The Raspberry Pi 4 is here

They want to it for actual learning projects controlling things, instead of just running it as a general purpose computer.

Almost no actual projects where you use the Pi to control something really requires much memory.

It is basically using it as desktop computer that requires the memory.

I use one as a media server in a bedroom running Kodi. I got to think it would run faster with more ram. Also I want to setup one running piehole and my understanding is it would run much better with more ram, maybe even using a single unit for vpn server and piehole.

I'm no expert, just a hobbyist and I can usually figure stuff out with online research as needed so I could be off base on this assumption
 
I use one as a media server in a bedroom running Kodi. I got to think it would run faster with more ram. Also I want to setup one running piehole and my understanding is it would run much better with more ram, maybe even using a single unit for vpn server and piehole.

That is still kind of along the lines of just using Pi as general computer, just a lightweight one. People often do all those things on an old computer running Linux.

The kind of projects that really differentiate Pi, tend to be adding control electronics to it.
 
I was hoping for faster drive options on the newest pi4. Looks like same old microSD is the limit.
 
You will be able to boot from the USB3 port with an update that is coming out soon. I saw some benchmarks. Made an incredible difference.
If the do, id buy.
How hard would it be for SBC makers to just add a couple SATA3 PORTS?
EMMC they all use is expensive for the size and speed you get.
SATA3 ssd would run circles around them and USB-C power could run them.
Im willing to try with a USB3.1 drive though.
Thanks for the info!
 
Im willing to try with a USB3.1 drive though.

If you attach a modern SATA SSD to USB3, the throughput would be indistinguishable from a SATA3 drive. There's still some extra latency from the USB <-> SATA3 translation, but it can certainly work very well. The challenge is the size and cost when speaking in terms of an SBC.

[same goes for spinners, too- you can easily pull full bandwidth off of a spinner if the controller used is up to the task]
 
ordered mines...went for 4BG just in case sinc eonlt $55. It said expected to ship in 2-3 weeks
 
Already did: Robotics, Home Automation, Mame Cabinet.

A couple of Robotics examples:

https://projects.raspberrypi.org/en/projects/build-a-buggy
https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/robocod/
https://www.instructables.com/id/Building-robots-with-Raspberry-Pi-and-Python/

When I was a kid I had a 150-in-1 electronics kit from Radio Shack. It had a bunch of electronic components with spring terminals to make projects out of. For instance you could make a transistor radio.

The point wasn't that it was a great transitor radio. The point was to learn about electronics and how a transitor radio works by building one.

As Trentchau says above. Kids today have access to things like the Pi for their learing. It's 1000 times better than my old 150-in-1 electronics kit.


The point of Pi is learning by doing, not having it just be a computer to run some software on.

If you are not interested in learning, then IMO Pi is wasted on you.

I still have the 200-in-1 variant of that kit in my closet; it's awesome for demonstrating simple circuits to this day and a hell of a lot easier than futzing around with breadboards.
 
I use my Pi 3 to monitor some plants and motion with two regular cams streaming at 720p actually uses quite a bit of cpu grunt. I think I'll pick one up just for the extra grunt
 
I still have the 200-in-1 variant of that kit in my closet; it's awesome for demonstrating simple circuits to this day and a hell of a lot easier than futzing around with breadboards.

I think mine still exists in a chest I left at my parents place more than 30 years ago, something of a time capsule if I can find it. I think it has that, plus microscope, D&D books (basic and Expert set), some comics, maybe some Vinyl records, computer/gaming/electronics/car magazines, and probably some stuff I don't remember.
 
You will be able to boot from the USB3 port with an update that is coming out soon. I saw some benchmarks. Made an incredible difference.

This is awesome to hear. I was hoping that after the bottleneck was lifted they would consider an update to allow booting directly from USB. This significantly increases my interest in getting one.
 
I think mine still exists in a chest I left at my parents place more than 30 years ago, something of a time capsule if I can find it. I think it has that, plus microscope, D&D books (basic and Expert set), some comics, maybe some Vinyl records, computer/gaming/electronics/car magazines, and probably some stuff I don't remember.


A) Are you me? I just found an old box of Popular Science and CGW in my basement after the move.
B) Dear god, we are old! :oldman: Wtf happened!? :eek:
 
You're right about the price point but they are marketing it as an entry-level desktop replacement. Raspbian with a GUI takes almost half a gigabyte. There really isn't all that much you can do, in terms of desktop usage, with what's left.
My C64 and my Amiga begs your pardon.
 
they could have just stacked 2 HDMI
Stacking HDMI ports would have been too tall. They're already using MicroHDMI on Pi Zero's. I'm not crazy about the MicroHDMI either, I think it's too fragile and will probably get broken alot.
Stacked HDMI was considered but rejected not only due to Z height, but also due to torque and EMC issues

I would have preferred to mini DP ports.
BCM2711 does not support DisplayPort.

This was definitely the best solution to take.
No, best would have been neither Micro HDMI nor stacked HDMI connectors, but dual upright HDMI connectors.
 
That is still kind of along the lines of just using Pi as general computer, just a lightweight one. People often do all those things on an old computer running Linux.

The kind of projects that really differentiate Pi, tend to be adding control electronics to it.
Except that this thing is cheap, fun, and a power sipper :)
 
I don't understand the Hdmi thing at all. You're forcing me to pay for an adapter. Micro HDMI is not super common so good connector will cost $4-5. And you're giving me a 2nd HDMI. Most of my PI projects are headless. This makes no sense. How about you go back to a single full HDMI and shave the price a bit.
 
I don't understand the Hdmi thing at all. You're forcing me to pay for an adapter. Micro HDMI is not super common so good connector will cost $4-5. And you're giving me a 2nd HDMI. Most of my PI projects are headless. This makes no sense. How about you go back to a single full HDMI and shave the price a bit.

They are really trying to sell it as a desktop computer solution. They have their own keyboard and mouse now too. The problem is that it’s not really up to the task yet. I’ve watched reviews showing it struggling to even play 720p video on YouTube. I can’t really complain about that much considering the price.
 
They are really trying to sell it as a desktop computer solution. They have their own keyboard and mouse now too. The problem is that it’s not really up to the task yet. I’ve watched reviews showing it struggling to even play 720p video on YouTube. I can’t really complain about that much considering the price.

I'm assuming (hoping really) that they'll get the video playback issues figured.

Beyond that, a 4GB Pi 4 is really plenty for a regular desktop machine. If it could be easily booted off of an SSD via USB, hell, if they upgrade the OS to do just that, it'd likely be downright snappy.
 
If you are a little more interested in diy you can get a way more powerful x86 version for ~$37. Diy because you either have to solder your own power solution, or you can spend an extra $5 for a power adapter board from their website.

Atomic Pi - High Speed SBC with Peripheral ICs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07N298F2B/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_PJEhDbS58A95H
ATOMIC Pi. Genuine Intel Atom x5-Z8350 quad core with 2M Cache. Runs up to 1.92GHz with a 480MHz GPU. Eats RPi for dessert. Beats some desktops. Loaded with memory: 2GB DDR3L-1600, 16GB eMMC, slot for SD expansion (up to 256Gb). Full HDMI port with Intel HD Graphics & audio out USB 3.0 and USB 2.0 ports On board peripherals include: Fast dual band WiFI b/g/n 2.4 & 5GHz WiFi RT5572 IPX connectors on board Bluetooth 4.0 CR8510 Gigabit hardwired RJ45 Ethernet RTL8111G 9-axis inertial navigation sensor with compass BNO055. L

Have had one running for a few months with no issues, have pihole, unifi and some other things and it hardly even stresses it.
 
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They are really trying to sell it as a desktop computer solution. They have their own keyboard and mouse now too. The problem is that it’s not really up to the task yet. I’ve watched reviews showing it struggling to even play 720p video on YouTube. I can’t really complain about that much considering the price.

That used to happen on my desktop PCs running Linux and I had to force hw accel on. It still happens with random videos on all my devices so I think it's more likely a video encoding using values not supported by the hw it's being offloaded onto.
 
Saw 4k output struggle a little on a Pi 4 4GB. As in, it mostly worked. I'd say that they're almost there.

I did grab a Pi 3 B+ kit, since those seem to be going on sale; no problem loading it up, and I'm currently RDP'ing into it from across the house. It's a little laggy with the GUI but perfectly functional. Bit like running a desktop with a spinner and not enough memory, except with 1/8th to 1/10th of the resources.
 
They are really trying to sell it as a desktop computer solution. They have their own keyboard and mouse now too. The problem is that it’s not really up to the task yet. I’ve watched reviews showing it struggling to even play 720p video on YouTube. I can’t really complain about that much considering the price.
720p?
I just got my RPi4 4GB and am amazed that even 144p doesn't run anywhere smoothy... 144p, not 1440p XD
...and here I was complaining that Atom x5-Z8350 tablet was running a little sluggish when playing YT videos but when compared to Pi4 it actually runs 1080p perfectly and even 1440p run almost well

It is possible SoC in RPi4 is slower than this Atom but this is terrible.
Openarea cannot even do 60fps at 640x480 when Atom tabled does Quake3 at 1600x1200 at almost 60fps constant
It is official Raspbian OS (Raspbian Buster) and they cannot configure it so that "It just works!"? The fck is this?

Oh and mouse lag is ridiculous. There is no reason why even mouse should be lagging... maybe except usb driver being too hard for Linux developers to handle that is...
 
I agree, something isn't right.
Even the original ARM11-based Raspberry Pi had no mouse lag, and could smoothly playback 1080p 30fps videos, depending on the codec.

Sounds like there might be some optimization needed for this latest platform.
 
720p?
I just got my RPi4 4GB and am amazed that even 144p doesn't run anywhere smoothy... 144p, not 1440p XD
...and here I was complaining that Atom x5-Z8350 tablet was running a little sluggish when playing YT videos but when compared to Pi4 it actually runs 1080p perfectly and even 1440p run almost well

It is possible SoC in RPi4 is slower than this Atom but this is terrible.
Openarea cannot even do 60fps at 640x480 when Atom tabled does Quake3 at 1600x1200 at almost 60fps constant
It is official Raspbian OS (Raspbian Buster) and they cannot configure it so that "It just works!"? The fck is this?

Oh and mouse lag is ridiculous. There is no reason why even mouse should be lagging... maybe except usb driver being too hard for Linux developers to handle that is...


This sounds like pretty heavy thermal throttling, even though it shouldn't happen even with no heat spreader. Make me wonder if the heat spreader has no contact with the die and is acting as a heat cap instead.
 
This sounds like pretty heavy thermal throttling, even though it shouldn't happen even with no heat spreader. Make me wonder if the heat spreader has no contact with the die and is acting as a heat cap instead.

The software isn't done yet. The fact that somebody on [H] hasn't figured that out... yikes
 
The software isn't done yet. The fact that somebody on [H] hasn't figured that out... yikes

There are launch videos that show the above observed behavior not happening- so the Pi 4 should be even faster once they get the minutia settled.
 
I don't understand the Hdmi thing at all. You're forcing me to pay for an adapter. Micro HDMI is not super common so good connector will cost $4-5. And you're giving me a 2nd HDMI. Most of my PI projects are headless. This makes no sense. How about you go back to a single full HDMI and shave the price a bit.

I agree. It's not a dealbreaker, but it's a weird choice.
 
The software side is still unfinished. Just recently they released PCIe ALPM capable firmware which drops the power consumption at idle by quite a bit.

Also problems have been reported with USB PD power supplies and e-marked USB-C cables. Only a hardware revision can fix those.

Atomic Pi - High Speed SBC with Peripheral ICs
There has been quite some controversy around the Atomic Pi, and the general consensus is that there was only one production run ever and once that sells out there will be no more at this price.
 
There are launch videos that show the above observed behavior not happening- so the Pi 4 should be even faster once they get the minutia settled.

i mean, yea i'm sure it will be. Software is still basically beta right now, but they have to release hardware to the community so they can fix, and i'm sure they will fix rather quickly based on how huge it is and the talent working on it(in spare time)
 
The software side is still unfinished. Just recently they released PCIe ALPM capable firmware which drops the power consumption at idle by quite a bit.

Also problems have been reported with USB PD power supplies and e-marked USB-C cables. Only a hardware revision can fix those.

There has been quite some controversy around the Atomic Pi, and the general consensus is that there was only one production run ever and once that sells out there will be no more at this price.
Meh controversy or not. Have had mine running solid on Ubuntu for past month or two with no issues and it smokes my pi 3 in terms of power, I'm pleased with it.
 
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Seems there are some serious issues with the USB-C port that is going to need a revision. Ars has an article on it.
 
As an EE, I wouldn't consider a compatibility issue that affects a small subset of users a serious problem, especially when most people are either going to use their existing low power cell phone chargers or the RPI branded power plug. It was an omission of a single resistor and wasn't caught during their testing of multiple power supplies. That said, it should have been found in a design review and be a part of the FMEA. It certainty will be going forward.
 
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