NVIDIA Founders Edition Cards - Yea or Nay? @ [H]

if the market will support it! NVidia knows that the suckers will pay for a "pre-order".

I know that the fanboi NV owners will pay the extra $100 and not even think twice about it.

Honestly I wouldn't pay a retail for a reference card... if I even buy into Pascal it will likely be 1080Ti. and if I do that it will be a "aftermarket" style cooler, such as EVGA ACX or such.
 
I'm not spending $700 on a video card one way or another. But, I think we will have to wait for reviews and benchmarks of the Ref(ounders)erence Cards and the third party cards before we can say anything definitive. If third party makers are cranking out consistently better overclocking cards at $100 less, I am not sure the market will support the $700 price for the Founders cards.

I doubt I would spent $450 on the GTX 1070 either. I think the $310 that the GTX 970 is selling for right now is a sweet spot...$379 for something that performs as well as a GTX 980ti would be worth it though.
 
More like Bias net journalism.

It's sad everyone basically has an agenda no matter what the product is.
 
Summary: At least for now, the 980 replacement will cost us $700. Or, if we wait, some AIB options might start around $600.....does that sound about right? Lastly, is there any chance the 1080ti will msrp for less than $800? The Titan $1200?

Love nVidia, but damn these prices are getting ridiculous....................
 
At least during 980 launch, most of the aftermarket cards with good coolers were at least $40 over MSRP. The Gigabyte G1 was like $70 over MSRP for a few months. Expecting the same with 10 series launch personally.
 
You know, a couple of days ago I was really leaning toward this 'Founder's Edition'. Almost to the point of looking forward to getting one, as there were a few positives I could see at the time:
  • Lack of competition will make it a reasonably solid investment. Nvidia will be in no rush whatsoever to get the 1080ti out. Polaris doesn't touch this space. a 1080 will serve you well all year.
  • First revision boards (from my experience) tend to be the best quality so as to promote the product in the best light. So they'd all be good overclockers.
  • These will be 'only revision' actually! Exact same quality throughout the product cycle and so SLI guaranteed to work as intended.

However, the PCB shots were released, which tells me EVERYTHING I need to know:

NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-1080-PCB-3-900x483.jpg


See the missing VRM line!?

Yup, no sale from me, will wait for AIB's custom designs now.

And this also says to me that the ti model will be based on this PCB! Yes, it seems to me that the ti will not be the full blown HBM2 jobby we all want, but likely simply a bigger version of GP104. I think GP100 will be a Titan exclusive this round, if at all, in the home user space.

Reminds me of the 8800GT and subsequent 8800GTS using the exact same PCB but with a full VRM setup.


That said, I'm not waiting on the ti version though, as I believe this time around we'll see the longest wait ever for a ti variant. Simply because AMD aren't giving nvidia a reason.
 
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spine said:
You know, a couple of days ago I was really leaning toward this 'Founder's Edition'. Almost to the point of looking forward to getting one, as there were a few positives I could see at the time:
  • Lack of competition will make it a reasonably solid investment. Nvidia will be in no rush whatsoever to get the 1080ti out. Polaris doesn't touch this space. a 1080 will serve you well all year.
  • First revision boards (from my experience) tend to be the best quality so as to promote the product in the best light. So they'd all be good overclockers.
  • These will be 'only revision' actually! Exact same quality throughout the product cycle and so SLI guaranteed to work as intended.

However, the PCB shots were released, which tells me EVERYTHING I need to know:

NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-1080-PCB-3-900x483.jpg


See the missing VRM line!?

Yup, no sale from me, will wait for AIB's custom designs now.

And this also says to me that the ti model will be based on this PCB! Yes, it seems to me that the ti will not be the full blown HBM2 jobby we all want, but likely simply a bigger version of GP104. I think GP100 will be a Titan exclusive this round, if at all, in the home user space.

Reminds me of the 8800GT and subsequent 8800GTS using the exact same PCB but with a full VRM setup.


That said, I'm not waiting on the ti version though, as I believe this time around we'll see the longest wait ever for a ti variant. Simply because AMD aren't giving nvidia a reason.
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Interesting observation. I believe this is why the GP102 identifier exists in the leaks we've seen: NVIDIA is going to place the Ti version more in between the 1080 and Titan version instead of making it a slightly cut-down version of the Titan this time around. That would fit more into their pricing scheme... Meaning Ti could very well be around $800 and Titan around $1,200.
 
I must be missing something because what I see is a 5+1phase VRM *shrug*.
The reference 980 was 4+1phase if I remember.

But yeah, for the premium price it is rather embarrassing compared to the AIBs approach.
Cheers
 
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You guys can see official statement from nvidia staff in german here (use google to translate)

Geforce GTX 1080: Was die Founders Edition von früheren Referenzdesigns unterscheidet - Interview

Basically just a bounch of BS marketing not work the extra 100$
Everything he said should be already on the 599$ and 379$

I think they just have the 375$ and 599$ pricing too look more attractive, but in the end most of the cards will end up costing 699$ even AIBs designs with the excuse they are overclocked.
 
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lukart said:
You guys can see official statement from nvidia staff in german here (use google to translate)

Geforce GTX 1080: Was die Founders Edition von früheren Referenzdesigns unterscheidet - Interview

Basically just a bounch of BS marketing not work the extra 100$
Everything he said should be already on the 599$ and 379$

I think they just have the 375$ and 599$ pricing too look more attractive, but in the end most of the cards will end up costing 699$ even AIBs designs with the excuse they are overclocked.
Click to expand...

Buy from AMD then and vote with your wallet against NV.
 
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DooKey said:
Buy from AMD then and vote with your wallet against NV.
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I don't think the intent of this thread is to persuade people to buy AMD, it is to discuss FE pricing. Perhaps if nVidia sees enough push-back from potential customers they might reconsider this poorly thought out marking strategy.
 
Singularity_Survivor said:
I don't think the intent of this thread is to persuade people to buy AMD, it is to discuss FE pricing. Perhaps if nVidia sees enough push-back from potential customers they might reconsider this poorly thought out marking strategy.
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I'm not trying to persuade anyone either way. I just think bitchin' on the forums is a waste of time and the only way to have either company change their ways is with your wallet. With that said I don't expect anything to change at NV because some forum folks are bitchin'.
 
Why? Why would nV make their own brand that would eat up sales of their card partners? Why not just have no card partners and just make all the cards themselves? It would save them money as they don't have to share profits with anyone.....

And lukart where in that article states what you just said?

Google Translate

The Founders Editions should not compete with the Custom designs of Nvidia partners. We had requests from Nvidia customers who want continuous access to Nvidia board designs - and that we have now.
Click to expand...
 
nVidia is fortunate that AMD hasn't gotten their shit together. This FE debacle is even worse than the 970 VRAM scandal. At this point, is anyone honestly expecting to see any AIB offer a $599 1080 card? Who would have ever thought the third highest performing nVidia card would cost us $700!?
 
We shell see, when reviews come out next week and following with AIB custom cards, I fully expect to see $599 gtx 1080's.
 
razor1 said:
We shell see, when reviews come out next week and following with AIB custom cards, I fully expect to see $599 gtx 1080's.
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For base models I expect them to be $599. But after seeing the Founders Edition PCB. WHAT A FUCKING JOKE NVIDIA. Please I would rather wait for AIB Partners to make good based Nvidia cards. Those Nvidia cards do not look like a $100 premium card.

I am sorry Nvidia Marketing is now on the same level as Apple. People are just that loyal. Personally I blame AMD....No Competition means Nvidia prices and Markets whatever the fuck they want.
 
Singularity_Survivor said:
At this point razor1, why would you expect that?
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Simple although AIB's are in the market to make money they are in competition with themselves too, so free market dictates pricing. If AIB's can make cards that have decent margins at $599 they will do it because its simple competition to get the sale.
 
Brackle said:
For base models I expect them to be $599. But after seeing the Founders Edition PCB. WHAT A FUCKING JOKE NVIDIA. Please I would rather wait for AIB Partners to make good based Nvidia cards. Those Nvidia cards do not look like a $100 premium card.

I am sorry Nvidia Marketing is now on the same level as Apple. People are just that loyal. Personally I blame AMD....No Competition means Nvidia prices and Markets whatever the fuck they want.
Click to expand...


nV's FE card's should not create a push to the market towards them, if that happens, AIB's would not be happy. Its counter productive for nV and their partners as a whole. Now if the FE's really do hurt AIB's bottom line, they would jump ship which won't be good for nV unless nV can over come that loss by selling more FE cards.

Personally I don't buy overclocked cards nor cards more expensive than the MSRP nor overclock cards anymore, so I would not buy anything more than a $599 if I was in the market for a gtx 1080 unless there is truly a quality or warranty difference but I don't see any of those for the FE
 
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razor1 said:
nV's FE card's should not create a push to the market towards them, if that happens, AIB's would not be happy. Its counter productive for nV and their partners as a whole. Now if the FE's really do hurt AIB's bottom line, they would jump ship which won't be good for nV unless nV can over come that loss by selling more FE cards.
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I agree, but Nvidia charging $100 for that piss poor PCB.....yea fuck Nvidia on that one. I want to buy a 1080 sure, but not with 1 8pin adapter and that horrible PCB. I would rather buy a base model AIB for $599 and buy a AIO WC with a bracket for $80, and have better cooling AND save $20.
 
athenian200 said:
I'm surprised to hear anyone say a reference card is a good or high-quality design. I always thought they were supposed to be inferior to cards produced by companies like MSI and ASUS because they used an inferior cooler and weren't binned in any way. Also, companies like Foxconn generally aren't known for putting out good quality PCBs.

I assumed the $100 premium was for a chance to get your hands on the card early, not because the product was better than an MSI or ASUS card... if anything, I would have expected it to be inferior.

I really don't know what to think now. If it's actually as good as any other card you can get, it might be worth it.
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I agree - the reference Nvidia PCBs in general actually are not that high quality (with a few exceptions, most arguably the 400 Fermi series). Most notably, the GTX 570 and 590 were known for their poor quality VRMs that actually exploded under normal gaming. The other GPUs generally did not have premium quality components.

You'd be far better off paying for something like the MSI Lightning, Galax HOF, or EVGA Classified Kingpin. A card like the Lightning typically has a 3 slot axial cooler, a much more robust power design (something like 14+3 DirectFET Mosfets + whatever chokes MSI uses), sometimes binned RAM (happened in the 290X Lightning, which I currently own 2 of), and much better other components (12 layer PCB and similar overkill designs).

If you are going to spend money, at least get your money's worth.
 
Brackle said:
I agree, but Nvidia charging $100 for that piss poor PCB.....yea fuck Nvidia on that one. I want to buy a 1080 sure, but not with 1 8pin adapter and that horrible PCB. I would rather buy a base model AIB for $599 and buy a AIO WC with a bracket for $80, and have better cooling AND save $20.
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Didn't I hear at the launch event that they were using better quality parts on the Founders Edition now? I mean, that could have just been marketing BS, but what if they actually upped the quality? Everyone is saying it's "just the reference design," but it may not be.
 
jamsomito said:
Didn't I hear at the launch event that they were using better quality parts on the Founders Edition now? I mean, that could have just been marketing BS, but what if they actually upped the quality? Everyone is saying it's "just the reference design," but it may not be.
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Only way to tell is identify each individual component for choke/capacitors/etc for manufacturer and the product-spec.
That can be very tricky.
Cheers
 
jamsomito said:
Didn't I hear at the launch event that they were using better quality parts on the Founders Edition now? I mean, that could have just been marketing BS, but what if they actually upped the quality? Everyone is saying it's "just the reference design," but it may not be.
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If you look at the picture of the PCB of the Founders Edition (Fucked over Edition) You will see its just a plain old normal card, nothing fancy on it at all.

Nvdia Marketing even fool you. That is called good marketing
 
Brackle said:
If you look at the picture of the PCB of the Founders Edition (Fucked over Edition) You will see its just a plain old normal card, nothing fancy on it at all.

Nvdia Marketing even fool you. That is called good marketing
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It is good marketing, but it only works when people don't point out how much BS it is.
 
More I think of this,the more it seems like NVDA is going to be competing directly with the AIB's. The deliberate silence from them this far is obviously very deliberate. I predict far fewer AIB's in a year or so. Most definitely looks and feels like a early adopters tax.
 
Manny Calavera said:
More I think of this,the more it seems like NVDA is going to be competing directly with the AIB's. The deliberate silence from them this far is obviously very deliberate. I predict far fewer AIB's in a year or so. Most definitely looks and feels like a early adopters tax.
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Not at all. If they priced the reference version at $599 with the same timing and fanfare then sure, the AIBs would be pissed and rightfully so. But at $699, this will have zero effect except for serving as an early adopter tax. We'll be laughing at it in a couple months.
 
As a Titan X owner, does this mean nVidia will expand the 'Founders' series to the Big Pascal Titan line? I'd guess there is limited to no information available to provide an answer though I had ask anyways.
 
AceGoober said:
As a Titan X owner, does this mean nVidia will expand the 'Founders' series to the Big Pascal Titan line? I'd guess there is limited to no information available to provide an answer though I had ask anyways.
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I'd say yes... In 2017
 
No website is really going to give Nvidia hell for this. They all softly rebuke them and play it down.
 
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Kyle is downright convinced the Founders Edition is actually a good thing. I don't see how that could possibly be true, but I'm waiting for the review before making up my mind 100%.
 
schizo said:
Kyle is downright convinced the Founders Edition is actually a good thing. I don't see how that could possibly be true, but I'm waiting for the review before making up my mind 100%.
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Marketing at is finest. Trick people into thinking they are getting the best.

At least some of us aren't fooled.
 
I really cant believe anyone and especially enthusiast would buy into this marking BS and if anything it will be terrible for consumers as now there is a chance we will get inferior coolers. This already happens now but the price difference is usually about $20-$30 apart, now it will jump to $100.


So now this.....
600.png

will command a $100 premium over this....

600.png
 
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