want to cede anything" to his development team. In other words, it looks like AMD will continue to push ahead on this front, even with the change in business strategies.
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Seems they've finally become aware that a 10-15% performance increase per year isn't enough and that the IPC absolutely must be addressed. Both good signs, so let's hope that the Piledriver cores in Trinity were part of that strategy.

I could give 2 shits about Vishera, but Trinity sounds like it has potential to be an incredible laptop APU and even good desktop replacement for the light gamer. If they can manage to squeeze out 6670 performance from the graphics and some actual crossfire scaling with a cheap 6670 then for somebody like me who only games on a single monitor and very occasionally, this sounds awesome :)
 
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