Windows 10 Redstone 2 Will Be Released In April

Flogger23m said:
Because the update broke functionality in a piece of software I use. Clear & concise. Not much more to it than that.
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Ok, but BF1 I just can't get. So BF1 was broken by a Windows 10 update but I'm running at 4k with SLI perfectly? And I never had to reinstall it? I've said it many times. Bash Windows 10 to hell and that's fine by me. But if you're telling me a Windows 10 update broke something I use that's working perfectly? Do you not get why some people are happy with 10? That they don't see all of these problems. And yeah, I saw the problem when the BF1 update broke SLI.

If Windows 10 is so horrible for some they shouldn't use it. There's no fucking way I'd touch it if it fucked up all the stuff you're saying. I've spent too much on all this. If there's something better, that's all I want. But not if that solution breaks more than the problems you're reporting.
 
Flogger23m said:
Bring it up with your co-workers or someone higher up and maybe they can look into it further.
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There's tons of folks on this site playing BF1 on Windows 10 and it's used as a benchmark in like every GPU review on this site with Windows 10. A profound problem with Windows 10 and updates would be well known around here by now.
 
grtitan said:
Ahh, another glorious update that will magically reset everything back to ms apps and must likely, way more spyware crap that cannot be disabled, per orders of the NSA.

Man, we really need a good alternative to MS.
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You know I'd be all for several decent Linux distros combining their projects into a united Voltron like super Linux that could get enough users to truly make MS take notice and try harder. Won't happen though.
 
Ultima99 said:
You know I'd be all for several decent Linux distros combining their projects into a united Voltron like super Linux that could get enough users to truly make MS take notice and try harder. Won't happen though.
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And yet Linux fans won't listen or don't care.
 
damn, i was hoping the update would be out sooner. i want my HDR support.

but hopefully the dpi scaling thing works well. or atleast well enough with 4k.
 
Ultima99 said:
You know I'd be all for several decent Linux distros combining their projects into a united Voltron like super Linux that could get enough users to truly make MS take notice and try harder. Won't happen though.
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The Microsoft employees around here sure seem to freak out every time Linux is mentioned as a viable Windows alternative. Used to be everyone (myself included) just sat around joking about how Linux would never gain traction on the desktop.

Do you currently run any boxes with Linux or have you recently? Load up Mint or your favorite distro, you may be surprised. All my hardware 'just works,' all my favorite games and 1/4 the Steam store is Linux native. It's not like a couple years ago where you really had to have a Windows box. I keep a Windows 7 install on one SSD in case I want to stream some old games to my Linux machines, but otherwise I haven't touched Windows since I made the switch to Linux Mint back in October.
 
DeathFromBelow said:
I keep a Windows 7 install on one SSD in case I want to stream some old games to my Linux machines, but otherwise I haven't touched Windows since I made the switch to Linux Mint back in October.
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Stream old Windows games to a Linux machine? LOL! You might want to check this line.
 
DeathFromBelow said:
The Microsoft employees around here sure seem to freak out every time Linux is mentioned as a viable Windows alternative. Used to be everyone (myself included) just sat around joking about how Linux would never gain traction on the desktop.

Do you currently run any boxes with Linux or have you recently? Load up Mint or your favorite distro, you may be surprised. All my hardware 'just works,' all my favorite games and 1/4 the Steam store is Linux native. It's not like a couple years ago where you really had to have a Windows box. I keep a Windows 7 install on one SSD in case I want to stream some old games to my Linux machines, but otherwise I haven't touched Windows since I made the switch to Linux Mint back in October.
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I don't run a regular Linux box but I use and play around with Ubuntu from time to time including 16.04 LTS. I've briefly tried Mint as well and they're both fine, but so is Windows really. My comment was more referring to the complete fragmentation of the Linux community being more of a hindrance at this point than a strength. Some of the good and more popular distros could conceivably funnel their efforts into a very well rounded and better supported OS with a larger userbase and maybe hope to get real, serious, traction that might actually be a threat to Windows. As it is now they're still more of a threat to each other which has been great to get them to compete with each other, but they have bigger fish to fry. If you don't think fragmentation isn't a problem just look at Google and all the versions of Android. It's all the same OS but even the different versions out there have been problematic for the ecosystem as a whole.
 
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ManofGod said:
Excellent FUD you have going there but hey, it must be if you experiencing these problems, everyone is! :rolleyes:
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ManofGod said:
Spymode, LOL! Good luck, do you have any actual, verifiable proof, not just your opinion? :rolleyes:
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You don't have much room to talk about FUD, when I caught you gaslighting just a few days ago. The fact that you just tried to obfuscate the issue afterwards then went silent on the issue makes you look very dishonest. So even if you have legitimate points, you've undermined yourself, because those kinds of tactics are not what honest people do and it makes your credibility almost worthless. As far as I'm concerned, you're just an advanced troll. At least heartlesssun has an obvious bias and he can present false dichotomies, but he tries to argue his side and is not engaging in active propaganda techniques. You accusing others of FUD is rich, man.
 
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tetris42 said:
You don't have much room to talk about FUD, when I caught you gaslighting just a few days ago. The fact that you just tried to obfuscate the issue afterwards then went silent on the issue makes you look very dishonest. So even if you have legitimate points, you've undermined yourself, because those kinds of tactics are not what honest people do and it makes your credibility almost worthless. As far as I'm concerned, you're just an advanced troll. At least heartlesssun has an obvious bias and he can present false dichotomies, but he tries to argue his side and is not engaging in active propaganda techniques. You accusing others of FUD is rich, man.
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It seemed like you were talking to yourself, then I realized the ignore function even removes the quotes from the ignored person from other members comments.
 
Flogger23m said:
Fairly easy, just read a few posts above (#46). Numerous users are having the same problem and I already know of two others having the same issues. When you pull your head out of your ass and wipe the shit off your face, you can probably see why people are annoyed.



You're confusing many different issues here; don't lump them all into one.

1) Windows 10 AU full screen problems in 3D applications.
2) Updater that has an obscene amount of fuck ups.
3) Updater that brings anything but high end systems to a crawl.
4) Windows 10 is getting slower and slower over time, unless you have a high end system.

3-4 aren't problems if you're running a high end desktop, but are if you're running the average laptop. Which most of the world does.
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fud fud fud fud.

you need some anti-fud pills?
 
tetris42 said:
You don't have much room to talk about FUD, when I caught you gaslighting just a few days ago. The fact that you just tried to obfuscate the issue afterwards then went silent on the issue makes you look very dishonest. So even if you have legitimate points, you've undermined yourself, because those kinds of tactics are not what honest people do and it makes your credibility almost worthless. As far as I'm concerned, you're just an advanced troll. At least heartlesssun has an obvious bias and he can present false dichotomies, but he tries to argue his side and is not engaging in active propaganda techniques. You accusing others of FUD is rich, man.
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Nope, I just did not care one way or the other and besides, specifically asked for clarification and context. But hey, deflect, deflect, deflect..........
 
ManofGod said:
Nope, I just did not care one way or the other and besides, specifically asked for clarification and context. But hey, deflect, deflect, deflect..........
Click to expand...
See this is what I mean by obfuscation. You need context on what YOU said? I put in quotes what heartlesssun said, then your quote saying he never said that. What more context do you need? Again, it's like he said the sky is blue, I said the sky is grey, and you came along and said no one ever said the sky is blue. And what am I deflecting? It's an important point that your commentary isn't helpful to the thread if you're actively gaslighting and trying to obfuscate everything. That's trolling and it's worth it for others to see it laid out bare. I do believe the part about you not caring one way or another though.
 
I have most of my computers running Windows 10, but I still have one running Windows 7 in case I find something that's not compatible with Windows 10. I have to say, whenever I fire up that computer and try to go back to Windows 7, I end up missing 10.

I keep getting annoyed that I can't use any of my Windows Store apps, can't use Edge, and it seems like things crash more often. If I ever need to reinstall it, I have to fuss around with making sure I slipstream my Z77 motherboard drivers into the installation, or it won't even work with the Z77's SATA controller. On top of that, it's actually more convenient to use the right-click menu on the Windows icon along with the search bar than it is to find stuff on Windows 7's start menu.

I'm thinking a lot of people here might be running Sandy Bridge-based systems. I see a lot of talk about how people haven't needed to upgrade since they overclocked their 2600k. Sure, there are probably people going around installing Windows 7 on their Skylake/Kaby Lake systems, but I think a lot of people are still running the computers they had before Windows 10 even came out. Historically speaking, people really hate changing out their OS on the computer they own, and notice all the backward compatibility issues. Most would rather stick with what they have until they buy a new system.

Now, being fair to the people that don't like Windows 10 at all, I can see where they're coming from. I notice the lack of built-in DVD playback functionality, and the lack of Windows Media Center. For anyone who wants to use their PC as an HTPC or something, Windows 7 is probably easier to use out of the box. The loss of the Windows XP mode VM is a problem for anyone that wants to run legacy applications that won't run outside of it (in fact, I most often have to use my Windows 7 PC to run Windows XP mode, because I'm too cheap/lazy to buy a Windows XP license to install into a VM on my Windows 10 installation). But I rarely do any of that stuff... except for occasionally watching DVDs or Blu-Rays on my machine, and I had no trouble using VLC player or Leawo player to deal with that issue. I also notice that they took away a lot of built-in games like Solitaire and give you Windows Store apps in their place, which can be more cumbersome to use and take longer to start up, log themselves into Xbox Games, etc.

In my opinion, as a guy that's been using Windows since 3.11, I've seen a lot of stuff. And I honestly think the version of Windows with the best interface for a desktop user was probably Windows 2000/Me/98. In Windows XP, the default Start Menu was awful, but you could still set the theme and start menu style to "classic" and make it look like Windows 2000. But starting with Vista, you didn't have that option anymore. So from my perspective, the Windows interface has been borked since Windows XP to the point that I could barely even use the Start Menu and just either searched for everything, pinned them to the taskbar, stuck the icons on my desktop, etc. To me, Windows 8 wasn't even a huge adjustment, it just felt like going back to the Windows 3.11 Program Manager, when you had to switch between your desktop where you could see minimized icons... and maximizing the place you start the programs from. Just for fun, I organized all the icons into groups with names like "Main," "Games," etc. And just when I got used to it, they brought Windows 10 into the mix... and I was stuck relying on pinned icons and searches again, because they turned the app menu into a junky list that throws in whatever is "most used" in a tiny part of the screen that you can't re-order, label, or organize (although recent updates have made it a little better). Which is exactly what I hated about XP/Vista/7. Everyone else who grew up with Windows XP/Vista/7 was happy. I missed being able to see everything I have installed with a glance. What I do like about Windows 10, though, is that it's very easy to expose advanced functionality. Between the action center and right-clicking the Windows icon, the administrative/configuration features I use on a regular basis are exposed with one click, without hunting through menus or using the search bar. That's the best I've had it since XP.

As for the security/spyware stuff... well, a lot of modern conveniences like Skydrive and Cortana require this. There's always a price to convenience. I get sick of being asked to change my password every month, and I always have to write it down unless I use a minor variant on a few that I use normally. But there's more database hacking, and they genuinely expect you to be ready to input a completely different password every month... that's a lot of responsibility, and most people would rather use facial recognition or give up their phone number for an automated text than think up and memorize good passwords on a regular basis. Sometimes even using, say, their Facebook/Twitter/Google account to login to other websites, potentially increasing the number of accounts that could be compromised at once. As bad as Microsoft may seem to be getting, you would be as bad off or worse on Android or a Chromebook. I personally (and this is a purely subjective, gut-feeling choice on my part) trust Google far less than Microsoft, because you pay them absolutely nothing and they make ALL their money off your information. Microsoft is ostensibly providing premium services and has an incentive to provide more security, although I'm sure that since people, unfortunately, prefer free stuff to privacy as a rule, they may be pushed towards the Google model in the future. I'm just saying, there's a reason why I have a Windows Phone instead of an Android Phone at the moment.

I don't really like how Linux is going either in terms of interfaces, to be honest. Gnome 3 is several times worse than Windows 10, and KDE feels like a slower and more bloated version of Windows 7/Vista. Wayland is threatening to make it tough to run any Window Manager you want, because Gnome and KDE are pretty much the only projects that are big enough to make their own Wayland compositor. X11 has a compositor built in, and once stuff isn't written to use that anymore, you'll likely be stuck using one of the big desktops (or at least having the whole thing available so other software can keep piggybacking on that desktop's compositor and breaking everytime something is changed). SystemD is also removing a lot of the choice and customization features that made Linux appealing to me in the first place (and there are rumors flying about SystemD being a security risk in the Linux community as well). A lot of choices that you probably won't like are going to be made for you if you want to use most software, and that's only getting worse.

Dumbed-down interfaces, limited choice, and touch-friendly are the order of the day, because too many people have grown up using nothing but smartphones. Microsoft is really far from the worst offender. If you look at the big picture, we've passed the point where technology caters to power users, and reached the point where the focus is on dumbing it down enough so that even the youngest and most uneducated people in the most impoverished nations can figure it out. That's where the untapped markets are, and that doesn't bode well for anyone who likes tweaking stuff for maximum performance, or using stuff to do anything other than what it was designed to do. Intellectual property owners would probably also love to see operating systems locked down to the point that people can't even run unlicensed software. It's going to be an uphill battle for power users, might as well face that right now.

I may not love everything about Windows 10, but I would have to say it suits my workflow and style a lot better than KDE, Gnome, or (yuck) Mac OS. It's even better than the Windows 7 interface to my mind. And they do seem to make it subtly better with each update... alphabetizing the app list, adding a section off to the right with little groups and such like Windows 8 had before, etc. Out of the ones I've tried, this one seems to reward me the most for mastering all the new functionality. Task view, action center, right-clicking on the Windows button, using the search bar straight from a click... pinning apps, organizing the Start icons into groups, etc. There's a lot to like here, and it seems like they've tried to take everything that worked with previous Windows interfaces and fit it all together here.
 
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opfreak said:
so to play games on your Linux box you need windows. Ironic?
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Nope, but it is convienient for people making the transition to Linux. All my favorite games and about 1/3 of my whole steam library are Linux native. Lately most of my gaming is Kerbal Space Program, Civ 5/Beyond Earth, Cities: Skylines, Europa Universalis IV, Stellaris, Mineraft, and Mount and Blade Warband, all Linux native.

I keep 7 on an SSD in case I run into something I can't get working. It's been some time now though. I thought I needed Windows to to play Age of Empires II/III HD but it turns out they run fine under Wine.
 
athenian200 said:
I have most of my computers running Windows 10, but I still have one running Windows 7 in case I find something that's not compatible with Windows 10. I have to say, whenever I fire up that computer and try to go back to Windows 7, I end up missing 10.

I keep getting annoyed that I can't use any of my Windows Store apps, can't use Edge, and it seems like things crash more often. If I ever need to reinstall it, I have to fuss around with making sure I slipstream my Z77 motherboard drivers into the installation, or it won't even work with the Z77's SATA controller. On top of that, it's actually more convenient to use the right-click menu on the Windows icon along with the search bar than it is to find stuff on Windows 7's start menu.

I'm thinking a lot of people here might be running Sandy Bridge-based systems. I see a lot of talk about how people haven't needed to upgrade since they overclocked their 2600k. Sure, there are probably people going around installing Windows 7 on their Skylake/Kaby Lake systems, but I think a lot of people are still running the computers they had before Windows 10 even came out. Historically speaking, people really hate changing out their OS on the computer they own, and notice all the backward compatibility issues. Most would rather stick with what they have until they buy a new system.

Now, being fair to the people that don't like Windows 10 at all, I can see where they're coming from. I notice the lack of built-in DVD playback functionality, and the lack of Windows Media Center. For anyone who wants to use their PC as an HTPC or something, Windows 7 is probably easier to use out of the box. The loss of the Windows XP mode VM is a problem for anyone that wants to run legacy applications that won't run outside of it (in fact, I most often have to use my Windows 7 PC to run Windows XP mode, because I'm too cheap/lazy to buy a Windows XP license to install into a VM on my Windows 10 installation). But I rarely do any of that stuff... except for occasionally watching DVDs or Blu-Rays on my machine, and I had no trouble using VLC player or Leawo player to deal with that issue. I also notice that they took away a lot of built-in games like Solitaire and give you Windows Store apps in their place, which can be more cumbersome to use and take longer to start up, log themselves into Xbox Games, etc.

In my opinion, as a guy that's been using Windows since 3.11, I've seen a lot of stuff. And I honestly think the version of Windows with the best interface for a desktop user was probably Windows 2000/Me/98. In Windows XP, the default Start Menu was awful, but you could still set the theme and start menu style to "classic" and make it look like Windows 2000. But starting with Vista, you didn't have that option anymore. So from my perspective, the Windows interface has been borked since Windows XP to the point that I could barely even use the Start Menu and just either searched for everything, pinned them to the taskbar, stuck the icons on my desktop, etc. To me, Windows 8 wasn't even a huge adjustment, it just felt like going back to the Windows 3.11 Program Manager, when you had to switch between your desktop where you could see minimized icons... and maximizing the place you start the programs from. Just for fun, I organized all the icons into groups with names like "Main," "Games," etc. And just when I got used to it, they brought Windows 10 into the mix... and I was stuck relying on pinned icons and searches again, because they turned the app menu into a junky list that throws in whatever is "most used" in a tiny part of the screen that you can't re-order, label, or organize (although recent updates have made it a little better). Which is exactly what I hated about XP/Vista/7. Everyone else who grew up with Windows XP/Vista/7 was happy. I missed being able to see everything I have installed with a glance. What I do like about Windows 10, though, is that it's very easy to expose advanced functionality. Between the action center and right-clicking the Windows icon, the administrative/configuration features I use on a regular basis are exposed with one click, without hunting through menus or using the search bar. That's the best I've had it since XP.

As for the security/spyware stuff... well, a lot of modern conveniences like Skydrive and Cortana require this. There's always a price to convenience. I get sick of being asked to change my password every month, and I always have to write it down unless I use a minor variant on a few that I use normally. But there's more database hacking, and they genuinely expect you to be ready to input a completely different password every month... that's a lot of responsibility, and most people would rather use facial recognition or give up their phone number for an automated text than think up and memorize good passwords on a regular basis. Sometimes even using, say, their Facebook/Twitter/Google account to login to other websites, potentially increasing the number of accounts that could be compromised at once. As bad as Microsoft may seem to be getting, you would be as bad off or worse on Android or a Chromebook. I personally (and this is a purely subjective, gut-feeling choice on my part) trust Google far less than Microsoft, because you pay them absolutely nothing and they make ALL their money off your information. Microsoft is ostensibly providing premium services and has an incentive to provide more security, although I'm sure that since people, unfortunately, prefer free stuff to privacy as a rule, they may be pushed towards the Google model in the future. I'm just saying, there's a reason why I have a Windows Phone instead of an Android Phone at the moment.

I don't really like how Linux is going either in terms of interfaces, to be honest. Gnome 3 is several times worse than Windows 10, and KDE feels like a slower and more bloated version of Windows 7/Vista. Wayland is threatening to make it tough to run any Window Manager you want, because Gnome and KDE are pretty much the only projects that are big enough to make their own Wayland compositor. X11 has a compositor built in, and once stuff isn't written to use that anymore, you'll likely be stuck using one of the big desktops (or at least having the whole thing available so other software can keep piggybacking on that desktop's compositor and breaking everytime something is changed). SystemD is also removing a lot of the choice and customization features that made Linux appealing to me in the first place (and there are rumors flying about SystemD being a security risk in the Linux community as well). A lot of choices that you probably won't like are going to be made for you if you want to use most software, and that's only getting worse.

Dumbed-down interfaces, limited choice, and touch-friendly are the order of the day, because too many people have grown up using nothing but smartphones. Microsoft is really far from the worst offender. If you look at the big picture, we've passed the point where technology caters to power users, and reached the point where the focus is on dumbing it down enough so that even the youngest and most uneducated people in the most impoverished nations can figure it out. That's where the untapped markets are, and that doesn't bode well for anyone who likes tweaking stuff for maximum performance, or using stuff to do anything other than what it was designed to do. Intellectual property owners would probably also love to see operating systems locked down to the point that people can't even run unlicensed software. It's going to be an uphill battle for power users, might as well face that right now.

I may not love everything about Windows 10, but I would have to say it suits my workflow and style a lot better than KDE, Gnome, or (yuck) Mac OS. It's even better than the Windows 7 interface to my mind. And they do seem to make it subtly better with each update... alphabetizing the app list, adding a section off to the right with little groups and such like Windows 8 had before, etc. Out of the ones I've tried, this one seems to reward me the most for mastering all the new functionality. Task view, action center, right-clicking on the Windows button, using the search bar straight from a click... pinning apps, organizing the Start icons into groups, etc. There's a lot to like here, and it seems like they've tried to take everything that worked with previous Windows interfaces and fit it all together here.
Click to expand...
This harkens back to a point I mentioned in another thread that when people say they like a specific OS less or more, half the time, they're mostly talking about the GUI. I got sick of the standard Windows interface a long time ago, I've been on Litestep for over a decade now (using Winstep Nexus as a taskbar replacement). It's kind of a pain in the ass to setup, but you can really customize it the way you want to. When people see my desktop they get confused and think it's Linux or something because it looks that different, despite being Windows 7. I really think it's nuts that MS doesn't open up the interface so people could make custom themes for it and have any sort of look / functional UI they wanted.
 
opfreak said:
so to play games on your Linux box you need windows. Ironic?
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Well, it's better than WINE when it comes to Windows only games. I don't see the irony as I didn't make any stupid claims.
 
Great. Redstone. Same name as our first ballistic missile, something designed to catastrophically blow up and destroy things by remote control. An absolutely perfect name for Windows.
 
athenian200 said:
Not my fault if people have short attention spans thanks to Twitter and text messaging. I could really care less if the "TL;DR" crowd reads my posts. :)
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Brevity is the soul of wit.

Nobody needs or wants to read a wall of text that essentially translates to 'meh.' People pull that shit all the time in the Soapbox to kill a discussion.
 
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