jacuzz1
Supreme [H]ardness
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The communists were right. They would destroy us from within and have done just that because we turned our childer over to them in our schools.
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Chinese smarter than everyone
- Thread starter Mega6
- Start date
Unfortunately, a Directed Communist Economy has proven to be much more efficient and flexible than a Democracy that changes elected officials, direction and policy constantly. Free Market can only compensate for so much. We also have a deadlocked, do nothing selfish Congress split along two party lines. In the past, differences have been set aside for the good of the Country. Not anymore.
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Zarathustra[H]
Extremely [H]
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Nah.
Yes China has seen unparalleled growth over the last few decades, but that has more to do with where they were, completely underdeveloped, and the rest of the world being willing to manufacture there to save money, than it has anything to do with their model of governance.
If anything, the unchecked authoritarian model of governance hurts them due to all the associated corruption.
To INSTANTLY change the direction of your economy on the turn of a dime far oustrips even approving the yearly budget. I agree that development has played a big role in chinese growth, but how did this occur? A drastic change in economic policy ie. DIRECTED The Chinese have very successfully quickly converting from Agriculture to Industrial in a VERY short amount of time. It took America 100 years, it took China 20ish. Now they are migrating from Industrial to High Tech just as fast, if not faster. Look how Quickly they have moved in Battery Tech, Memory, CPU, AI.. the list goes on. Free market moves much slower.
Zarathustra[H]
Extremely [H]
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Its a lot easier to do when the rest of the world has laid the framework for you. Developing stuff from scratch is always going to take longer.
You do realize that the Chinese have a satellite orbiting NOW with quantum technology. We have nothing to compare. Just one example. China is known to be leader in AI, battery tech, solar cells and 5G at least on the level of USA. So they are not copying everything, they do innovate.
Zarathustra[H]
Extremely [H]
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You can't trust anyone ng they tell you. They lie cheat and steal to keep up appearances.
And 5g is set to be a historic fail.
"everything"?
To deny known facts as accepted by the world to support your argument is a pointless sideshow. What I have mentioned is commonly accepted. And EVERY country lies and steals in their best interest.
Sure, that's why the Soviet Union won the Cold War and is still around, while the USA collapsed in the early 80s.
you are right but we have absolutely failed to contain their influence. Its not about nuclear weapons anymore. Look at the political unrest around the world. Its a geopolitical war that Russia is winning. Look at how Trump is wiping out the relationships with europe and other countries and picking fights with NATO. It was the relationships that were built against Russia and the partnerships that are slowly being taken apart. Its all about power of the internet to divide people against people internally.
Soviets went broke in a Arms Race with the USA. They also did not have anything close to the cross-over type of Communism that China has. Comparing the the CCCP economy design (State Ownership) to the Chinese economic design (socialist market economy) is futile and misleading, They are nothing alike. China combines market with directed socialism where as CCCP is completely directed socialist.
You have this completely backwards btw. The CCCP no longer exists, USA still here. Russia is now closer to China in economic design than the former CCCP's Socialism.
Criticalhitkoala
[H]ard|Gawd
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Dude, not a cool statement.
![main-qimg-bbdf1c367bb467c0a6e845c410a1be89[1].jpg](https://cdn.hardforum.com/data/attachment-files/2019/12/257756_main-qimg-bbdf1c367bb467c0a6e845c410a1be891.jpg "main-qimg-bbdf1c367bb467c0a6e845c410a1be89[1].jpg")
try italics or a smile with that.. I'm not a mind reader and there is no inflection with plain text.
Sorry, man, the sign was intended in jest. I figured you'd realize my first post wasn't serious by the counterfactual.
No big deal. I just took it at face value.
GoldenTiger
Fully [H]
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Facts like he said are more important than feels.
Criticalhitkoala
[H]ard|Gawd
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If I made a blanket statement about a group of people normally on this forum I would get my ass banned. But since it's the the Chinese I guess it doesn't matter. I'm not pro china government, but I can't help but feel that blanket statement about the whole Chinese is kinda a dick statement.
Well, China is not communist anymore but still a totalitarian regime of a new kind, very close to communism regarding individual freedom. The behaviour of China is sneaky and also have in mind that they had everything to catch up, and when you catch up is by making new kind of things of the old ones. About all their business is based on spying and plotting. All the countries and especially the US let them act that way and even helped them. For instance the US especially during Obama times played China against Europe, and so played a totalitarian regime against democracies. Not so nice. But that was even the case between EU countries. Germany is used to be allied with China against France on EU laws favoring Chinese imports in exchange of German companies advantages in China. Many eastern countries depending on German economy and UK, happy to kick against France, supported Germany. On Airbus, Germany and UK sides who have kind of played 0 effort to build that European company that the French brought to life, but especially Germany who got all the benefits from this, sold to China all the Airbus tech for about 2 billion euros against the will of France. The French were not even allowed presence by the chinese to the Airbus facility inauguration in China. And of course now China is profiting from the chinese people working at Airbus moved at new chinese plane facilities based on Airbus trustworthy tech, and will compete against Airbus and Boeing in the very near future. Huawai up to 4G got their tech from Alcatel, for nearly nothing. Same on Thomson (french company that also owned RCA, Braun, Continental Edison, Brandt... and was most important global TV set manufacturer in the 80s) media technology that was sold to chinese by paying money to them in exchange of "nice social attitude" by keeping french workers and facilities that never happened. The Chinese just laughed at the french. Apart from very bad management Alcatel was attacked by the financial business pressing them to sell their technology to China because it will become obsolete and they won't be able to keep competition. Huawei who made a co-enterprise with Alcatel who sold their partnership cheaply, took profit of that and stole all Alcatel markets with the own technology of Alcatel. Most of the financial push of that strategy was coming from the US. I'm not sure how this US finance like the Chinese totalitarian regime more than our democracies. Maybe they had been bought for that from China. China has been caught on buying or blackmailing members of the EU commission. But EU under German pression did nothing about it.
I think some people here are making some very flawed assumptions with regards to China and how things work there. Just because the government can shift resources relatively quickly to something new does not mean that's a good thing. First of all, the only reason the government would shift resources around would be to concentrate on something which keeps the government in power and those who run the government in power. That sort of top down control over resources will always devote resources into projects which benefit them first. This is the exact opposite of innovation and progression.
As an example, there's no way a Bill Gates could be successful in China. No Bill Gates means no Microsoft. A company which revolutionized computing literally would not be allowed to exist in China. He would be seen as a threat to the government and those who run it. He and/or the company would be co-opted under government control and anyone who didn't like it would not be heard from again. Once that happened, any innovation the company could have done would have been killed because the company would be put to the sole use of the Chinese government. Top down government control over all industries cannot foster innovation and advancement. It's simply not possible because it is individuals with freedom to choose who innovate and create.
As for the students. A piece of paper does not an education make. And this isn't even taking into account the actual level of education taught or the fact that China lies about just about everything. What can be inferred is a lot of people can pass some tests. It doesn't mean these people actually know the subject matter. It just means they were able to supply the correct answers to the tests. It also doesn't mean these people are smart or that they can actually perform the tasks the piece of paper would normally indicate. The style of teaching also needs to be taken into account. Are they being taught how to do something or are they being taught to memorize some answers. I'd say it's better than likely most of the people with these pieces of paper have been taught nothing more than how to be cogs in a machine doing rote tasks.
As an innovator who can overtake the rest of the world, I don't think China is a real threat. A threat with regards to stealing technology and ideas, sure. A threat to copying technology and ideas that others have and maybe make some minor changes in the process, sure. A threat with regards to innovation and inventions, no. The very culture of the country as imposed by the government stifles and destroys the conditions required to make these things. Look throughout history and in most cases you will find the greatest inventors, innovators and theorists had the freedom to pursue their ideas and put them forth. In China the government tells you what to think, what to invent, what to research and what to engineer. There is no freedom to innovate on your own. To do so would be a waste of the government's time and resources better put towards doing only what the government wants.
As an example, there's no way a Bill Gates could be successful in China. No Bill Gates means no Microsoft. A company which revolutionized computing literally would not be allowed to exist in China. He would be seen as a threat to the government and those who run it. He and/or the company would be co-opted under government control and anyone who didn't like it would not be heard from again. Once that happened, any innovation the company could have done would have been killed because the company would be put to the sole use of the Chinese government. Top down government control over all industries cannot foster innovation and advancement. It's simply not possible because it is individuals with freedom to choose who innovate and create.
As for the students. A piece of paper does not an education make. And this isn't even taking into account the actual level of education taught or the fact that China lies about just about everything. What can be inferred is a lot of people can pass some tests. It doesn't mean these people actually know the subject matter. It just means they were able to supply the correct answers to the tests. It also doesn't mean these people are smart or that they can actually perform the tasks the piece of paper would normally indicate. The style of teaching also needs to be taken into account. Are they being taught how to do something or are they being taught to memorize some answers. I'd say it's better than likely most of the people with these pieces of paper have been taught nothing more than how to be cogs in a machine doing rote tasks.
As an innovator who can overtake the rest of the world, I don't think China is a real threat. A threat with regards to stealing technology and ideas, sure. A threat to copying technology and ideas that others have and maybe make some minor changes in the process, sure. A threat with regards to innovation and inventions, no. The very culture of the country as imposed by the government stifles and destroys the conditions required to make these things. Look throughout history and in most cases you will find the greatest inventors, innovators and theorists had the freedom to pursue their ideas and put them forth. In China the government tells you what to think, what to invent, what to research and what to engineer. There is no freedom to innovate on your own. To do so would be a waste of the government's time and resources better put towards doing only what the government wants.