Beware the Wraith

M

magoo

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Oct 21, 2004
Messages
14,554
Lesson to learn here.
Never use the pre-applied manufacturer TIM when you mount your CPU.
Bought a new Ryzen 3700X and ASUS Crosshair VIII Hero.
Set the board up just to make sure it POSTed before I mounted my Heatkiller.

OK I was lazy and just slapped on the Wraith cooler, fired up the board....all was well.

Next day came back to take it off and put my Heatkiller on....
The Wraith was stuck.
I gently worked it free, it "let go" or so I thought.....

The cooler pulled the CPU right out of the socket.....

Thank goodness, everything is fine.......Yikes.
 
Sounds like the protective plastic on the bottom of the heatsink wasn't removed before installation.
 
push down.. twist til it comes loose, pull heatsink off..


viivo said:
Sounds like the protective plastic on the bottom of the heatsink wasn't removed before installation.
Click to expand...

nah it's a known issue with amd's mounting.. not hard to deal with but if you're use to dealing with intels mounting system ya sometimes forget.. i've done it plenty of times, as long as you don't panic and accidentally set it back down on the pins it'll come out cleanly without any issues.. can be a bitch getting it off the heatsink after though sometimes.
 
sirmonkey1985 said:
push down.. twist til it comes loose, pull heatsink off..




nah it's a known issue with amd's mounting.. not hard to deal with but if you're use to dealing with intels mounting system ya sometimes forget.. i've done it plenty of times, as long as you don't panic and accidentally set it back down on the pins it'll come out cleanly without any issues.. can be a bitch getting it off the heatsink after though sometimes.
Click to expand...

Gently twist. :)
 
I've been able to pick up a motherboard by an unhooked HSF that was only using Arctic Silver. Definitely gotta twist it.
 
viivo said:
Sounds like the protective plastic on the bottom of the heatsink wasn't removed before installation.
Click to expand...

LoL, I might be dumb....but I'm not stupid.
Logically how could you mount a HSF with that big ass plastic sleeve still attached?

sirmonkey1985 said:
push down.. twist til it comes loose, pull heatsink off..

Brother, I tried every maneuver.....motherfucker was stuck.




nah it's a known issue with amd's mounting.. not hard to deal with but if you're use to dealing with intels mounting system ya sometimes forget.. i've done it plenty of times, as long as you don't panic and accidentally set it back down on the pins it'll come out cleanly without any issues.. can be a bitch getting it off the heatsink after though sometimes.
Click to expand...

I haven't used an AMD CPU since the FX series when every CPU had 1 core........
 
viivo said:
Sounds like the protective plastic on the bottom of the heatsink wasn't removed before installation.
Click to expand...

Not at all. If you do that, the temperatures will be excessively high and you will experience thermal throttling. The system will shut down if you attempt to stress test it as well.

Master_Pain said:
Twist, don't pull.
Click to expand...

Exactly.

thebufenator said:
Next time run a stress test and get the paste hot before shutting down and popping it off
Click to expand...

This helps, but the better thing to do is just twist the heat sink and then remove it.
 
I've also used razor blades to cut into the paste sliding it in sideways. Just by slicing into a couple of corners helps break it also.
 
I let mine run a stress test for 15 minutes than did the twist a pull, came right off.
 
this isn't specific to the wraith, or to factory-applied paste, it's just a PGA thing. I was swapping AM4 CPUs around like mad all summer and with MX-4 paste, a Wraith Spire got stuck, a Hyper 212 got stuck, a Corsair H115i got stuck... IMO if the CPU gets stuck that's a good sign, it means the IHS and heatsink surfaces are flat and mating well <shrug>
 
I did this last week.
Corsair aio bracket doesn't give you much wiggle room.
Everything is fine besides having to toothbrush some Tim off the edge pins.

Oh well.
 
magoo said:
Lesson to learn here.
Never use the pre-applied manufacturer TIM when you mount your CPU.
Bought a new Ryzen 3700X and ASUS Crosshair VIII Hero.
Set the board up just to make sure it POSTed before I mounted my Heatkiller.

OK I was lazy and just slapped on the Wraith cooler, fired up the board....all was well.

Next day came back to take it off and put my Heatkiller on....
The Wraith was stuck.
I gently worked it free, it "let go" or so I thought.....

The cooler pulled the CPU right out of the socket.....

Thank goodness, everything is fine.......Yikes.
Click to expand...

This happened to me. Luckily no pins were bent. I can't stand that glue that AMD and Intel uses. So I used some Noctua paste instead. Gives me zero problems.
 
KATEKATEKATE said:
this isn't specific to the wraith, or to factory-applied paste, it's just a PGA thing. I was swapping AM4 CPUs around like mad all summer and with MX-4 paste, a Wraith Spire got stuck, a Hyper 212 got stuck, a Corsair H115i got stuck... IMO if the CPU gets stuck that's a good sign, it means the IHS and heatsink surfaces are flat and mating well <shrug>
Click to expand...

It seems to happen more with AMD CPU's than the older Intel CPU's, but any non-LGA style socket can do this if you just pull straight up on the heat sink. Fortunately, as long as you pull straight up it generally doesn't hurt anything.
 
Dan_D said:
It seems to happen more with AMD CPU's than the older Intel CPU's, but any non-LGA style socket can do this if you just pull straight up on the heat sink. Fortunately, as long as you pull straight up it generally doesn't hurt anything.
Click to expand...

yep definitely pulled some AM2 and 478 chips right out of the socket back in the day and everything seemed to turn out fine lol
 
Always twist first. LGA has seemingly made everyone unaware of well-known PGA techniques. I always twist loose, even with LGA. I guess I'm not interested in testing the fastener strength of those sockets.

Also, don't just increase rotational pressure until it snaps, unless you really hate the capacitors around your VRM. Push down slightly and twist one way, if it doesn't budge, twist the other way. Keep going back and forth like that, increasing force a little bit each time until it frees itself. Sounds like a lot of steps, but usually takes less than 5 seconds to free up a cooler. I suggest doing it for all coolers with paste, even LGA... Do it CAREFULLY with graphics cards if it doesn't automatically come apart after screw removal, just don't push down on those, pull up slightly instead because there's no protective heat spreader on the die.
 
KATEKATEKATE said:
yep definitely pulled some AM2 and 478 chips right out of the socket back in the day and everything seemed to turn out fine lol
Click to expand...

yup. its when they look like this that you got a prob

Preview.jpg
 
No twisting involved, no cleanup, reusable, no air bubbles:

ThermalPad.jpg
​
Get the bigger size like this for Ryzen AM4, as you can see it covers the whole socket. The smaller version works great for Intel 1151 pin sockets. You may loose 1c but then again you may see a gain over a not perfect application of TIM. This is the 3rd or 4th time using or reusing thermal pad as in taking off the water block and putting it back on. 1700x -> 2700 -> 3900x. No degradation of performance when re-used.
 
This has nothing to do with stock pastes. Many expensive pastes will do this, too. Its not a problem. Its just how this stuff works. And its indicative of a good bond.

Sure, someone might chime in about a paste which doesn't do this. But many pastes do it.
 
noko said:
No twisting involved, no cleanup, reusable, no air bubbles:

Get the bigger size like this for Ryzen AM4, as you can see it covers the whole socket. The smaller version works great for Intel 1151 pin sockets. You may loose 1c but then again you may see a gain over a not perfect application of TIM. This is the 3rd or 4th time using or reusing thermal pad as in taking off the water block and putting it back on. 1700x -> 2700 -> 3900x. No degradation of performance when re-used.
Click to expand...

Noko what kind of performance do you get with these? I had one in my hand at microcenter but thought maybe it was kind of gimmicky so I put it back.
 
tangoseal said:
Noko what kind of performance do you get with these? I had one in my hand at microcenter but thought maybe it was kind of gimmicky so I put it back.
Click to expand...
I am getting great performance, clamping pressure, as in more, is the key with these pads. Linux looked at these last year if you can take his voice.



https://www.innovationcooling.com/initial-desktop-tests-ic-graphite-vs-gelid-gc-extreme/

You can get a 90x90 pad which looks like will be the size needed for TR. One very unique property is that it has excellent side to side heat transfer which will conduct heat to more of your cooler. The Pad Linus used was smaller than the heat spreader, I suspect having a bigger pad as in 40x40 the cooling will be better since the pad will conduct heat all the way to the edges transferring heat to more of the cooler/heatpipes/water. I have a 40x40 pad for the 3900x and it covers the whole heat spreader.
 
noko said:
I am getting great performance, clamping pressure, as in more, is the key with these pads. Linux looked at these last year if you can take his voice.



https://www.innovationcooling.com/initial-desktop-tests-ic-graphite-vs-gelid-gc-extreme/

You can get a 90x90 pad which looks like will be the size needed for TR. One very unique property is that it has excellent side to side heat transfer which will conduct heat to more of your cooler. The Pad Linus used was smaller than the heat spreader, I suspect having a bigger pad as in 40x40 the cooling will be better since the pad will conduct heat all the way to the edges transferring heat to more of the cooler/heatpipes/water. I have a 40x40 pad for the 3900x and it covers the whole heat spreader.
Click to expand...



Oh awesome! Ill buy one tomorrow at Mcenter and put it on 3900x custom loop.
 
It's not the Wraith. I easily pulled out my cpu as well and I was using NT-H1.
 
tangoseal said:
Oh awesome! Ill buy one tomorrow at Mcenter and put it on 3900x custom loop.
Click to expand...
Buy the bigger 40x40 pad, beware these are very electrically conductive, if AM4 they will fit about perfect with a little overhang but should not pose a problem.
IMPORTANT:
  • Best if you lay the motherboard/case so the CPU is flat or horizontal - these pads are like Teflon in slipperiness and will move out of position real easy
  • Any movement of the block will most likely move the pad somewhat off the CPU - can be a real bitch
  • So beware and try it a few times down and up on the block until you are confident that you can put the block on without moving the pad and then tighten down the hold down screws
  • Clamp/Clamp/Clamp obviously not so tight to break anything, use washers if needed for more clamping - I didn't have to do that
  • The second link on the above post, the guy used thermal paste on the corners to keep the pad stationary - I didn't do that and advise against that unless for some reason you find you cannot keep the pad centered on the CPU while putting on the block - if it is offset it will suck and you will know it (I did)
  • The pad can be used over and over again without any degradation of performance (unless it gets contaminated with paste or damaged)
Let us know how it works out.
 
Last edited:
This thread made me laugh. I've done the "Pull heatsink with Cpu out of socket" method hundreds of times. First time with a 478 I panicked and peed my pants thinking I killed my brand new P4 :ROFLMAO:. The method I used to avoid that happening again was using a hair blower to warm up the sink and thermal goo so it'll soften up and then twist the sink. Works every time, but the g/f wasn't happy I kept using her hair dryer :LOL:


You would think after all these years AMD would come up with a locking mechanism similar to intel's to avoid this shit.
 
Nebulous said:
This thread made me laugh. I've done the "Pull heatsink with Cpu out of socket" method hundreds of times. First time with a 478 I panicked and peed my pants thinking I killed my brand new P4 :ROFLMAO:. The method I used to avoid that happening again was using a hair blower to warm up the sink and thermal goo so it'll soften up and then twist the sink. Works every time, but the g/f wasn't happy I kept using her hair dryer :LOL:


You would think after all these years AMD would come up with a locking mechanism similar to intel's to avoid this shit.
Click to expand...

i'm hoping when they replace am4 at some point they'll just use something similar to the mounting system used with threadripper.
 
I'm just glad I'm not the only one.

But honest, I twisted. pulled, cursed, fucking thing would not come out.
 
magoo said:
I'm just glad I'm not the only one.

But honest, I twisted. pulled, cursed, fucking thing would not come out.
Click to expand...
Yeah, my first PC upgrade went something like that. Finally, broke down and asked my dad for help, and he yanked the sonovagun right out of the socket. lol
 
noko said:
Buy the bigger 40x40 pad, beware these are very electrically conductive, if AM4 they will fit about perfect with a little overhang but should not pose a problem.
IMPORTANT:
  • Best if you lay the motherboard/case so the CPU is flat or horizontal - these pads are like Teflon in slipperiness and will move out of position real easy
  • Any movement of the block will most likely move the pad somewhat off the CPU - can be a real bitch
  • So beware and try it a few times down and up on the block until you are confident that you can put the block on without moving the pad and then tighten down the hold down screws
  • Clamp/Clamp/Clamp obviously not so tight to break anything, use washers if needed for more clamping - I didn't have to do that
  • The second link on the above post, the guy used thermal paste on the corners to keep the pad stationary - I didn't do that and advise against that unless for some reason you find you cannot keep the pad centered on the CPU while putting on the block - if it is offset it will suck and you will know it (I did)
  • The pad can be used over and over again without any degradation of performance (unless it gets contaminated with paste or damaged)
Let us know how it works out.
Click to expand...

Thank you very much
 
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