Hyperloop Co-Founder 'Very Serious' About California Secession

lcpiper said:
No, Texas has the right to secede per the Texas State Constitution. According to the Supreme Court of the United States it does not. But face it, if Texans decide to leave they will be looking to their own constitution first and not that of the United States.

And to those who think the federal tanks would roll into Texas to settle the issue one must consider that two things. First, that it's Texas citizens who make up about 20% of the total military strength of the US Armed Forces. And second, that the home of the largest formation of Heavy Armored units is ..... Fort Hood Texas, the III Armored Corps. So who is it that has the tanks to start with?
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Yes and all that belongs to the US Army, not the Texas National Guard, you guys wouldn't be defending your boarders as the Army is already in there. Texas would absolutely not win any type of civil war. "20%!!! blah blah" well yeah that leaves the other 80% for you to deal with. 80 > 20.

But whatever, Texas and California aren't going anywhere. And any chance of that is more likely in congress and court rooms than any type of fighting.
 
Hey everyone,

As a Californian here, I just want to say this...there are alot of hard working people in this state that love our nation, and want only the best for it. Sometimes, we disagree on how to achieve those goals, but in the end, we are just as proud to be Americans as we are to be Californians. Please remember that many, many of us are cut from the same cloth as all of you, and we are all trying to contribute toward a better future for America. We aren't all hippies, crazies, and malcontents, so don't be so hard on us. We bring alot of good to the Union, and despite any grumblings right now, I seriously doubt a #Calexit would ever happen...especially after all of us saw how poorly the #Brexit turned out. This is just alot of hot air from some very disappointed people.
 
Konig-Wolf said:
Hey everyone,

As a Californian here, I just want to say this...there are alot of hard working people in this state that love our nation, and want only the best for it. Sometimes, we disagree on how to achieve those goals, but in the end, we are just as proud to be Americans as we are to be Californians. Please remember that many, many of us are cut from the same cloth as all of you, and we are all trying to contribute toward a better future for America. We aren't all hippies, crazies, and malcontents, so don't be so hard on us. We bring alot of good to the Union, and despite any grumblings right now, I seriously doubt a #Calexit would ever happen...especially after all of us saw how poorly the #Brexit turned out. This is just alot of hot air from some very disappointed people.
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Reality is your state has been expertly gerrymandered and should actually be two states. But the 2 senators from the sane half could negate the 2 senators from the insane half as well as freeing half the electoral votes.

long story short: Sane Californians need to cede from California.
 
dgingeri said:
By all means, go. I hate having Californians moving to Colorado so much anyway. They've upset everything here, from the political structure to rush hour traffic patterns.
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Fellow Coloradan here. I would laugh except they've ruined this state politically. Why do these morons move here to get away from the mess that is California and then vote the same way they did there? Did they somehow expect it was going to turn out differently here than it did there???
 
Shotglass01 said:
Because the last time this happened we voted him for president.
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I...i'll give you that one particular happening. Regardless, I doubt this sentiment is something that any worthwhile number of people actually are considering for, and even then, its just probably anger and frustration that will reside like all things.
 
DeathFromBelow said:
No, that's a myth. Nothing in the Texas constitution supports a 'right' to secede and it never has. Texas has the right to divide itself into up to four additional states per its annexation agreement. That would be an interesting situation as it would presumably create additional solidly-conservative states, but it's not secession.

No state has a right to secede, human beings have a natural right to revolt and replace their government if it becomes oppressive. Better make sure you're capable of winning though.
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Then how did Texas secede the first time?
 
SighTurtle said:
I...i'll give you that one particular happening. Regardless, I doubt this sentiment is something that any worthwhile number of people actually are considering for, and even then, its just probably anger and frustration that will reside like all things.
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Umm, you might want to look into it yourself and see if your doubts are warranted. It's my understanding that the secession movement has been alive in Texas for over a hundred years and it's slowly and inexorably growing little by little every year. I few years back, they were two votes shy of actually having a vote on secession.
 
lcpiper said:
It's not the same. First, it's legal for Texas to secede, second, Texas can support itself but Cali can't.
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No, it's not legal for a state to secede. That's pretty much the short and long of it. Now of course any state can TRY to secede, but yeah, we would see how well that would work out once the Federal government sent in the military to recapture the state. I mean if you honestly think Texas can take on the rest of the military force of the entire country... well what can I say, Texans love The Alamo.

Bottom line: California isn't going to secede, Texas isn't going to secede, but people on the internet like to talk big.
 
J-Will said:
CA is in too much debt to survive.
Also- only the West cost sliver of CA is dem... so that'll be an awkward state vote.
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Kinda pathetic considering this is the bastion of liberalism. 61% voted blue. Doesn't seem that great for the official safe space of America.

n5e1sDJ.jpg


This is all counties. Shows why the "popular" vote is a terrible way to determine the election.

KY59S4f.jpg
 
it wouldn't last a month before war started and a cleansing began. i would get some popcorn for sure and head over to LL
 
westrock2000 said:
Kinda pathetic considering this is the bastion of liberalism. 61% voted blue. Doesn't seem that great for the official safe space of America.

n5e1sDJ.jpg


This is all counties. Shows why the "popular" vote is a terrible way to determine the election.

KY59S4f.jpg
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All this shows is that rural counties voted for Trump and the concentrated ones for Clinton. Still doesn't justify the electoral college which is long overdue for removal and a true democracy put in it's place. Just for the record, I wasn't for either candidate.
 
Raffin said:
Fellow Coloradan here. I would laugh except they've ruined this state politically. Why do these morons move here to get away from the mess that is California and then vote the same way they did there? Did they somehow expect it was going to turn out differently here than it did there???
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In California when that happens they also wave the flag of the place they left behind as a bonus.
 
5150Joker said:
All this shows is that rural counties voted for Trump and the concentrated ones for Clinton. Still doesn't justify the electoral college which is long overdue for removal and a true democracy put in it's place. Just for the record, I wasn't for either candidate.
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America is a constitutional republic not a democracy. The Electoral college ensures the large population centers don't decide national elections for everyone.
 
tetris42 said:
No, it's not legal for a state to secede. That's pretty much the short and long of it. Now of course any state can TRY to secede, but yeah, we would see how well that would work out once the Federal government sent in the military to recapture the state. I mean if you honestly think Texas can take on the rest of the military force of the entire country... well what can I say, Texans love The Alamo.

Bottom line: California isn't going to secede, Texas isn't going to secede, but people on the internet like to talk big.
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You were listening closely enough were you?

Texans make up one fifth of the military as it is, and all the damn tanks are already in Texas , along with the B1 Bombers and a whole lot more. The only States with combat units are Marines in California, and North Carolina, Army in Washington State and , Kentucky, North Carolina and Georgia, and then there is the largest military base in the world, Fort Hood Texas, home of the 3rd Armored Corps, three heavy combat divisions. and an honorable mention for Fort Bliss in El Paso.

The US Army is made up of three Corps and all of the Combat units belong to these three Corps.
I Corps at Fort Lewis
I Corps is unique among the active US Army corps in that it is composed of a mixture of active duty and US Army Reserve units in 47 of the 50 U.S. states, for a total of around 20,000 active duty and 20,000 army reserve forces
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The major units of i Coprs include;

The XVIII Airborne Corps is much stronger then I Corps;

  • 7th Infantry Division (Light)

And then there is III Corps;

Now I Coprs 7th Infantry Div has no tanks, the do have Strykers but Strykers are not M1s, Out of the XVIII Airborne Corps, only 3rd ID has M1s. But III Corps has M1s at Fort Hood in the 1st Armored Cav, 3rd Armored Cav, and more then all the others combined in the 1st Armored Div at Fort Bliss. In other works, the 75% of the tanks are in Texas. The same is true for most of the Self Propelled Artillery because the units with the tanks get the mobile arty as well.

Now if I was going to lead a secession, and I knew the Federal Government would look poorly on it, and that it might come to a fight. Do you think I would let those tanks leave Texas? Almost one out of five service members are Texans.

And a war machine needs fuel, fuel comes from or through where ?

chart2.png


The reason so much Oil is exported from Texas is because that's where it's produced. Most of the Oil produced in Texas is exported or sent elsewhere in the US to refineries scattered acrossed the nation. Now I am not saying that the US couldn't get other oil from other countries, but then again, if other countries saw major turmoil happening in the US, how many would agree to help and how many would see this as a way to weaken the US for their benefit ?
 
5150Joker said:
All this shows is that rural counties voted for Trump and the concentrated ones for Clinton. Still doesn't justify the electoral college which is long overdue for removal and a true democracy put in it's place. Just for the record, I wasn't for either candidate.
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I'm not sure there is anything wrong with the electoral college.

Clinton 228 60,212,217 votes
Trump 279 59,875,788 votes
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It doesn't get closer, and someone has to win. And if you don't vote for someone who has a chance to win, then what were you voting for, spite?
 
Raffin said:
America is a constitutional republic not a democracy. The Electoral college ensures the large population centers don't decide national elections for everyone.
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How do you think the electoral college ensures that large population centers don't decide national elections? By what mechanism exactly, because I'm not seeing it. The only thing the electoral college does, is prevent direct election, basically that the EC voters can arbitrarily say, 'ohh hell no' and decide to vote any way they want (and in some cases face a small penalty for doing so.) It has nothing to do with a few large cities vs many small cities. EC voters are distributed by population. Each state individually decides how it assigns it's EC voters.
 
The electoral college prevents ballot stuffing in one state from affecting the entire election. A corrupt state could stuff 1 million votes extra for their candidate today an all they could deliver is the state that was going to go to that candidate anyway. This is because ballot stuffing is most likely in states that are deep deep to one party. Without the electoral college those 1 million votes get put on the national heap and have real effect.

The other purpose of the electoral college is the same reason a state has two senators no matter how big or small it is. Montana without the advantages of the Senate and electoral college would be the country's toilet. It would be voted the toxic waste dump, nuclear waste dump, and medical waste dump of the country. Carrying a little extra weight prevents smaller states from being railroaded by the big states. If you don't understand the reasons for that later point, go die in a die fire.

Third point, is suck it up. You weren't this upset about it 3 days ago. Because you didn't know if it was going to help or hurt the result you wanted. Amping up the indignation now is just scorched earth / sour grapes politics. Work to change it if you want, but it invalidates nothing about this election. Should have had a movement 4 years ago.
 
Raffin said:
America is a constitutional republic not a democracy. The Electoral college ensures the large population centers don't decide national elections for everyone.
Click to expand...

It's because the founders feared a true democracy. That fear is unfounded in modern America and the electoral college is a relic that should be done away with.
 
Spidey329 said:
Wait a minute .. do we honestly care? I don't see how this country will function with their budget.

The Republican's shouldn't care because this state always goes to the Dems, so it makes winning way easier.
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Some might think it would be okay for the nutty Californians to have their own country, but consider the problems.

First there would be a hostile communist nation on our borders, with a military likely funded by like minded commie nations.

Even worse (and more likely) would be having the resultant snowflake nation attacked by a foreign power, then real men from the US would have to rescue them every so often.

No thanks.
 
If CalExit were a real possiblity, I'd imagine Oregon, Washington and possibly Nevada joining them to form a new country. And then I wouldn't be surprised to see the North East (e.g. NYC, NJ) wanting to follow in their steps. So basically no state will ever be allowed to leave the union, it would create a domino effect and the US would cease to exist.
 
Raffin said:
So you just want to throw away the US Constitution and start over? Good luck with that...
Here is a good explanation why a pure democracy would be a bad idea: http://www.stopthenorthamericanunion.com/NotDemocracy.html
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Did I say I want to do away with the Constitution? There is something called an amendment. I also don't think a President should be limited to just two terms throughout his lifetime and should be allowed to run again after another President has taken office after him.
 
Konig-Wolf said:
Hey everyone,

As a Californian here, I just want to say this...there are alot of hard working people in this state that love our nation, and want only the best for it. Sometimes, we disagree on how to achieve those goals, but in the end, we are just as proud to be Americans as we are to be Californians. Please remember that many, many of us are cut from the same cloth as all of you, and we are all trying to contribute toward a better future for America. We aren't all hippies, crazies, and malcontents, so don't be so hard on us. We bring alot of good to the Union, and despite any grumblings right now, I seriously doubt a #Calexit would ever happen...especially after all of us saw how poorly the #Brexit turned out. This is just alot of hot air from some very disappointed people.
Click to expand...
lcpiper said:
You were listening closely enough were you?

Texans make up one fifth of the military as it is, and all the damn tanks are already in Texas , along with the B1 Bombers and a whole lot more. The only States with combat units are Marines in California, and North Carolina, Army in Washington State and , Kentucky, North Carolina and Georgia, and then there is the largest military base in the world, Fort Hood Texas, home of the 3rd Armored Corps, three heavy combat divisions. and an honorable mention for Fort Bliss in El Paso.

The US Army is made up of three Corps and all of the Combat units belong to these three Corps.
I Corps at Fort Lewis

The major units of i Coprs include;

The XVIII Airborne Corps is much stronger then I Corps;

  • 7th Infantry Division (Light)
And then there is III Corps;

Now I Coprs 7th Infantry Div has no tanks, the do have Strykers but Strykers are not M1s, Out of the XVIII Airborne Corps, only 3rd ID has M1s. But III Corps has M1s at Fort Hood in the 1st Armored Cav, 3rd Armored Cav, and more then all the others combined in the 1st Armored Div at Fort Bliss. In other works, the 75% of the tanks are in Texas. The same is true for most of the Self Propelled Artillery because the units with the tanks get the mobile arty as well.

Now if I was going to lead a secession, and I knew the Federal Government would look poorly on it, and that it might come to a fight. Do you think I would let those tanks leave Texas? Almost one out of five service members are Texans.

And a war machine needs fuel, fuel comes from or through where ?

chart2.png


The reason so much Oil is exported from Texas is because that's where it's produced. Most of the Oil produced in Texas is exported or sent elsewhere in the US to refineries scattered acrossed the nation. Now I am not saying that the US couldn't get other oil from other countries, but then again, if other countries saw major turmoil happening in the US, how many would agree to help and how many would see this as a way to weaken the US for their benefit ?
Click to expand...


This is all silly.

Firstly, just because a regiment is stationed in a state, doesn't mean that if push comes to shove, that regiment is loyal to that state. Service members are sourced from all across the country and mixed in their assignments. Traditionally this was done for this very reason, such that the average troops have their allegiance to their commanders, not to any local instigators.

Secondly, the thought that it would ever come to armed conflict is preposterous. Something like this would be fought, and fought hard, in the courts.
 
5150Joker said:
It's because the founders feared a true democracy. That fear is unfounded in modern America and the electoral college is a relic that should be done away with.
Click to expand...
It is a true democracy, its a representative democracy. It is also a geographic-popular democracy hybrid. That was intentional and its probably needed now more than ever.
 
webdev511 said:
Running a surplus at the sate level. Paying down Debt.
California contributes just under $300 Billion in taxes to the fed and puts more in than it gets back, so there's going to be a short fall there.
Oh 6th largest economy in the world. I think we can support ourselves just fine.

All that said, it's just some pissed off rich guy saying stuff that won't ever happen.
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California is rated as one of the worst states for fiscal solvency.

FR16-OVERALL-Map-v8_0.jpg



https://www.mercatus.org/statefiscalrankings
 
Bounty said:
How do you think the electoral college ensures that large population centers don't decide national elections? By what mechanism exactly, because I'm not seeing it. The only thing the electoral college does, is prevent direct election, basically that the EC voters can arbitrarily say, 'ohh hell no' and decide to vote any way they want (and in some cases face a small penalty for doing so.) It has nothing to do with a few large cities vs many small cities. EC voters are distributed by population. Each state individually decides how it assigns it's EC voters.
Click to expand...

EC slots are based on the total of Senators and Representatives from each state. The effect is that the larger the state the more people per EC slot. Small states end up with a largely disproportionate number of slots because of the min limits.
 
Oh yeah, let's pay attention to the scam artists building the *fake hyperloop. They're totally legit. The media covering this should be ashamed of themselves. California isn't really going to separate, this is just a publicity stunt from a bunch of scam artists.

*Seriously, if you don't know about this already their "test track" is just a maglev train, which is tech that has been around for years. "Open-air hyperloop test track" is an oxymoron.
 
I am going to state up front that I was not for Trump. Think he didn't have any plans and is simply a loud mouth bully. I say that because I've seen a bunch of crap from people who say they did not want him but did not vote along with a bunch of people who voted for him because they want change. Guess what - none of them win. If you want change in the US, clear out the House and Senate - and I mean I don't care who is in office, vote them out. Too many fat cats there and that is where the real power to make change lies - not at the top. Sure the POTUS can initiate things but if there is no funding or there are veto overrides, none of it matters.

Now, what the POTUS can do is pop off his mouth and get us into some interesting situations. That's the fear that I have. Trump is used to bullying people to get his way. That does not work with diplomatic negotiations and certainly will not work in today's cyber world.

In the end, he's our POTUS and even though I did not vote for him, I will respect him and support him. Fighting gets us nowhere. That's more than I can say for the simple minded far-right people that I know who have been bitching every day about Obama and Obamacare but offer no solutions to the latter other than repealing it and calling him names. I cannot believe how naive they are to somehow have a notion that they are not paying for the uninsured one way or another. I simply ask for them to come up with a solution for the masses before complaining because they, as an individual or family, are paying more. Look out for the greater good of all the people, not yourself or your own bottom line. People using the ER as office visits hurts everyone's bottom line.

I'd love to have a crystal ball only to see what Republicans are running in 2020 because I doubt he goes unopposed.

My only political rant as I'm sick of both sides and rarely, if ever, talk politics.
 
California:

Total federal spending in 2014: $343 billion
Total federal taxes collected: $292 billion

Where is California going to come up with an extra $51 billion dollars from, EVERY YEAR?

Looks like they'll need to raise taxes by 20% to start. Imagine having an additional 20% off your paycheck, and having to pay more for everything.
 
Dems could have easily won with Bernie but they juuuust have to pick the intensely unlikeable corrupt woman.
 
evilwon said:
I am going to state up front that I was not for Trump. Think he didn't have any plans and is simply a loud mouth bully. I say that because I've seen a bunch of crap from people who say they did not want him but did not vote along with a bunch of people who voted for him because they want change. Guess what - none of them win. If you want change in the US, clear out the House and Senate - and I mean I don't care who is in office, vote them out. Too many fat cats there and that is where the real power to make change lies - not at the top. Sure the POTUS can initiate things but if there is no funding or there are veto overrides, none of it matters.

Now, what the POTUS can do is pop off his mouth and get us into some interesting situations. That's the fear that I have. Trump is used to bullying people to get his way. That does not work with diplomatic negotiations and certainly will not work in today's cyber world.

In the end, he's our POTUS and even though I did not vote for him, I will respect him and support him. Fighting gets us nowhere. That's more than I can say for the simple minded far-right people that I know who have been bitching every day about Obama and Obamacare but offer no solutions to the latter other than repealing it and calling him names. I cannot believe how naive they are to somehow have a notion that they are not paying for the uninsured one way or another. I simply ask for them to come up with a solution for the masses before complaining because they, as an individual or family, are paying more. Look out for the greater good of all the people, not yourself or your own bottom line. People using the ER as office visits hurts everyone's bottom line.

I'd love to have a crystal ball only to see what Republicans are running in 2020 because I doubt he goes unopposed.

My only political rant as I'm sick of both sides and rarely, if ever, talk politics.
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The POTUS can do quite a lot when the House and the Senate area also of the same color.

Do you have proof of this bullying? You don't get that kind of money in a bank account by being a total dick. You get it by listening to the people around you, and coming to agreements and deals. People walk away when they are being treated badly.

Cyber world? Do you mean the pussies on Twitter? Lol.

Why is any other solution needed? The ACA asked(demanded) insurance companies to offer insurance to everyone that wanted it, with ncoverage at n$. Now, the goal was that this influx of new customers (volume) was going to offset the cost of the insurance plans. In addition to this, there was the Cadillac Tax, that taxed companies that provided their employees really good insurance, nearly an extra 50%. Well fucking guess what?! That gets passed on to the employee. It gets better though! On top of of the Cadillac Tax, there is the reinsurance fee- another tax added to every single person that gets employee sponsored health insurance. My premiums nearly tripled year before last. We are in a Cadillac plan- the company I work for takes care of its employees. I went from $60 every two weeks for my wife an I, to $186 once the taxes started to hit with the ACA. We get $40 knocked off if we have a physical done yearly. It is not my responsibility to take care of you, just as it is not your responsibility to take care of me. Health is not a right. I really don't give a flying fuck about the better good. I'm in this world to take care of my own family, not yours. The majority of people are employed. It's not my damn job to work to provide for someone that doesn't work. Fuck all that noise. Now, I do help. When I have extra money, I toss it in the charity buckets. I donate my old clothes to NPO's. I serve lunches for the homeless, and buy the person on the corner holding a cardboard sign a lunch or dinner every week. I do plenty. However, fuck you for even thinking that I have a responsibility to do it.

The far-right, as you say, have every right to bitch. Show me in the Constitution where it says that I have to pay extra for people that won't take care of themselves.

***People with severe mental/physical handicap do not apply. They can't help their situations. Everyone else can fuck off.
 
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