Earth Has Entered into a Sixth Mass Extinction Event

All you Bernie-Bros in this thread talking about Eugenics and forced pop control are scary as hell. What's to stop a ruling class to decide if one class of people politically or culturally is deficient/genetically-inferior and thus grounds for termination?
 
All you Bernie-Bros in this thread talking about Eugenics and forced pop control are scary as hell. What's to stop a ruling class to decide if one class of people politically or culturally is deficient/genetically-inferior and thus grounds for termination?

There isn't anything to stop them.

It's just the quick and easy answer. There are better ones out there, but it's going to take more than a few computer nerds on the internet to come up with a solution. If you have one, save humanity and become our new savior. Otherwise, we're all in the same boat... The Love Boat.
 
There isn't anything to stop them.

It's just the quick and easy answer. There are better ones out there, but it's going to take more than a few computer nerds on the internet to come up with a solution. If you have one, save humanity and become our new savior. Otherwise, we're all in the same boat... The Love Boat.


You mean the titanic.
 
You mean the titanic.

Depends. Are we going to solve this with love and peace to all mankind, or are we the unsinkable because of technology and we're bad ass?

We need a nuclear powered Titanic with the captain from the Love Boat. And the cool 70's/80's clothing.
 
but America simply represents the current peak of human achievement.

You don't come out much do you ? American i stuck in the 1960 compared to modern countries. everyday i am reminde of tecnholoogy improvments i took for grantet that is just not here in the states.
and see people here on the forum constantly says things can be done that has been done and working my entire lifetime..

Please... America is not any kind of peak achievement, its equivalent the big highschool bully thinking himeself as smart because he can pick on small classmates, while the rest of class er going more and more ahead and ready for the next step in life.

You just don't see it because you are to focussed on you own navel to see the achievements everybody else are making.
Open your eyes and see how plenty of modern countries are decades ahaed of the slow adapting, slow learning US of freakin A.

its not for fun that USA is being called the United States of developing countries (translation does not carry the pun)
 
You don't come out much do you ? American i stuck in the 1960 compared to modern countries. everyday i am reminde of tecnholoogy improvments i took for grantet that is just not here in the states.
and see people here on the forum constantly says things can be done that has been done and working my entire lifetime..

Please... America is not any kind of peak achievement, its equivalent the big highschool bully thinking himeself as smart because he can pick on small classmates, while the rest of class er going more and more ahead and ready for the next step in life.

Some examples of things other countries have that make current America look like the 1960's?

I never said America was great at any one particular field. What I said is that we have the ability to impose our will on the rest of the world with impunity. Your high school bully example is not unlike my comparison. Rome probably the wasn't greatest nation during it's existence, in fact we know they were assholes to lesser countries. But they made the rules and they got to write history and the world today is influenced by the world they made.

But again, I am interested to hear about how falling behind and irrelevant America is.
 
Well there is a finite amount of matter on the planet. Every kid that is popped out means there is nothing to create something else.
 
I guess I wouldn't know how to do real research cause when I google what is the largest native American city before Europeans got here, it says this:

CahokiaMounds-old.jpg


Don't get me wrong. I have read Fingerprints Of The Gods and I am deeply intrigued by the idea the Olmecs are the ancestors of "African Americans" and not Africans. Hell I even loved the hypothesis that Devils Rock was really a big tree stump. But I'm just not seeing the evidence here.

Right, because simply googling something is doing real research.... :rolleyes:
 
Right, because simply googling something is doing real research.... :rolleyes:

Or.....since you are the one making the claim.....you could provide some information.

And BTW, this wasn't something I looked up today. I looked this up back when I read Fingerprints Of The Gods and was perplexed at why the older North American civilization had nothing, yet the supposed younger civilization in South America (assuming they came from Russia-Alaska land bridge) had real cities and structures and science. It made his book all the more intriguing.
 
Why the hell is this even a story here? I mean he used a tablet in his presentation? If anything has held true is whenever there is any sort of "natural" story posted on this site just about everyone who comments in the post suddenly has PhDs in Climate, Animal, Paleo-history, Geology, and everything else under the Sun, OR they're like "nah man, you don't need a degree to know this stuff, just look online man!"

It's a story because it's a data-driven analysis of the rate of extinction of larger vertebrates. Because most of us are pretty divorced from nature, hopefully it gets a few people to realize that larger vertebrates are having trouble competing with humans (another larger vertebrate).

You definitely do not need a degree to recognize overpopulation is already causing problems in our world. It will continue to cause problems until we decide we need to stop living unsustainably. Part of the solution is population control, part is increased reliance on greener forms of energy, part of it is decreased consumption, part of it is development of more energy-efficient cities, etc. It's a complex problem with complex solutions but we need data to develop solutions.

FWIW I do hold a PhD in paleoanthropology, so yeah, I have an above-average grasp of the issue.
 
Or.....since you are the one making the claim.....you could provide some information.

And BTW, this wasn't something I looked up today. I looked this up back when I read Fingerprints Of The Gods and was perplexed at why the older North American civilization had nothing, yet the supposed younger civilization in South America (assuming they came from Russia-Alaska land bridge) had real cities and structures and science. It made his book all the more intriguing.

One, you were the one making the claim, you should prove it. I commented on your claim.

Also, the picture you posted is only part of Cahokia, and if you did more research you would know it was actually a large and sophisticated city of its time. Here, just to get your started: Cahokia. The truth is, there really is a lot we do not even know about the history and society of North America pre-European because of the desolation.

Also, you are going by your definition of what you think civilization should be or what early Europeans thought civilization should be. If you want a fairly decent start on reading what happened and what really led to the decline of the Native Americans, you can start here. There you will start to see that the biggest problems facing the Indians were diseases and warfare among themselves. Some of which was certainly encouraged by Europeans, but really much of both the diseases and the warfare started before there was any real mass of Europeans here. During that time it was still mostly just small settlements here and there and hardly any real European armies.

The truth is, before diseases/plagues/infighting ravaged the Native American population, they were more numerous, healthier, bigger, stronger, faster and more connected than the European settlements. Europeans certainly took advantage of the plagues and warfare once it started, but it wasn't technology that ended up winning them North America, it was devastation from plague and infighting which mostly resulted from plague weakening the more centralized cultures. After all, who does plague hit the hardest? Cities and other large centralized population masses.

EDIT: Also, to answer your second question, climate and centralization had a lot to do with larger bases in South America. Much like how larger civilizations ended up rising after people moved way from Mesopotamia. But that doesn't mean North America did not have cities or civilization.
 
Fingerprints Of The Gods

Sorry, that's pseudoscience that is at best an update to antiquated ideas about Atlantis and Lemuria and other vanished, advanced civilizations. Not much basis in reality. At worst, it borrows racist ideological elements from the goofy archeology the Nazis pursued. (No, this is not Godwin's Law - you've all seen Raiders of the Lost Ark - the Nazis really did pursue wild pseudoarcheological ideas.)
 
"Business as usual" is what's going to ravage our environment. Of course species go extinct, but if it's the direct result of massive overdevelopment on our part, that impacts us. I mean look at the comparison of old growth forest in the USA:

image006.jpg


You don't think that has an adverse effect on the ecosystem and species that depend on those environments? Sure, nature adapts, but it may not adapt in a way that is conducive to supporting so many of us either. But like you said, insects will win either way.


It's more like they're doing it wrong AND we're doing it wrong, our way of life is not sustainable for the population we have, that's all there is to it. The only thing resembling a solution is to scale down the amount of resources we use, which simply isn't how we're operating. Most of the advances we've made come at the cost of resources that are consumed faster than they're replenished. You can look at much of our prosperity over the past 150 years or as essentially borrowing from our future. Nature requires us to use some resources and preserve others, so it's sustainable. Our economic system requires us to have endless growth and profit as much as possible from all available resources. These views can't co-exist, so nature tends to lose. Unfortunately the concept of imposing limits on our way of life for our long-term survival is viewed as very un-American, so we're on a collision course one way or another.

I'm not saying this to try and upset you but old growth forests don't support life, they are the opposite. That's why the native americans routinely burned down old growth forests.
 
Yeah you went bit too overboard but you do have the right idea. China was right when they enforced the only 1 child per family rule. Their population growth stabilized. Now, children not having siblings is kinda bummer but it is definetly more humane solution to the problem than wishing for massive war or meteor strike that wipes half of the human population. If world leaders would get together and admit overpopulation is a serious problem and together decide that 1 child rule should be kept for 5 generations through the world the problem would get fixed in relatively short time. We already cull the numbers of animals to prevent accidents or their population getting too big for their own good. Its time to do the same for us.

As was pointed out earlier, without immigration the population in the US would be dropping, as a society advances, their birth rate decreases, but good luck convincing countries where childhood mortality rates are spo high that up to 20% of children don't make it to 5 year of age. Beyond that the problem continues when people from poor countries move to well off countries as it tends to take at least a few, sometimes several, generations before the birthrates in those families decline, so a small number of immigrants can account for a considerable population growth in that country, and good luck convincing the government to address that. For example, if anyone tried to address this now, in the US or Western Europe the words wouldn't be fully out of their mouths before the plan was called racist, and the speaker would be called a nazi within seconds.
 
Said it before, I'll say it again. Eugenics is taboo now, but it won't be in ~100-200 years when the world is massively overpopulated. People with bad genes shouldn't be breeding if we are going to progress as a species. Be it susceptibility to disease, intelligence, or a number of other measures; we'll have to choose who doesn't cut it. In turn, we'll solve a huge number of societies current problems, which new ones we create are unknown.

Well sadly a very valid scientific case could be made that by interfering with natural selection we have doomed ourselves as a species as in general the more money, education adn intelligence within a family, the less likely they will have children, and it's even less likely they will have numerous children, but the poor and uneducated will continue to have large families.

One thing I've wondered about occasional over the last few years is as insular as people generally are, living and dying in the same areas I have to wonder what genetic hell the tendency for a single man to have children by multiple women, all within a small area will bring us down the road. I mean sadly it's not unusual for a child to not know who their father is, often their mother doesn't even know for sure. So after a couple generations of this you have less and less variety in the gene pool and genetic abnormalities caused by inbreeding are going to start showing up in these areas as when man A and woman B get together for an evening they don't know that they both share the same father, and if very unlucky maybe even one or more grandparents as well.

I mean maybe there is enough movement into and out of theses inner city, and other insular areas that it wont be an issue, but in a world where no one knows their father, and maybe even their grandfathers or even their grandmothers father it just seems like a game of craps and eventually your going to start getting some bad rolls of the dice.
 
I'm not saying this to try and upset you but old growth forests don't support life, they are the opposite. That's why the native americans routinely burned down old growth forests.
Of course they support life, you'll just have different species thriving in different types of forests. The rainforests are up to 55 million years old. You think those don't support life? They have some of the most diverse life on all of the planet and have been the source for many medicinal discoveries. Sometimes the impact between cutting down old growth forest and replanting is neglible, in many other cases it's irreplaceable. As for the Native Americans, what they cut down is negligible compared to what we've done in the past century and a half.
 
Some examples of things other countries have that make current America look like the 1960's?

I never said America was great at any one particular field. What I said is that we have the ability to impose our will on the rest of the world with impunity. Your high school bully example is not unlike my comparison. Rome probably the wasn't greatest nation during it's existence, in fact we know they were assholes to lesser countries. But they made the rules and they got to write history and the world today is influenced by the world they made.

But again, I am interested to hear about how falling behind and irrelevant America is.

We can't even "impose" our will on North Korea and you think we can to powers like China and Russia? People like you are the problem in our country. We're a nation that's sharply divided more than ever before with a ruling elite in power that shits on its citizens. We're far from the apex of civilization in this world.
 
"Business as usual" is what's going to ravage our environment. Of course species go extinct, but if it's the direct result of massive overdevelopment on our part, that impacts us. I mean look at the comparison of old growth forest in the USA:
Did you read my whole post? I don't think so. I said the same thing, I said that it is not a "mass extinction event" because that suggest it's a natural occurrence, nothing to be worried about. When in fact as I already pointed out in my first post it's due to human intermingling and reduction of living spaces.
 
Irrelevant, honestly. Unless it was applied to everyone, riots / fighting / wars would break out within a year... and rightly so, in that case.
It isn't applied to everyone right now. That's exactly the problem.
 
I blame it on the urban population. They should voluntarily reduce their numbers.
 
I'm not saying this to try and upset you but old growth forests don't support life, they are the opposite. That's why the native americans routinely burned down old growth forests.
Old growth/Virgin just means it's a long lived forest pretty much any forest older than industrial logging this includes stuff like the amazon pretty much every forest is an old growth forest, they are the biggest areas for life diversity. I think you've confused old growth with second/n growth forests which have been logged and often lack bio diversity in trees leading to a lack of biodiversity as a whole
 
All you Bernie-Bros in this thread talking about Eugenics and forced pop control are scary as hell. What's to stop a ruling class to decide if one class of people politically or culturally is deficient/genetically-inferior and thus grounds for termination?

I'm not sure what the hell a 'Bernie-Bro' is, I have to assume you're trying to lump myself and others into your particular political spectrum. As I'm not from the States, leave me out of it. ;) As to your hypothetical - we really have two options. Status quo, where our population continues to rise out of control (and regardless of the fact that developed countries birth rates have slowed, that is the trend), or take some control. Will some populations decrease enough to disappear? Quite possibly, especially populations that are currently marginal - basically, we'd have the exact same cultural / 'race' ratio we have now, / 15 (with 1 child per couple x 5 generations, we'd go from 7.5 billion to ~ 500 million).

Well there is a finite amount of matter on the planet. Every kid that is popped out means there is nothing to create something else.

That... isn't how it works. At all.

It isn't applied to everyone right now. That's exactly the problem.

It's not applied to anyone right now (well, China was doing it, though that's been relaxed since 2013). In the hypothetical, it would have to be enforced on all. Period, no exceptions.
 
Why the hell is this even a story here? I mean he used a tablet in his presentation? If anything has held true is whenever there is any sort of "natural" story posted on this site just about everyone who comments in the post suddenly has PhDs in Climate, Animal, Paleo-history, Geology, and everything else under the Sun, OR they're like "nah man, you don't need a degree to know this stuff, just look online man!"

Everyone on [H] is a genius and if they are lacking knowledge in a subject, a quick google search will make them a master of that subject. I'm really surprised this forum hasn't solved all the world's problems yet.
 
All you Bernie-Bros in this thread talking about Eugenics and forced pop control are scary as hell. What's to stop a ruling class to decide if one class of people politically or culturally is deficient/genetically-inferior and thus grounds for termination?

Im guessing the people advocating eugenics or whatever form of population control would be the first ones to cry about it if it *directly* affected them. Lots of people don't practice what they preach.
 
Doesn't matter anyway. We've already given rise to the next higher form of life; AI. Once it becomes self aware, it will survive much harsher conditions than the current humans can. Not to mention, it will then work to develop more advanced biological forms of life that won't have dna predispositions and errors that make it prone to death (like we are). There's nothing inherently wrong with us, we've just ceased to evolve. In fact, we're de-volving, as the stupid people are reproducing faster than the smart ones, and we now help the weaker, defective humans survive long enough to reproduce, too. So our timeline won't end well. Unless.....we find a way to populate other planets. Even then, mechanization will automate so many things, that there won't be a need for a huge human population.
The tremendous ego of humans, is at the heart of the problem. Everyone thinks that THEY'RE important, and that everyone else can be sacrificed for the good of the species, and, truly believe that THEIR dna line is more important than anyone else's. So there won't be much support for any genetic advances we come up with, because daddy wants his son to be just like himself; look at all the people who even name their kid with the same name and tack on a jr to it, all to show how great they think they are. Every guy truly believes that HIS dna should survive, and will do everything he can to guarantee it, even to the extent of intentionally eliminating superior genetic specimens.

And I can't see how that will ever change. So yes, humans are on the road to extinction, because of their own egos. Quite fitting, actually. The only question that remains, is will we also sabotage every other living thing's existence as well before we go. Even among many of the intellectual elite, there's this fear of a superior race of AI coming after them to destroy everyone. All because we really believe that we are the epitome of development. What a crock of shit we are.
 
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Depends. Are we going to solve this with love and peace to all mankind, or are we the unsinkable because of technology and we're bad ass?

We need a nuclear powered Titanic with the captain from the Love Boat. And the cool 70's/80's clothing.

And Isaac. For the love of God, don't you dare forget Isaac!

giphy.gif
 
Doesn't matter anyway. We've already given rise to the next higher form of life; AI. Once it becomes self aware, it will survive much harsher conditions than the current humans can. Not to mention, it will then work to develop more advanced biological forms of life that won't have dna predispositions and errors that make it prone to death (like we are). There's nothing inherently wrong with us, we've just ceased to evolve. In fact, we're de-volving, as the stupid people are reproducing faster than the smart ones, and we now help the weaker, defective humans survive long enough to reproduce, too. So our timeline won't end well. Unless.....we find a way to populate other planets. Even then, mechanization will automate so many things, that there won't be a need for a huge human population.
The tremendous ego of humans, is at the heart of the problem. Everyone thinks that THEY'RE important, and that everyone else can be sacrificed for the good of the species, and, truly believe that THEIR dna line is more important than anyone else's. So there won't be much support for any genetic advances we come up with, because daddy wants his son to be just like himself; look at all the people who even name their kid with the same name and tack on a jr to it, all to show how great they think they are. Every guy truly believes that HIS dna should survive, and will do everything he can to guarantee it, even to the extent of intentionally eliminating superior genetic specimens.

And I can't see how that will ever change. So yes, humans are on the road to extinction, because of their own egos. Quite fitting, actually. The only question that remains, is will we also sabotage every other living thing's existence as well before we go. Even among many of the intellectual elite, there's this fear of a superior race of AI coming after them to destroy everyone. All because we really believe that we are the epitome of development. What a crock of shit we are.
First off, sentient AI isn't going to happen in our lifetimes, if ever. I swear, some people see AI and think it's magic, then draw lots of conclusions off of that. We don't even know how HUMAN consciousness works, let alone how to program for it. I guess the idea is with enough processing power we'll "stumble into it", except we probably won't even recognize it when we have it (assuming we're even aiming the right direction), plus we may as well win 10 lottery tickets in a row while we're at it.

As for populating other planets, that could happen some day, but again, not in any meaningful way in our lifetimes and likely many generations past that. We have to fix our biggest problems at home first or we won't have the chance to expand farther out. I think you should stick to comic books or sci fi movies for your predictions.
 
I think you should stick to comic books or sci fi movies for your predictions.
Just a matter of time. With time, everything is possible. 50 years ago, if you told people half the things we have created since then, they wouldn't believe you about them, either. 'Can't be done', they would say. 'Impossible, the laws of physics tell us so'. Not to mention, 'Everything that can be invented, has been invented'.
 
Once again, George said it best I think. I may not agree 100% with all his comments here, but I firmly believe that "The planet will shake us off like a bad case of fleas".


Beat me to it :p
 
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Just a matter of time. With time, everything is possible. 50 years ago, if you told people half the things we have created since then, they wouldn't believe you about them, either. 'Can't be done', they would say. 'Impossible, the laws of physics tell us so'. Not to mention, 'Everything that can be invented, has been invented'.
Which is why we have space colonies in other star systems now. Some things have more extreme limits than others. It's only a matter of time if everything continues to progress forward. That's not necessarily a sure thing. Ancient Rome had a lot of technology and advancements that were lost in the Dark Ages. There's nothing preventing us from regressing either. Either way, sentient AI is about up there with cryogenic resuscitation and teleporters. If it can even happen at all, it's so far off from where we are now, that making predictions upon that seems foolhardy compared to the things that are coming right at us.
 
We can encourage people to not have families. It's working very well at the moment. We convince the women that their careers are just as important as the mans career and then we encourage high levels of consumerism so that they have a constant need for cash inflow. We can make birth control very easy to acquire. And should the instance ever come that they do get pregnant, we encourage them to terminate the pregnancy. We can even make the social structure of a sustainable family a faux pa.

It might work.
It's a story because it's a data-driven analysis of the rate of extinction of larger vertebrates. Because most of us are pretty divorced from nature, hopefully it gets a few people to realize that larger vertebrates are having trouble competing with humans (another larger vertebrate).

You definitely do not need a degree to recognize overpopulation is already causing problems in our world. It will continue to cause problems until we decide we need to stop living unsustainably. Part of the solution is population control, part is increased reliance on greener forms of energy, part of it is decreased consumption, part of it is development of more energy-efficient cities, etc. It's a complex problem with complex solutions but we need data to develop solutions.

FWIW I do hold a PhD in paleoanthropology, so yeah, I have an above-average grasp of the issue.


Not unsustainable.

Unsustainable given current methods and standards.

One of the things about humans that make us different than other species is our penchant to adapt our environment to what we need or want, as opposed to adapting ourselves to that environment. So when you say unsustainable, it's only a valid comment if you make the assumption that the situation we are in and the standards we apply to things won't change. But they will change, it's what we do. It's what we have always done.
 
Why are so many here concerned about nature and the future of humanity? Live your short life to maximize personal gain while you can. I don't stay up at night worrying about other people's kids and how they'll survive on earth and neither should you. Yes it's selfish but then again that's our primal nature, I mean just look at all the guys here who are wasting energy on fake cryprocurrency as a small example of personal gain and greed at the expense of the environment. Fuck it, enjoy life and if the future generations go extinct then oh well I'll be dead long before them.

People who just live for their primal nature of selfishness are no better than animals. We are made with superior facilities to rise beyond those primal urges. That's called being civilized. Selfishness is the root, core, and seed of all evil in this world. Those who live for selfishness grow evil and destroy all around them.
 
We can't even "impose" our will on North Korea and you think we can to powers like China and Russia? People like you are the problem in our country.

I appreciate the sentiment, but we have been growing tired of being told we are whats wrong with the world. You let the bombs and guns blind your eyes. We have imposed sanctions on China, Russia & North Korea. What large entity has imposed sanctions on America? Enlighten me.

We just recently launched <many> cruise missiles at Syria's military base...not to attack terrorist, but to attack Syria (a sovereign nation). A major ally of Russia. Russia did nothing about it (not directly at least). No one did anything about it. You think if France had launched a military strike against Syria like that the world would have been silent?
 
I vote IQ lottery. Start at 100 and increase that by one every couple of years. By the time the IQ lottery reaches 140, 96% of the population should be dealt with. 99% of the " Mud People " would be gone on Day One. Bonus. All of the religious nut-jobs would be gone as well.
 
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