AMD Chief Confirms New High-End GPU: "We Will Be Competitive in High-End Graphics"

renz496 said:
any company is not your friend. and don't compare intel to nvidia either. does 2080ti being 5% faster than 1080ti for almost double the price? i don't like the price increase either but when it comes to GPU nvidia is the only one that still provide at least 30% performance increase every other year.
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We don't exactly get new releases yearly anymore :(
 
IdiotInCharge said:
I'm aware of the history too- and I don't run noisy space-heaters for the hell of it. And yeah, AMD did eventually unfuck their drivers for the most part. But they were still behind.
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Yeah they were behind for a bit but point is not for long, but people only ever remember launch for some weird reason.
Luckily the after market 290 cards were great, quiet and no different to any of the other 250W modern GPUs, all the same thermal load and similar cooling designs to what is used today.
I used to game with a 7970 on a 40% oc on the ref cooler. 100% fan, headphones on. Sweet FPS but fuck that noise.. it would change RPM according to load power load even with 1000W of PSU, that card was the star that shone brightly.. and died within a few years xD I've heard the 290x reference models were sort of like this but out of the box... horrific. I don't know what they were thinking tbh.
 
Gadgety said:
You do know that competition is the only way to keep prices down? It has nothing to do with Nvidia being honest or dishonest. How do you mean dishonest? They have a monopoly on the high performance GPUs and they take advantage of it. Personally I will not buy at today's prices for the RTX series, but any manager of a corporation tries to maximize profits. If no one buys, they'll have to lower prices, but if they sell in sufficient volume, they'll keep prices up.
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Sigh... Yes I know. All I was saying is that while some companies like Intel don't price gouge when there's a lack of competition, Nvidia is and that we desperately need AMD to be competitive so that we're not having to pay $1200 for a card that should cost $700.

That's it. Not that Nvidia should be sweethearts and give cards away, not that faster cards shouldn't cost more than slower cards, not that supply & demand doesn't work, not that AMD is as pure as the wind driven snow, not that Nvidia is doing anything illegal or immoral.

What I mean by "keeping them honest" is that when AMD was nonexistent in the CPU market for 5 years, Intel kept their prices in line. Generation after generation their prices were about what we expected them to be. AMD is weak in the GPU market for a fraction of the time and Nvidia has nearly doubled their prices. Not to mention all the heavy handed reviewer/journalist control bullshit they're trying to pull. Taking advantage of lack of competition is fine and proper. Ass raping consumers and trying to control the press is not and that's what Nvidia is doing and apparently will continue to do until the GPU market becomes competitive again.
 
MacLeod said:
Sigh... Yes I know. All I was saying is that while some companies like Intel don't price gouge when there's a lack of competition, Nvidia is and that we desperately need AMD to be competitive so that we're not having to pay $1200 for a card that should cost $700.
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They've all 'gouged' when they've been in a position due to their own innovative efforts to charge more. Of course I put 'gouged' in quotes because it isn't gouging in the slightest, that's just emotional butthurt.
 
MacLeod said:
Sigh... Yes I know. All I was saying is that while some companies like Intel don't price gouge when there's a lack of competition, Nvidia is and that we desperately need AMD to be competitive so that we're not having to pay $1200 for a card that should cost $700.

That's it. Not that Nvidia should be sweethearts and give cards away, not that faster cards shouldn't cost more than slower cards, not that supply & demand doesn't work, not that AMD is as pure as the wind driven snow, not that Nvidia is doing anything illegal or immoral.

What I mean by "keeping them honest" is that when AMD was nonexistent in the CPU market for 5 years, Intel kept their prices in line. Generation after generation their prices were about what we expected them to be. AMD is weak in the GPU market for a fraction of the time and Nvidia has nearly doubled their prices. Not to mention all the heavy handed reviewer/journalist control bullshit they're trying to pull. Taking advantage of lack of competition is fine and proper. Ass raping consumers and trying to control the press is not and that's what Nvidia is doing and apparently will continue to do until the GPU market becomes competitive again.
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This is simply false sentiment, competition means nothing to Nvidia because the mind share is with them. They recently released https://www.gamersnexus.net/hwrevie...1030-gddr5-benchmark-worst-graphics-card-2018

I'll say it again people preaching competition will fix prices are not going to get what they think they should.
The only way you will be getting what you want from Nvidia if you stop buying their products it is as simple as that.
 
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Pieter3dnow said:
This is simply false sentiment, competition means nothing to Nvidia because the mind share is with them. They recently released https://www.gamersnexus.net/hwrevie...1030-gddr5-benchmark-worst-graphics-card-2018

I'll say it again people preaching competition will fix prices are not going to get what they think they should.
The only way you will be getting what you want from Nvidia if you stop buying their products it is as simple as that.
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Oh I know it won't be a utopia market with competition. Nvidia has always been on the expensive side of the spectrum but their cards are usually a little better. And that's fine. I expect to pay more for a better card. Just not $1200 for a card that should cost $700.
 
MacLeod said:
Oh I know it won't be a utopia market with competition. Nvidia has always been on the expensive side of the spectrum but their cards are usually a little better. And that's fine. I expect to pay more for a better card. Just not $1200 for a card that should cost $700.
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You mean $1500+ since you still can barely find the damn thing in stock.

The market sets prices not feelings.

The die is also 50% larger than the 1080ti so I don’t know why people expected the same MSRP with a way more costly BOM. Is a good portion of the die useless right now since it’s dedicated to RTX? Sure! And that’s where the disconnect is between pricing and current performance...

It’s also a great opportunity for AMD if they get off their asses and launch something before RTX is popular.
 
MacLeod said:
I hope so, we've never needed it more. Nvidia has proven they can't be trusted to operate without competition to keep them honest.

All those years Intel had no competition, they kept their prices in check. Yeah they only bumped performance by 3% each generation but the 8000 series chips didn't cost twice what the 7000's did.
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Turing is a MASSIVE chip with poor yields. Nvidia is charging what they have to to make money.
 
You mean playable at 1440 and at least 120 Hz. That's 2-3 gens from now which is at least 6 years from now given the current release cycles.
 
AMD has a hard cap of 4,096 shaders. Navi on 7nm has zero chance of compeating with 2080(ti) even if it runs at 2.0ghz
 
N4CR said:
Yeah they were behind for a bit but point is not for long, but people only ever remember launch for some weird reason.
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There's an adage that applies here: You only get one chance to make a first impression. People remember the launch because that is their first impression of the card and first impressions are what you tend to remember the strongest. No matter how things turn out the first impression is still something stuck in the back of your mind. AMD has a bad habit of bungling their first impressions. Either due to a sloppy launch or with their abysmal GPU marketing.
 
Dayaks said:
You mean $1500+ since you still can barely find the damn thing in stock.

The market sets prices not feelings.

The die is also 50% larger than the 1080ti so I don’t know why people expected the same MSRP with a way more costly BOM. Is a good portion of the die useless right now since it’s dedicated to RTX? Sure! And that’s where the disconnect is between pricing and current performance...
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So because the chip is larger, that justifies nearly doubling the price?

Fuck it, apparently I'm in the wrong thinking a new generation of cards shouldn't cost twice as much as the previous gen for 20% better performance.

I'll keep quiet if next year the 3080 Ti drops with a $2000 price tag which will probably happen if AMD is still MIA from the market.
 
I recently replaced 2x 7970's with one RX480; it's better performance, and less than half the power.

I paid $600 for the 7970's, the RX480 was cheap.

Why do I need a better video card? The Games used to push the tech, but since games are designed for consoles, that's no longer a thing.

I initially liked the fact that gaming was being adopted by more people, but the whole controller/auto-aim thing hasn't produced more talented games, and we're getting old.

You only get better playing people better than you; I loved the days when we'd get banned for 'cheating' because we stormed someones server and raped them.

I've never 'cheated', except in Q2, because our preferred games involve 'give all' and are awesome. But everyone has it, it's not really a cheat, it just makes it more [H}ard.

(you get a give all when you come in, and for every kill; it keeps things moving, and reduces the camping thing. )
 
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MacLeod said:
So because the chip is larger, that justifies nearly doubling the price?

Fuck it, apparently I'm in the wrong thinking a new generation of cards shouldn't cost twice as much as the previous gen for 20% better performance.

I'll keep quiet if next year the 3080 Ti drops with a $2000 price tag which will probably happen if AMD is still MIA from the market.
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It’s more like 30-55% going off the H 4k review and it’s a business reality not how you feelz.

It’s also the exact same slot and price as the original Titan X Pascal. There’s also cards listed at $999 if you can find them.

If I am going to buy an item I don’t expect a price that is at a loss for the company (or at the very least break even) and completely illogical due to market demand. People are acting like they are raping the market when these cards are at best the same margin as Pascal.

And lets get real, AMD will be six months late, lower performance, and $100 more expensive than it should be just like Fury X and Vega 64.
 
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Rathor said:
AMD has a hard cap of 4,096 shaders. Navi on 7nm has zero chance of compeating with 2080(ti) even if it runs at 2.0ghz
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I've heard that's not correct, it can be worked around but would require re-segmenting of the shaders. Same reason why Fiji had certain limitations that are not as prominent in Vega, they were able to work around some existing 'limits'.

Derangel said:
There's an adage that applies here: You only get one chance to make a first impression. People remember the launch because that is their first impression of the card and first impressions are what you tend to remember the strongest. No matter how things turn out the first impression is still something stuck in the back of your mind. AMD has a bad habit of bungling their first impressions. Either due to a sloppy launch or with their abysmal GPU marketing.
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Well I hope this remains the case for Nvidia 20 series. They dropped the ball this time.
 
Krenum said:
You can right now, AMD RX 580. I may have one for sale well below $250 shortly.
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Oldmodder ^this or even a new GTX 1060 if you prefer nvidia. But you can get a new RX580 for under 250... sorry Krenum. Either of those would suffice for quality 1080p unless you are trying to push 144hz+ in which you're talking a big jump up.
 
DrBorg said:
I recently replaced 2x 7970's with one RX480; it's better performance, and less than half the power.

I paid $600 for the 7970's, the RX480 was cheap.

Why do I need a better video card? The Games used to push the tech, but since games are designed for consoles, that's no longer a thing.

I initially liked the fact that gaming was being adopted by more people, but the whole controller/auto-aim thing hasn't produced more talented games, and we're getting old.

You only get better playing people better than you; I loved the days when we'd get banned for 'cheating' because we stormed someones server and raped them.

I've never 'cheated', except in Q2, because our preferred games involve 'give all' and are awesome. But everyone has it, it's not really a cheat, it just makes it more [H}ard.

(you get a give all when you come in, and for every kill; it keeps things moving, and reduces the camping thing. )
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So, manual Clan Arena? :D
 
dgz said:
So, manual Clan Arena? :D
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I have to admit, I don't know what you mean. we play on lan, or a vpn made to look like one.

We're playing Q2 Ground Zero, or The Reconing, which have different mods.

Research hangar a LOT. :)
 
techguymaxc said:
Literally every time we get to this point (NV way out in front of AMD), this is the refrain. Echoing other commenters, I'll believe it when I see it, less talk, more action, etc. They're so far behind now there's about zero chance they catch up this time. I've bought 2 AMD cards in the years since G80 (which was really the turning point in the graphics war), HD 7950 and R9 290 - both excellent cards, especially from a value perspective. Unfortunately, nothing they have produced since this time has been worth buying for me. I upgrade every generation because this is my hobby, and I just can't find a reason to buy AMD hardware for gaming any more. Happy to be proven wrong though, still rooting for them.
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AMD is competitive until you get to the high end. They simply don't have a card to compete with the 1080ti, let alone the 2080ti...but unless you are looking for the highest end cards, AMD will serve you just fine. I have a Vega 64, and it's working VERY well with every game I throw at it at 3440x1440. Is my card the fastest? No. Is it enough to play most games in ultra quality settings with a 75hz (maximum for my monitor) refresh. Sure is!

When you get to the $200-$300 cards, the value proposition is even better on the AMD side, and the VAST majority of graphics cards sold fall into this price range.
 
N4CR said:
Bet they will release 7nm Vega to consumers sooner than they are letting up. At least around a 2080/1080Ti stock which is more than enough power for most people. OC bring it closer to 2080Ti in raster. Being a new node, like the 7970 before it, it could have a bit of OC left on the table.
Do it. Hurry up Lisa!
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AMD has not released a GPU with meaningful overclocking headroom in a very long time now. You expect that to suddenly change with 7nm Navi? Why exactly?

2080 Ti performance from 7nm Navi is pie in the sky dreaming, IMO.
 
IdiotInCharge said:
It's a universal truth ;)
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Nope, not at all. In fact, AMD as a company only just started turning things around in early 2017. We are not even barely 20 months since then and they definitely could not build off of Raja's mess.
 
ManofGod said:
Nope, not at all. In fact, AMD as a company only just started turning things around in early 2017. We are not even barely 20 months since then and they definitely could not build off of Raja's mess.
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Nice, compartmentalizing the blame!

You got any more excuses?

Their tech didn't turn out- and Raja didn't build Vega on his lonesome.. It's as simple as that. Had it, we might all be running Vegas instead.
 
IdiotInCharge said:
Nice, compartmentalizing the blame!

You got any more excuses?

Their tech didn't turn out- and Raja didn't build Vega on his lonesome.. It's as simple as that. Had it, we might all be running Vegas instead.
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Do not deal with things as they are, that's cool. In the mean time, AMD is doing what they can and reports of their death are greatly exaggerated. Raja had an agenda, it did not work out the way he had hoped and AMD had to pay the price because of that. Thankfully, they are slowly but surely digging themselves out of that hole. :) Hey, I am willing to wait for them to do their thing, it is worth it.
 
ManofGod said:
Do not deal with things as they are, that's cool.
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That is 'how things are'.

ManofGod said:
Raja had an agenda, it did not work out the way he had hoped and AMD had to pay the price because of that.
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They had to pay for their design decisions that didn't pan out. You can pin that on Raja to fit your agenda, but the rest of us realize that it's a team effort, and while Raja was rightly criticized for over-hyping Vega, the failure of the design to live up to its potential was not due to his efforts alone.

ManofGod said:
Hey, I am willing to wait for them to do their thing, it is worth it.
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The rest of us will continue to buy what works. If that's AMD someday, great, if not, well, I'll remain happy that someone is capable of pushing the performance envelope ;).
 
IdiotInCharge said:
That is 'how things are'.



They had to pay for their design decisions that didn't pan out. You can pin that on Raja to fit your agenda, but the rest of us realize that it's a team effort, and while Raja was rightly criticized for over-hyping Vega, the failure of the design to live up to its potential was not due to his efforts alone.



The rest of us will continue to buy what works. If that's AMD someday, great, if not, well, I'll remain happy that someone is capable of pushing the performance envelope ;).
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Well AMD does work well, just as my sig says. Also, I still have a lot more money in my bank instead of wasting it on the more expensive and waste of time products. (RTX2***) Oh well, suddenly, AMD produces a faster product next year than they have now, Nvidia takes a hit and low and behold, their prices plummet.
 
ManofGod said:
Well AMD does work well, just as my sig says. Also, I still have a lot more money in my bank instead of wasting it on the more expensive and waste of time products. (RTX2***) Oh well, suddenly, AMD produces a faster product next year than they have now, Nvidia takes a hit and low and behold, their prices plummet.
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Prices are going to come down either way- and I'm glad you like your space-heaters!
 
IdiotInCharge said:
Nice, compartmentalizing the blame!

You got any more excuses?

Their tech didn't turn out- and Raja didn't build Vega on his lonesome.. It's as simple as that. Had it, we might all be running Vegas instead.
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Shit, I remember when Vega launched and was such a failure even AMD fans couldn’t ignore it; all I heard was, “Raja didn’t have enough time to have much affect on Vega. Wait for Navi” So this thread is hilarious to me... now it’s all Raja’s fault since he left.
 
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