PUBG Sues Fortnite

ryno9100 said:
It had the same style of gameplay, but you weren't dropped from a plane at the beginning, which is what PUBG Corp is stating as their unique take on the genre, and one of the things they say Fortnite is copying.
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You jump from a hot air RV/bus, not quite the same lmao
 
Advil said:
Guys, the games are stupidly similar. There actually is a bit of an issue here. Not saying PUBG should win, but it has been an elephant in the room recently.

Don't any of you dare take this to mean I'm fanboying PUBG. I don't love or play the game that much. It's just that it almost makes a bit of sense for this to have ended up in court at some point. The decision will probably be exactly what you all expect, "You can't copyright a genre." But in the case of these collapsing map battle royale games there are only so many game elements that can be changed between games. So does this fall under the "there are 1000 different RTS games out there that all play substantially the same so how can you sue?" or is it "these two games are more similar than that." Similar enough to be infringement?
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But this goes on all the time, it is a style of gameplay. Racing games, space flight, squad based FPS, turn based squad strategy, etc etc. For PUBG to have a case, they would have to prove that elements of their game were used in the creation of fortnite, this being design files, images, songs, voices, story. As this is one of many battle royale games, it is just a new popular genre.

The point is to be competitive, not attack the competition, all that does is sour the market and reputation.

Fortnite also could be argued that it was not the basis of the game, but an expansion added later that was giving people a requested feature.
 
I haven't read the specific allegations in the pleadings. I doubt anyone here has, either. If it's frivolous, that's a thing. If it is not, that's another thing. I'm at least willing to entertain the idea that something untoward *might* have happened, before wholesale condemnation of the lawsuit.
 
Advil said:
Guys, the games are stupidly similar. There actually is a bit of an issue here. Not saying PUBG should win, but it has been an elephant in the room recently.

Don't any of you dare take this to mean I'm fanboying PUBG. I don't love or play the game that much. It's just that it almost makes a bit of sense for this to have ended up in court at some point. The decision will probably be exactly what you all expect, "You can't copyright a genre." But in the case of these collapsing map battle royale games there are only so many game elements that can be changed between games. So does this fall under the "there are 1000 different RTS games out there that all play substantially the same so how can you sue?" or is it "these two games are more similar than that." Similar enough to be infringement?
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Yeah, unless they can demonstrate that EPIC stole their code or art assets or something of that nature then there's no way this is going anywhere. Otherwise we wouldn't get multiple games with CTF, Payload, Gun Game, zombie mode, VIP escort, etc. You can find these in dozens of shooter games.

The fact that the game elements that are "unique" to the BR mode were first demonstrated successfully in other popular media just makes this even more laughable. No one in their right might would say these are similar games outside of a few commonalities.
 
jmilcher said:
So I played the original battle Royale mod for Arma. Which dropped you from a plane. And that was years before either of these games...

But since that was made by Player unknown....
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I never played Arma's mod. To be clear, I'm not inferring in any way that I think PUBG Corp is right (they're a bunch of morons). The Arma mod means just one less leg for them to stand on.
 
I really hope there's a clause in the Unreal Engine license agreement that allows Epic to screw them over :D.
 
I'm surprised there hasn't been more of this. I mean, Fortnight is a total ripoff of PUBG.

I'm even surprised anyone wants to play a lame me too copy instead of the original.

It's like the Giana Sisters to Super Mario Bros.
 
Sycraft said:
I really hope there's a clause in the Unreal Engine license agreement that allows Epic to screw them over :D.
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I don't know man, I'm hoping Epic gets their asses handed to them over this.

No one likes a copycat

Ideal (but highly unlikely) outcome to me here is Fortnight gets shut down globally, and Epic owes bluehole millions.
 
Rauelius said:
This is a shame, I really enjoy PUBG, but frivolous lawsuits like this tend to be a sign of "no ideas left" and "one hit wonder" ... I'm not sure PUBG oe BlueHole will be around in a couple years of their only retaliation against Fortnite is a frivolous lawsuit.

Reminds me of when Atari sued Sony to prevent the PlayStation from launching, was a last ditch effort to hold back more competent competition.
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You don't seem to understand what frivolous means.

Epic essentially stole their entire game, but changed a few details.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I'm surprised there hasn't been more of this. I mean, Fortnight is a total ripoff of PUBG.

I'm even surprised anyone wants to play a lame me too copy instead of the original.

It's like the Giana Sisters to Super Mario Bros.
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Zarathustra[H] said:
I don't know man, I'm hoping Epic gets their asses handed to them over this.

No one likes a copycat

Ideal (but highly unlikely) outcome to me here is Fortnight gets shut down globally, and Epic owes bluehole millions.
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Zarathustra[H] said:
You don't seem to understand what frivolous means.

Epic essentially stole their entire game, but changed a few details.
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But they didn't "steal" shit, their game is pretty different from what I can see considering fortnights big catch is building structures for the advantage. Fortnight is much more of a rts/fps combo and to say that epic owes bluehole anything is insane. That would be like saying blizzard owes valve millions for overwatch since overwatch and TF2 are so similar. Bluehole needs to deal with the fact that they pulled a blackberry and failed to innovate/listen to their consumer base and has been surpassed by a competitor. Epic didn't steal any of their assets, but instead improved upon their game mode.
 
From what gameplay I've seen of Fortnite and PUBG, they're two different beasts. Just because Unreal Tournament looked like Quake doesn't mean only one can be around.

I'd really like to see more of a Hunger Games style match.
 
I agree. This whole "genre" borrows ideas from so many classic shooters, survival games, base-builders, team shooters, etc. that nobody can "own" it. All that can really be done in my view is to claim they came up with a particular combination of borrowed mechanics first for publicity, and even that's on shaky ground. They just need to get used to the fact that they're losing, and need to entice more people back. This type of litigation has the potential to create bad precedents that are bad for everyone who makes or plays games. Sonic and Mario co-exist. TF and OW co-exist. Diablo and Dungeon Siege co-existed (though Diablo wiped the floor with DS). There are metric fuck-tons of games that mimic others. That's the way it is. If you want to overshadow the competition, get better, release something better.
 
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if the games are copies of eachother, does everyone like them almost equally? Should feel like a reskin then huh? Except reskins don't count as copies either.
 
ryno9100 said:
I never played Arma's mod. To be clear, I'm not inferring in any way that I think PUBG Corp is right (they're a bunch of morons). The Arma mod means just one less leg for them to stand on.
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It was a mod developed by PlayerUnknown. And it was very popular. I was not surprised we eventually say stand alone games.

Either way this is bad for business. Pubg has gone way down hill.
 
This ends one of 2 ways; Bluehole looses hard the game stagnates the player base dwindles and people move on, or Bluehole wins the entire game community suffers as developers sue everybody who makes a game remotely similar to theirs.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I don't know man, I'm hoping Epic gets their asses handed to them over this.

No one likes a copycat

Ideal (but highly unlikely) outcome to me here is Fortnight gets shut down globally, and Epic owes bluehole millions.
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In that case PUBG is the one you should want shut down. I mean they copied many of their assets from the Unreal store, they copied their engine from Epic, they copied their guns from IRL gun companies, they copied third person shooting from Spacewar, and copied their idea from "The Invisible Man" and their title from the novel "Battle Royale". Oh and they weren't even the first game with a battle royale system.

...

Or maybe, just maybe, accept that all art is derivative. They don't "own" the battle royal idea any more than anyone else own a basic idea. If you want to go the "whoever does it first owns it and everything like it" you will be in a situation where nobody can release anything since everything is derivative. I mean, imagine if the only company that could release 3D shooters was iD software since Wolfenstein was the first one?

I seriously do not bet the PUBG fanboyism where there is this idea that they should be the only ones, ever, allowed to do a game that even remotely resembles it.
 
I read elsewhere that they are mainly suing based on the fact that when Fortnite was first released, Epic made an official comment saying they wanted to create a BR game that people enjoy like PUBG. Bluehole claims that people got confused and took it as an endorsement of Fortnite by pubg since it used Epics game engine—basically it’s a bs lawsuit designed to delay the release of Fortnite in Korea.
 
Joust said:
I haven't read the specific allegations in the pleadings. I doubt anyone here has, either. If it's frivolous, that's a thing. If it is not, that's another thing. I'm at least willing to entertain the idea that something untoward *might* have happened, before wholesale condemnation of the lawsuit.
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What I can tell you is that they feel Epic Games has a conflict of interest at this point (which would be difficult to sue for due to legal requirements - see Crytek vs. CIG) so they're going for copyright infringement in a specific region (South Korea) instead. With regard to that, there's a lot of potential money in that market (not least due to esports) and South Korea's stance on copyright tends to be restrictive rather than competitive (translation: they have a better chance, and it means $$$).
 
I can't take credit for this. Saw someone post it in response to this PUBG deal on another site. However, it sums it up nicely. :D

 
5150Joker said:
basically it’s a bs lawsuit designed to delay the release of Fortnite in Korea.
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In my opinion, you are correct; this is a defensive legal action. South Korea is a good market in which to set a precedent for this, though, and Epic Games in the very least will have to give up some ground, somewhere, to get the game out there.
 
This is a sleazy move, but in all honesty, I've come to despise fortnite.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I don't know man, I'm hoping Epic gets their asses handed to them over this.

No one likes a copycat

Ideal (but highly unlikely) outcome to me here is Fortnight gets shut down globally, and Epic owes bluehole millions.
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I don't see how we can have all these other genres where stuff like Tekken vs Mortal Kombat vs Street Fighter vs dozens of other fighters is okay, but we can't have two vastly different battle royale games at the same time because they both drop you into a map to loot items and be the last alive. How could anyone attempt to set a precedent against this when the entire industry is already full of this stuff and has been for decades?
 
Aix. said:
I don't see how we can have all these other genres where stuff like Tekken vs Mortal Kombat vs Street Fighter vs dozens of other fighters is okay, but we can't have two vastly different battle royale games at the same time because they both drop you into a map to loot items and be the last alive. How could anyone attempt to set a precedent against this when the entire industry is already full of this stuff and has been for decades?
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Yep
 
NeghVar said:
PUBG and Fortnite both use the Unreal engine 4 and Epic Games owns it. Threaten to revoke the license to use the Unreal Engine 4 if they do not drop the case.
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Honestly, if I were EPIC, I would look into pulling their licence now until the trial is over and the dust settles.
 
Advil said:
Guys, the games are stupidly similar. There actually is a bit of an issue here. Not saying PUBG should win, but it has been an elephant in the room recently.

Don't any of you dare take this to mean I'm fanboying PUBG. I don't love or play the game that much. It's just that it almost makes a bit of sense for this to have ended up in court at some point. The decision will probably be exactly what you all expect, "You can't copyright a genre." But in the case of these collapsing map battle royale games there are only so many game elements that can be changed between games. So does this fall under the "there are 1000 different RTS games out there that all play substantially the same so how can you sue?" or is it "these two games are more similar than that." Similar enough to be infringement?
Click to expand...

PUBG and Fortnite are about as similar as Overwatch and Paladins are, and we don't see Blizzard going after Hi-Rez.
 
Now....Playerunknown did create the Arma Battle Royale mod, And he helped h1z1 with their Battle Royale mod. So I can see why they might think they own the IP. But thats the thing do they really own it? I mean TBH I think the case will be thrown out, but at the same time who knows what the courts might think.

The problem is PUBG went downhill....and its the damn developers own fault. It is still horribly optimized, and still has bugs and lag all the damn time. Now sure it doesn't help that Fortnight is free to play, but TBH I think they are being greedy.

Who knows...Maybe they win? I know Blizzard sued Valve for DOTA2 because DOTA was a mode for WC3, but I don't remember how that played out.
 
Rauelius said:
PUBG and Fortnite are about as similar as Overwatch and Paladins are, and we don't see Blizzard going after Hi-Rez.
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Exactly. We also don't see id going after Epic either, or Epic going after CroTeam, or anything else like this.

Litigation like this isn't completely unheard of. I can think of a few cases in the '80s specifically, but we're long past there being anything truly unique from one game to another. Basically, you play nice, you make your game, and if someone else makes a better one like yours, then you need to get back to work I think. Unless someone rips off your artwork, or code wholesale, this is bullshit.
 
The real way that one "wins" when their game is successful? You sell it for someone else to maintain, take your money, and move to a nice tropical island. Enjoy your life. Then you can occasionally release some quirky indie title out of the blue, just to let people know you're still there. :D
 
Brackle said:
Now....Playerunknown did create the Arma Battle Royale mod,
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He did, however that was directly inspired by the Survivor GameZ mod, which Brendan Greene did NOT create. So he copied a mod for DayZ, which itself was a mod for Arma 2. I'm sure the release of The Hunger Games had absolutely nothing to do with his "inspiration" either. And of course, let's not forget every "last man standing" mode for god knows how many FPSs prior to that. In terms of game evolution, this would be like the creators of Team Fortress 2 suing Overwatch.

That's what so insane about this. It's a copycat suing another copycat. The irony aside, the fact that he made hundreds of millions of dollars apparently wasn't enough for him, making him a sore WINNER on top of it. If I was in his shoes I would think one of the following:

"Gee, well they're maintaining their game a lot better than I am, I guess that's why they're so successful."
"Gee, they made a lot of money copying someone else and tweaking it... just like me!"
"Gee, at least I'm still one of the most financially successful indie devs ever making 100s of millions of dollars from being in the right place at the right time and can do absolutely anything I want with my life."

Pick which one suits you, that's why this is a shit show any way you slice it.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
You don't seem to understand what frivolous means.

Epic essentially stole their entire game, but changed a few details.
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Blizzard Entertainment copies, refines, and spins off other people's game idea's all the damn time. The most obvious example is WoW which is very much a easier more simplified Everquest that holds your hand more and tries to constantly reward you more. Plus every damn game made today pretty much rips off Maze War which the bulk of all modern game features that widely used everywhere, but taken for granted today.
 
racing games are just retextures.....

huh, come to think of it, did any lawsuit came about during the heydays of FPS, where there were actual blatant retexture rip-offs ? That would set precedent for this sort of copy-cat allegation lawsuits
 
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