Might be done with AIO's

doyll said:
Just supporting you and showing that small systems do not need CLCs to cool very well.
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You quoted yourself :)
It wasnt clear you were supporting me, no mention of cooling method was made.
Cheers though.
 
doyll said:
Just supporting you and showing that small systems do not need CLCs to cool very well.


TC14PE is great cooler and the new fans are even better.
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Indeed they are, coincidentally that's the version i got as i bought it 1 month ago. Couldn't find any reviews comparing them to the old ones but since they spin at around 400 rpm faster they must be at least a little better.
 
LordBlakeTheGreat said:
Indeed they are, coincidentally that's the version i got as i bought it 1 month ago. Couldn't find any reviews comparing them to the old ones but since they spin at around 400 rpm faster they must be at least a little better.
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They have a higher pressure rating so move more air at low speed too.
 
doyll said:
D14 and D15 have near identical 'real' performance with same fans.
In the end there are only real and unreal test results. I prefer real to unreal. ;)
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In the end there are only real world test results and laboratory test results. And in practice only one of those matters.
In other words I don't care how much power your car makes at the flywheel it's the lap-times that matters.

An AIO you can just slap on an intake fan or any place where there is no hot air from other devices and get great performance. Or you can use them in micro and itx systems where it's impossible to get proper airflow and probably isn't even enough space inside the case for a huge heatsink.

You don't have to like AIO solutions, but that doesn't mean they're pointless.
 
Araxie said:
Reeven Justice and TRUE 140 Direct both Disagree with you..
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Considering that i got it for £40 (got the black version, white one was actually £35 i think), that it comes with 2 fans and with the possibility to add a third one i'd say it is, i wouldn't take any other air cooler over this one.
 
LordBlakeTheGreat said:
Considering that i got it for £40 (got the black version, white one was actually £35 i think), that it comes with 2 fans and with the possibility to add a third one i'd say it is, i wouldn't take any other air cooler over this one.
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Second hand or what? It's at least 75-80 here in pounds.
 
M76 said:
Second hand or what? It's at least 75-80 here in pounds.
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Nope, new from amazon.uk. Now that i think about it, it's because they didn't charge me VAT haha, anyways i checked and the white one was £45 back in May (VAT included). I even got a partial refund because some of the black paint was chipped off on the fins, so it ended up costing me £32 lol, bargain i tell you!
 
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LordBlakeTheGreat said:
Nope, new from amazon.uk. Now that i think about it, it's because they didn't charge me VAT haha, anyways i checked and the white one was £45 back in May (VAT included). I even got a partial refund because some of the black paint was chipped off on the fins, so it ended up costing me £32 lol, bargain i tell you!
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But surely you have to agree, that one special set of extraordinary circumstances doesn't make it the defacto best value cooler. You got lucky with it, but generally speaking people like myself can only think in list price. It's 60 now on amazon uk, and with shipping it goes up to about 80 for me. I can get it for the same price locally as well.
 
AIO's are fine, but I'm going back to Air for my next cooler. It seems like most of the high end air coolers perform similarly to AIO's and you don't deal with higher idle temps due to the water heating up. My Thermaltake 240mm has done fine over the past 4 or 5 years.
 
I wouldn't mess with CLCs.
But I can get into a solid AIO.
I'm a fan of the Eisberg, Kelvin, and predator.

The Eisberg is fantastic for builds where you don't have space for pump and res.
 
I often wonder with folks that get a lot of faulty AIO's is how much fiddling they did with them. How many times have they been plugged in, unplugged, run for 72hours running Prime95 for no same reason etc. etc.

I have three AIO setups dating back to a original H50 from years back and they all still work just fine. They get carefully fitted the day they arrive and the only maintenance they get is a blast of dust shifting air through the rad on occasion and maybe a paste refresh every 4 years if I can be bothered.

They just run and run.

Oh and I've never heard a pump either.
 
-Strelok- said:
AIO's are fine, but I'm going back to Air for my next cooler. It seems like most of the high end air coolers perform similarly to AIO's and you don't deal with higher idle temps due to the water heating up. My Thermaltake 240mm has done fine over the past 4 or 5 years.
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They deal the same by now being twice the size and weight they were when AIO's first appeared I reckon.
 
daglesj said:
They deal the same by now being twice the size and weight they were when AIO's first appeared I reckon.
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Actually there were big coolers out when first 240 CLCs were sold. To name a couple of the most popular; Silver Arrow and NH-D14 were out.
 
doyll said:
Actually there were big coolers out when first 240 CLCs were sold. To name a couple of the most popular; Silver Arrow and NH-D14 were out.
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Probably back then exceptions to the rule. The rest followed suit.
 
daglesj said:
Probably back then exceptions to the rule. The rest followed suit.
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They were quite popular, so of course others started making bigger coolers too.

Point is CLCs have never been a 'better' cooler than top air. At best they now equal top air at similar noise levels. But AIOs like Swiftech are better than air coolers and CLCs. ;)
 
My piece of shit Deepcool Captain 360 deteriorated with time (pump) and leaked coolant on my Titan XP, frying it. $1200 video card bricked.

I thinking of switching away from AIO watercooling and just getting a good air cooler.
 
StormCIlaw said:
My piece of shit Deepcool Captain 360 deteriorated with time (pump) and leaked coolant on my Titan XP, frying it. $1200 video card bricked.

I thinking of switching away from AIO watercooling and just getting a good air cooler.
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I started switching from custom loops back to air about 8 years ago, maybe a little longer. I've never had any desire to use CLCs .. other then the time it took me to test them when I had to review one. I have used and still have a AIO that is not a CLC (be quiet! Silent Loop 280) and like is .. is very quiet and does a great job of cooling. But I won it, so didn't have to pay what they sell for. A good top tier air cooler costs 2/3rds to 3/4ths as much as an air cooler with similar noise level and cooling ability .. that, and how little maintanance air coolers need is biggest reason I changed back from custom loops.
 
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StormClaw said:
My piece of shit Deepcool Captain 360 deteriorated with time (pump) and leaked coolant on my Titan XP, frying it. $1200 video card bricked.

I thinking of switching away from AIO watercooling and just getting a good air cooler.
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That's what I did for that reason. I hope things work out for you.
 
kirbyrj said:
That's what I did for that reason. I hope things work out for you.
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Yeah, if you got expensive components inside, it's not worth the risk.

I had a second card in there (SLI).
Luckily, it survived the leak (along with CPU and MB)
 
God that Noctua or NH whatever is FUGLY as FUGGING HELL Balls.... glad you guys like those... ugly ass things.

I am all about custom loop.
 
tangoseal said:
God that Noctua or NH whatever is FUGLY as FUGGING HELL Balls.... glad you guys like those... ugly ass things.

I am all about custom loop.
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oh ok... that is why god gave us window less side panels because I wanna use my computer / see what is on the monitors // not be distracted by that sweet RBG watercooler pump yo.. I personally think the Noctual HSF is pretty awesome looking ... but I am solidly in the windowless side panel camp. I had a window case back in the early 2000s it was a huge pain in the butt trying to get everything all showy and whatever.. I just can not be bothered at this point.
 
atarione said:
oh ok... that is why god gave us window less side panels because I wanna use my computer / see what is on the monitors // not be distracted by that sweet RBG watercooler pump yo.. I personally think the Noctual HSF is pretty awesome looking ... but I am solidly in the windowless side panel camp. I had a window case back in the early 2000s it was a huge pain in the butt trying to get everything all showy and whatever.. I just can not be bothered at this point.
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LOL of course don't take me serious hahaha.. I just YUK at those things.. but they cool damn good! Their just obnoxious lol ... but I am glad you like yours and that is actually what counts :)
 
Custom loop is different, typically if it leaks it's on you for not running your tubing or fittings correctly. Back to AIO, I never had one leak but I have had pumps go bad leading to over heating. Of the 5 PCs in my house only one has an AIO which will be replaced in a year or so with an Cryorig H7 or similar.

Getting another 200mhz on an 8700k while spending $150+ on an AIO just doesn't do it for me. I'll take 4.9mhz from a large dual tower HSF and put the the extra $50-$100 towards my GPU.
 
Meanwhile my h50 has been purring for 8 years, without a single leak - and its been moved and installed/reinstalled so many times I cant even count. Cooled so many CPUs. And I bought it used.
 
greyboxer said:
Meanwhile my h50 has been purring for 8 years, without a single leak - and its been moved and installed/reinstalled so many times I cant even count. Cooled so many CPUs. And I bought it used.
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As with everything YMMV my Corsair unit died after 2.5 years. My TC14PE cools better than what I had and I'll never have to worry about it. Just depends on your experience and priorities.
 
Definitely true - its best to take some of the reviews and user experiences with a grain of salt at all times.
 
I run them all, from a 1k€ DIY Loop from Watercool with external Mo-Ra3 radiator and QuickConnectors all over on my personal gaming rig to my son's 7700k with a H110 and several air cooled CPU's that all run Noctua Air Coolers.

I have no trouble with either one, but there are things you should obey and know when you decide what solution to follow,...and pay for.


Air cooled with Noctua is the #1 choice for Workstations, it's ultra reliable, no fuss, no BS, it plain works, silent. The downside is limited RAM clearance, a heavy cooler on your board and last but not least, you gotta like the looks.

Corsair H110 AIO on my sons PC was terribly loud initially, I bought 2 silent fans for 50€ right away with it, making this a very expensive AIO in the end. The cooling power is enough for 5G on the 7700k, not much less than my DIY loop. I ran that CPU/Board for half a year in my rig so I can compare. The downside is, everything is internally, any leak is a catastrophe and will ruin your rig, like a cup of coffee drippin' through the case ( DONT remind me of that incident !! ). The benfit is a little more cooling Power than a big Noctua, but you trade it for more noise.


My DIY loop now runs on the 3rd rig, 2600k-->7700k-->8700k, always coupled with a Asus Poseidon GTX GPU of that era and VRM/MB waterblocks when available. The noise is 0dB as this MoRa3 has ~200w passive cooling capacity tgrough its big mass, the fans only need to spin up when I torture either my GPU or CPU, or both. For daily work, only some case fans slowly push some air over the board and VRMs. Cooling power is ample, maintenance is easy through the Koolance QC, draining, cleaning, adopting, only a matter of little work.
Having most of the stuff outside of the case ( Rad & Pump/Res, Eheim 1048 ) minimizes the risc of leaks inside.


I now consider only Noctua or a DIY Loop, I would never buy any AIO again. My son got my 980GTX Poseidon and he cant hook it up the loop, it's closed AIO. I really think about getting him a small rad ( 280er ) and a pump/res to cool the GPU, and later expand it to cool the CPU too. That way I can safe money in the long run and adopt with samll changes to coming hardware and needs.


AIO is a nice start, it attracts people into watercooling, but it is only the start ;)
 
One of the reasons I went with a horizontal motherboard chassis was to alleviate any weight on the CPU socket. Now I don't even care what my RAM looks like as I can't see it anyway. I will most likely downgrade on cooling capacity a bit on my next platform change as I want a Dark Rock Pro 3 for looks which is not as good as my TC14PE. I may go with an R1 which would be similar to what I have now.
 
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i consider this to be a custom loop.

corsair block/pump switchtech res and coolit rad.
 
Design1stcode2nd said:
One of the reasons I went with a horizontal motherboard chassis was to alleviate any weight on the CPU socket. Now I don't even care what my RAM looks like as I can't see it anyway. I will most likely downgrade on cooling capacity a bit on my next platform change as I want a Dark Rock Pro 3 for looks which is not as good as my TC14PE. I may go with an R1 which would be similar to what I have now.
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Dark Rock Pro 3 is only a few degrees less cooling than TC14PE. So unless your are running your TC14PE at full fan speed you probably won't notice much if any difference at all.
 
StormClaw said:
I find this hard to believe.

After 8 years the liquid would have turned into a shitty goo. And rubber/plastic pipes would have deteriorated.
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I mean.. what do you need to see lol. Its not a dominant cooler by any stretch, but it keeps my 3770K at 4.4ghz 1.25v in the mid 80s.

I bought it, used in 2010, off of an overclock.net user who also sold me a PC Power and Cooling 610W and have had it in push pull for years. Both work fine.
 
While Greyboxer's CLC is not the only one that old still working good working one over about 6 years old are rather rare.. so I can understand why StormClaw is quiestioning one still working after 8 years.
 
I just swapped out an older CPU for the 3770K, and cleaned off the ole h50. Changed position in my case. I mean, it doesnt matter if anyone wants to question it - its still cooling a solidly OC'd CPU. Does that mean I want to ride it out for another 8 years? nah, but it'll do me fine til a decent deal pops up on a next gen corsair AIO.
 
I've got 3 Corsair CLC's in service. Looked up my order history from Newegg for the exact dates I bought them.

H60 4/21/12 on a PII X4 975BE @ 4.0GHz still going strong on my server. Max temp 54c(Handbrake)

H70 5/13/11 on a i7 2600K @ 4.5GHz Still going strong on my main rig. Max temp 79c(Prime) 63c (games)

H50 11/09/09 on a C2Q9550 still going strong, was mine for a year then sold to a client. Max temp 61c(Photoshop)

All still have the stock fans and paste(don't fix it unless it's broke mentality). And I only clean the rads every 6 months or so. And I will be buying another for my main rig when I upgrade soon.

If I swore off every particular brand/piece of hardware I saw badmouthed on the forums, I wouldn't even be able to build a potato PC.
People have to learn that there are lemons and then there is straight junk, just because you have had bad luck with something, doesn't mean your bad karma will repeat with the next guy in line to buy that same piece of hardware. It's one thing to not like a certain brand and boycott it, but it's something else entirely to post in every thread that you can find about AIO/CLC's, and proclaim them ALL junk just because YOU had a catastrophic failure.

Unlike most forums that have a shit ton of noobs, [H]ardForum is filled to the rafters with knowledgeable folks, and if you ever take a gander at their sig's, you will see that peeps here seem to like AIO's, hell I would even go as far to say they out number the ones on air, and to me that speaks for itself.
 
You can have AIO's that function great for years, I have no issue with anyone that uses them and there are a vast number that do. From my perspective I have had them fail so unless I have a case that requires their use due to height limitations I will opt for similar cooling with greater reliability. A D15, R1 or TC14PE will cool just as well as any 240 rad AIO, typically cost less and be more reliable.
 
that is what literally everyone says anytime anyone ever talks about any AIO

"DH15 is just as good and quieter" *Exits thread*

If that was true, then everyone would have a pair of grandmas sugar cookie fans cooling those sweet fins in every PC, everywhere.
 
trentchau said:
I love the custom loop systems but 2 things are stopping me right now from it. 1) Cost and 2) With both failures even with a fry's 30 minutes away I still would of had a 2 hour downtime on the machines. Do custom loop people have multiple pumps at their house just in case of failure? Cause I would assume it would be equally as inconvenient if your system goes down.

Like mentioned above a fan dying is just a fan dying. I have so many 120mm fans laying around it seems a lot more accessible in an emergency over another pump, mostly a custom pump.

After having 2 failures in less than 6 months, count me a little bit more on the skeptical side.
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Honestly, I have been running custom Koolance loops since the original Koolance case was released. Since that time I got their PC2 case, 2 different Exos 2 units, an Exos LT, AND have two of their 5.25" bay pump/reservoir units. Of these, the original Koolance case was sold to someone else to help fund the PC2, the PC2 had an electronics failure several years after purchase and was retired. Both 5.25" bay units, and the newer Exos 2 unit are all still in service - the other, older Exos 2 unit has a problem where it no longer reads any temperature probes correctly causing it to beep loudly all the time, and it was removed from service last week.

NONE of these systems has ever had a failed pump. NONE - and we're talking about a 15-year period here with some of these units being in continual operation for over 8 years! (On the lighter side, Koolance did have a period where they had infamously flaky electronics :))



PS: If anyone has any suggestions on how to fix the older Exos 2 (an original Exos 2, not one of the newer ones) other than replacing the circuit board, they would be appreciated ('Cuz I know this step, and these boards are hard to find now). Basically, this uses the 50kOhm temp probes and reads any probes connected to it too low, and reports an SO error until the CPU reaches ~65C at which point it reads as 22C on the display. Hooking a 10KOhm probe up results in it reading cold start temps as 85C and scales up from there. I tried new 50KOhm probes, a 10KOhm probe, a new interface bracket, and an in-block 50KOhm probe.
 
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