Hackers Make Game Boy, Mega Drive, SNES Games Playable on NES Mini

Megalith

Megalith

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Playing Genesis games on an NES? That’s like, sacrilege, right? You’ll probably have to get a controller with more than two buttons (e.g., Wii Classic Controller) to enjoy them in full, but you can very well play everything from Mega Drive to Game Boy games on the NES Mini now. Is it still hard to find stock?

…the budget system is pretty easy to hack, with those keen to use the tiny box for more games finding a way within weeks, rather than the months or years similar efforts can take on other Nintendo consoles. Rather quickly there were people finding ways to add their own games, to the point that the whole NES library came into play. Of course, hacking the system is legally questionable - due to the use of unofficial ROMS etc - and has the potential to disrupt it further. In any case, we seem to have gone down the rabbit hole now, as some have found a way to run a well-known bit of emulation software. It's not pretty in terms of user interface, but as the video below shows the NES Mini is capable of running Game Boy, Mega Drive and SNES games, albeit there are occasional choppy moments with the 16-bit titles; this may improve as the hackers work on the exploit further.
 
It exposes more people to the classics and as cool as this is, ain't nothin' like the real thing. Nintendo really shot themselves in the foot by not allowing purchase of additional titles or support with updates to their official emulator. Also, Double Dragon 2 but not the first one? Again, Super C but no Contra? The same goes for Megaman, WTF Nintendo.
 
blkt said:
It exposes more people to the classics and as cool as this is, ain't nothin' like the real thing. Nintendo really shot themselves in the foot by not allowing purchase of additional titles or support with updates to their official emulator. Also, Double Dragon 2 but not the first one? Again, Super C but no Contra? The same goes for Megaman, WTF Nintendo.
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The rights were probably cheaper for those.
 
I remember the good ol days when ZSNES and Snes9x were battling it out and a fresh new edgy enthusiast site was just getting started....
 
I was going to buy a NES Mini for my kids as a Christmas present. What a mess - everyone knows the story of how they ran out and you couldn't get one. Now, it's after Christmas and I don't care. I think Nintendo really made a bad decision with that product.
If they come out with an SNES or whatever this coming Fall, I hope they learn a lesson and have enough for people to buy. I gotta wonder - how much money did they lose out on? I'm sure I'm not the only one that thought it was a good stocking stuffer. I haven't even checked to see if you can buy them know.
I already had RetroPi setup for me.
 
A pi3 is the much better choice in every regard, why waste money on this?
 
steakman1971 said:
I was going to buy a NES Mini for my kids as a Christmas present. What a mess - everyone knows the story of how they ran out and you couldn't get one. Now, it's after Christmas and I don't care. I think Nintendo really made a bad decision with that product.
If they come out with an SNES or whatever this coming Fall, I hope they learn a lesson and have enough for people to buy. I gotta wonder - how much money did they lose out on? I'm sure I'm not the only one that thought it was a good stocking stuffer. I haven't even checked to see if you can buy them know.
I already had RetroPi setup for me.
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Same here. My wife was going to buy one for me for Christmas but couldn't find any. Now she doesn't care and I didn't need one in the first place. Already have a Wii and WiiU with virtual console along with a HTPC and emulators.
 
It was probably in nintendos best interest to make this thing "hackable"

You still can't find them in stores. Pretty crazy. Word on the street is mid March or so big retailers might finally have some.

Nintendo blames production supplier shortages, but this thing is about as advanced as a toaster oven now-a-days.

steakman1971 said:
I was going to buy a NES Mini for my kids as a Christmas present. What a mess - everyone knows the story of how they ran out and you couldn't get one. Now, it's after Christmas and I don't care. I think Nintendo really made a bad decision with that product.
If they come out with an SNES or whatever this coming Fall, I hope they learn a lesson and have enough for people to buy. I gotta wonder - how much money did they lose out on? I'm sure I'm not the only one that thought it was a good stocking stuffer. I haven't even checked to see if you can buy them know.
I already had RetroPi setup for me.
Click to expand...
 
westrock2000 said:
It was probably in nintendos best interest to make this thing "hackable"

You still can't find them in stores. Pretty crazy. Word on the street is mid March or so big retailers might finally have some.

Nintendo blames production supplier shortages, but this thing is about as advanced as a toaster oven now-a-days.
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Seems like they just weren't prepared, I'm sure how advanced it is isn't an issue.
 
Vaulter98c said:
A pi3 is the much better choice in every regard, why waste money on this?
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Pi requires at least some degree of computer literacy, some finess and Legal ROMS (the latter of which is definitely not easy to get).

the NES mini doesn't have any of the issues, it's plug and play, and completely legal as they are directly from Nintendo themselves.

But, I am in agreement with you on that, RetroPi on Pi3 is a far superior option for this kind of thing, and also I find the NES mini controller to be hideously small, so I prefer a full sized game pad.
 
chenw said:
Pi requires at least some degree of computer literacy, some finess and Legal ROMS (the latter of which is definitely not easy to get).

the NES mini doesn't have any of the issues, it's plug and play, and completely legal as they are directly from Nintendo themselves.

But, I am in agreement with you on that, RetroPi on Pi3 is a far superior option for this kind of thing, and also I find the NES mini controller to be hideously small, so I prefer a full sized game pad.
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The hack on the NES Classic does require some degree of computer literacy. That being said, it requires software literacy not necessarily hardware knowledge like a Raspberry Pi does.

The hack makes use of RetroArch, freely available software mainly for use on Linux operating systems as a front end for the emulators and the ROM's. Most of the interface shown and all of the emulators used are EXACTLY the same ones used in RetroPie (a Debian Linux variant for Raspberry Pi).

Also, you can not get those Sega ROMS used in the video direct from Nintendo and the hack itself and use of other company's ROM's is not sanctioned by Nintendo. Modification of the device to play legally acquired Nintendo ROM's probably still breaks some Nintendo software licensing agreement, but I doubt anyone gives a rat's ass, including Nintendo.

There's a place for both setups. However, if you are the tinkering type and want to be able to play more systems, a Raspberry Pie setup with Retropie is a lot more flexible.
 
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Yeah, that's my primary issue with the NES classic, if you want to do literally anything else with it, Raspberry Pi with RetroPie system would end up being much more useful (and probably cheaper too), and much more open to customisation than even a Hacked NES Classic, unless there are some hardware advtages?
 
chenw said:
Yeah, that's my primary issue with the NES classic, if you want to do literally anything else with it, Raspberry Pi with RetroPie system would end up being much more useful (and probably cheaper too), and much more open to customisation than even a Hacked NES Classic, unless there are some hardware advtages?
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The hardware advantages are with literally every other conceivable device OTHER than the NES Classic.

We're talking almost every other single board computer setup out there be it Raspberry Pi, Latte Panda, Odroid, your average $50 Amazon.com Android TV special, your cell phone, etc. The NES Classic was designed with one goal in mind, playing NES ROM's. The fact that it can do anything more means that it was actually too expensive for Nintendo to downgrade the hardware further.
 
Which makes me wonder if Nintendo is trying too hard to stay in the hardware business...

Like, they have a literal goldmine of retro titles that could do very well on distribution platforms like Steam and such (Sega has their own Genesis classics on Steam), especially the mobile market, where they'd probably make an absolute killing even with license fees in.
 
at this point why not go with any cheap android box off amazon/ebay? Mine plays games right up to the ps1 and nintendo DS era just fine, plus android games and supports kodi/plex/youtube/netflix all for the same price these nintendo classics cost lol. The only advantage the Nintendo classic had was plug and play but getting this far to emulate others your far better off with a android box or pii system
 
Ragenrok said:
at this point why not go with any cheap android box off amazon/ebay? Mine plays games right up to the ps1 and nintendo DS era just fine, plus android games and supports kodi/plex/youtube/netflix all for the same price these nintendo classics cost lol
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Either nostalgia (Android TV box =/= NES shaped), or the legality of the ROMs/BIOS themselves.

NES classic is pretty faithful to the original designed of the NES, my main problem is that the joypad is TINY, and there is no room for expansion, which is, literally, a wasted opportunity.
 
CaptNumbNutz said:
The hack on the NES Classic does require some degree of computer literacy. That being said, it requires software literacy not necessarily hardware knowledge like a Raspberry Pi does.

The hack makes use of RetroArch, freely available software mainly for use on Linux operating systems as a front end for the emulators and the ROM's. Most of the interface shown and all of the emulators used are EXACTLY the same ones used in RetroPie (a Debian Linux variant for Raspberry Pi).

Also, you can not get those Sega ROMS used in the video direct from Nintendo and the hack itself and use of other company's ROM's is not sanctioned by Nintendo. Modification of the device to play legally acquired Nintendo ROM's probably still breaks some Nintendo software licensing agreement, but I doubt anyone gives a rat's ass, including Nintendo.

There's a place for both setups. However, if you are the tinkering type and want to be able to play more systems, a Raspberry Pie setup with Retropie is a lot more flexible.
Click to expand...

Retro arch on a pi3 is not accurate in NES or SNES FYI.
 
I was referring to the hack. If you want the NES mini for what it is it's fine, as long as you don't pay the stupid high prices. If you are going to hack it tho you need just as much, if not more, computer literacy as you do for a retro pie setup.

Literally. Get Pi, put in a plastic case (or buy ones in a case). Get a micro SD card. Use a simple 2 click program documented on youtube to flash the image to the card. Put card in Pi. Plug in like just any other micro usb device and it's on and working. You're most advanced setup for a simple user would be pushing buttons to map a controller but that's required and pops up on it's own anyways.You just push the button on the controller that's on the screen. Then, you drag and drop your roms into folders from your PC on the network and you're done. For the simple user I'd say those steps are easier then the NES mini hack, and no chance to brick it (granted I can't say this has happened on the Mini yet but it could). Then, if you want, you can go much deeper in the Pi for other settings and teaks but even just as a simple base user it's already better at this point then what the hacked mini offers. Hell, even the UI is easier on the pi then the hacked mini, because from what I've seen on youtube you have to load 2 things before you can run a game, you can't just scroll through a list and click a game and start playing.

And Mini NES emulation isn't accurate either watch some RGB comparisons on youtube, it's better then the Wii U but still not 100% to the real hardware. It's close, but then again so is the Pi. If you're going to make accurate an argument you can't include anything but the real hardware.

If you're going to make hacking an argument, the better CPU, built in wireless and wired networking, built in bluetooth for controllers, non-proprietary expansion slots, higher native resolution if you want it, cheaper price, expandable memory, ease of updating and initial setup, open hardware platform, and even the availability of the Pi3 over the mini just destroys the argument. If you're going to consider hacking at all there is zero advantage that system gives compared to a Pi3.
 
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Master_shake_ said:
i noticed while playing super mario world (SNES) on my OG XBOX the jump is a little delayed.

while on the PC it isn't, how is it on the pi?
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I don't notice it. However, I do not own an SNES to compare it too. For me, it plays exactly the same on the Pi 3 running Retropie 3.8 and Retropie 4.1 as it does on my Windows based emulator.

Verge said:
Do you have a NES/SNES hooked up?


You won't need an explanation if you do :)
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No, I don't. Which is why I asked you to elaborate. :confused:

I haven't owned either system in 20 years. However, I'm not a purist, quirks of emulation are fine with me as long as they don't significantly alter gameplay. I have not experienced this jump delay you are speaking of on my setup. The only thing I have to compare it to is using SNES9X emulator on a Windows PC, and for me the play for that game on the Pi is identical to the PC emulator. However, I don't deny that it exists or occurs in certain scenarios. This is software emulation after all. I'm sure if I had both systems side by side I could pinpoint it. If the delay is there, I don't notice it and adjusted my play style to accommodate it unconsciously.

That being said, all of this is moot because we are talking about the NES Classic system and this "hack" to get additional games running. The fact that it is running RetroArch at all means these additional ROMS, be they NES, SNES, Sega or any other game system, are being emulated just like they are on a Raspberry Pi. The hardware used on the NES Classic is no where close to the original, so at best the 30 some games included with the system were re-compiled for the new hardware. Seeing that the hardware in the NES Classic is woefully lacking compared to the likes of the humble Raspberry Pi 3, I have my doubts that the additional games added through the hack perform equally to a Raspberry Pi or even equally when compared to the ones native to the machine.
 
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Well if I recall correctly nesticle could run fine on a 386 DX back in the day ;) maybe minus punchout... so I cannot imagine that the emulation of nes is that demanding. I guess the hack is cool if you got a nes mini you can load a few more games, I think the platform has over 700 titles in total. Probably not worth the cost really unless you dont want to mess with it that much.... kinda pissed about the short controller cables. Launchbox for the PC is a pretty cool front end for emulators(steam and dos box too) that makes setup a breeze on multiple platforms using retroarch or custom emulators. PC is going to be the option for advanced emulation like ps2, wii, higher end mame and later stuff as the rpi3 is good but just not enough horsepower under the hood. But then again you are talking about way more $$$
 
rhansen5_99 said:
Well if I recall correctly nesticle could run fine on a 386 DX back in the day ;) maybe minus punchout... so I cannot imagine that the e I guess the hack is cool if you got a nes mini you can load a few more games, I think the platform has over 700 titles in total. Probably not worth the cost really unless you dont want to mess with it that much.... kinda pissed about the short controller cabmulation of nes is that demanding. les. Launchbox for the PC is a pretty cool front end for emulators(steam and dos box too) that makes setup a breeze on multiple platforms using retroarch or custom emulators. PC is going to be the option for advanced emulation like ps2, wii, higher end mame and later stuff as the rpi3 is good but just not enough horsepower under the hood. But then again you are talking about way more $$$
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Ah yes, the venerable Sardu and his emulators (Nesticle, Genecyst, Callus) were a gift showcasing what assembly optimizations could do. It was the only time I was able to utilize the QSound chip on my Sound Blaster AWE32 (and yes, it was awesome). MAME still can't run certain CPS games at the proper timings or speeds (sf2t/sf2hfu). You might be surprised how much extra resources are required for true accurate emulation. Sorry for off topic, my member berries are acting up again.
 
CaptNumbNutz said:
I don't notice it. However, I do not own an SNES to compare it too. For me, it plays exactly the same on the Pi 3 running Retropie 3.8 and Retropie 4.1 as it does on my Windows based emulator.


No, I don't. Which is why I asked you to elaborate. :confused:

I haven't owned either system in 20 years. However, I'm not a purist, quirks of emulation are fine with me as long as they don't significantly alter gameplay. I have not experienced this jump delay you are speaking of on my setup. The only thing I have to compare it to is using SNES9X emulator on a Windows PC, and for me the play for that game on the Pi is identical to the PC emulator. However, I don't deny that it exists or occurs in certain scenarios. This is software emulation after all. I'm sure if I had both systems side by side I could pinpoint it. If the delay is there, I don't notice it and adjusted my play style to accommodate it unconsciously.

That being said, all of this is moot because we are talking about the NES Classic system and this "hack" to get additional games running. The fact that it is running RetroArch at all means these additional ROMS, be they NES, SNES, Sega or any other game system, are being emulated just like they are on a Raspberry Pi. The hardware used on the NES Classic is no where close to the original, so at best the 30 some games included with the system were re-compiled for the new hardware. Seeing that the hardware in the NES Classic is woefully lacking compared to the likes of the humble Raspberry Pi 3, I have my doubts that the additional games added through the hack perform equally to a Raspberry Pi or even equally when compared to the ones native to the machine.
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It's laggy and unresponsive in some games. More so the SNES.

Same reason I dumped that stupid ouya, it just isn't the same. Requires 3ghz on a pc.
 
Verge said:
It's laggy and unresponsive in some games. More so the SNES.

Same reason I dumped that stupid ouya, it just isn't the same. Requires 3ghz on a pc.
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I get where your coming from, but what your describing does not happen 100% of the time.

Processor speed is only secondary to the efficiency of the emulator itself. I've been emulating since 1998 with a Pentium II. Even the NES Classic is running a quad core ARM A7 chip in it with 256MB of RAM which is less than the Pi3's Quad Core ARM A8 running at 1.2ghz with 1GB of RAM. The NES Classic is roughly on par with the older Pi2 (which uses a Cortex A7) and uses the exact same versions of RetroArch for this hack.

It's all about the efficiency of the software now. TBH, I've been doing this since Retropie 3.8 last year and have found only a handful of games that are laggy. Even those that lagged were still playable. Yes, it is frustrating when you playing 1943 and have 20 enemy planes on the screen all firing their guns at you in and the game slows to a crawl for a brief second, but it isn't constant nor does it happen often enough for me or most of the community to care. If the community made this to be as big a deal as it is with a gaming purist like yourself, I doubt the community would be as big as it is now.

As far as how this relates to the thread at hand...
Excluding the 30 games that ship with the NES Classic (they are potentially re-compiled or running on their own efficient proprietary emulator), the NES Classic is not going to exceed the performance of a Pi3 using this hack for several reasons:
1. It uses the exact same emulation software on both (RetroArch).
2. It has a slower CPU in both mhz and IPC. The CPU it uses is the same architecture as the one in the older Pi2.
3. The NES Classic has yet to be overclocked.
 
CaptNumbNutz said:
Yes, it is frustrating when you playing 1943 and have 20 enemy planes on the screen all firing their guns at you
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Off topic, but damn I didn't think anyone else on this planet knew of this game...

Another off topic: is there options on the RetroPio emulators that would remove certain limitations on the old hardware, like Mesen has with its sprite limit remover?

One of the problems I have often encountered playing 1943 (including on the original FC, which I still have, though I am not sure if it still functions) is that the sprites would often flash if there's too many planes and/or bullets on the screen.
 
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