FCC Votes to Change How It Handles Consumer Complaints

The fee is nothing new. Formal complaints have always had this fee. The only thing changing is that now, the FCC will simply forward your complaint to whomever your complaint is with. They have 30 days to respond, and the FCC will review the response.

I think this is a good thing. Should help lean the agency up a bit.
 
alxlwson said:
The fee is nothing new. Formal complaints have always had this fee. The only thing changing is that now, the FCC will simply forward your complaint to whomever your complaint is with. They have 30 days to respond, and the FCC will review the response.

I think this is a good thing. Should help lean the agency up a bit.
Click to expand...

Exactly.

Literally nothing's changed except the FCC isn't spending boatloads "filing" each complaint and response. The carrier only has to file a response when the FCC requires them to, such as when there are hundreds of similar complaints. So now, they won't have to file 500 canned "We're the best carrier! Honest!" responses for 500 separate "My Internet is Slow!" informal complaints. They'll just file 1 canned message for the 500 responses. It also keeps them from having to respond to complaints like "My Dog chewed up my cable modem and they won't replace it unless I Pay!" unless there's a rash of Dog chewing modems (maybe they laced the modem case with Milk Bone Gravy or something) for some reason

This story came from yet another shock article to make sure that the "Ajit Pai is the Devil! Screw Drumpf!! Vote Democrat November 2018!!!" Bass Drum is still beating in your head.
 
Comcast / Verizon / Charter: Okay - our email address to send complaints to is RecycleBin@<Company>.net
 
Companies won't do anything about the complaints just like the FCC now either so you're basically forced to pay the fee.
 
alxlwson said:
The fee is nothing new. Formal complaints have always had this fee. The only thing changing is that now, the FCC will simply forward your complaint to whomever your complaint is with. They have 30 days to respond, and the FCC will review the response.

I think this is a good thing. Should help lean the agency up a bit.
Click to expand...
Yes, the fee was always there as you said. They forwarded the complaint to the company before. What is new is that the FCC no longer has to review what the company responded with and disposition of the matters raised. They just forward what the judgement rendered from the company to you. If you don't like what the company ruled then you can file the $225 formal complaint.

The whole FCC review and disposition requirement was removed. Now the FCC can optionally review your complaint if they feel like doing so. But it is up to their discretion if they read it or not due to the language change.

Here is the old way for reference.
https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2010-title47-vol1/pdf/CFR-2010-title47-vol1-sec1-717.pdf

§ 1.717 Procedure. The Commission will forward informal complaints to the appropriate carrier for investigation. The carrier will, within such time as may be prescribed, advise the Commission in writing, with a copy to the complainant, of its satisfaction of the complaint or of its refusal or inability to do so. Where there are clear indications from the carrier’s report or from other communications with the parties that the complaint has been satisfied, the Commission may, in its discretion, consider a complaint proceeding to be closed, without response to the complainant. In all other cases, the Commission will contact the complainant regarding its review and disposition of the matters raised. If the complainant is not satisfied by the carrier’s response and the Commission’s disposition, it may file a formal complaint in accordance with §1.721 of this part.

The underlined bold part is no longer applicable. This was the part that was removed to streamline the process.

Here is the FCC flowchart of how they handle reviews now. If you can find the section where the underlined text above exists please point it out to us.
https://consumercomplaints.fcc.gov/hc/en-us/articles/202752940-How-the-FCC-Handles-Your-Complaint
 
i remember when if you had a complaint you would contact your local BBB office, and they would look into it and businesses generally didnt like that and responded. LOL not so nowadays. So, the FCC is simply catching up to the times


BBB = Better Business Bureau
 
Putting a $25 fee that would be switched to the carrier if the complaint is upheld would be enough of a barrier - provided one is needed.

$225 is out of the reach of many Americans.
 
Real complaints to exist, however, if you've ever worked in a department that handled complaints, the vast majority were false. The merit to this new approach is since the response to the customer has to also be copied to the FCC, they have some "teeth" if they need to take action against the company (e.g. perhaps they chose not to respond at all). Not sure about the "fee". Seems extreme given the new approach.
 
Drakeniir said:
That sounds pretty fair. and a heck of a lot better than what the CRTC does here in Canukistan (which is, by the way, introduce enough bureaucracy into everything to the point where your complaint may just be redirected back to you.)
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My experience filing a complaint about Bell (pulling a bait and switch), resulted in Bell calling me in less than 48 hours, "fixing" the problem and applying a hefty discount.

Granted, I had documented the entire contract signing process. Part of the reason why I request chat transcripts, screencap, and record all my phone calls...
 
I read nothing crazy about this.

File a complaint to the FCC against company, FCC records the complaint and tracking number given. If the FCC has relevant educational material about said issue it will send it to the person. If not, FCC sends the complaint to company, requiring a written response to both the FCC and person filing the complaint within 30 days. FCC reviews the response and if it's sufficient the complaint is closed. If that's not to the liking of the person you can rebuttal (or file a formal complaint), the FCC will review and see if its sufficient to send back to company (including any new information - which if there is enough, may require a new filing) with the same requirements. If that response isn't enough you can file a formal complaint. Sure, that costs money... but the formal complaint requires both parties to appear before the FCC (like a court proceeding) usually represented by lawyers/experts in communication law and FCC rules. So yeah, a formal complaint sounds like a big deal and not something you do for normal stuff. Company is still required to respond (so they cant just ignore it) and the FCC reviews the response. So there's opportunities for both the FCC and the individual to say "Nope, not good enough" for regular complaints... or, "Yup, sounds good. Complaint closed." which is likely much more common since it appears that common sense...isn't and people tend to complain about everything regardless if it's justified.
 
cageymaru said:
The FCC which is led by Ajit Pai has voted to change the way that it handles consumer complaints. Instead of investigating informal complaints from consumers about companies, it will now forward the complaints to the offending company which have 30 days to respond. If the consumer doesn't receive satisfaction from the ruling of the company, they can now file a formal complaint for a $225 filing fee.

Previously the Commission was required to contact the complainant regarding its review and disposition of the matters raised. Since the Commission no longer has to review a complaint, politicians are fearful that the new languange leaves a consumer's only recourse is to file the $225 formal complaint. This new process is meant to streamline the way complaints are handled by the FCC.

Does the FCC contact me directly about my complaint?

No, the FCC serves your complaint on your provider(s) and the provider is obligated to respond to your complaint within 30 days and provide the FCC with a copy of that response. It is likely that your provider(s) will contact you to attempt to resolve your complaint.
Click to expand...


Shit like this is why I am sad that guy didn't succeed in killing Ajit Pai. That man is a cancerous tumor in our society and needs to be removed and studied to see if he has infected others.
 
atp1916 said:
I see no issues with this outside of the filing fee.

$225 is.... rough. LOL
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The FCC is supposed to be the authority here, instead they are passing the buck to the company. If i make a complaint to the FCC, i want THEM to pressure the company in my stead. This is a legal process, not arbitration.
 
fuzzylogik said:
I read nothing crazy about this.

File a complaint to the FCC against company, FCC records the complaint and tracking number given. If the FCC has relevant educational material about said issue it will send it to the person. If not, FCC sends the complaint to company, requiring a written response to both the FCC and person filing the complaint within 30 days. FCC reviews the response and if it's sufficient the complaint is closed. If that's not to the liking of the person you can rebuttal (or file a formal complaint), the FCC will review and see if its sufficient to send back to company (including any new information - which if there is enough, may require a new filing) with the same requirements. If that response isn't enough you can file a formal complaint. Sure, that costs money... but the formal complaint requires both parties to appear before the FCC (like a court proceeding) usually represented by lawyers/experts in communication law and FCC rules. So yeah, a formal complaint sounds like a big deal and not something you do for normal stuff. Company is still required to respond (so they cant just ignore it) and the FCC reviews the response. So there's opportunities for both the FCC and the individual to say "Nope, not good enough" for regular complaints... or, "Yup, sounds good. Complaint closed." which is likely much more common since it appears that common sense...isn't and people tend to complain about everything regardless if it's justified.
Click to expand...

The FCC is no longer required to review the complaint. That's what was done away with to streamline the process. Read the links and quotes in my post here. What you just detailed very nicely is how they handled it BEFORE the change. Unfortunately we're not in Kansas anymore. :)
https://hardforum.com/threads/fcc-v...mer-complaints.1964096/page-2#post-1043726220
 
cageymaru said:
The FCC is no longer required to review the complaint. That's what was done away with to streamline the process. Read the links and quotes in my post here. What you just detailed very nicely is how they handled it BEFORE the change. Unfortunately we're not in Kansas anymore. :)
https://hardforum.com/threads/fcc-v...mer-complaints.1964096/page-2#post-1043726220
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I got all this directly from the new process on filing a complaint that was linked to. I summarized it.

...You will be given a tracking number and you will receive periodic emails about the status of your complaint. You may be contacted by an FCC consumer representative if more information is necessary to complete your complaint. When all required information has been gathered, the FCC either responds to you by providing relevant educational material or sends your complaint to the service provider. The provider is required to respond in writing to the complaint within 30 days of receipt of the complaint. The Provider must provide you and the FCC with a copy of the response. The provider will likely contact you to resolve your complaint...
Click to expand...

Once a response is received from the provider, the FCC reads the response and if sufficient, closes your complaint...
Click to expand...

If you believe the carrier response you received was insufficient, you may send rebuttal information to the FCC by replying to the email that you were sent by the FCC. The FCC will review your information and determine if it is sufficient to send to the provider triggering a new obligation to respond. If your additional information actually constitutes a new complaint, you will be asked to fill out a new form. Another option is filing a formal complaint with the FCC.
Click to expand...

If you are not satisfied with the response to your informal complaint, you can file a "formal" complaint. Your formal complaint must be filed within six months of the date of the response to your informal complaint. The current fee for filing a formal complaint is $225.00, but it is subject to change. Formal complaint proceedings are similar to court proceedings. Each party must comply with specific procedural rules, appear before the FCC and file documents that address legal issues. Parties filing formal complaints usually are represented by lawyers or experts in communications law and the FCC's procedural rules.
Click to expand...
 
fuzzylogik said:
I got all this directly from the new process on filing a complaint that was linked to. I summarized it.
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Nowhere in there do they have to actually have to read your complaint.

You will be given a tracking number and you will receive periodic emails about the status of your complaint.

Does not require a human to read your complaint.

You may be contacted by an FCC consumer representative if more information is necessary to complete your complaint.

This means that they can optionally read your complaint if they feel like it. The language stipulating them to actually read your complaint and the response from the offending company was removed. This is to streamline the process.

When all required information has been gathered, the FCC either responds to you by providing relevant educational material or sends your complaint to the service provider. The provider is required to respond in writing to the complaint within 30 days of receipt of the complaint. The Provider must provide you and the FCC with a copy of the response. The provider will likely contact you to resolve your complaint...

If they want to optionally respond to you, then they will send educational material OR they will just send your complaint to the offending company. They don't even have to send you a pamphlet now. The offending company will respond to your complaint within 30 days with you and the FCC getting a copy. Again the original text required the FCC to read and respond. Now they just forward your complaint to the service provider, file a copy of your complaint and the response that you got, then maybe send you a copy of it if they felt like reading it. The requirement to actually read complaints and response from the offending company is removed!

Now if you want to escalate it you can pay $225 to actually get a FCC worker to look at your complaint. Before they were required to view and read the free complaint response from the company. If you didn't agree with the FCC and offending company's findings then you can pay $225 to escalate it.

Big differences that a few little words make in a contract.
 
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Wow, so now there is a paywall wall to access the "formal complaint system".

So if I want to throw 1/4 of my check at a problem with (company name)

My socioeconomic status might keep me quiet.... What a world....

Screw pai
 
cageymaru said:
Nowhere in there do they have to actually have to read your complaint.
Click to expand...

If the entire initial process is fully automated - that could probably work if the forms etc. are really well created so that the system will know if all the required information is there and can determine itself whether to respond to the individual by sending educational material or just sending it directly to the company. But If it's the case where they never do the first part and they only stick a number to some submitted form and sent it off to the company... What about the other side of this process?

When the response is received by the FCC and they read it (as required - "Once a response is received from the provider, the FCC reads the response and if sufficient, closes your complaint..."), are we supposed to believe that the FCC, stating that they read the response, is not a requirement to read the response? With that are we to understand that the FCC doesn't know what the complaint is that is being responded to? How can the FCC send it back to the company if it's not a sufficient response? How can sufficient be determined without context? Somewhere in this process the FCC is reading the complaint - the whole process won't work otherwise (the FCC appears to just be removing possibly redundant work at the start of the process, and putting a bit more on the company in question?). And if there isn't a resolution they have a more legal way of handling it that requires both parties to show up in front of the FCC for a fee.
 
fuzzylogik said:
If the entire initial process is fully automated - that could probably work if the forms etc. are really well created so that the system will know if all the required information is there and can determine itself whether to respond to the individual by sending educational material or just sending it directly to the company. But If it's the case where they never do the first part and they only stick a number to some submitted form and sent it off to the company... What about the other side of this process?

When the response is received by the FCC and they read it (as required - "Once a response is received from the provider, the FCC reads the response and if sufficient, closes your complaint..."), are we supposed to believe that the FCC, stating that they read the response, is not a requirement to read the response? With that are we to understand that the FCC doesn't know what the complaint is that is being responded to? How can the FCC send it back to the company if it's not a sufficient response? How can sufficient be determined without context? Somewhere in this process the FCC is reading the complaint - the whole process won't work otherwise (the FCC appears to just be removing possibly redundant work at the start of the process, and putting a bit more on the company in question?). And if there isn't a resolution they have a more legal way of handling it that requires both parties to show up in front of the FCC for a fee.
Click to expand...

Does the FCC contact me directly about my complaint?

No, the FCC serves your complaint on your provider(s) and the provider is obligated to respond to your complaint within 30 days and provide the FCC with a copy of that response. It is likely that your provider(s) will contact you to attempt to resolve your complaint.
 
I thought the internet ended with the end of net neutrality?
 
So all our taxes are going down right? If you have to pay them to do their job, no reason they should get the tax money too.
 
cageymaru said:
Does the FCC contact me directly about my complaint?

No, the FCC serves your complaint on your provider(s) and the provider is obligated to respond to your complaint within 30 days and provide the FCC with a copy of that response. It is likely that your provider(s) will contact you to attempt to resolve your complaint.
Click to expand...

Wait. Was the issue about the FCC reading the complaint or about how the FCC communicates about the complaint?
 
cageymaru said:
Yes, the fee was always there as you said. They forwarded the complaint to the company before. What is new is that the FCC no longer has to review what the company responded with and disposition of the matters raised. They just forward what the judgement rendered from the company to you. If you don't like what the company ruled then you can file the $225 formal complaint.

The whole FCC review and disposition requirement was removed. Now the FCC can optionally review your complaint if they feel like doing so. But it is up to their discretion if they read it or not due to the language change.

Here is the old way for reference.
https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2010-title47-vol1/pdf/CFR-2010-title47-vol1-sec1-717.pdf

§ 1.717 Procedure. The Commission will forward informal complaints to the appropriate carrier for investigation. The carrier will, within such time as may be prescribed, advise the Commission in writing, with a copy to the complainant, of its satisfaction of the complaint or of its refusal or inability to do so. Where there are clear indications from the carrier’s report or from other communications with the parties that the complaint has been satisfied, the Commission may, in its discretion, consider a complaint proceeding to be closed, without response to the complainant. In all other cases, the Commission will contact the complainant regarding its review and disposition of the matters raised. If the complainant is not satisfied by the carrier’s response and the Commission’s disposition, it may file a formal complaint in accordance with §1.721 of this part.

The underlined bold part is no longer applicable. This was the part that was removed to streamline the process.

Here is the FCC flowchart of how they handle reviews now. If you can find the section where the underlined text above exists please point it out to us.
https://consumercomplaints.fcc.gov/hc/en-us/articles/202752940-How-the-FCC-Handles-Your-Complaint
Click to expand...

Okay now explain exactly the procedural change? What does "contact the complainant regarding its review and disposition of the matters raised" actually mean? What it meant before is they would basically check up with you to see if the company replied to you and if the matter was resolved. That was it. They can still do that now if they choose, but are not required to. Nothing procedural in the complaint process actually changed though. In either case, to get a resolution from the FCC, you still have to file a formal complaint.

So please where is the sky falling in this change?
 
so now you have to pay to formally complain. Bad business wins again.
 
NoOther said:
Okay now explain exactly the procedural change? What does "contact the complainant regarding its review and disposition of the matters raised" actually mean? What it meant before is they would basically check up with you to see if the company replied to you and if the matter was resolved. That was it. They can still do that now if they choose, but are not required to. Nothing procedural in the complaint process actually changed though. In either case, to get a resolution from the FCC, you still have to file a formal complaint.

So please where is the sky falling in this change?
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It used to be required within the flow chart to "contact the complainant regarding its review and disposition of the matters raised" as you said. In a flow chart X happens and then the result dictates where in the flow chart the next step occurs. You don't follow all the steps every time correct? It is based on conditional statements so some steps may never occur. But when you have an absolute or fixed statement like the one in dispute then it must be executed each time. It cannot be skipped. By changing the language, the interpretation of the rules can come into play in the future.

Take for example Valve. They used to have all types of issues answering consumer questions about Steam. This is just like what the FCC is experiencing. What did Valve do? They hired more workers, upgraded their software to streamline the review process and trained their employees more. Now they can process more complaints in less than a week than what would have taken them a month or more previously. The FCC should have taken that approach rather than throw consumers under the bus by opening up the interpretation of the rules by removing the absolute, fixed statement that they will read each complaint.

That's my issue with the change. Got to find more articles so I might not be able to respond for some hours. I hope that clears up my opinion of the change.
 
Kor said:
Fuck yeah, a bigger barrier to entry for those less fortunate! </s>
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No it isn't. Informal complaint was free before and remains so. Formal complaint was $225 before and remains so.
 
Guarana [BAWLS] said:
yell at people when they have boobies show up on TV?
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USA is weird.

I've been following some news where the FCC started monitoring frequencies for Part 95/97 violators (among others) and handing out fines. It's being called operation "One kilohertz at a time". Basically, they were so backed with complaints that they started this big frequency sweep to rationalize ignoring the list. For them to also start charging for filed complaints means they better fucking follow through, otherwise people will get really upset. It still seems shitty that the department is wasting their money on lawyers and legislation changes (i.e. not their job) and is now using their new and legal pan-handilng scheme to afford their actual job.
 
cageymaru said:
It used to be required within the flow chart to "contact the complainant regarding its review and disposition of the matters raised" as you said. In a flow chart X happens and then the result dictates where in the flow chart the next step occurs. You don't follow all the steps every time correct? It is based on conditional statements so some steps may never occur. But when you have an absolute or fixed statement like the one in dispute then it must be executed each time. It cannot be skipped. By changing the language, the interpretation of the rules can come into play in the future.

Take for example Valve. They used to have all types of issues answering consumer questions about Steam. This is just like what the FCC is experiencing. What did Valve do? They hired more workers, upgraded their software to streamline the review process and trained their employees more. Now they can process more complaints in less than a week than what would have taken them a month or more previously. The FCC should have taken that approach rather than throw consumers under the bus by opening up the interpretation of the rules by removing the absolute, fixed statement that they will read each complaint.

That's my issue with the change. Got to find more articles so I might not be able to respond for some hours. I hope that clears up my opinion of the change.
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That is a terrible analogy. Valve is addressing complaints about their service. FCC is merely facilitating complaints about ISPs/Carriers. The FCC doesn't get involved unless its a formal complaint. Again, this is much ado about nothing.
 
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NoOther said:
That is a terrible analogy. Valve is addressing complaints about their service. FCC is merely facilitating complaints about ISPs/Carriers. The FCC doesn't get involved unless its a formal complaint. Again, this is much ado about nothing.
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They used to be involved if it an informal complaint because of the wording that was removed.
 
cageymaru said:
They used to be involved if it an informal complaint because of the wording that was removed.
Click to expand...

Yes, and their involvement consisted of passing the complaint to the ISP/Carrier, and then following up with the complainant about the issue, if it isn't resolved, they advise the complainant to send a formal complaint. The only real change now is that its the complainants obligation to send a formal complaint if their issue is not addressed. That seems extremely reasonable. Again, much ado about nothing.
 
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Ajit Pai is a mafia don wannabe. Pay us protection money and we'll protect you. Otherwise you're on your own.
 
NoOther said:
Yes, and their involvement consisted of passing the complaint to the ISP/Carrier, and then following up with the complainant about the issue, if it isn't resolved, they advise the complainant to send a formal complaint. The only real change now is that its the complainants obligation to send a formal complaint if their issue is not addressed. That seems extremely reasonable. Again, much ado about nothing.
Click to expand...
No, they were required to read what the ISP/Carrier said previously and formulate a disposition.

A disposition means:
  1. power to make decisions about or dispose of a thing; control
  2. regulation; management; dispensation:
Dispensation means:

A system of order, government, or organization of a nation, community, etc., especially as existing at a particular time.


If the complainant didn't agree with the ISP/Carrier response and or FCC disposition, then they had the opportunity to file a $225 formal complaint. That was the OLD way.

In the new set of rules, the FCC doesn't have to formulate a ruling or make a decision. Now they just forward whatever if sent to them from the ISP / Carrier and tell you to go spend $225 on a formal complaint if you don't like what the ISP/Carrier rules. They will give a copy of your complaint and response to the FCC secretary to file to show that a complaint occurred.

The FCC can optionally read the complaint if they want to and assist. That's what Ajit Pai is saying that they will do from now on thus nothing changed. What he conveniently leaves out is that it is now optional to read the complaint due to the recent change in the rules whereas it was mandatory before.

Basically it is now worthless to complain to the FCC in my opinion. I'd rather see their powers reverted to the state level and the entire government office shuttered as they have made themselves worthless. I can write a letter to my ISP myself.
 
cageymaru said:
The FCC which is led by Ajit Pai has voted to change the way that it handles consumer complaints. Instead of investigating informal complaints from consumers about companies, it will now forward the complaints to the offending company which have 30 days to respond. If the consumer doesn't receive satisfaction from the ruling of the company, they can now file a formal complaint for a $225 filing fee.

Previously the Commission was required to contact the complainant regarding its review and disposition of the matters raised. Since the Commission no longer has to review a complaint, politicians are fearful that the new languange leaves a consumer's only recourse is to file the $225 formal complaint. This new process is meant to streamline the way complaints are handled by the FCC.

Does the FCC contact me directly about my complaint?

No, the FCC serves your complaint on your provider(s) and the provider is obligated to respond to your complaint within 30 days and provide the FCC with a copy of that response. It is likely that your provider(s) will contact you to attempt to resolve your complaint.
Click to expand...
I see nothing wrong with this. The problem was that people file complaints over just about everything. Millions of frivolous complaints. What are you going to do? Address them all?

You need a system where the two most important things happen:
1) The company who is being discussed needs to be alerted of the complaint. This allows them to be aware of the issue.
2) If it's a serious issue, put your money where your mouth is and pay the US government to look further into it.

$225 isn't much for serious complaints.
 
meltdowner said:
I see nothing wrong with this. The problem was that people file complaints over just about everything. Millions of frivolous complaints. What are you going to do? Address them all?

You need a system where the two most important things happen:
1) The company who is being discussed needs to be alerted of the complaint. This allows them to be aware of the issue.
2) If it's a serious issue, put your money where your mouth is and pay the US government to look further into it.

$225 isn't much for serious complaints.
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We already pay the government through taxation. Why do we have to pay them twice?
 
meltdowner said:
Handling complaints from the internet is not their primary duty. They will still be handling their primary duty with taxes dollars.
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Why does the manner in which a person submit a request matter? So senators shouldn't accept requests over the phone, email, or read comments on their own website because it is not their primary duty?

That is interesting! I think that phone companies should stop accepting credit card payments over the internet also.
 
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