NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

Sleeving Question: For those of you who have shortened / sleeved the SF600. Thoughts on average cable run length? Or a direction to a good readup on the topic.
 
This screenshot shows my Ncase build running a delid and basic overclock:

7700K @ 5.0GHz / 1.35v
1080 Ti Founders Edition (stock clocks)

As I've said here before - the cooler used here is a Noctua C14 w/ 2 Gentle Typhoons (1850PWM) on the side panel as intake. For the delid I used Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra between the CPU Die/IHS. I resealed it using Permatex Ultra Black and left a larger gas chamber than Intel (similar to how AMD did a double chamber on the Ryzen chips. The chip went back under the C14 with Gelid GC Extreme.

Temps: (prior to running this Firestrike test I was running Aida64 stability to check temps.

Idle is around 28-30C
Load just falls short of 70C

Keep in mind I know the 1.35v can go down, but this was to throw a rock solid test quickly together.

(this is on air) and besides the slim Noctua rear exhaust I have no other fans - I won't be mashing 2 under the 1080ti because it produces little to no impact contrary on that being very common with Ncase builders..

I made this post to demonstrate and encourage more people considering the 7700K to consider a delid. If you are on the fence about the Ncase or are lurking this forum as I did for a long time you probably are concerned about using air or battling the decision to cram a AIO Corsair product in this case (totally pointless imo). When the 7700K was announced my plan was to accomplish something like this. With the release of the 1080 Ti and delid becoming such a simple process the results are baffling and speak for themselves. In 2017 where literally every company (EVGA LOL) is developing a AIO liquid cooler it is great to see what can be done in SFF cases with air. I feel the need to debunk 2 unnecessary trends in the Ncase community that immediately come to mind. 1. The popularity in AIO water solutions imo are a waste of space and money. 2. Mounting fans in every spot they fit is also a waste of space and money, especially under the GPU.

1 thing to consider: What I'm accomplishing here with a Strix Z270i and Ncase in raw performance could barely be improved upon with a Asus Z270 Apex mobo and AIO/custom loop in a mid or full tower case. Though there are more reasons to go custom loop than just raw performance, the case can be still be made.

Feel free to ask any questions as I'm happy to help!

nIMnBWK.jpg
 
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rfarmer said:
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608020

Probably a good idea to check with the vendor but a company named AmaMax is listing a Noctua NH-C14 original version on Newegg for $120. Be worth the price if you could actually still get one new.
Click to expand...

I'd say jump all over that! Wow! Amamax is one of Noctuas biggest distributors, and sells a lot via Amazon/Newegg. I would have no hesitation buying that or paying that price.
 
Parish_Rane said:
Sleeving Question: For those of you who have shortened / sleeved the SF600. Thoughts on average cable run length? Or a direction to a good readup on the topic.
Click to expand...

Hey there I think if you check my 'recent activity' in my profile, I liked most of the posts pertaining to custom cable length. For me personally, I have an SF450 and Asus Z270I and the lengths I went with were, 20cm 24 pin extension + 5cm corsair shorty, 35cm cpu extension + 5cm corsair shorty, and 20cm pci extension + 5cm corsair shorty. Purchase from Ensourced.net; waiting for them at the moment.

I know Pslate had a recent post on here with his setup that has ensourced cables as well.

EDIT: Nvm, looks like those likes aren't available in my public profile/ have been removed.
 
gsilver said:
Alright. I've gotten the SX700-LPT installed:
1. The fan does turn on sometimes during gaming, and when it is on, it is somewhat loud, but it activates only briefly. HUGE improvement over the SF450, which spun up loudly and *stayed spun up* even when I stopped gaming.
2. I'll try replacing the slim 140mm fan with two slim 120mm fans in the side bracket to see if that helps. When I have some spare time, I'll also try flipping the vent of the PSU inward (*might* run cooler, once there are two 120mm fans)
3. I might also try replacing the PSU fan with a better one, but I'll probably wait and see if Noctua actually releases the slim 120mm fan that they've been teasing for years this summer.
4. Installation was a bit tight. An extra mm or two of height in the case would do wonders... But I got the video card in there without too much difficulty.
5. No coil whine detected from the PSU, though I did notice some from the motherboard. I've been having lots of minor issues with the board (popping in audio, one of the front panel USB ports provides power but not data, unresponsive keyboard on bootup, flicker in video (though I haven't seen the latter two since upgrading to Windows 10)) so I might have a defective motherboard.
6. I really really like that the SX700 only requires one set of cables from the PSU to provide two 6+2 power connectors to the video card. Definitely helps with wire clutter.

Here's a picture of it:
NCase%20M1.jpg

Asus Z170I Pro Gaming
6700k
Noctua C14s cooler
be quiet! Silentwings 3 (lower CPU fan)
NF-A9 FLX (exaust)
Prolimatech Ultra Sleek Vortex 140mm slim fan (side panel/upper CPU fan)
Gigabyte Xtreme Gaming GTX 1070
Silverstone SX700-LPT
Samsung 960 Evo 1tb (NVMe)
Click to expand...


Can you talk about temps / noise with this setup? The prolimatech fans are very nice, wondering how important the lower fan is.
 
xcharlesy said:
Can you talk about temps / noise with this setup? The prolimatech fans are very nice, wondering how important the lower fan is.
Click to expand...
Right now, the lower fan situation is less than ideal, since I'm waiting on Noctua to send me some 120mm clips. Right now, half of it is being propped in place by the ram, so the fan is at an off-angle.

As for noise, the Xtreme Gaming has rather buzzy fans, which, as long as the PSU fan doesn't spin up, aren't terribly noisy, but do have a somewhat irritating sound signature.
The CPU fans are very quiet, even when running Prime95. Temperatures peaked at 80, but I do have the fans running slowly and the lower fan is off-angle.
Coil whine on the motherboard is somewhat irritating when running Prime 95.

The PSU fan speeds up pretty much immediately if I'm playing a game that requires 100% GPU power, and it is loud. Games that require less only cause it to spin up on occasion.

My hopes are that flipping the PSU inward + a pair of 120mm fans will quiet down the PSU under load. If not, I'll replace the fan (being veeeerrrry careful and using rubber gloves when doing so!)



Oh, and has anyone with the Xtreme Gaming tried removing the shroud and replacing it with a pair of bottom-mounted 120mm fans? Taking advantage of the oversized heatsink, but replacing the fans with ones with a better sound signature. Given the construction of the M1, exhaust is the preferred direction, correct?
 
gsilver said:
Right now, the lower fan situation is less than ideal, since I'm waiting on Noctua to send me some 120mm clips. Right now, half of it is being propped in place by the ram, so the fan is at an off-angle.

As for noise, the Xtreme Gaming has rather buzzy fans, which, as long as the PSU fan doesn't spin up, aren't terribly noisy, but do have a somewhat irritating sound signature.
The CPU fans are very quiet, even when running Prime95. Temperatures peaked at 80, but I do have the fans running slowly and the lower fan is off-angle.
Coil whine on the motherboard is somewhat irritating when running Prime 95.

The PSU fan speeds up pretty much immediately if I'm playing a game that requires 100% GPU power, and it is loud. Games that require less only cause it to spin up on occasion.

My hopes are that flipping the PSU inward + a pair of 120mm fans will quiet down the PSU under load. If not, I'll replace the fan (being veeeerrrry careful and using rubber gloves when doing so!)



Oh, and has anyone with the Xtreme Gaming tried removing the shroud and replacing it with a pair of bottom-mounted 120mm fans? Taking advantage of the oversized heatsink, but replacing the fans with ones with a better sound signature. Given the construction of the M1, exhaust is the preferred direction, correct?
Click to expand...

I read your last post and think you absolutely have a defective mobo. I had a Z270i with coil whine, 1 usb header bad, and front audio not coming through correctly. You'll definitely want to check that out!
 
xcharlesy said:
I read your last post and think you absolutely have a defective mobo. I had a Z270i with coil whine, 1 usb header bad, and front audio not coming through correctly. You'll definitely want to check that out!
Click to expand...
Alright. I'll look into it.
I'll probably "upgrade" to a z270 board soon and sell the replacement Z170i Pro Gaming when that finally goes through.

Well, assuming that ASUS approves it.
 
xcharlesy said:
I'd say jump all over that! Wow! Amamax is one of Noctuas biggest distributors, and sells a lot via Amazon/Newegg. I would have no hesitation buying that or paying that price.
Click to expand...

I have a full loop in mine, but I know there are a lot of people here who would love to get their hands on a NH C14 but I know they are really, really hard to find.
 
I just got a Z270 ASRock ITX Fatal1ty, and the board is fantastic.... other than the fact it won't post with anything in the DIMM A slot.

DIMM B only works great, DIMM A, nope, DIMM A+B, nope.

CPU fan whirrs up and down kinda pulsing at high rpm.

=/

Going to check tonight with another set of RAM, then RMA it off....

I also ordered a SATA-Express (PCI-E x2) to PCI-E x4 adapter, will let people know if it works tonight. Put that 3rd PCI slot to work...
 
betaflame said:
I just got a Z270 ASRock ITX Fatal1ty, and the board is fantastic.... other than the fact it won't post with anything in the DIMM A slot.

DIMM B only works great, DIMM A, nope, DIMM A+B, nope.

CPU fan whirrs up and down kinda pulsing at high rpm.

=/

Going to check tonight with another set of RAM, then RMA it off....

I also ordered a SATA-Express (PCI-E x2) to PCI-E x4 adapter, will let people know if it works tonight. Put that 3rd PCI slot to work...
Click to expand...
Am I wrong to think there seems to be an unusually large amount of QC issues with these new z270 mobos?
 
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Chimaera43 said:
Am I wrong to think there there seems to be an unusually large amount of QC issues with these new z270 mobos?
Click to expand...

I don't think you are. Reminds me a lot of the old z77 motherboards; I saw five or six of them that just crapped out and lost half their usb ports or their audio or what have you pretty much straight from the factory.
 
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anyone have an Asus Z270i?

just started building and see this:

20170313_181116.jpg

looks to be some sort of tape that needs to be removed?? anyone have any ideas?
 
pookguy88 said:
anyone have an Asus Z270i?

just started building and see this:

View attachment 19236

looks to be some sort of tape that needs to be removed?? anyone have any ideas?
Click to expand...
The metal cover (which is also covered with clear plastic by the way) is a heatsink for any M.2 SSD you install in that slot. The blue tape (that says "remove") is protecting the white thermal pad that should make contact with the label of the SSD (which, most of the labels claim to have some kind of copper or aluminum to them to act as a weird cheap heatsink).
 
awesome thanks... ok, I have another weird issue. So my H100i needs an internal USB connector for power, my old motherboard had two of these but the Z270i doesn't seem to... it does have this header called 'heatsink 3' that isn't documented anywhere in the manual... can I use it for that? pic:
20170313_185602.jpg

edit: just found out it won't fit, I can't align the connector to fit the header properly so it must not be the right connector
 
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noobzilla said:
Whoa, surprised to see that my Z77 Asus Deluxe/WD ITX mobo is selling on ebay used ($~160+) for more than my brand new purchase price ($150). I'm wondering why... is it because Windows 10 is now attached to the mobo? i5 2500K also has solid price at $80. Looks like I won't have to spend much to upgrade to 7700K or the new Ryzen!

Anyone else here looking to upgrade and still deciding between Ryzen and 7700K? Any guesses how many months before an ITX for AM4 gets released?

I'm slightly leaning towards Ryzen since I read it has better minimum frame rates, though gets beat by 7700K overall in gaming. I'm betting that future games are optimized to use more CPU cores. Back when I got the 2500K, there was really no point getting the i7 version for gaming since not many games would use all the threads. That has clearly changed by today.

EDIT: Just watched this. Basically a more in-depth big picture analysis of cpu performance dating back from Intel 2500K vs AMD 8xxx up to 7700K vs Ryzen. I'd say I'm now sold on getting Ryzen for my upgrade.

Click to expand...



For me, the lack of Ryzen compatible M-ITX Mobos pretty much decided it in favor of the 7700K. Since gaming is a secondary priority for me, the 7700K is probably not the best fit and I am intrigued by Ryzen's additional cores. It was a real struggle to find real world (meaning non-gaming skewed benchmarks) that indicated how much performance difference additional cores would make. The lower power 1700 probably simplifies cooling.... In the end, decided not to wait.
 
pookguy88 said:
awesome thanks... ok, I have another weird issue. So my H100i needs an internal USB connector for power, my old motherboard had two of these but the Z270i doesn't seem to... it does have this header called 'heatsink 3' that isn't documented anywhere in the manual... can I use it for that? pic:
View attachment 19240

edit: just found out it won't fit, I can't align the connector to fit the header properly so it must not be the right connector
Click to expand...
I used to have an H80i, and I thought the power for the pump comes from SATA? Also, the internal USB is for the Corsair Link software stuff (which isn't mandatory) but I'm pretty sure the Z270I doesn't have any headers that match.
 
ghostwich said:
I used to have an H80i, and I thought the power for the pump comes from SATA? Also, the internal USB is for the Corsair Link software stuff (which isn't mandatory) but I'm pretty sure the Z270I doesn't have any headers that match.
Click to expand...

you're right, the power for the pump comes from the SATA... but I don't need to plug the internal USB in for Corsair Link? I didn't know that.. it will run without Corsair Link?
 
I'm pretty sure Corsair Link is not mandatory for these units. You're controlling the pump with PWM, fans with a separate PWM header... so, LED lighting?
 
You would have to get a usb 3.0 to 2.0 internal converter cable to connect it. Asus decided to put that weird usb 3.1 connector in the corner that I cant find being used anywhere yet.
 
Hello,

Having just acquired an M1 (undamaged from post #23441), I have some noob questions. I've read several hundred pages of this thread, which have been informative, but at the same time the sheer mass of posts has turned into a stream of mush in my memory.

I have a long time to wait for my build, as I'm waiting for a Ryzen-compatible mini-ITX board to become available which is probably months away. At the same time, I live in Hong Kong where it's surprisingly difficult to get a decent variety of computer parts (e.g. the Noctua U9S is a special order item here and has a 2 month delivery time) so I'd like to at least make a start getting things (fans and coolers) together now via the US.

My system will be something like this:
  • AMD 1700 or 1700X, mildly overclocked, probably using a Noctua U9S or a Dark Rock TF for air cooled simplicity
  • Old graphics card (9" dual fan Radeon R9 270X) as the only game I play is not GPU intensive
  • Motherboard: The only one that's been announced so far is by Biostar, here: https://www.kitguru.net/components/...hows-off-first-mini-itx-x370-am4-motherboard/
  • In addition to SSDs, I'll be mounting a single 3.5" HDD
My main goal is lots of positive air pressure as I live in a dusty environment. I'll be using much finer 3M Filtrete sheets over the fan intakes rather than the dust filters that come with the M1, and these sheets really impact airflow, hence a preference for two high static pressure fans. A second and conflicting goal is I'd like this build not to sound like a hair drier. The PC will be about a yard away, above my head.

I'm going to start off ordering several fans, 2 x NF-F12 and 1 x NF-A15, and possibly a U9S or Dark Rock TF.

So my questions:
  1. Does using a Noctua U9S mean that there is no space for an intake fan directly above the motherboard?
  2. Does the Dark Rock TF still have the terrible mounting system that is mentioned from the old 2015 reviews, or has Dark Rock addressed this? Any idea if this cooler will work with the Biostar motherboard linked above?
  3. Will the addition of the single 3.5" drive interfere with the installation or airflow of a side intake fan?

Thanks.
 
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ghostwich said:
I'm pretty sure Corsair Link is not mandatory for these units. You're controlling the pump with PWM, fans with a separate PWM header... so, LED lighting?
Click to expand...
As with most AIOs the pump speed is fixed, there is no PWM and you shouldn't try to change the pump speed through adjusting the voltage. The USB header is for monitoring water temperature, controlling the light and adjusting fan speeds. I.e. you are stuck with the constant humming noise of the pump, which is the very reason I chose air cooling.
 
tessier-ashpool said:
Hello,

Having just acquired an M1 (undamaged from post #23441), I have some noob questions. I've read several hundred pages of this thread, which have been informative, but at the same time the sheer mass of posts has turned into a stream of mush in my memory.

I have a long time to wait for my build, as I'm waiting for a Ryzen-compatible mini-ITX board to become available which is probably months away. At the same time, I live in Hong Kong where it's surprisingly difficult to get a decent variety of computer parts (e.g. the Noctua U9S is a special order item here and has a 2 month delivery time) so I'd like to at least make a start getting things (fans and coolers) together now via the US.

My system will be something like this:
  • AMD 1700 or 1700X, mildly overclocked, probably using a Noctua U9S or a Dark Rock TF for air cooled simplicity
  • Old graphics card (9" dual fan Radeon R9 270X) as the only game I play is not GPU intensive
  • Motherboard: The only one that's been announced so far is by Biostar, here: https://www.kitguru.net/components/...hows-off-first-mini-itx-x370-am4-motherboard/
  • In addition to SSDs, I'll be mounting a single 3.5" HDD
My main goal is lots of positive air pressure as I live in a dusty environment. I'll be using much finer 3M Filtrete sheets over the fan intakes rather than the dust filters that come with the M1, and these sheets really impact airflow, hence a preference for two high static pressure fans. A second and conflicting goal is I'd like this build not to sound like a hair drier. The PC will be about a yard away, above my head.

I'm going to start off ordering several fans, 2 x NF-F12 and 1 x NF-A15, and possibly a U9S or Dark Rock TF.

So my questions:
  1. Does using a Noctua U9S mean that there is no space for an intake fan directly above the motherboard?
  2. Does the Dark Rock TF still have the terrible mounting system that is mentioned from the old 2015 reviews, or has Dark Rock addressed this? Any idea if this cooler will work with the Biostar motherboard linked above?
  3. Will the addition of the single 3.5" drive interfere with the installation or airflow of a side intake fan?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I'll take a try at your questions:
  1. Yes. The NH-U9S is 125 mm tall and the CPU cooler height limit is 130 mm.
  2. I don't know, but every review that I read complains about the mounting system, so my guess is that it has not changed.
  3. I think you can mount a 120 mm fan in the drive cage and then mount a 3.5-inch drive above it in the cage. I only saw this a long time ago.
Alternatively, you could mount a 3.5-inch drive under the graphics card on the case floor against the rear panel, but that will be a warm place for it. Another option would be to put the 3.5-inch drive in an external enclosure. It would be better if you replaced the 3.5-inch drive with a 2.5-inch model. Seagate has a 5 TB model, and a couple of 4 TB ones as well.
 
In your guys' opinion, in terms of Corsair water cooling, is there a big performance difference between dual radiator (e.g. H100) vs single radiator (i.e. H75, H80) etc.? If not, shouldn't we just go single radiator?
 
tessier-ashpool said:
Hello,

Having just acquired an M1 (undamaged from post #23441), I have some noob questions. I've read several hundred pages of this thread, which have been informative, but at the same time the sheer mass of posts has turned into a stream of mush in my memory.

I have a long time to wait for my build, as I'm waiting for a Ryzen-compatible mini-ITX board to become available which is probably months away. At the same time, I live in Hong Kong where it's surprisingly difficult to get a decent variety of computer parts (e.g. the Noctua U9S is a special order item here and has a 2 month delivery time) so I'd like to at least make a start getting things (fans and coolers) together now via the US.

My system will be something like this:
  • AMD 1700 or 1700X, mildly overclocked, probably using a Noctua U9S or a Dark Rock TF for air cooled simplicity
  • Old graphics card (9" dual fan Radeon R9 270X) as the only game I play is not GPU intensive
  • Motherboard: The only one that's been announced so far is by Biostar, here: https://www.kitguru.net/components/...hows-off-first-mini-itx-x370-am4-motherboard/
  • In addition to SSDs, I'll be mounting a single 3.5" HDD
My main goal is lots of positive air pressure as I live in a dusty environment. I'll be using much finer 3M Filtrete sheets over the fan intakes rather than the dust filters that come with the M1, and these sheets really impact airflow, hence a preference for two high static pressure fans. A second and conflicting goal is I'd like this build not to sound like a hair drier. The PC will be about a yard away, above my head.

I'm going to start off ordering several fans, 2 x NF-F12 and 1 x NF-A15, and possibly a U9S or Dark Rock TF.

So my questions:
  1. Does using a Noctua U9S mean that there is no space for an intake fan directly above the motherboard?
  2. Does the Dark Rock TF still have the terrible mounting system that is mentioned from the old 2015 reviews, or has Dark Rock addressed this? Any idea if this cooler will work with the Biostar motherboard linked above?
  3. Will the addition of the single 3.5" drive interfere with the installation or airflow of a side intake fan?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

You really should look at other cooling options. I know you're in HK, why not take the train a short way to Shenzhen where they have electronics shopping malls for pc building? You can easily find one of the cooling options not readily available in north america. Scythe for example should be very easy to get over there. (I used to live in HK)

pookguy88 said:
In your guys' opinion, in terms of Corsair water cooling, is there a big performance difference between dual radiator (e.g. H100) vs single radiator (i.e. H75, H80) etc.? If not, shouldn't we just go single radiator?
Click to expand...

What's the reason you even need to consider water cooling? What chip / overclock do you desire?
 
xcharlesy said:
You really should look at other cooling options. I know you're in HK, why not take the train a short way to Shenzhen where they have electronics shopping malls for pc building? You can easily find one of the cooling options not readily available in north america. Scythe for example should be very easy to get over there. (I used to live in HK)



What's the reason you even need to consider water cooling? What chip / overclock do you desire?
Click to expand...

I like water cooling because the CPU block is a lot easier to install, less overall noise imo and I already have a H100i from my 2500k system

If I could find a nice CPU air cooler that fits in the N1 with my mobo (Z270i) then I would but every air cooler seems like they have an engineering team who's sole purpose is to make installing it a PITA
 
I prefer air tbh.

I've used all the cooling methods, and custom is reserved for absurd clocks on gpus, and CLC is good when you want to do low case airflow and dump heat outside the case, as well as use negative pressure to reduce the overall number of fans.

Air + ducting is what I've settled on.
 
I just added a Noctua P12 to the side bracket and connected it with the included low noise adapter to my Asus Z270i Strix Gaming but the fan doesn't spin. It just barely moves forward and backwards. Would could I've done wrong?

//edit

Oh well, the P12 seems to be off when not needed and turns on if needed. Does this sound normal to you? I am not familiar with this.
 
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Amr0d said:
I just added a Noctua P12 to the side bracket and connected it with the included low noise adapter to my Asus Z270i Strix Gaming but the fan doesn't spin. It just barely moves forward and backwards. Would could I've done wrong?

//edit

Oh well, the P12 seems to be off when not needed and turns on if needed. Does this sound normal to you? I am not familiar with this.
Click to expand...

You can run it like this. The LNA is limiting the voltage to the P12 fan below what it needs to start spinning.

Alternatively, you could remove the LNA and then create a profile for the fan in FanXpert or another application, such as SpeedFan.
 
Currently the fan is not even recognized by the mainboard. Are you sure that it's not caused by the LNA?
 
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