Vega Rumors

I have no interest in Prey or Wolfenstein II but then again I'm also not in the market for either Vega as I bought my 1070 13 months ago. :whistle:

In an alternate reality in which I did not purchase a video card last July, I would have been interested in Vega 56 now, but I sure as hell wouldn't be interested in paying 100 USD for games that I have no interest in playing. I don't mind game bundles per se, but most of the game bundles I see are after a card has been out for a while and all of a sudden a game code is attached to a normally-priced card. That's not the case here, it appears.
 
why in holy hell are you guys stuck on the games? Let me tell you how mine panned out and then maybe you can shut the hell up about it.

I bought the WC Vega64 pack. It had the card @699.99, 2 games @129.99 and a 21:9 Samsung 34" ultra-wide monitor @949.99 (actually a little less there was a sale that took of $13 or so). At checkout the games price stayed however that price was DEDUCTED from the GPU, and the monitor was $200 less.

SO I FN GOT THE GAMES FOR FREE. Now we can argue semantics, ie: The card being $100 more, but it doesn't change the rationale behind the intent. It was setup to ensure that I as a gamer would have access to purchasing the card. LO AND BEHOLD... MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. So you just want the card... Tough cookies, fight the miners for them. AMD wasn't guaranteeing individual card prices, only the packs. The packs aren't only incentives to consumers like me but outlets like newegg which now have guaranteed larger tickets sales as well as Samsung selling a higher profit monitor (I am sure). Bethesda I am sure appreciates the sales too.

I would wager the packs do in fact cost more, the gpu price I mean, as they have requirements for selling. This IS QUITE TYPICAL in retail. I would also wager AMD is limiting sales accordingly to ensure pack in-stock availability. Again this is typical and not some conspiracy as some of you tinfoil hat wearing basement dwelling.... Sorry just watching ignorant banter for days on end has set my tolerance a bit low.
 
JustReason said:
why in holy hell are you guys stuck on the games? Let me tell you how mine panned out and then maybe you can shut the hell up about it.

I bought the WC Vega64 pack. It had the card @699.99, 2 games @129.99 and a 21:9 Samsung 34" ultra-wide monitor @949.99 (actually a little less there was a sale that took of $13 or so). At checkout the games price stayed however that price was DEDUCTED from the GPU, and the monitor was $200 less.

SO I FN GOT THE GAMES FOR FREE. Now we can argue semantics, ie: The card being $100 more, but it doesn't change the rationale behind the intent. It was setup to ensure that I as a gamer would have access to purchasing the card. LO AND BEHOLD... MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. So you just want the card... Tough cookies, fight the miners for them. AMD wasn't guaranteeing individual card prices, only the packs. The packs aren't only incentives to consumers like me but outlets like newegg which now have guaranteed larger tickets sales as well as Samsung selling a higher profit monitor (I am sure). Bethesda I am sure appreciates the sales too.

I would wager the packs do in fact cost more, the gpu price I mean, as they have requirements for selling. This IS QUITE TYPICAL in retail. I would also wager AMD is limiting sales accordingly to ensure pack in-stock availability. Again this is typical and not some conspiracy as some of you tinfoil hat wearing basement dwelling.... Sorry just watching ignorant banter for days on end has set my tolerance a bit low.
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Problem is which mission was accomplished, cause miners aren't that interested in this card, none of the people that I have been talking to that have over 10 rigs each and some many more than 10 rigs, have no interest in Vega.

$100 bucks increase for the packs won't deter a person looking at the bottom line, 100 bucks bottom line is 1.5 months in mining, currently even with Eth, @ 35mhs @ 250 watts 2.37 bucks a day inclusive of power. That is 71.10 a month, to cover the cost of the card will take just over 7 months. Currently Eth is estimated to go to POS in Feb. so since Launch day till then is 7 months, No profits man. This doesn't interest miners for that reason. Now if it could mine other alt coins decently then ok it will be interesting to miners, but there are no OpenCL miners that can match the CUDA miners right now in those other alt coins. Zcash would be AMD card holders next best coin to mine but a 580 mines at the same rate as a 1060 while using 30% more power, it uses more power than a 1070 while the 1070 gets 30% more hashrates.

AMD would have know all this, I know it cause I plugged in all the values in a calculator (I didn't do the extrapolation of the difficult levels but that would skew that 7 months over to around 10 months). Also I'm assuming while undervolting the card will only consume 250 watts, that is a pretty big assumption it might be closer to 300 watts. That too will have a negative affect on profits adding to around 11 months, both of those together at worst case will end up 1.5 years. If 6 months is the cut off time to have return on investment and 6 month of profitability, then we are way passed that point, miners will make a loss without the potential of speculation on price.

If you consider this ignorant, there is a reason why AMD bundled their products, to make them look like they are giving a bargain, while they themselves are not. All the assumptions I have made are negative to what can possible be there, and removed them, even with that its not a profitable mining card! Anyone that does mining seriously will know this, hence you had a couple pre order idiots that posted they got fooled by the "leak" hashrate, ya know they returned their cards.

There is no reason for the packs to make these cards unattractive for miners. They are unattractive as is.

Its all BS, man, we saw it with the r290, if miners are buying up all the cards AMD can produce, in normal circumstances, AMD's markeshare will grow. If they have a certain amount of marketshare last quarter and the quarter from the year prior, they will use those numbers and try to figure out how many cards to make and with inventory to cover any changes, if demand increases, right? Well that means marketshare can only go up for AMD if miners were buying all those r290's. That didn't' happen then. And most likely it sure won't happen now. They have already used that excuse in the past. And that was for a card that was good for mining. With the above showing Vega is no where near that attractive. Really they are going to blame miners again?

Its them either having a supply issue or creating the supply issue for any of two reasons. One it sell the card at a higher rate by the addition of packs or the second, they want to make sure its a limited product because of the cost of the product to begin with.
 
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Magic Hate Ball said:
They have a supply/production issue.

End of story.

Jesus Christ people, it's not a Bilderberg group level conspiracy.
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That is not my understanding. I think AIB packaging has been the "issue" currently. That said, AMD knows how long it takes for cards to get through that process, so not exactly like inventories got to AIBs quick enough to satiate demand on launch day. We should know for sure in another 7 days or less.
 
If AMD wanted gamers to get a chance to buy these cards at 599, they should've included codes to like 5 or 6 games. Not fucking two games.
 
Reality said:
If AMD wanted gamers to get a chance to buy these cards at 599, they should've included codes to like 5 or 6 games. Not fucking two games.
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... that doesn't change the potential bang for buck on miners... unless you're suggesting they sell the cards for $749-799 "SEP" with 5-6 games?
 
So, do we subtract retail value for games included with comparable Nvidia cards and reassess price/performance?

Anyone want to claim that using game values somehow makes Vega more attractive after that?

;)
 
Araxie said:
so you genuinely think that 100$ can discourage an avid miner?. an avid miner that simply doesn't like VEGA because it doesn't worth performance wise and power hungry wise?. miners already pay 400$+ for GTX 580, why could anyone think 100$ can discourage them to buy a GPU? what discourage miners are not the 100$ tax, is the fact that it simply doesn't worth as a mining card. that place belong to RX 580s and GTX 1070s.
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Whether or not this has had any impact is anyone's' guess.
 
_mockingbird said:
Good for you, but it so happens that other people who want Radeon RX Vega 64 for $499 can't get them $499.

$499 wasn't even a good price for Radeon RX Vega 64 to begin with.

Is NVIDIA charging $100 for Destiny 2?
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When Nvidia launched the 1080 and they were selling for $799 i dont remember all this hate. Why are we busting AMD's balls, if they are sold out kudos to them. I am someone that wants Vega pretty bad, but i settled for 1080s. I also happen to think the bundles were a fantastic idea. My friends that wanted to upgrade need motherboard, processors, ram, video cards -- as they are still on I7-920s.

I am a miner first, gamer second -- when i ordered video cards, i want the highest hash rate for the lowest dollars in stock. Right now that seems to be the 1080, so i purchased 4 of them. Miners want ROI. RX580 4gb for $349 seems like a bad deal to me compared to a $500 1080 or Vega if you can find them.

* affordable up front
* good hash rate
* good power efficiency
* good resale value

Games, motherboards, processors, etc would get in the way of this especially for those of us that may want to buy dozen at a time. its a lot of work reselling them parts
 
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buttons said:
When Nvidia launched the 1080 and they were selling for $799 i dont remember all this hate. Why are we busting AMD's balls, if they are sold out kudos to them. I am someone that wants Vega pretty bad, but i settled for 1080s. I also happen to think the bundles were a fantastic idea. My friends that wanted to upgrade need motherboard, processors, ram, video cards -- as they are still on I7-920s.

I am a miner first, gamer second -- when i ordered video cards, i want the highest hash rate for the lowest dollars in stock. Right now that seems to be the 1080, so i purchased 4 of them.
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Actually, I remember that it was selling for $699, not $799
 
buttons said:
When Nvidia launched the 1080 and they were selling for $799 i dont remember all this hate. Why are we busting AMD's balls, if they are sold out kudos to them. I am someone that wants Vega pretty bad, but i settled for 1080s. I also happen to think the bundles were a fantastic idea. My friends that wanted to upgrade need motherboard, processors, ram, video cards -- as they are still on I7-920s.

I am a miner first, gamer second -- when i ordered video cards, i want the highest hash rate for the lowest dollars in stock. Right now that seems to be the 1080, so i purchased 4 of them. Miners want ROI. RX580 4gb for $349 seems like a bad deal to me compared to a $500 1080 or Vega if you can find them.

* affordable up front
* good hash rate
* good power efficiency
* good resale value

Games, motherboards, processors, etc would get in the way of this especially for those of us that may want to buy dozen at a time. its a lot of work reselling them parts
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Ugh, I remember more hate... so much nVidia said they won't do the FE charge again.
 
_mockingbird said:
Actually, I remember that it was selling for $699, not $799
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PCPartsPicker cost graph disagrees, that line spikes about 1/4 of the way betwen $760 and $950, which is around $800...

trend.gpu.chipset.geforce-gtx-1080.30e8591feefe3b5845a753afd1cc750f.png
 
buttons said:
When Nvidia launched the 1080 and they were selling for $799 i dont remember all this hate. Why are we busting AMD's balls, if they are sold out kudos to them. I am someone that wants Vega pretty bad, but i settled for 1080s. I also happen to think the bundles were a fantastic idea. My friends that wanted to upgrade need motherboard, processors, ram, video cards -- as they are still on I7-920s.

I am a miner first, gamer second -- when i ordered video cards, i want the highest hash rate for the lowest dollars in stock. Right now that seems to be the 1080, so i purchased 4 of them. Miners want ROI. RX580 4gb for $349 seems like a bad deal to me compared to a $500 1080 or Vega if you can find them.

* affordable up front
* good hash rate
* good power efficiency
* good resale value

Games, motherboards, processors, etc would get in the way of this especially for those of us that may want to buy dozen at a time. its a lot of work reselling them parts
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There was hate the entire FE hate. Even at launch the FE was pretty much a stupid thing, It was selling from 699 for a hunk of aluminum, first it sounded like they were going to have a better cooler, which would have maybe made it worth it, but after wards nV stated its the same cooler just with an aluminum shroud, total waste of money. Its nice they renamed the reference design, but still a rename isn't worth 100 bucks. And neither is a piece of aluminum. Granted there was a spike early on, but nothing like 100 bucks. And there was more hate on the FE once AIB cards came out too, cause the AIB card pricing was higher then the FE which nV made it sound like they were going to be less that the FE! Everyone was price gauging at launch. But it didn't last long, maybe a month or so. Pretty much once the AIB cards came out, prices went down pretty fast. But everyone took their early adopter cash.
 
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buttons said:
Honestly i picked a random ridiculous number but it seems pcpartpicker shows 1080 founders selling for $799 at times.

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/gRvZxr/msi-video-card-geforcegtx1080foundersedition

more proof:

https://www.extremetech.com/gaming/...are-in-short-supply-experiencing-price-spikes
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That data is not accurate.

It's showing GeForce GTX 1080 FE selling for $799.89 in October 2015, but GeForce GTX 1080 FE hasn't even been announced yet, let alone, put for sale.
 
guys the FE price caused the price hike with the launch of the 1070 and 1080, there were numerous posts about this :) It was totally screwed up as AIB cheapo cooler cards came out at FE prices. Everyone took advantage of that. And FE prices went up a little too, then AIB custom coolers were even more expensive, but that didn't last long at all. It actually had very little to do with supply cause they were easy to get.
 
_mockingbird said:
#FAIL again

iE8ZUJH.png
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Look at the graph.

LOOK AT THE LEGEND.

Looking at a per product listing is going to be horribly inaccurate, as the SuperBiiz listing for "$650" is still on the graph up to the present, LOOK AT THE GRAPH. But it's "Out of Stock", which means you can't buy it.

Per vendor pricing is not accurate as it'll list out of stock items at whatever price they have listed.

Look at the averages and just suck it up that you're wrong on this.

Next you'll tell me the 290X was available at $549 if B&H Photo left an out of order sign up for the year it was in demand from miners and was actually going for $900?
 
Magic Hate Ball said:
Look at the graph.

LOOK AT THE LEGEND.

Looking at a per product listing is going to be horribly inaccurate, as the SuperBiiz listing for "$650" is still on the graph up to the present, LOOK AT THE GRAPH. But it's "Out of Stock", which means you can't buy it.

Per vendor pricing is not accurate as it'll list out of stock items at whatever price they have listed.

Look at the averages and just suck it up that you're wrong on this.

Next you'll tell me the 290X was available at $549 if B&H Photo left an out of order sign up for the year it was in demand from miners and was actually going for $900?
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You think the one you posted is super accurate?

eye roll
 
_mockingbird said:
You think the one you posted is super accurate?

eye roll
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it's the average, Buttons posted a contemporaneous article talking about the significant price spikes on the GTX 1070 and 1080.

If you still can't see, then you're just admitting to be a troll at this point.

We're not even two weeks into just the Vega 64, let alone the Vega 56! Yeah it'll take a bit for prices to stabilize, yeah AMD can't afford to pump as much silicon as Nvidia, no shit Sherlock.

But don't pretend Nvidia didn't ever have pricing issues.
 
Magic Hate Ball said:
it's the average, Buttons posted a contemporaneous article talking about the significant price spikes on the GTX 1070 and 1080.

If you still can't see, then you're just admitting to be a troll at this point.

We're not even two weeks into just the Vega 64, let alone the Vega 56! Yeah it'll take a bit for prices to stabilize, yeah AMD can't afford to pump as much silicon as Nvidia, no shit Sherlock.

But don't pretend Nvidia didn't ever have pricing issues.
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You can't have it both ways.

You can't use pcpartpicker and pretend that it's accurate when it supports your argument then suddenly say that pcpartpicker is inaccurate when it counters your argument.

The ones selling for $950+ could really be placeholders for all I know.
 
_mockingbird said:
You can't have it both ways.

You can't use pcpartpicker and pretend that it's accurate when it supports your argument then suddenly said that pcpartpicker is inaccurate when it counters your argument.

The ones selling for $950 could really be a placeholder for all I know.
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Statistics mate, how does it work?

If only we had someone's account recorded in digital format regarding the pricing situation from the time.... oh look at that another person used the written word? (The "Why Wait" section of the article if you're impatient)

Golly, imagine that.
 
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Does anyone know if the FE cards sold on nVidia's site were ever priced above MSRP?
 
Algrim said:
Does anyone know if the FE cards sold on nVidia's site were ever priced above MSRP?
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No they never where. NVIDIA has no reason to price scalp there own cards. However they did suffer from the same market availability as did all GTX 1080 and 1070 the first two months.
 
reaper12 said:
I admire your patience but you are wasting your time. It doesn't matter what AMD do or say, the usual suspects will complain about it, they will just whine and moan about it as they have whined and moaned in nearly every AMD thread on this forum.
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And the usual suspects will suck AMD dick and won't care when AMD pulls out and shoots off in their eyes.

For the record I don't understand why anyone worships a fucking company that wants to get as much money out of you as they can.
 
DooKey said:
And the usual suspects will suck AMD dick and won't care when AMD pulls out and shoots off in their eyes.

For the record I don't understand why anyone worships a fucking company that wants to get as much money out of you as they can.
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I am the official officiant of the church of latter day RC Cola drinkers and I take personal offense at the idea that you think it's crazy to worship a company that sells such sweet divine nectar. Is there profit to be made? Sure, but it is simply profit for the shareholders who grant divine guidance to secure more followers.
 
Statistics are like a bikini. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.

Can we get off the topic of pricing of the FE, we know it was all f'ed up because of that.
 
Magic Hate Ball said:
... that doesn't change the potential bang for buck on miners... unless you're suggesting they sell the cards for $749-799 "SEP" with 5-6 games?
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No. Sell it for 599, and give gamers 5-6 codes. Which gives actual value to the 100 dollar price increase.
 
I don't see what the big deal is. If you are really motivated, you could find a Vega. I woke up at 5:45 AM (against my better judgement) on launch day and got 2 @ $599.

Stock has been been coming in every day, even at $499 which someone here got. If you are on it, you can find the card without paying the scalpers.
 
cybereality said:
I don't see what the big deal is. If you are really motivated, you could find a Vega. I woke up at 5:45 AM (against my better judgement) on launch day and got 2 @ $599.

Stock has been been coming in every day, even at $499 which someone here got. If you are on it, you can find the card without paying the scalpers.
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There hasn’t been any at 499.99 after launch date. Not even at 599.99 actually.
 
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