Net Neutrality Rules Officially Repealed and Now the Legal Fight Begins

Listen, don't waste your time being angry. There's nothing that we can do right now. The fix is in. Only after El Trumptardio is out of office, one way or another, will we be able to undo the madness.
 
the only upside I can really think of ...

the comedy gold that is going to be the massive pissing match / war between :: Amazon , Google, Netflix ....etc VS Verizon, Spectrum, AT&T ..etc

it could be quite hilarious...maybe then can all manage to bleed themselves to death fighting each other..
 
Biznatch said:
Corporations only care about money, and will do whatever they can to make more.
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Pissing off your customers by grossly polluting generally doesn't work out well for the whole "making money" thing.

This idea that only the government can enforce goodness and all businesses are patently evil and thus we need someone to save us from them is beyond absurd.

For all you anti-business people: where the f$#k do you think the paychecks that the taxes are collected from that fund the government come from?
 
travisty said:
IMO we, the US, have swung too far toward the business/corporate side and we, the nation as a whole, will be making a correction in the next few election cycles.
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You are high. The last 20 years regulations have been running amok. Dodd-Frank is still an absolute disaster. We didn't need it; there were plenty of laws on the books that simply weren't enforced.

Ah, but that's the rub. Actually enforcing shit takes work. It's much easier to pass laws and declare victory than actually solve real problems.

Whomever dubbed congress "Lawmakers" should be drawn and quartered; if they are dead hopefully they are burning in the deepest portions of hell.

Lawmakers. What a joke. Frankly I'm surprised we are as productive as we are with all the bureaucratic bloat. Want an eye opening peek into how bad it is from a real world perspective?

Read JWT's blog at https://www.dnalounge.com/backstage/log/2016/12/19.html

He's not some republican either - ha!

If you go back and add up the literally hundreds of thousands of dollars of lost revenue just from having to wait around for the wheels of bureaucracy to turn, let alone the outrageous fees for permits, licenses, etc. and expenses in lawyers and professional "expediters" needed to navigate the bureaucracy he wouldn't be in near the financial pickle he now is in. And he's right - no regulations or not having government at all isn't the answer; I do agree there needs to be some regulation. But it's out of control right now and it's sucking up a ridiculous amount of resources. Over the last week I got swept up in reading his back catalog of posts (because he has a great writing style and an eclectic mix of artists that perform in his venue) and the amount of bureaucracy he's had to put up with over the last 20 years is simply breathtaking when you look at it in totality.

We don't need more laws tossed around willy-nilly. We need targeted laws where they really are needed and all the other cruft to be purged out. But that would make too much sense. There's too many trolls and leaches that benefit from the current morass so I'm not holding my breath for substantive changes. I keep waiting for people to finally get pissed off enough and demand enough is enough. Perhaps the fact that someone like Trump got elected to president means there is finally enough of a groundswell that maybe things might trickle down locally too. Time will tell - there might be hope before we utterly collapse on ourselves.
 
thejokker said:
Old news... More and more American's are realizing that progressive Marxism almost destroyed our Republic. Returning to American Capitalism is reviving our stagnant economy. The fat lady is singing her song for the progressive movement; it's over...
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I know some people don't wanna hear what I've said, but the truth is companies have paid to have Net Neutrality removed, while the majority of Americans didn't. Money is now greater than the people. This is something Yanis Varoufakis has warned us about.

The only saving grace is the states has also passed similar laws like Net Neutrality. I live in NJ so I'm so far unaffected by this. Though the other problem is that states have made competition against ISP's illegal, which is the other problem we're facing. Again, something the majority of people don't want but corporation's do. I mean why would they ever invest in a infrastructure if they couldn't profit with a monopoly? And when I say they invest, I mean we subsidize it.
 
Wyodiver said:
Listen, don't waste your time being angry. There's nothing that we can do right now. The fix is in. Only after El Trumptardio is out of office, one way or another, will we be able to undo the madness.
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That's what we said about Premier Obamski too. And here we are.
 
Master_shake_ said:
states making their own laws is going to be a huge mess for everyone involved.

50 states potentially 50 different sets of rules, that will be a dream to code.
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This is the problem with states rights allowing everyone to make their own laws. All the different laws cost the economy billions a year. Meanwhile, in the EU, the opposite is true. Although, most EU nations have functioning democracies that represent the will of their people, and whats best for their citizens. If they don't do that, the other parties can swoop in thanks to their Parliamentary system and overthrow even the most entrenched group.

And before some ******* says it, America IS a democracy. We're a constitutional republic that elects its representatives and president democratically. Thus, Democracy.
 
Chunder said:
.

And before some ******* says it, America IS a democracy. We're a constitutional republic that elects its representatives and president democratically. Thus, Democracy.
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Wrong. We are a Republic. Sing the pledge of Allegiance.
 
Master_shake_ said:
states making their own laws is going to be a huge mess for everyone involved.

50 states potentially 50 different sets of rules, that will be a dream to code.
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I agree except I read a few weeks ago that someone(guess who) is lobbying to pass a federal law from preventing any state laws to supersede any part of this decision.
 
Seventyfive said:
OsgVOUG.jpg
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I don't remember which comedy(probably Spies Like Us), but I remember some scene with a Russian to the effect "America, Capitalism, WE LOVE IT!"

Seriously though, I've been telling people for a while now they should look up the difference between the two and truly tell me what they honestly believe we have. For me, I know it doesn't begin with the letter "d".
 
lostin3d said:
Seriously though, I've been telling people for a while now they should look up the difference between the two and truly tell me what they honestly believe we have. For me, I know it doesn't begin with the letter "d".
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Right now, we have a bunch of corrupt old men that sitting on their wrinkly asses doing nothing but passing gas a bickering. Basically our government has turned into a Bingo Hall.
 
DocNo said:
You are high. The last 20 years regulations have been running amok. Dodd-Frank is still an absolute disaster. We didn't need it; there were plenty of laws on the books that simply weren't enforced.

Ah, but that's the rub. Actually enforcing shit takes work. It's much easier to pass laws and declare victory than actually solve real problems.

Whomever dubbed congress "Lawmakers" should be drawn and quartered; if they are dead hopefully they are burning in the deepest portions of hell.

Lawmakers. What a joke. Frankly I'm surprised we are as productive as we are with all the bureaucratic bloat. Want an eye opening peek into how bad it is from a real world perspective?

Read JWT's blog at https://www.dnalounge.com/backstage/log/2016/12/19.html

He's not some republican either - ha!

If you go back and add up the literally hundreds of thousands of dollars of lost revenue just from having to wait around for the wheels of bureaucracy to turn, let alone the outrageous fees for permits, licenses, etc. and expenses in lawyers and professional "expediters" needed to navigate the bureaucracy he wouldn't be in near the financial pickle he now is in. And he's right - no regulations or not having government at all isn't the answer; I do agree there needs to be some regulation. But it's out of control right now and it's sucking up a ridiculous amount of resources. Over the last week I got swept up in reading his back catalog of posts (because he has a great writing style and an eclectic mix of artists that perform in his venue) and the amount of bureaucracy he's had to put up with over the last 20 years is simply breathtaking when you look at it in totality.

We don't need more laws tossed around willy-nilly. We need targeted laws where they really are needed and all the other cruft to be purged out. But that would make too much sense. There's too many trolls and leaches that benefit from the current morass so I'm not holding my breath for substantive changes. I keep waiting for people to finally get pissed off enough and demand enough is enough. Perhaps the fact that someone like Trump got elected to president means there is finally enough of a groundswell that maybe things might trickle down locally too. Time will tell - there might be hope before we utterly collapse on ourselves.
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Actually, one of the biggest things affecting DNA Lounge is the near monopoly control of live music venues and booking as embodied in Live Nation, AEP, and APE. They basically control the large venues, bookings, festivals, and ticketing allowing them outsized influence across the nation. JW*Z* even has a recent post about it. That's caused completely by a lack of regulation and enforcement in anti-trust.

Much of the original regulation hurdles that JWZ experienced are because the venue he took over was largely grandfathered for decades and that ended with change of ownership.
 
Krenum said:
That's what we said about Premier Obamski too. And here we are.
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Listen, I don't know you. I don't know anything about you. I'm trying to not be judgemental here.

I'm asking you a serious question: How can you say that Obama was a worse president than Trump?

Again, I'm only asking because I'm honestly curious about how you think. Maybe you might be curious as to how I think.

No matter what, I'm not looking to start a fight.


Wyo
 
Wyodiver said:
Listen, I don't know you. I don't know anything about you. I'm trying to not be judgemental here.

I'm asking you a serious question: How can you say that Obama was a worse president than Trump?
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That has yet to be seen really, you can't judge a 2 term presidents job with the current president that has been in office for a little over a year.

Obama had a policy of leading from behind. Much like the Carter years. He made America look weak on the global stage. Trump, is the chaos president. I don't support many of his policies, there are some that make sense, and some that don't. At least he is saying what needs to be said to other world leaders. That we are not going to be pushed around. Which we shouldn't, nor should any other nation. When Obama was elected, I expressed that I hoped he would do a good job, same for Trump, same for any of our elected officials.

Honestly, I voted for Ben Carson but I don't think he would have been a strong world leader.
 
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DocNo said:
[rant]
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Not high, no. I am ever the optimist though.

TBH i hate the slowness of government but at the same time I know bureaucracies, at their heart, are designed to be slow and deliberative. To a point, the fact nothing major has gotten done, besides giving the rich more money, after the conman Trump was elected is a testament to the design - slow and deliberative. Same if Bernie gets elected, nothing major will happen on the socialist side either.

Whether this will need to change as we go into an exponential-technology world will need to be discussed. As it is now, nothing will get done for the next 3 years.
 
thejokker said:
Obama's economic policies gave us economic stagnation largely because he held an anti-business bias. Reversing all his economic policies will result in growth and prosperity. Net Neutrality is an Obama economic policy and needed to be reversed. Sorry but the "all corporations are evil" argument is not going to fly...
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Well, he bailed the banks out to the tunes of trillions, deregulated the EPA to open up fracking, pushed hard for the TPP, and didn't prosecute anyone for the 2008 crash. If that's anti-business, I'm not sure what pro-business looks like. I'm with you in that for reversing all of that though.
 
DocNo said:
You are high. The last 20 years regulations have been running amok. Dodd-Frank is still an absolute disaster. We didn't need it; there were plenty of laws on the books that simply weren't enforced.

Ah, but that's the rub. Actually enforcing shit takes work. It's much easier to pass laws and declare victory than actually solve real problems.

Whomever dubbed congress "Lawmakers" should be drawn and quartered; if they are dead hopefully they are burning in the deepest portions of hell.

Lawmakers. What a joke. Frankly I'm surprised we are as productive as we are with all the bureaucratic bloat. Want an eye opening peek into how bad it is from a real world perspective?

Read JWT's blog at https://www.dnalounge.com/backstage/log/2016/12/19.html

He's not some republican either - ha!

If you go back and add up the literally hundreds of thousands of dollars of lost revenue just from having to wait around for the wheels of bureaucracy to turn, let alone the outrageous fees for permits, licenses, etc. and expenses in lawyers and professional "expediters" needed to navigate the bureaucracy he wouldn't be in near the financial pickle he now is in. And he's right - no regulations or not having government at all isn't the answer; I do agree there needs to be some regulation. But it's out of control right now and it's sucking up a ridiculous amount of resources. Over the last week I got swept up in reading his back catalog of posts (because he has a great writing style and an eclectic mix of artists that perform in his venue) and the amount of bureaucracy he's had to put up with over the last 20 years is simply breathtaking when you look at it in totality.

We don't need more laws tossed around willy-nilly. We need targeted laws where they really are needed and all the other cruft to be purged out. But that would make too much sense. There's too many trolls and leaches that benefit from the current morass so I'm not holding my breath for substantive changes. I keep waiting for people to finally get pissed off enough and demand enough is enough. Perhaps the fact that someone like Trump got elected to president means there is finally enough of a groundswell that maybe things might trickle down locally too. Time will tell - there might be hope before we utterly collapse on ourselves.
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You got some truth mixed with bullshit there, but whatever... The one key thing you are missing, is the fact that many times, these onerous complicated regulations are desired and in fact often initiated by established big players.. its all about fucking with barriers of entry. If you see a regulation pass with ease, look for the big player benefit angle, and you will find it. You can see this more clear in pharma and sometimes agriculture. Also note that de- regulations that translates into lower pay for workers usually pass with ease too. So often big players make sure regulations are hard to get in, with all those forms and costly lawyers needed to do them ( or complex studies ) but also fuck workers, by lowering job requirements shit like that.
 
tetris42 said:
Well, he bailed the banks out to the tunes of trillions, deregulated the EPA to open up fracking, pushed hard for the TPP, and didn't prosecute anyone for the 2008 crash. If that's anti-business, I'm not sure what pro-business looks like. I'm with you in that for reversing all of that though.
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Yeah, I don't know wtf some are smoking, ( usually right wing pro trump) democrats are pro business all the way, at most they toss a bone here and there to the common folk... I will take my bones.
 
20 years ago Obama would have been a moderate Republican and would of fit right in with the 1994 Congress pro-business Republican model while being socially liberal.
 
tetris42 said:
Well, he bailed the banks out to the tunes of trillions, deregulated the EPA to open up fracking, pushed hard for the TPP, and didn't prosecute anyone for the 2008 crash. If that's anti-business, I'm not sure what pro-business looks like. I'm with you in that for reversing all of that though.
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Massive over-regulation of business (especially from the EPA)... We can see reversing those regulations pushed GDP over 3.0 for most of last year and cutting the corporate tax rate will push it even higher. TPP was pro-foreign business but anti-American business.

If you go back and look you will see that in July 2008 there was a simultaneous crash in the price of oil and the value of the Euro. A Euro bubble created the oil bubble and the bursting of those massive bubbles evaporated a lot of capital resulting in the banking crisis. It's hard to prosecute European bureaucrats. If you don't believe me check the price of oil and the value of the Euro on the first of July 2008 and the prices on October 1, 2008. Trillions and Trillions of dollars disappeared in a matter of months.
 
DukenukemX said:
I know some people don't wanna hear what I've said, but the truth is companies have paid to have Net Neutrality removed, while the majority of Americans didn't. Money is now greater than the people. This is something Yanis Varoufakis has warned us about.

The only saving grace is the states has also passed similar laws like Net Neutrality. I live in NJ so I'm so far unaffected by this. Though the other problem is that states have made competition against ISP's illegal, which is the other problem we're facing. Again, something the majority of people don't want but corporation's do. I mean why would they ever invest in a infrastructure if they couldn't profit with a monopoly? And when I say they invest, I mean we subsidize it.
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My dad was in the military so I've lived all over the country and the world. When I was in the Navy I lived in NJ, a beautiful state with wonderful people. I liked it so much I stayed for a couple years after leaving the service. As much as I loved the people of NJ the state was the closest thing to a police state of all the places I've lived. I have far more trust in privately owned companies and corporations than corrupt politicians who want to rule the people like they are feudal lords.

If we get the federal government out of the picture there will be some states who will screw their people and other states who will not but people will still have the freedom to move to another state. Under Federal Net Neutrality everyone will get screwed...
 
The Cobra said:
20 years ago Obama would have been a moderate Republican and would of fit right in with the 1994 Congress pro-business Republican model while being socially liberal.
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There's a difference to not being anti-business which is what was meant 20 years ago by being "pro-business" and the "pro-business" corporatism and cronyism we see today. They all subscribe to the latter because as an impatient authoritarian you can use loopholes in the Constitution to get business to do what is difficult for the government to do today. If the price of that is protecting monopolies and forcing consumers to your corporation's product, I don't think that is pro-business except as a means to an ends.
 
Biznatch said:
So you want to be like china, where they have so much pollution they can barely breathe or even see the fucking sun? Corporations only care about money, and will do whatever they can to make more. They don't give a shit about what it does to the environment, local wildlife, or even the fucking people, as long as they make more money. Without regulations limiting how bad they can fuck us and the environment, we're going to end up competing with China/India on being the most polluted shit hole on earth.....

And it's not like these corporations are suffering from these regulations, they are still making insane proffits, they just don't want to cut into their bottom line doing shit like properly disposing of toxic waste (that's what streams are for right?), cleaning up spills, not dumping pollution into the air.....

But if you truly think all those 'obama regulations' are hurting these poor giant corporations so much they can't even operate..... Well enjoy regurgitating F(au)X news corporate talking points with the rest of the mindless tards. And before you jump right to 'but... but... teh fake news CNN and MSNBC is teh fakest", I don't watch any of that garbage either
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Corporations don't give a crap about you. Neither does the government. Probably best to have some sort of balance since both will try and screw you in their own way.
 
TheCommander said:
Corporations don't give a crap about you. Neither does the government. Probably best to have some sort of balance since both will try and screw you in their own way.
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Well only 1 of those 2 entities is SUPPOSED to be looking out for us, but instead the gov is working for the corporations, and the corporations are working for themselves to make more money..... We can't vote corporations out of the office, but we can with politicians, and that is what it's going to take to unfuck our current situation.
 
Biznatch said:
Well only 1 of those 2 entities is SUPPOSED to be looking out for us, but instead the gov is working for the corporations, and the corporations are working for themselves to make more money..... We can't vote corporations out of the office, but we can with politicians, and that is what it's going to take to unfuck our current situation.
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Ya I agree but I don't see it changing anytime soon; there is way too much money involved.

My point was that in terms of regulations, there should be some sort of a balance.
 
TheCommander said:
Ya I agree but I don't see it changing anytime soon; there is way too much money involved.

My point was that in terms of regulations, there should be some sort of a balance.
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Agreed, but we have swung WAY too far to the right in terms of balance. The past year has been 100% pro mega corporations and fuck consumers. The FCC is only a single example of that.

I'm hoping more states start passing legislation killing the ISP lobbied monopolies and get either city run fiber or other competition in the market. This would fix the problems we are having REAL quick.
 
from beeing a place of freedom and all. technology/internet/pc/phones are just slowely beeing turned against ppl. i think internet and pc was better before it was becoming mainstream and popular with everyone lol.
 
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