So linux is the tiny loud minority, we get it. Why someone wants to run a 390x in linux and play a game on it, i don't get that at all. Fucking dual boot windows and play on the OS that games are made for, gaming on linux is worse than the idea of gaming on a mac. Maybe stick to browser games? if you are using linux it already proves you aren't a gamer. You maybe play 5 hrs a week or so, you are just hurt because no one uses linux for gaming
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AMD Radeon Software Crimson Edition Is A Letdown On Linux
- Thread starter HardOCP News
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Pieter3dnow
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It is more about Vulkan then Linux really , as soon as developers support it you can choose what OS to use.
yep its not as simple as re compiling. Compilers are different, networking is different, security is different, program loaders are different, etc, etc. porting from one OS to another regardless of the API is a complex task and depending on the application can be a daunting task.
As both a Windows and Linux user I'm not telling people to use Linux, I'm telling people to stop being so negative regarding it's adoption and support an OS on an open platform such as the PC that isn't owned and controlled. I've stated all along, if you want to use Windows, use Windows - I am standing by the claim that Windows is a shitty OS however.
And it's obvious that a great many of these people in this thread that claim to have used Linux extensively, quite simply haven't - Although, not that many people in this thread have made such a claim.
No, the expected and usual response from an individual that knows nothing more than Windows is "I don't see the point" or "Dual boot". The reason you don't see the point is because you've never tried something better than Windows and experienced that disappointment when you realize just how bad an OS that you paid good money for can be. And, apart from the fact that MS are making it harder and harder to dual boot - I don't want to use Windows as I don't fear change and respond with aggression, unfounded, unjustified, flatly inaccurate statements and rhetoric ranting about some arbitrary 1% figure that's about as accurate as the percentage of Windows 10 adoption and seems to change depending on where you get the figures from - I embrace change, I try new things, and I know just how much better a desktop OS Linux is compared to Windows and I understand that in using Linux I'm not going to feel limited in comparison to using Windows. I know all this because I did it, I made the change and I don't regret it one bit.
My choice to use Linux doesn't affect Windows users in the slightest and the fact that this discussion is even taking place is downright laughable. As there is no reason for anyone to not support an alternative, free from the constraints of what large corporations deem to be appropriate for PC users.
However, my belief is that those that sit there and argue the point don't care for what they can achieve by using their PC, they only care for games. Reasoning that is perfectly in line with the oldie that doesn't care for the OS used as long as they can open their emails, surf the web, open a PDF and type a letter.
Perfect candidates for a Steambox. You can still use a keyboard and mouse, unlike a console. You can run higher resolutions, unlike a console, and you can run a choice of hardware, unlike a console - You don't have to worry about all that other pesky stuff PC's can do!
But despite all this pointless ranting, the steam library for Linux is growing and awareness for the alternate operating system is increasing. If AMD wish to sit on their hands in relation to a decent Linux driver, well, that's typical of AMD.
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The whole point of a compiler is to convert a language easier for us to understand to native code.
An open API would benefit all gaming platforms, it's that simple.
This is a cop out. Earlier in the thread people were asking for evidence that AMD would be massively impacted by adopting a decent Linux driver and no one could provide such facts.
In my opinion it's fairly obvious that it's a moot point, as no one knows the internal runnings of the corporations in question.
At this point it's hard to see what business would want to get into the desktop market with all of the known trends. You're basically looking at investing a lot of money for something that brings in low profit margins. Even MS is rethinking how it approaches the "commoditized" desktop market. There are specialized cases of course that have their own motivations (ChromeOS is a bit of a hedging strategy for Google), and specialized applications where companies can make money.
Most of the money in OSes right now is server stuff and support contracts. Making a nice desktop OS for everyone from gandma to hardcore gamers just isn't going to make money; there's not much of a business opportunity there.
No. Nobody knows that level of detail except people who have access in the company. But we can deduce some pretty obvious facts. Those supercomputer wins that nvidia has had are running on Linux. Linux is ubiquitous in the animation and CAD industries. The Tesla and Quadro lines are high-margin products.
All nvidia GPU cards and all OpenGL versions have day 1 support available on Linux, FreeBSD and Solaris, which must mean that even on FreeBSD and Solaris they still have important customers. I doubt they're supporting Solaris out of a special favor for Larry Ellison.
The Tegra stuff has been a mixed bag so we can't say that nvidia is making money from Linux in that segment, but they're certainly trying.
Anarchist4000
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http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/12...argeting-20-million-nx-units-shipped-for-2016
I wonder if 20 million units in the first year for a single vendor is enough to warrant a few linux devs from AMD? Seems significant as discrete graphics account for roughly 60m units a year from all vendors.
Scarier part is if they can't source components fast enough and were using HBM2. That is despite an allegedly exclusive deal from Hynix.
That should cover the worst parts of any port. Not to mention that designing around SDL and Vulkan would allow a dev to cover almost all platforms.
As for economics of that, just how many linux exclusive copies would you need to sell to pay your dev staff if all they have to do is make it run? As an example: Total War: Rome II sold about 1.1m copies. If 1% of the market is Linux users that's ~11k sales bringing in x revenue per copy. Lets say they make $20 a copy. That's $226k you could spend on linux devs and break even. If your graphics, input, threading, network, audio, etc port straight over it shouldn't take very many dev hours to properly package the game. Far easier than needing devs to port a DX game to OGL so it can run on linux.
I wonder if 20 million units in the first year for a single vendor is enough to warrant a few linux devs from AMD? Seems significant as discrete graphics account for roughly 60m units a year from all vendors.
Scarier part is if they can't source components fast enough and were using HBM2. That is despite an allegedly exclusive deal from Hynix.
An efficient graphics stack is a huge part of that though. I haven't seen very many games that are bottlenecked by inefficient handling of input devices for example. Many of the engines also make use of SDL which would wrap up most of the odd functionality games would need. (input, threading, network, window management, and likely vulkan initialization as it does DX and OGL already)
That should cover the worst parts of any port. Not to mention that designing around SDL and Vulkan would allow a dev to cover almost all platforms.
As for economics of that, just how many linux exclusive copies would you need to sell to pay your dev staff if all they have to do is make it run? As an example: Total War: Rome II sold about 1.1m copies. If 1% of the market is Linux users that's ~11k sales bringing in x revenue per copy. Lets say they make $20 a copy. That's $226k you could spend on linux devs and break even. If your graphics, input, threading, network, audio, etc port straight over it shouldn't take very many dev hours to properly package the game. Far easier than needing devs to port a DX game to OGL so it can run on linux.
But...
...Think about the economics Anarchist4000...!
And that's assuming that the desktop market share of Linux is 1%, as I find that figure highly unlikely and wouldn't be surprised if it was at minimum 2%- Meaning a 100% increase in market share that's very likely to grow with decent industry support and a decent cross platform API.
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SDL hasn't been used much in a while
, it was popular 10 to 15 years ago, but as of now nope.But yeah Linux is used by many in a corporate professional environment and that's why we don't really see that in desktop consumer user numbers.
Its not just the code either, you still have to qa and what not, so dev's, qa analysts, project managers, etc. Still need the full team even when porting, it might not take as long as making the software piece in the first place, but don't expect it to take less amount of time (minus the assets), the only way it would take less time, is if they planned with the Linux port right up front.
Anarchist4000
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Thought Unreal Engine still used it, along with CryEngine and Source. Can't say I've dug into very many other engines to check lately. There are other kits like Qt, but I've only seen games use it for patchers and external tools.SDL hasn't been used much in a while
Many of the AAA games that target multiple platforms (consoles, PC, mobile) probably design with a deal of portability in mind when they start.
I guess what I find so frustrating about a thread like this is the fact that PC gamers are so passionate when it comes to defending their chosen platform against console gamers, but the issue is that they aren't really defending their chosen platform at all, all their doing is defending the Windows/DirectX monopolization of the open platform PC.
It's disappointing that they can't zoom out a little bit and see the bigger picture and understand just how much harder it is to port games across a variety of platforms, as well as Linux, when Microsoft is doing everything they can to corner the market with DirectX.
What PC gamers need to understand is that they need to support their chosen platform, not the operating system/API. And the easiest way to do that is to first of all stop being so aggressively negative about Linux adoption on the desktop and actually support the idea of choice and freedom. Secondly, where possible (and it's totally understanding that this wouldn't be suitable for all users for obvious reasons), learn something new, install Linux on a spare box or dual boot and actually give Linux a go - And in saying give it a go I don't mean "I booted it up, couldn't achieve what I'm used to under Windows and gave up", I mean tinker, learn and adapt. Break things, fix things, add PPA's, download and install drivers, actually wholeheartedly give alternate software a go and sort out the associated issues so that you can actually make it work for you, install Steam and get a game of TF2 or Halflife 2 Deathmatch going with your mates and remember how good games used to be - In simple terms, stop being lazy and comfortable within the ecosystem you're being spoon fed by Microsoft.
Only once the numbers start increasing will developers begin to take notice and gaming as a whole will improve across a variety of platforms. Take note: I'm not just ranting about Linux here, I'm discussing gaming as a whole.
However, as a side effect, you may find, as I did, just how disappointing it is when the penny drops after tinkering with Linux for a while and you discover that the OS you paid good money for really isn't that good. And as a result you may find yourself using that Windows partition less and less as time goes on.
So now what I'm going to do is sit back and wait for the narrow minded rebuttals on just why it's so hard for people to try and learn new things "because they can't see the point", all the while western society globally just keeps degrading while the top 1% get fatter and richer and the gap between low/middle and high class becomes wider because we're too lazy to see the bigger picture and make a change or even try something new.
It's disappointing that they can't zoom out a little bit and see the bigger picture and understand just how much harder it is to port games across a variety of platforms, as well as Linux, when Microsoft is doing everything they can to corner the market with DirectX.
What PC gamers need to understand is that they need to support their chosen platform, not the operating system/API. And the easiest way to do that is to first of all stop being so aggressively negative about Linux adoption on the desktop and actually support the idea of choice and freedom. Secondly, where possible (and it's totally understanding that this wouldn't be suitable for all users for obvious reasons), learn something new, install Linux on a spare box or dual boot and actually give Linux a go - And in saying give it a go I don't mean "I booted it up, couldn't achieve what I'm used to under Windows and gave up", I mean tinker, learn and adapt. Break things, fix things, add PPA's, download and install drivers, actually wholeheartedly give alternate software a go and sort out the associated issues so that you can actually make it work for you, install Steam and get a game of TF2 or Halflife 2 Deathmatch going with your mates and remember how good games used to be - In simple terms, stop being lazy and comfortable within the ecosystem you're being spoon fed by Microsoft.
Only once the numbers start increasing will developers begin to take notice and gaming as a whole will improve across a variety of platforms. Take note: I'm not just ranting about Linux here, I'm discussing gaming as a whole.
However, as a side effect, you may find, as I did, just how disappointing it is when the penny drops after tinkering with Linux for a while and you discover that the OS you paid good money for really isn't that good. And as a result you may find yourself using that Windows partition less and less as time goes on.
So now what I'm going to do is sit back and wait for the narrow minded rebuttals on just why it's so hard for people to try and learn new things "because they can't see the point", all the while western society globally just keeps degrading while the top 1% get fatter and richer and the gap between low/middle and high class becomes wider because we're too lazy to see the bigger picture and make a change or even try something new.
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That is true but the work has to be put into place to get the work done. Its not something that just happens if you just use an API as Pieter would like to put it
I guess what I find so frustrating about a thread like this is the fact that PC gamers are so passionate when it comes to defending their chosen platform against console gamers, but the issue is that they aren't really defending their chosen platform at all, all their doing is defending the Windows/DirectX monopolization of the open platform PC.
It's disappointing that they can't zoom out a little bit and see the bigger picture and understand just how much harder it is to port games across a variety of platforms, as well as Linux, when Microsoft is doing everything they can to corner the market with DirectX.
What PC gamers need to understand is that they need to support their chosen platform, not the operating system/API. And the easiest way to do that is to first of all stop being so aggressively negative about Linux adoption on the desktop and actually support the idea of choice and freedom. Secondly, where possible (and it's totally understanding that this wouldn't be suitable for all users for obvious reasons), learn something new, install Linux on a spare box or dual boot and actually give Linux a go - And in saying give it a go I don't mean "I booted it up, couldn't achieve what I'm used to under Windows and gave up", I mean tinker, learn and adapt. Break things, fix things, add PPA's, download and install drivers, actually wholeheartedly give alternate software a go and sort out the associated issues so that you can actually make it work for you, install Steam and get a game of TF2 or Halflife 2 Deathmatch going with your mates and remember how good games used to be - In simple terms, stop being lazy and comfortable within the ecosystem you're being spoon fed by Microsoft.
Only once the numbers start increasing will developers begin to take notice and gaming as a whole will improve across a variety of platforms. Take note: I'm not just ranting about Linux here, I'm discussing gaming as a whole.
However, as a side effect, you may find, as I did, just how disappointing it is when the penny drops after tinkering with Linux for a while and you discover that the OS you paid good money for really isn't that good. And as a result you may find yourself using that Windows partition less and less as time goes on.
So now what I'm going to do is sit back and wait for the narrow minded rebuttals on just why it's so hard for people to try and learn new things "because they can't see the point", all the while western society globally just keeps degrading while the top 1% get fatter and richer and the gap between low/middle and high class becomes wider because we're too lazy to see the bigger picture and make a change or even try something new.
True, well, I could care less what my system runs on, as long as it does everything I need it to, I have used Mac, PC, and Linux on the same machine, which now I'm only using PC and Linux, since I got rid of my 7 year old Mac Pro tower due to graphics cards not supporting its EFI bios anymore, I don't like consoles, because I can't stand a gamepad, I like my keyboard and mouse because I can setup a ton of hot keys for my games which I do have a PS4 and Xbone with a keyboard and mouse for those games that are console specific.
I think the main thing that stopped Linux over Windows in the early days was that it wasn't that user friendly as in "dumb" people couldn't just plug and play, MS-DOS and Windows were bad enough for them, Linux and Unix was a whole different level. Then we have the entire Mac users lol, yeah I don't even want to go there
.......Linux has gotten better with this but still has some way to go.
Interesting quote. Thinking of packaged distro's only, and ignoring the obvious AMD driver issues, specifically what part of Linux in your opinion still has a long way to go?
well its mostly 3rd party stuff
, for windows, its just easier don't need to think about it, Linux, easy enough for us but that's cause we know what we are doing. Other people, just don't want to spend the time to know what the system is all about. I kind of think of it like a power user in Windows vs a Mac guy. A power user knows how to customize installations of software to get exactly what they want, vs a person that just doesn't want to think about and takes the easy way out.well its mostly 3rd party stuff
Linux isn't that complicated, it's just an operating system. There was a time when Windows was pretty alien to most of us also.
You don't need to be a power user to use a packaged distro.
Right, but command line installation, isn't something you want to tell a mac guy to do lol, its like speaking alien to them, there response is "YOU HAVE TO TYPE!" hehe.
I'm from the MS dos days, so yeah I still use command lines for just about everything, just easier to make a batch file with all my commands in there and use that.
You'd actually be surprised at the number of people confused by the process of dragging an application to the app folder to install it - Especially when it makes more sense just to double click on the app and have it install.
JustReason
razor1 is my Lover
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Well eventually I will get back to setting up my Linux machine, got some work from home to do so very little time to play. But I will give my experience as an ignorant Linux newbie.
Never used Linux before and my take and understanding was it was convertible. Convertible in the way of being able to tweak every aspect of it to your own needs and uses. But this ability came with the price of time and the need to sit down and understand the nuances of how to set it up. Cant say I believed it was better or worse than windows, but rather another way. Its appeal to me was the ability to tweak. Been tweaking my games and software for years so it seemed right up my alley.
Now recently upgraded my Wifes computer because I thought the Mobo was bad but turned out it was the 4 pin power connector shorting out, actually one pin backed out so only had 1 12v pin in use and the amps was heating it up melting the connector causing it to reboot randomly. Well seeing as it was still good decided I would put it in the living room and use Steam and stream my games from my computer which is considerably strong in CPU and GPU. So being I didn't want to spend a ton on an OS for just some frankenstien computer setup, figured now was the time to try Linux.
It was fairly easy to setup, so a positive there. However it lacked the plethora of choices I was accustomed with Windows. Granted it is still early on in its use for me so it will get where I need eventually.
But As you can see for the ignorant user this is the uphill battle. Windows just works (well most of the time for most people, never an issue with me). Linux for the common man is going to be wrought with contempt, simply because the common man is quite ignorant and, well, stupid when it comes to computers. It doesn't mean Linux sucks, hell it could be 10 times better but the simple fact of windows widespread use for decades has not helped much.
Seriously this is real hard to convey without making one look worse than the other, not my intent. I have no qualms with either one, and much like the consoles my stance is the same, I would love to have both.
Never used Linux before and my take and understanding was it was convertible. Convertible in the way of being able to tweak every aspect of it to your own needs and uses. But this ability came with the price of time and the need to sit down and understand the nuances of how to set it up. Cant say I believed it was better or worse than windows, but rather another way. Its appeal to me was the ability to tweak. Been tweaking my games and software for years so it seemed right up my alley.
Now recently upgraded my Wifes computer because I thought the Mobo was bad but turned out it was the 4 pin power connector shorting out, actually one pin backed out so only had 1 12v pin in use and the amps was heating it up melting the connector causing it to reboot randomly. Well seeing as it was still good decided I would put it in the living room and use Steam and stream my games from my computer which is considerably strong in CPU and GPU. So being I didn't want to spend a ton on an OS for just some frankenstien computer setup, figured now was the time to try Linux.
It was fairly easy to setup, so a positive there. However it lacked the plethora of choices I was accustomed with Windows. Granted it is still early on in its use for me so it will get where I need eventually.
But As you can see for the ignorant user this is the uphill battle. Windows just works (well most of the time for most people, never an issue with me). Linux for the common man is going to be wrought with contempt, simply because the common man is quite ignorant and, well, stupid when it comes to computers. It doesn't mean Linux sucks, hell it could be 10 times better but the simple fact of windows widespread use for decades has not helped much.
Seriously this is real hard to convey without making one look worse than the other, not my intent. I have no qualms with either one, and much like the consoles my stance is the same, I would love to have both.
JustReason,
What distro are you using? I'm tipping an Ubuntu Install running Unity?
The plethora of choices is there, it's just not as obvious as you think. For instance, Mint has a menu similar to the Windows Start menu, if you don't like the layout, the menu is classed as an applet, so you just delete the old menu applet and replace it with a better one - It's literally drag and drop.
Pantalaimon
Limp Gawd
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You keep thinking like a power user. For an ordinary user they really don't care a lick what's under the hood. The only thing they want is ease of use in the sense that they don't have to tinker, or go through hoops to get something done.
Take my scenario earlier. Your suggestion is for me to start using pdf files. Ok assuming I'm willing to go that extra step to convert every file to PDFs, never mind that the document I'm sending out is a contract that is under work, and the client or the suplier also needs to work on it and we use the track changes feature extensively to discuss the changes we each make during our meetings. I now have to convince the suppier or client that they need to also convert files to PDFs when they send their files to me, because I'm kooky and insist on using LibreOffice.
Yeah, not going to happen.
The extra step to change to .PDF?!
Are you serious?
I run my own business, and you never send raw files unless you have to, never. Raw files can be edited and manipulated and their file size is downright annoying for the recipient. If you need to work with raw files in Libre apply font substitution - You only have to do it once as it's set and forget and doesnt affect the integrity of the document for the recipient - I've yet to have an issue since I worked that trick out. And as stated, there are compatibility issues between the numerous versions of office itself!
Further more, the step (as in one) needed to convert to .PDF is stupidly simple under both platforms.
Even my wife in her role knows never to send documents in raw format, mind you, she can also work out that Linux is not for power users and uses the main Linux PC just as easily as I do.
You overestimate the difficulty of using a different OS compared to what you've been spoonfed all these years. The argument that people don't care what's under the hood supports both sides of the argument, it doesn't just work in favour of Windows.
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Pantalaimon
Limp Gawd
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That's the problem right there. You run your own business, you can decide which desktop OS you can run on your machine. I work for a global company with it's Global IT department.
And regarding using PDF files, Nobody I know sends PDF files unless it's the final version of a document that is to be sent out of our company. When we still work on a document and collaborate in writing it with the outside party, we absolutely send out normal documents and use the track changes feature while we're still collaborating on it.
Maybe it does when you're a power user but not when you're a normal user. I can imagine me telling my counterpart on the client side, oh yeah, you need to convert the file to PDF when you're done commenting and modifying the project plan. After a few times he forgets it he will insist I switch back to MS Word, or deal with him not saving the document in PDF format.
I can also imagine me sending my latest project cost and invoicing file to our shared service center for invoicing in PDF format. I will immediately get back a reply telling me to resubmit it in excel format, because they have some super duper macro that is programmed to extract the invoicing information from predetermined cells and it doesn't work if I use PDFs.
So,
As stated previously, Linux obviously isn't going to be for everyone in every situation (why you can't slap together a rig at home and actually learn something new is beyond my comprehension - But, whatever!) - So why be so negative regarding it's support/use and potential growth?
And Excel is the most overused piece of software out there, being used for applications it was never intended for.
Pantalaimon
Limp Gawd
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Only when you downplay the obstacles, because you think everyone else is in the same situation as you are, and brush aside any other objections as people being stupid or lazy.
I don't have space in my apartment and I don't care about it that much.
I'm not downplaying anything! It's something you're not used to. I don't know how old you are but Windows may very well be all you know, and as far as your concerned the world consists of Windows and that other operating system...OSX!
There are vastly more operating systems out there, some run on x86, some run on PPC, some run on ARM.
But modern Linux distro's aren't difficult to use, nor are they that incompatible with Windows!
To quote yourself:
That's obvious regarding your misinformation regarding Linux, and it's a textbook response from a spoon fed Windows only user.
Get out of your comfort zone and support something good, as I'm sure that you could fit a small second hand Dell Optiplex in that square meterage of yours.
I have stated numerous times "run whatever OS suits your situation". I'm not forcing people to adopt Linux, and while sometimes written text is difficult to put into context, if someone's wrong, I'm going to say it how it is! It's not difficult to weed out the misinformed from the knowledgeable in this thread.
What surprises me is just how negative, how unsupportable people are about freedom of choice and the bonus of cost saving! It really does reflect poorly on modern western society!
Once again. If your situation forces you to use Windows, why be so negative in discussion surrounding an open source alternative? If you portray Linux in such a negative light, why even post in this thread?
I'm not making people feel like idiots, they're the ones telling me Linux is too hard, therefore, by definition....?
In actual fact, I'm telling them they aren't idiots and Linux isn't that hard! Support something good! I see individuals like JustReason and I want to give him a high five! Respect to a user willing to learn something new.
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Pantalaimon
Limp Gawd
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See, when I say I don't care about it that much, I mean I have other more important matters in my life to spend my time and energy on instead of switching to Linux. You seem to know me so well, that you 'know' it's because I'm misinformed, lazy to not get out of my comfort zone, and that my desk has more space for another machine and monitor. Talk about being condescending.
Some people just don't want to know whats under the hood, and that is up to them. This is where Linux can make improvements, well is making improvements, one of the short comings of open sourced projects is usability, because its being designed by programmers
, not everyone thinks like a programmer.But you are the one with the problem in this thread. This thread isn't about using an open source alternative to windows, it's about AMD's Linux Drivers, or lack of drivers and the reasons why they aren't up to scratch.
It only became this discussion when it was pointed out to you by several people that AMD probably don't have the resources to spend on such a small market. Then you started on your anti Microsoft crusade. Phrases like
"MS is going to continue to dominate and it's the consumer that will suffer as a result"
"But the baseless negativity and blatant lack of support for an exceptional, free operating system, almost to the point of disgust from a handful of Windows users is just a recipe for the consumer to bend over and take it from Microsoft"
"Why, exactly, is there a group of Windows only users that are so heavily opposed to freedom of choice? If you prefer Windows, run Windows. Of course, what you should be doing is supporting the PC as an open platform capable of running any OS you like free from the monopolizing constraints of any one corporation. "
So your agenda became very apparent. Linux may well be the best OS on the planet, but, for you, it's not about that, it's about Microsoft been evil basically.
You are banging on about the freedom of choice but in the same sentence berating people who have a negative view on Linux. Why don't they have a right to post in this thread?
This is a tech forum, most of the people here would have used Linux at some stage or another and I bet most stopped and switched to another OS.
Linux is great if you have a reason to use it, like programming or whatever. But for the regular home user there is nothing special about Linux, there is no reason in the world to pick it over windows.
Doesn't the common man just need to open Chrome to check his email and look at Facebook? To be honest, ChromeOS might be better for the common man since the common man isn't going to know how to deal with Windows viruses and system updates, etc.
You are right, this thread exists to discuss why AMD Linux drivers suck so bad when it comes to linux. And to quote yourself:
This is the reason why AMD drivers under Linux suck so bad, this attitude. It's blatantly sad, there's just no other way to put it. And that's not because I believe Microsoft is evil (this isn't some episode of Mr Robot), it's because you aren't willing to support even the concept of a great idea on an open platform such as the PC, "just use Windows!"
Furthermore, this statement is incorrect and based around assumption. Linux is every bit as good as Windows for far more than just programming, and there's a number of advantages to using Linux and a number of reasons to pick it over Windows - Just go back through this thread and you will see I've mentioned a number of advantages and reasons to use Linux over Windows. I'm not going to go over them all again because this is just becoming a ridiculous rhetoric, if you didn't pay attention to my comments back then why are you going to pay attention to them now? Throughout this whole thread, I've replied on a Linux machine, a machine that my wife and six year old daughter can use for a variety of tasks just fine! It's not that different to my Windows machine, I'm even running the exact same browser that I use on my Windows machine and both machine's are synced. The exception is that the desktop on this Linux machine has a number of advantages that make it more productive over Windows - That sounds like a little more than just programming to me? I haven't programmed since I was at uni 25 years ago compiling programs under COBOL!
It seems that when it comes to Linux, pure Windows folk respond with blind terror that quickly becomes negativity that turns to anger! And it's unfounded.
Why burn money buying an OS when that's $$ better spent on hardware? (although, I'll admit, I grudgingly shelled out for Windows 10 Pro retail - At least I got it at trade) Especially when OS support is just as good under the free alternative if not better? And don't harp on about software packages again, unless you work in a niche industry there's no reason to choose Photoshop over GIMP, especially for the outlay, in fact do some research and you'll quickly discover that there are a number of professionals using open source packages in their field just fine. Some software is better under Windows, some software is better under OSX, and some software is better under Linux, it's the way it's been since multi platform computing has existed I'm afraid. Really, the only disadvantage to running Linux is that you miss out on all the latest, cool viruses, malware and spyware - Including the spyware built into the OS itself! (that was tongue in cheek)!
And SteamOS offers an opportunity to run a console with none of the limitations of a console and all the advantages of a PC - I see no negatives to that also. If AMD want to hand that market to Nvidia, well...That's what AMD's good at.
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LOL man you need help.
I don't hate Linux, Linux lovers get on my nerves though. You keep going on and on about how great your Linux setup is at home and how you and your wife are wonderfully happy since moving to Linux. Well actually, first you started out with just you enjoying Linux, then your wife came into it, and now in the latest post it's your six year old girl. What family member are you going to introduce next in your anecdotal Linux stories? You should throw in someone elderly. Telling about some old person you know using Linux will definitely change the minds of people. People will switch over in droves!!
Again, Do I hate Linux? No,why would I? And I haven't seen anyone getting angry in this thread. But You can't seem to get your head around the fact that people have used Linux and didn't like it.
I haven't once said anything bad about Linux. All I said was that the regular man on the street won't find anything in Linux better than windows. Saying that, even for regular stuff windows is more productive? LOL what home user wants to be more productive, oh wow, I can get to facebook 1 second quicker on linux!!
You said that Linux installation is far quicker and easier in of your posts, but in the same sentence mention that you wrote install scripts that setup everything for you. Haha, great, for you. You think the ordinary web surfer at home is going to do that?
And look I already know what you will reply.
1. That I hate Linux.
2. that I am lazy.
3. that I have never used linux
4. that my attitude is bad because I point out the reality of Linux
5. that anybody using windows is moron.
6. that I am wasting money buying a windows OS.
None of which are true.
I admire your passion for an operating system though. It's nearly as deep as the love some people in this section have for their video cards.
Flu!d, Saving the world, one windows user at time!!
OK,
So you prefer Windows, it's easier for you (is it not easier for you? If this isn't the case I do apologize, don't want to assume anything here).
So tell me, why post in a thread discussing the state of AMD Linux drivers? Should the thread be somehow biased towards the merits of Windows (if there are any)?
As a full time user of both operating systems does my opinion somehow hold less merit than someone that uses Windows only? And regarding that point, when a Windows only user posts misinformation shouldn't I correct them because they're a Windows user and I'm the minority?
As stated over, and over again (are you actually reading posts?) my intention is not to switch users to Linux. if everyone switched to Linux I'd have no work to do. My intention is to clear up the FUD spread by misinformed Windows users - And some of you in this thread alone are literally off the planet in this regard!
Take this post from page one of this thread:
Not only is it blatantly wrong, like massively wrong, it's insulting, with massive over generalization in regards to Linux users. It's obvious this Windows user doesn't care about the state of current Linux drivers? Why is that post even present? What was it's purpose in the first place?
Just look at a quote from your own post above:
Think about that answer for a minute, because in an attempt to drive your point home you've got it all wrong! And it highlights a lack of knowledge regarding Linux, and here you are arguing in a thread regarding Linux!
It's the type of post I expect from an ill informed Windows user, sprinkled with the typical form of arrogance I've come to expect - And reading the post, do you understand why I've come to that generalization?
Once again. How are you negatively affected by Linux as a gaming platform? Why do you believe more choice is a bad thing? We've been over the difficulties in statistically measuring the adoption of Linux vs Windows so what makes you assume it's popularity has remained unchanged since it's introduction?
And I stand by the fact that many of the people here arguing that Windows is somehow a superior OS have never used Linux for any extended period of time, this is evidenced in the lack of knowledge in their posts. At most I'd say it's safe to assume that a handful of Windows only posters in this thread may have fired up a Linux live DVD or set Linux up on a spare HDD at some stage, tried it for a week, possibly even a few hours, and thought "bah, change is too hard and I'm sticking to Windows!" And I can understand this, the fact remains that it hardly makes you an expert on Linux as evidenced by my point above!
It is undeniable that the number of gaming titles are constantly increasing under Linux, what more is there to argue? If AMD can't get their act together, that's typical of AMD.
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