NVIDIA Blames AMD for Excess GPU Inventory

Member when everybody wanted them to just make more cards during the mining craze?
 
I understand him as saying AMD's mid range design out sold anything Nvidia has to offer by $700 million revenue .. is that correct ?
 
cyclone3d said:
Well, I bought a 1080 and a 1070Ti in the last couple months... so he should be happy..

Oh, wait, I bought them off of eBay for less than 1/2 of of what they go for new because I refuse to spend any more than that on a video card.

New video card prices are stupid high. Maybe if they brought the prices down to a sane level then people would start buying them.
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I would imagine many people are doing just this, I see a card that launched for $5-600 a few years ago, runs most every game at 1080P great and I don't care if it has been mined on, if it lasts 3-5 years for $100 I'm happy. I bought a card and a backup, and a backup to the backup, and still saved money.
 
For the last few weeks it looked like the 1060 3GB was going to stay priced at around $160-180 which would have easily held off the RX 570 and RX 580... but as of now with the Nov sales over they're right back up to $210+.

That's IDIOTIC when a 8GB RX 580 is $199 ($179 after rebate). At either price point it makes way the hell more sense than a 3GB 1060 especially if you are planning on keeping it forever.
 
DukenukemX said:
Everyone right now has an equivalent to a GTX 1060 or a RX 580. If you have a R9 290 then you have this level of performance, or a GTX 970, or GTX 980, and etc. Since the crypto market fell apart a lot of those people are now selling them for cheap. I should know I bought a RX 470 for my HTPC cause why not? Since AMD did far better in the crypto craze, then their cards are selling for dirt cheap right now. Doesn't help that AMD released the RX 590 for $280 when it's just an overclocked RX 580, which is just an overclocked RX 480.

Just lower prices already and deal with your mediocrity in the mainstream products. People with a GTX 970 aren't going to upgrade to the GTX 1060, but Nvidia just keeps making faster more expensive RTX cards that 90% of people don't buy. AMD is kidding themselves if they think the RX 590's higher price is justified over the now much cheaper used RX 480's and 580's hitting the market. It also doesn't help that game developers are still making games for the lowest common denominator which are consoles. Anything equivalent to a GTX 1060 (which is a lot) is going to play games just fine at 1080p until the PS5 or Xbox Two is out.
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First.. PARAGRAPHS.. Break up your individual lines of thoughts into Paragraphs to be readable and digestible. Right now this is a garbled mess of too many topics per paragraph.

I get it you think both companies are screwing up here and are holding each accountable for different mistakes... right?

Every company that plotted future production on a giant spike of demand created by the crypto Currency craze is eating their own pants right now because margins are going to become razor thin and it might be cheaper to sell now cheap than keep stock around. Why... because if they don't and stock sits around and a competitor releases some new hotness after selling their previous stock at dirt prices to drive YOUR margins down and your profits down. THEN that competitor releases said new hotness. You're going to be in a loss cycle for longer than you thought.

AMD is playing a shrewd business game. They saw the backlash on price and started acting immediately. This let them put Nvidia in a shitty position and that directly benifits themselves. Yea sure the 590 is a renamed xxx gen card that was a renamed xxx gen card. As long as the performance is present they will be just fine in that regard.

The card they need to play here soon is a high performance card faster than Nvidia's XXXX card of the day. Even release it without RTX, THEN for another 2-300 bucks sell an RTX daughter card that plugs right into this video card. With it's own power intake and management. Build the card to accept the daughter card.

Then watch Nvidia shit themselves because you just released an lets call it 700 dollar card that out performs your top of the line RTX 2080 ti. Without ray tracing, then at the SAME TIME released a small range of Ray Tracing Daughter cards in a price range from 100-500 dollars that let you add raytracing performance to your video card. Allow them to be purchased individually.

THEN people can get the high performance card for normal rendering in games. And when they have the money they can purchased the Ray Tracing addon card that fits their need for performance for that one feature. Get a couple of AAA ray tracing titles to be bundled with it based on the tier that you purchase and it is an ADDITIONAL win win!

I honestly see this as the solution that meets consumer demand for a new hotness, delivers on price point for performance per dollar, and gives those that want ray tracing later or don't have the budget for it on a single purchase the ability to add it a few months or heck even a year later.

That makes Nvidia have to scramble to make a card that just works... ;)

But who knows.. add-in-boards for some new 3d feature... Nobody would by those piecemail to add performance to gaming right?
 
Yeah, RX 580 is exactly the same speed as a 1060 6GB, so Nvidia's going to have to suck it up buttercup if they want to move inventory.

AMD has gotten the memo pretty clearly.

In addition, the yields on these chips are better than they've ever been, so the price to build the GPU chip itself has fallen significantly. The GPU is the most expensive component in the board building game, so you could drop GPU MSRP prices by $50 (lower chi[p cost by $25) and still make a profit. I'm talking GTX 760 rebrand of the 660 Ti at a $50 lower introductory MSRP.

The problem here is that Nvidia got so distracted by Crypto keeping prices high so long, they never thought through their exit strategies. So they got stuck with GPU inventory, instead of doing their normal slow-and-steady rebrand price cuts. They're too distracted with the RTX launch to have formulated a rebrand, so they took the stock price hit.


I expect them to sit on this until it finally sells through at MSRP.
 
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AMD has maneuvered themselves into a nice position. Consoles, and mid-range cards... Nvidia seems to have dug themselves a hole and now refuses to get out. I remember when AMD announced there strategy to release new tech in mid to low range first for market adaption then improve it over time. Took a few years but it seems to be paying off. Nvidia releases the 2080 with tech that i still cannot see a reason to pay that kind of money for (IMO), and AMD is pumping out great performing 5xx cards like candy for a great price.
 
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defaultluser said:
Yeah, RX 580 is exactly the same speed as a 1060 6GB, so Nvidia's going to have to suck it up buttercup if they want to move inventory.

AMD has gotten the memo pretty clearly.

In addition, the yields on these chips are better than they've ever been, so the price to build the GPU chip itself has fallen significantly. The GPU is the most expensive component in the board building gme, so you colld drop GPU MSRP prices by $50 (lower chi[p cost by $25) and still make a profit

The problem here is that Nvidia got so distracted by Crypto keeping prices high so long, they never thought through their exit strategies. So they got stuck with GPU inventory, instead of doing their normal slow-and-steady rebrand price cuts. They're too distracted with the RTX launch to have formulated a rebrand, so they took the stock price hit.


I expect them to sit on this until it finally sells through at MSRP.
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How much better would the RTX have been accepted if they did this with the overstock of Pascal. And left RTX with those with more dollars than sense.

nVidia GTX1185
Actually a further cut down GP102a, -5% GTX-1080-Ti performance
Release: September 7th-14th
Price is said to be $429.99-$579.99
5GB/10GB GDDR5x Memory

nVidia GTX1175
This card is a full GP104a GTX 1070-Ti Peformance
Release: September 7th-14th
Price is said to be $279.99-$379.99
4GB/8GB GDDR5 Memory

nVidia GTX1165
This card is again a GP104a, with performance identical to a GTX1070
Release: September 7th-14th
Price is said to be $179.99-$249.99
4GB/8GB GDDR5 Memory

nVidia GTX1155
This card is cut-down GP106a, -7/-3% GTX1060 performance
Release: October 26th-November 2nd
Price is said to be $139.99-$159.99
3GB/6GB GDDR5 Memory

nVidia GTX1135-2GB
This series is based on the GP107a, -12% GTX1050 2GB
Release: December 2018
Price is said to be $59
2GB DDR3 Memory

nVidia GTX1135-3GB
This series is based on the GP107a, -5% GTX1050 3GB
Release: December 2018
$79
3GB DDR4 Memory

nVidia GTX1135-Ti
This series is based on the GP107a with GTX1050/Ti performance.
Release: December 2018
$119
4GB GDDR5 Memory
 
Rauelius said:
How much better would the RTX have been accepted if they did this with the overstock of Pascal. And left RTX with those with more dollars than sense.

nVidia GTX1185
Actually a further cut down GP102a, -5% GTX-1080-Ti performance
Release: September 7th-14th
Price is said to be $429.99-$579.99
5GB/10GB GDDR5x Memory

nVidia GTX1175
This card is a full GP104a GTX 1070-Ti Peformance
Release: September 7th-14th
Price is said to be $279.99-$379.99
4GB/8GB GDDR5 Memory

nVidia GTX1165
This card is again a GP104a, with performance identical to a GTX1070
Release: September 7th-14th
Price is said to be $179.99-$249.99
4GB/8GB GDDR5 Memory

nVidia GTX1155
This card is cut-down GP106a, -7/-3% GTX1060 performance
Release: October 26th-November 2nd
Price is said to be $139.99-$159.99
3GB/6GB GDDR5 Memory

nVidia GTX1135-2GB
This series is based on the GP107a, -12% GTX1050 2GB
Release: December 2018
Price is said to be $59
2GB DDR3 Memory

nVidia GTX1135-3GB
This series is based on the GP107a, -5% GTX1050 3GB
Release: December 2018
$79
3GB DDR4 Memory

nVidia GTX1135-Ti
This series is based on the GP107a with GTX1050/Ti performance.
Release: December 2018
$119
4GB GDDR5 Memory
Click to expand...

What part of my post did you not read where I said $50 price cuts across-the-board?

The GT 1030 has room to squeeze downward now that every fucking model has been replaced with DDR4 (unofficially). So drop it down to $50 officially.

GTX 1060 3GB rebrand : $150
GTX 1060 6GB rebrand : $200
GTX 1070 rebrand: $300
GTX 1070 Ti rebrand: $400
GTX 1080 rebrand: $450.
GTX 2070 starts at $500.

Sounds like a perfect rebranded price structure to me. The RTX 2070 has perfect separation form it's non RTX cards (currently there's overlap).

And if you haven't noticed, the GTX 1080 has mostly already sold-out. It's imperfect GP104 and the GP106 stock that's still remaining.
 
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while i dont have much hopes for AMD to bring a 1080ti competitior anytime soon, when they do and if intel does thats plenty for most gamers and 4k. Nvidia is going to have alot more issue like this coming their way.
 
DF-1 said:
i dont get his answer at all. a $250 product was overproduced, so our normal production of the $500-600 one wasn't bought?

what?
Click to expand...

His answer makes no sense. The fact the ratio of unsold inventory is 90:10 nvidia/amd, or 50:50 has no bearing on the fact they missed determining demand to such an extent they are sitting on a full quarter's production unsold. Atr best it means your competitor fucked up even worse than you in predicting market demand and overproduced worse, and thus you will all be fighting a glut longer than you need to.

Crypto tanked, demand dropped, your prices are high and don't represent good value per dollar for performance right now. You either screwed up, or you simply can't admit publicly that this is fine and your long term strategy is viable but speaking it in public would enrage your customer base and result in negative consequences.
 
Grimlaking said:
First.. PARAGRAPHS.. Break up your individual lines of thoughts into Paragraphs to be readable and digestible. Right now this is a garbled mess of too many topics per paragraph.

I get it you think both companies are screwing up here and are holding each accountable for different mistakes... right?

Every company that plotted future production on a giant spike of demand created by the crypto Currency craze is eating their own pants right now because margins are going to become razor thin and it might be cheaper to sell now cheap than keep stock around. Why... because if they don't and stock sits around and a competitor releases some new hotness after selling their previous stock at dirt prices to drive YOUR margins down and your profits down. THEN that competitor releases said new hotness. You're going to be in a loss cycle for longer than you thought.

AMD is playing a shrewd business game. They saw the backlash on price and started acting immediately. This let them put Nvidia in a shitty position and that directly benifits themselves. Yea sure the 590 is a renamed xxx gen card that was a renamed xxx gen card. As long as the performance is present they will be just fine in that regard.

The card they need to play here soon is a high performance card faster than Nvidia's XXXX card of the day. Even release it without RTX, THEN for another 2-300 bucks sell an RTX daughter card that plugs right into this video card. With it's own power intake and management. Build the card to accept the daughter card.

Then watch Nvidia shit themselves because you just released an lets call it 700 dollar card that out performs your top of the line RTX 2080 ti. Without ray tracing, then at the SAME TIME released a small range of Ray Tracing Daughter cards in a price range from 100-500 dollars that let you add raytracing performance to your video card. Allow them to be purchased individually.

THEN people can get the high performance card for normal rendering in games. And when they have the money they can purchased the Ray Tracing addon card that fits their need for performance for that one feature. Get a couple of AAA ray tracing titles to be bundled with it based on the tier that you purchase and it is an ADDITIONAL win win!

I honestly see this as the solution that meets consumer demand for a new hotness, delivers on price point for performance per dollar, and gives those that want ray tracing later or don't have the budget for it on a single purchase the ability to add it a few months or heck even a year later.

That makes Nvidia have to scramble to make a card that just works... ;)

But who knows.. add-in-boards for some new 3d feature... Nobody would by those piecemail to add performance to gaming right?
Click to expand...

Just to play the devil's advocate.....

Considering how graphics cards are currently manufactured: single board completely covered in components with a massive 2-3 slot cooler covering the entire card. Most have some sort of back plate, again covering the entire PCB.

Where would you attach a daughter board?

The heatsink side? Possibly blocking airflow to the heatsink. Not to mention fattening up the entire assembly making a 4+ slot Voltron?

The back plate side? Now you are fighting ATX compatibility. Running into CPU air coolers with any top slot installation.

How about a completely separate slot and attach via gold fingers like the SLi connectors? This starts adding up costs. A specialty connector that comes in a variety of slot-gap sides to accommodate motherboard layout and cooler thickness.

As much as I like specialty co-processors I can't see this happening. A market leader can afford to build niche-addons, but AMD can't afford to have a me-too add-on that their board partners will probably not support.

Every single GPU AMD produces until they are selling as many as Nvidia has to be a stand alone product.
 
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mbelue said:
Just to play the devil's advocate.....

Considering how graphics cards are currently manufactured: single board completely covered in components with a massive 2-3 slot cooler covering the entire card. Most have some sort of back plate, again covering the entire PCB.

Where would you attach a daughter board?

The heatsink side? Possibly blocking airflow to the heatsink. Not to mention fattening up the entire assembly making a 4+ slot Voltron?

The back plate side? Now you are fighting ATX compatibility. Running into CPU air coolers with any top slot installation.

How about a completely separate slot and attach via gold fingers like the SLi connectors? This starts adding up costs. A specialty connector that comes in a variety of slot-gap sides to accommodate motherboard layout and cooler thickness.

As much as I like specialty co-processors I can't see this happening. A market leader can afford to build neich-addons, but AMD can't afford to have a me-too add-on that their board partners will probably not support.

Every single GPU AMD produces until they are selling as many as Nvidia has to be a stand alone product.
Click to expand...


So you don't think that there is a reasonable way to do an add on card for high speed Raytracing support in games? I disagree but I can't claim to have a job doing board design. With bus speeds getting higher and higher, the number of PCIE channels getting higher with top end CPU's, I think there is a real market for an Ray Tracing Addin card that works with specific drivers.

I will concede you have a point to the card girth issue as it exists today. It would need to have connectors that worked similarly to an SLI addin card but didn't require a slot consumption. Just features to attach to the existing card. This would let the designers preserve air flow, have a standard to fit to for the AIB designers. AND let you have a way to attach an daughter card to the card you purchased.

I even think you could do it as a second slot PCIE card for the video card. THEN have the daughter card on the bottom layer of the PCB. Even let it replace the metal guard as it's mounting and have it's own active cooling with the PCIe slot case cover built into the case.

I believe that a design like that would work, the issue from an engineering perspective would be how to have the high performance bandwidth with the distance and connectors adding latency and resistance.
 
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