Vega Rumors

Presbytier said:
Seems to suffer real badly in DX11
90083.png
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or, ya know ..4k.
 
Araxie said:
The dual vega card its made by asus not directly by AMD so I would left any fancy tech, so PLX controller, it will probably be just two highly binned moderately clocked GPUs in a single PCB with AIO cooling.
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Agreed - that dual vega card yes, but 10x2 has been on AMD roadmap for ages and they will not be advertising an ASUS card with that. Be the pro duo in Vega form I presume, but will be rather interested if it's not.


Anarchist4000 said:
Vega20 is a dedicated compute thing. I'm talking 480 to 580 refresh. That was same memory with faster core, but Vega could be a different combination. AMD had a dual GPU on slides, but may be more of a density play for compute. No reason it wouldn't work for gaming to move volume though.
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Won't that be vega 11 or similar?

Sorry I really don't pay so much attention to the mid range stuff.

razor1 said:
still have the latency issue to get around ;) GPU's that latency will kill any type of capabilities to have transparency in multiple dies.

How are they going to get around this, they just need more bandwidth and cache per die. To do that in a consumer GPU product the same cost/benefit ratio has be realized. Until that point, it will never happen.

Just using an MCM is costly enough to remove it from a consumer line up. This is why nV has not gone with HBM or 2, the memory is expensive, the interposer is expensive and the cost of manufacturing and setting up that pipeline is expensive. That expense must be reflected either on margins or the cost of the product. Its not too bad on the CPU side, cause the interconnects don't need to be anywhere near as much throughput as a GPU needs are and the memory is still off the MCM in regular old DIMMs.
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Vega already has 500gb/sec IF capabilities, its what they're using for SSG. That's as fast as the god damn ram interface........ latency wise, perhaps a little slower with die-die distance. I do not see how that isn't possible to accomplish at all, or insufficient bandwidth to do so.

You are right, it would have to be above-titan tier cost card though (like the 295X2) and they'd better be able to deliver. Considering the results of Vega, maybe not going to see them bother with this till Navi. Too bad, a pair of Vega nanos with 500Gb/sec would've been very interesting to see running.
They could then scale the tech down and use the Ryzen strategy to fight Nvidia as they have with Intel.
 
cageymaru said:
If you look at the entire Anandtech review it certainly had its WTF moments like the graph you chose but it was close in others. I'm not digging the AA on performance.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/11717/the-amd-radeon-rx-vega-64-and-56-review/15
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Id definately performs well in DX12 and Vulkan games. It seems though to suffer in DX11 games sometimes not too badly other times huge performance discrepancies. AMD has optimized really well for DX12 and Vulkan. I think it is misguided to ignore the more widely used API, but I can understand their logic. Also why is no one using the Witcher 3 to benchmark. it is still one of the most demanding games out there.
 
Presbytier said:
Ghost RTecon Wildlands shows the same performance discrepancies.
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didn't expect Vega to do well in Wildlands, at least not at launch.

Wildlands is, IMO, the most beautiful game on any platform currently. maxed out its just unbelievable.
 
For me, these days HardOCP has the best structure of games to test, and this also shows in the Vega test when compared to a lot of sites IMO.

Most other sites are using games that are not truly indicative of games going forward, especially when a lot of sites focus heavily on the very 1st gen of DX11/DX12 fudged games, back then only credible DX12 'game' was AoTS.
Cheers
 
CSI_PC said:
For me, these days HardOCP has the best structure of games to test, and this also shows in the Vega test when compared to a lot of sites IMO.

Most other sites are using games that are not truly indicative of games going forward, especially when a lot of sites focus heavily on the very 1st gen of DX11/DX12 fudged games, back then only credible DX12 'game' was AoTS.
Cheers
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Well HardOCP also used lots of DX11 games. Most games are still DX11 even the majority of newer games coming out. DX12 and Vulkan are still probably a year or more away from being the primary API used.
 
So how is the mining performance? Someone said same as FE which is meh?
 
Presbytier said:
Well HardOCP also used lots of DX11 games. Most games are still DX11 even the majority of newer games coming out. DX12 and Vulkan are still probably a year or more away from being the primary API used.
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The point is HardOCP used a better balance set of games with more modern DX12 specific engines as well, not just Deus Ex/Hitman/Warhammer/usual early games (most are flawed designs) that are fudged - yes I know they still use a couple of them but one can see better designed engines as well in their test suite.
DX11 is here to stay for years, so you still need them.
Anyway like I said the only early DX12 gen game that could be deemed a good implementation is AoTS (more so these days where it now performs equally on both AMD/Nvidia), which unfortunately due to its nature is a pig to use and also importantly must be done using independent 3rd party tool such as PresentMon and not the internal tool (just mentioning because quite a few sites still do not use such independent tools to measure-analyse frame performance behaviour).

Cheers
 
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razor1 said:
not good enough with 300 watts. I can get 2 1070s for 100 bucks more that will give 20% more hashrates or 2 580s that give 10% more hashrates at 100 bucks less. The 2 1070's will use less power too 30% less and the rx 580s will too about 20% less.

Can't modify the clocks of the HBM 2 much either on Vega, so that really hurts it that means modifying for more efficiency like we do with the 580's or the 1070s not going to happen.

So it makes no sense for miners to buy these cards right now.
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I'm glad to hear that you fuckers won't pilfer all the cards. Hopefully have to drop the prices quickly.

darrpara said:
I MSPainted a quick power diagram for this.
TpveIK0.png
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You need to step up your free energy game, Vega could be extremely profitable if employed correctly.
TR00 H VEGA PC.jpg
 
Got mine this morning for $599 from Micro Center.
Gigabyte GV-RXVEGA64-8GD-B (889523011201)

Guys in line in front of my were bragging about mining, and said they were going to buy at least 20 Vega cards today, so they could flip them for 2-3x profit on ebay. Then they planned to come back and buy more for mining, and keep the store depleted until no longer lucrative. In the end, I left with the one Vega64 I wanted, and they left with none. :)
 
jkw said:
Got mine this morning for $599 from Micro Center.
Gigabyte GV-RXVEGA64-8GD-B (889523011201)

Guys in line in front of my were bragging about mining, and said they were going to buy at least 20 Vega cards today, so they could flip them for 2-3x profit on ebay. Then they planned to come back and buy more for mining, and keep the store depleted until no longer lucrative. In the end, I left with the one Vega64 I wanted, and they left with none. :)
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How come they were in front of you but got none?

And, what's up with the male porn star pic in your profile?
 
bezant said:
How come they were in front of you but got none?

And, what's up with the male porn star pic in your profile?
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The manager came out 30 minutes before open and told everybody they did not get a shipment, so everybody took my cue and left. I then drove around the block while the FedEx guy dropped off packages, returned, and walked in at 10 a.m. and got one of the four they received today.

My profile picture? My name is Ron and I needed a Vega 64 for my VR pron.
 
cageymaru said:
If you look at the entire Anandtech review it certainly had its WTF moments like the graph you chose but it was close in others. I'm not digging the performance when AA is turned on. I'm hoping that is a driver bug that will be fixed in the future. Honestly who knows but the AMD engineers.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/11717/the-amd-radeon-rx-vega-64-and-56-review/15
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Doesn't AA performance and ROPs count go hand in hand? NVIDIA has pretty significant advantage there once you factor in clock advantage.
 
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jkw
I got the other one.

They told me they didn't have any coupons. So I didn't get the game codes and couldn't consider a monitor option.

I really wanted the limited edition water cooled Vega version for my primary pc so I'm a bit disappointed with the way that all went down. Microcenter said they got very little if any info from AMD about this launch.
 
Archaea said:
jkw
I got the other one.

They told me they didn't have any coupons. So I didn't get the game codes and couldn't consider a monitor option.

I really wanted the limited edition water cooled Vega version for my primary pc so I'm a bit disappointed with the way that all went down. Microcenter said they got very little if any info from AMD about this launch.
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I must have walked right past you. :). I'll see if I can find out anything about the game codes and will let you know if I do.

Note that Microcenter already has $200 knocked off the regular price of that Samsung 34-in monitor.
 
Yeah. Decent card but way to late and the pricing is optimistic

Rightly so though since this will be a great popular mining card for a few reasons
  • Hash rate is not an all time record breaker but might get better
  • Probably on the low side of "good enough" efficiency
  • Probably on the low side of "good enough" price/$
  • All the better cards are already out of stock or under extreme price pressure ($450 RX580s actually sell apparently)
 
GreenOrbs said:
All the reviews are stating that the price of the Vega 64 air-cooled is $500 MSRP but it looks like the cheapest I could find is $600... All the retailers are sold out as well.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16814150807
https://www.nowinstock.net/computers/videocards/amd/rxvega64/

$100 more than a 1080, double the power consumption, no Crossfire support at launch at basically the same performance. Liquid cooled isn't much better (5-10% better than air) at 1080 TI prices. Yet all sold out. I'm wondering if the stock was really low on launch and its more of a paper launch.
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Nice try.. but failed..
Those are the Limited Editions sold as part of the Pack... since day one it was announced those would only be available as part of the bundle/packs.

Black (Reference) = $499.99 (stand alone)
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814137226

Black (Reference) = $599.99 (part of pack)
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131728

Silver (Limited Edition) = $599.99 (part of pack)
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16814150807

packs.png
 
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Magic Hate Ball said:
Yeah, they're making hay while the sun is shining, which is good for the company bottom line in the short term.

Gamers and the community in general won't appreciate it though.
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Well even Raja stated it was going to have great perf/$ ratio, that sure didn't happen. They gave everyone the same thing nV has been giving them for the past 3 months (after then Ti launch and cut down prices of the 1080)
 
Dayman said:
:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
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Those prices probably are not inaccurate long term if things do not change massively with some unknown, magic drivers. They will very likely have to drop it to that, especially Q4-1 as Volta launches. The perf/W will be a gaping chasm by then unless Nano does well or they massively improve the sillicon (unlikely) or make some nano IF MCM (highly unlikely).
 
N4CR said:
Those prices probably are not inaccurate long term if things do not change massively with some unknown, magic drivers. They will very likely have to drop it to that, especially Q4-1 as Volta launches. The perf/W will be a gaping chasm by then unless Nano does well or they massively improve the sillicon (unlikely) or make some nano IF MCM (highly unlikely).
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Well the only recourse after Volta comes out is to drop prices, but that means these cards are now relegated to go up against mid range Volta, how many mid range computers will have a 1000 watt power supply?
 
ronan_zj said:
if it is good for mining, I believe all the miners will pay whatever the websites list.
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That's the rub.
Miners have already paid a high price for results that we're a lie.
Lolololol
Fuck them for jacking up prices.
Vegas is no better at mining and uses too much power and price when compared to Nvidia .

Miners got played.
Good.
 
griff30 said:
That's the rub.
Miners have already paid a high price for results that we're a lie.
Lolololol
Fuck them for jacking up prices.
Vegas is no better at mining and uses too much power and price when compared to Nvidia .

Miners got played.
Good.
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You think miners are buying this, they aren't, they know what they invest in and its not Vega. Miners penny pinch to get the best perf/$ they don't go crazy, that is why most of them don't buy those pre built systems on Ebay, stupid if they did, instead of 3 month return it becomes a 6 month return and in those 6 months they have no idea of the swings the cryptomarket will take.

Just expect the people that are buying this have been waiting for AMD cards that can somewhat compete, because they invested into freesync already or will only buy AMD products. I haven't seen a single person yet on miners forum saying they want Vega over any other card.
 
griff30 said:
That's the rub.
Miners have already paid a high price for results that we're a lie.
Lolololol
Fuck them for jacking up prices.
Vegas is no better at mining and uses too much power and price when compared to Nvidia .

Miners got played.
Good.
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I don't think that is actually settled yet. Right now they are waiting to flash BIOS that lets them undervolt and a few other tweaks + it is uncertain if the card is actually operating at full mining potential. I'd expect that within a few days we will hear that it has been undervolted and can do 45 MH/s with HBM overclock and some tweaking..
 
darrpara said:
I don't think that is actually settled yet. Right now they are waiting to flash BIOS that lets them undervolt and a few other tweaks + it is uncertain if the card is actually operating at full mining potential. I'd expect that within a few days we will hear that it has been undervolted and can do 45 MH/s with HBM overclock and some tweaking..
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I hope they burn them up trying.
 
darrpara said:
I don't think that is actually settled yet. Right now they are waiting to flash BIOS that lets them undervolt and a few other tweaks + it is uncertain if the card is actually operating at full mining potential. I'd expect that within a few days we will hear that it has been undervolted and can do 45 MH/s with HBM overclock and some tweaking..
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I think the discussion of memory bandwidth constraints happened a few pages ago, if it hits 45 I would be surprised, but still is not worth it. Not if the going price is 1,000$+, that's two 1070s.

Hard already has a link

http://www.legitreviews.com/amd-radeon-rx-vega-64-vega-56-ethereum-mining-performance_197049
 
razor1 said:
Well the only recourse after Volta comes out is to drop prices, but that means these cards are now relegated to go up against mid range Volta, how many mid range computers will have a 1000 watt power supply?
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Lmao, normally I don't give a fuck about power but in this case it's actually a legitimate concern. A 250-300W card can be done by the average barbones build gaming PC with a 550W psu and a mid tier CPU.. just.. but you're right. They will have a hell of a time moving these once volta launches if they don't start making lots of cheap nanos... which they can't as they seem to be binned chips.
800W is recommened though AFAIK. If not OCing CPU too hard a 600-700W PSU should do it though.

razor1 said:
You think miners are buying this, they aren't, they know what they invest in and its not Vega.
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I've seen plenty of 'I wanna mine what do I do tell me what to buy' posts...
I'd say there is enough low-tier small time miners like that to make enough volume to buy a few, e.g. following gibbo as gospel, preordering etc.
They do it (gouging) every time in my country a new card launches, so I'm used to it, but seeing it in USA is interesting.
I think they tried to play on the me firsts and the gullible new miners and it will become a standard practice. Retailers have now seen major ebay re-sale gouging from last 2-3 generations and they want in on the pie now and I don't blame them.
Don't see that strategy working so well with Vega though, with availability and the performance, power use etc etc.
 
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