Star Citizen’s $27,000 Bundle Raises Eyebrows

while i like support and enjoy star citizen this on going business of ever more expensive digital items will be the precursor that creates a genre of games that are inaccessible to all but the most privileged of players. This, in my opinion will harm gaming as a whole. as these 'privileged' type games will most likely create artificial and or legal barriers that harms general accessibility of gaming today. by locking concepts and mechanics behind legal barricades that are funded by a privileged player base. new and or old game concepts may be locked away behind a legal web supported by the cash of those who fund such endeavors.

A example of this is the PUBG lawsuit against Epic. the players unknowingly funded a company who believes they have the sole right to create battle royale games.
its only a matter of time before a game with a determined business head manages to get the funding and legal support to lock up a game genre behind a huge legal web of some kind.
with players supporting the price tiers of digital items into the thousands of dollar, now even into the 10's of thousands its just a matter of time before these monsters come into existence.

star citizen along with a bevy of other games have demonstrated that there is a player base willing to put big dollars into games and thats going to draw in some undesirable elements into the game industry, and end up doing a lot of damge in the end . as highlighted by the loot box fiasco.

this may actually be the beginning of the end of gamings golden age.
 
Jim Kim said:
As for the amount of money taken in, I don't see any outrage over Fortnite making $300 million in April .
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Why would there be? Fortnite is an actual delivered game which can be played for free on multiple platforms.

The outrage over Star Citizen isn't about them making money. They should absolutely be in the business of making money. The outrage is that they're pushing $200 million in fan funding (I don't know the current figure) to produce a game over the past 7 years, and all they seem to accomplish is finding new ways to suck more money out of their fans without actually producing a completed game.
 
Mut1ny said:
What is there to defend? Are they forcing this on anyone in anyway? Seriously?

It's just some PR stunt/if you wanna you can *shurgs*.

As for the game itself I have my doubts...latest "Around the Universe" showed how they're still working on weapon recoil for Squadron 42...the fuck? How?

I think the MAIN issue here is that they're focusing too much on both technology development and game development. They don't have SET TOOLS to make a game because they're MAKING THE TOOLS...so they create some new shit and next thing you know they're having to remake this whole system over here because of this new system over here.

I think the game will come, something will, we already have pretty decent ground work laid out. Just landed yesterday on a planet and it looks phenomenal. But when the fuck will it end?

ALSO have to keep in mind that while I disagree with them stating release dates that haven't happened there's been other larger richer studios with tech already laid out that have taken LONGER to make SMALLER games. Rockstar gets a pass for a game taking 8 years to make (RDR 2, GTA 5, etc) with hundreds of million already in the bank, full studios, networking, etc yet SC gets shit because they started from scratch?

Come on...people need to get real.
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The difference is, Rockstar is using its own money, not crowd funding and selling digital content while missing every single deadline. Just like RS is beholden to answer to its shareholders, imperium is beholden to answer to the public since they are publicly funded. If you aren't deeply bothered at what is going on, you should be.
 
Babbster said:
Why would there be? Fortnite is an actual delivered game which can be played for free on multiple platforms.

The outrage over Star Citizen isn't about them making money. They should absolutely be in the business of making money. The outrage is that they're pushing $200 million in fan funding (I don't know the current figure) to produce a game over the past 7 years, and all they seem to accomplish is finding new ways to suck more money out of their fans without actually producing a completed game.
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I'm not going to get outraged over fan funding or the amount of money spent or the time taken to make the game. No one is forcing people to open their wallets and give money to this project. They do so willingly while knowing the risks and missed deadlines (it's not like this was the first game to ever miss a deadline) ;). /shrug
 
Jim Kim said:
I'm not going to get outraged over fan funding or the amount of money spent or the time taken to make the game. No one is forcing people to open their wallets and give money to this project. They do so willingly while knowing the risks and missed deadlines (it's not like this was the first game to ever miss a deadline) ;). /shrug
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Yeah, lots of scams are "voluntary." That doesn't exclude deceit and fraud.
 
Hmmm i haven't bought this and still have my copy of star citizen coming. I still don't regret the $30 I spent years ago.
 
chaos4u said:
Love how this figure keeps getting higher and higher with this kinda of inflation star citizen will be in development for 30 years by 2020 !!
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Hilarious. I got the number from Wikipedia. If you think it's wrong, you should definitely fix it.
Star Citizen is an upcoming massively multiplayer, space trading and combat game developed and published by Chris Roberts' company Cloud Imperium Games for Microsoft Windows and Linux. Development of the game began in 2011, and is being mostly financed from a large crowdfunding campaign.
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why would they ever release this this game for a mere 60 bucks when they have chumps paying thousands
 
For the GTA example, imagine if all those GTA Online BS cars and missions were being sold, but GTA 5 still wasn't out yet. That's what they're doing.

I'm confused as I thought the 10k pack was supposed to include everything. At least with Bernie Madoff some people made a profit.

I lost it when they recently said we've started work on Squadron 42, I've still got my Kickstarter receipt...
 
IRSmurf said:
This is such a stupid thing to get outraged over. It's like getting upset because someone spent six figures on a car, boat, or vacation. If someone wants to throw $27,000 at a video game, good for them. And good for the people who are making something people are happy to throw money at.
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Its not a video game though.
 
Babbster said:
Hilarious. I got the number from Wikipedia. If you think it's wrong, you should definitely fix it.
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funny the game began large scale crowd funding in november of 2012 ..

i guess production is relative as is time its self ... i guess that really does mean star citizen has been in production for 40 some years since this has been crhis's dream game from the beginning.
 
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This is really only shocking to people on the outside who assume this is merely a(nother?) shameless money grab and that CIG is expecting random followers to consider it seriously. They're offering a $27,000 ship package because there are backers who requested it. Yes, seriously. Apparently these people wanted to spend even more money on spaceships, so CIG obliged them. And why wouldn't they? Personally, I think it's asinine to put that kind of money into any hobby (that includes you, car / gun / whatever people), but lucky for all of you I don't get to decide how you spend your money.

Sorry for injecting thought into the usual mindless pile-on.
 
There's a sucker born every minute.

And star citizen not only found them but tricked them in to paying money to a fucking vacuum.

Can't wait for this to be on some future top ten lists of fucking million dollar scams.
 
Only buy games that are officially released and don't require microtransactions.
In this case macrotransactions.

I didn't spend any money backing this game and I will never buy it. It's DLC at it's very worse.
 
People, meaning individuals, spend $hundreds per week on "free to play" mobile app games. I think this is not substantially different.

$27k is a lot of money. To me. To many (most) people. There are people in this very forum that net that in less than a week. Maybe an in-game pink tophat is worth a few days' labor to someone. It's not for me, but who am I? Not the target audience for this type of thing.
 
It's Funny that people get upset by this $27,000 Package. First of no one is forcing anyone to buy it , 2nd the people that buy it are grown ups and can clearly afford it no one is living under a bridge eating out of a dumpster to pay for their virtual spaceships. Whats funny is that CIG has actually been doing a bunch of shitty things to their backers that are genuine shady and affect a bunch of people who aren't whales but who genuinely backed the game in good faith, and no one is reporting on any of that. Not saying that CIG isn't turning into another EA because they certainly look like they are, but the "journalists" reporting on this package are just a bunch of click bait peddling vultures. Look is a $27,000 video game package stupid? Yeah it is, but people buy all sorts of stupid shit so why does this particular stupid shit merit so much shock and outrage. If some moron (or person genuinely that zealous about the game)wants to buy this that's his business so STFU.


Want to me mad about something genuinely worth being mad about? Get mad that the HUD secretary spent $32,000 tax payer dollars on fucking furniture or get mad that the last administration spent millions of our dollars spying on us and effectively wiretapping all of our phones.



TLDR: People backing Star Citizen are Big Kids, no need to get all bent out of shape over what other people purchase with their money, No one is forcing people to buy this package (there are packs available for $60). If you want to get upset se above for shit worth getting upset about.
 
Hardly a scam when it's actually finished. Sorry they are building something ambitious at their own pace rather than at the demands of others. That's what crowdfunding is supposed to be about. The freedom to build on their time and creative schedule without the demands of a corporate overlord breathing down their neck. Except now replace Corporate Overlords with impatient consumers who know nothing about making something.

Yes they are charging a shit ton for these ships. PRobaby because the ships included costed individual people quite a bit of money to begin with. And selling them for less than what those people paid isn't really fair.

And again, no one is forcing anyone to do this. Mr Roberts is creative in that they come up with these things to keep more funding coming in, and people keep giving them money. And as long as they do, there's no incentive not to do things like this.

It's done when it's done, get over it. Leave your expectations at the door.
 
Also if Star Citizen is a Scam it is the most poorly thought out scam Ever. H


Hmm. Let make up a cool game and get suckers to give us millions of dollars to "make the game" ok boss sounds good then ... we take the money and buy and Island and snort coke off strippers???.... NO !!! then we use that money higher hundreds of software developers to build the game so we can keep raising money! but boss won't that just mean that we spend all the money to make the game and then we never get the island and the coke and the strippers? ...... Oh shit your right.

Look Star Citizen maybe overly Ambitious (it almost certainly is) , it may collapse under it's on weight and the Hubris of the Egomaniac at the helm (pretty good chance ), Or it may deliver on a tenth of what it promises and be the greatest game ever created (worth the risk for the potential IMO, but if you disagree guess what don't give them money)(, but it's definitely not a scam and anyone claiming it is is a bitter piece of shit troll.
 
Mut1ny said:
yet SC get's shit on because it's MASSIVE scope isn't coming together fast enough for crybabies.
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I think it gets shit on more since they were estimating "A digital copy of the finished game" for November 2014. That, and it seems like the massive scope would have made way more sense to add in gradually after initial release, like almost every other actively maintained game on the planet does.
 
There are millions keeping all the televangelists in mansions and jet airplanes. So does this really shock anyone ? The world is right full of stupid.
 
kinjo said:
Also if Star Citizen is a Scam it is the most poorly thought out scam Ever. H
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It didn't start out as a scam. I don't for a minute think that CR went into it planning a giant ripoff. He was genuine at first. But when they saw that they can take in money by not making a game, just promises and non-existing content, they slowly started to change their goals, and the development shifted from actually wanting to make a game to maintaining the business model of perpetual development, while showcasing features that are nowhere near ready to be implemented to keep the hype, and keep the ignorant thinking they're doing something of worth.

It's obvious to anyone even partly familiar with game development that SC's development is not normal. And not because it is "bigger" or "more complicated" than anything else, as the defenders claim.

I don't give two shits about how your throw your money away at CR. You do what you want. But don't for a second try and say that the "non-believers" are the fools.

Really, star citinenship at this point should be registered as a religion, because it's equally foolish to believe in it as in scientology or some such nonsense.

Honestly, at what point will you be ready to admit, that this is going nowhere? 10 years 20 years?
 
M76 said:
It didn't start out as a scam. I don't for a minute think that CR went into it planning a giant ripoff. He was genuine at first. But when they saw that they can take in money by not making a game, just promises and non-existing content, they slowly started to change their goals, and the development shifted from actually wanting to make a game to maintaining the business model of perpetual development, while showcasing features that are nowhere near ready to be implemented to keep the hype, and keep the ignorant thinking they're doing something of worth.

It's obvious to anyone even partly familiar with game development that SC's development is not normal. And not because it is "bigger" or "more complicated" than anything else, as the defenders claim.

I don't give two shits about how your throw your money away at CR. You do what you want. But don't for a second try and say that the "non-believers" are the fools.

Really, star citinenship at this point should be registered as a religion, because it's equally foolish to believe in it as in scientology or some such nonsense.

Honestly, at what point will you be ready to admit, that this is going nowhere? 10 years 20 years?
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I knew there was a good chance it could go nowhere from the time they started adding stretch goals. But I am willing to gamble some money on the chance that it pays off. Anyone that loses a significant amount of money if SC fails will be someone who can afford it. Star Citizen is a lot like cryptocurrency If you only put in money you can afford to lose without being salty about it you will be fine and you may be richly rewarded. If you put money in you can't afford to lose you are a fool; now I don't think that means it's ok for CIG to take advantage of their backers and they have been doing things lately that border on that, but no one is talking about those things and instead they are wasting breath talking about this stupid $27,000 package.
 
kinjo said:
I knew there was a good chance it could go nowhere from the time they started adding stretch goals. But I am willing to gamble some money on the chance that it pays off. Anyone that loses a significant amount of money if SC fails will be someone who can afford it. Star Citizen is a lot like cryptocurrency If you only put in money you can afford to lose without being salty about it you will be fine and you may be richly rewarded. If you put money in you can't afford to lose you are a fool; now I don't think that means it's ok for CIG to take advantage of their backers and they have been doing things lately that border on that, but no one is talking about those things and instead they are wasting breath talking about this stupid $27,000 package.
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wtf?
 
kinjo said:
I knew there was a good chance it could go nowhere from the time they started adding stretch goals. But I am willing to gamble some money on the chance that it pays off. Anyone that loses a significant amount of money if SC fails will be someone who can afford it. Star Citizen is a lot like cryptocurrency If you only put in money you can afford to lose without being salty about it you will be fine and you may be richly rewarded. If you put money in you can't afford to lose you are a fool; now I don't think that means it's ok for CIG to take advantage of their backers and they have been doing things lately that border on that, but no one is talking about those things and instead they are wasting breath talking about this stupid $27,000 package.
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I think that the comparison with crypto is not appropriate. In so far as I can tell, they promised a completed game. In fact, they promised - or at least projected - a completed game several times. The maximum upside is getting what was marketed to you.
 
$27,000...well, that's it. I am now raising my eyebrows AND rolling my eyes so far back I can now see my brain. Ah yes there it is, and now I am going to use it to never touch this shitshow of a "game".
 
Joust said:
I think that the comparison with crypto is not appropriate. In so far as I can tell, they promised a completed game. In fact, they promised - or at least projected - a completed game several times. The maximum upside is getting what was marketed to you.
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I disagree the comparisons is apt, the maximum value of the reward is subjective but the nature of the "investment" is very similar, in both cases you are betting (much more so than investing) your money in a high risk venture based on something that conceptually promises to redefine the industry it's part of (video games for SC currency exchange for crypto). In both cases you are betting on something that's far from a sure thing and the potential reward is great (1000%+ cash return for crypto, $50 dollars for a sci-fi life simulator that people have dreamed of for decades for SC) .

In both cases you are betting on something created with the intent of redefining the status quo which is not something that is usually done intentionally. You are taking a huge risk and in both cases if you put in money you cannot afford to lose you are an idiot. People have called both SC and Crypto a scam and in both cases those people are wrong; people have also treated both crypto and SC like a sure thing and in both cases those people are morons.



I put money into both crypto and Star Citizen, Crypto paid off well Star Citizen not so much thus far but in both cases I knew the risk going in and chose to take that risk, and in both cases I only risked what I could afford.
 
M76 said:
It's obvious to anyone even partly familiar with game development that SC's development is not normal. And not because it is "bigger" or "more complicated" than anything else, as the defenders claim."
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I don't usually wade into the raw sewage that is SC discussions on [H], but what the hell. It's curious that you rule out the game's size and complicated nature as explanations for why it would take a long time to develop. Like... why? It is big. And complicated. Also, what specifically is not normal about SC's development, aside from its length? It just seems weird that you'd point out it's taking a long time to develop and then claim it can't be because of the most obvious factors. I've never felt it was taking longer than it should, given what I know of its scope.

M76 said:
Honestly, at what point will you be ready to admit, that this is going nowhere?
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A number of core game mechanics should go live by the end of this year (when it'll probably be interesting enough for me to take notice) and through the next--the Gameplay categories here, which is a fun thing to keep an eye on. If, at the end of 2019, we don't have a game that is eminently playable and enjoyable and reasonably polished, I'd be very disappointed and more than a little annoyed. But as long as obvious progress continues to be made, I don't imagine I'd ever feel like it was going nowhere. I mean, that's kind of the nature of progress, isn't it? If it's being made (which it undeniably is), it's all going... somewhere. Isn't it?

Granted, my expectations haven't changed for at least a couple years. It seems like the people who complain about how long it's taking maybe had unrealistic expectations to begin with.
 
Jesus Christ, just throw that money at Elon, and shoot yourself into orbit in his roadster.
 
Korrd said:
I don't usually wade into the raw sewage that is SC discussions on [H], but what the hell. It's curious that you rule out the game's size and complicated nature as explanations for why it would take a long time to develop. Like... why? It is big. And complicated. Also, what specifically is not normal about SC's development, aside from its length? It just seems weird that you'd point out it's taking a long time to develop and then claim it can't be because of the most obvious factors. I've never felt it was taking longer than it should, given what I know of its scope.
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That's the beauty of scope creep - no one will ever know how long it'll take, seemingly including the developers themselves.

But didn't CIG actually have some approximations of when they'd finish? I mean, that's from the horse's mouth. I'd say people who paid money towards funding the game have every right to be annoyed. Forget [H], people on the SC subreddit seem irked, and that sub is usually a circlejerk.
 
Korrd said:
I don't usually wade into the raw sewage that is SC discussions on [H], but what the hell. It's curious that you rule out the game's size and complicated nature as explanations for why it would take a long time to develop. Like... why? It is big. And complicated. Also, what specifically is not normal about SC's development, aside from its length? It just seems weird that you'd point out it's taking a long time to develop and then claim it can't be because of the most obvious factors. I've never felt it was taking longer than it should, given what I know of its scope.
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Who says it is complicated? I haven't even seen CR say that. It is a made up excuse by the supporters as far as I can tell. They decided that a space sim is complicated. I know for a fact that it is the least complicated game you can make. It takes place in vacuum, there is no going simpler than that, minimal amount of interactions, and minimal amount of objects compared to the scope. And the hangar and social modules? They are (broken) walking simulators. Again not complicated. The persistent universe? What persistent universe? What they released so far shouldn't have taken them 6 years to develop that's the point. The long development isn't proof of the complexity, it is proof that they're not doing it right.
A number of core game mechanics should go live by the end of this year (when it'll probably be interesting enough for me to take notice) and through the next--the Gameplay categories here, which is a fun thing to keep an eye on. If, at the end of 2019, we don't have a game that is eminently playable and enjoyable and reasonably polished, I'd be very disappointed and more than a little annoyed. But as long as obvious progress continues to be made, I don't imagine I'd ever feel like it was going nowhere. I mean, that's kind of the nature of progress, isn't it? If it's being made (which it undeniably is), it's all going... somewhere. Isn't it?
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Should go? How many times have we heard that? I don't care about minor game mechanics that they add. It just doesn't get me excited anymore, I need a fully featured playable game, not a broken tech demo at this point to turn me around about the project. I'm pretty sure that's never going to happen. These minor milestones should be completely internal and none of our business. If my car mechanic would call me to show that he has tightened a bolt weekly, I'd say fuck off, give me my money back. I don't care about nuts and bolts. If you worked on it properly it wouldn't take a week to tighten a bolt. Comparatively 7 years into development you shouldn't be adding game mechanics anymore. Those should be set in rock by now. Not even now, years ago!

Granted, my expectations haven't changed for at least a couple years. It seems like the people who complain about how long it's taking maybe had unrealistic expectations to begin with.
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Unrealistic expectation given by CR himself when touting a 2014 release for SQ42. Which is still completely MIA, and I suspect not even being worked on at all. And that trumps every excuse anyone can come up with in their defence. They're not doing what they took my money for. Shame on them. And while 2014 was an unrealistic promise. 2016-2017 would've been completely realistic and plenty of time for a wing commander type game if not for mismanagement of the project.
 
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